Steve Jobs - Leading Candidate to Exterminate the PC

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MagickMan

Diamond Member
Aug 11, 2008
7,460
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Agreed they are Personal Computers, buuut a Shitty OS?! Compared to Windows?! I beg to differ. For my OS X (as it is based on BSD) is just the nicest, most end user-friendly distribution of linux, when you look at it like that, it makes sense.

I agree. OS X is the best OS out there, I just hate having to pay twice as much for a machine that's half as fast. There's the Hackintosh world, but it's still a buggy solution. If I could put OS X on my machine legally, and it ran like a Mac, I'd never use Windows again except to play a few games.
 

HAL9000

Lifer
Oct 17, 2010
22,021
3
76
I agree. OS X is the best OS out there, I just hate having to pay twice as much for a machine that's half as fast. There's the Hackintosh world, but it's still a buggy solution. If I could put OS X on my machine legally, and it ran like a Mac, I'd never use Windows again except to play a few games.

You don't really have to pay twice as much for a machine half as fast now, not now that they've adopted intel, the speed matches up pretty well, and the price premium is maybe 20% I would say.

Also that's exactly where I'm at, I have a mac, in windows it plays games really well, better than all the PC's I've owned, and I'm in the perfect win-win situation.
 

Vdubchaos

Lifer
Nov 11, 2009
10,408
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I agree. OS X is the best OS out there, I just hate having to pay twice as much for a machine that's half as fast. There's the Hackintosh world, but it's still a buggy solution. If I could put OS X on my machine legally, and it ran like a Mac, I'd never use Windows again except to play a few games.

What makes it "the best" OS?

:colbert:

I mostly play games and surf the web, maybe few office apps. I don't see how or what OS X can possibly offer to make that a better experience....as I simply don't have an issue with Xp or Win7 on that end.

Mac crowd reminds me of Eurofanboi crowd of the Car enthusiasm world.
 

zsdersw

Lifer
Oct 29, 2003
10,505
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Yes, someone please objectively quantify "the best OS". I'd be very interested to see how it's categorized, segmented, and how many caveats there are.
 

HAL9000

Lifer
Oct 17, 2010
22,021
3
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What makes it "the best" OS?

:colbert:

I mostly play games and surf the web, maybe few office apps. I don't see how or what OS X can possibly offer to make that a better experience....as I simply don't have an issue with Xp or Win7 on that end.

I don't know really it's hard to define, it just feels better, obviously very subjective, it's just to me the operating systems I have had problems with rank in the following order, Starting with the worst and working down.

Windows Vista, Windows ME, Windows 2000, Windows 3.1, Windows 7, Windows XP, Windows 95, LiveCD Linux Distro's, Mac OS 9, Mac OS X, Linux Distro's (particularly debian based)

So yeah I guess it's just an opinion based on my experiences. On a day to day basis I find some reason that windows pisses me off, In OSX I don't notice problems and in Linux I sit with a happy content grin on my face.
 

HAL9000

Lifer
Oct 17, 2010
22,021
3
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I suppose the other things that add to it for me are just how easy things are, and how everything is to me, "how it should be" example:

Installing a program in Windows:

Download program.
Open installation file
Select destination to install to
Wait will installation completes
Finish
Reboot
//Then Uninstalling
Open control panel
select application and any other bits in installed
select uninstall
follow uninstall instructions
wait while uninstall completes
Reboot
find the misc. crap that's left and remove

Installing a program in OSX

Download the program
Drag to applications folder
Wait while files copy.
//Then Uninstalling
Drag app to trash
Empty trash
Wait while trash empties.

Just one example of how we do things in different OS's
 
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Vdubchaos

Lifer
Nov 11, 2009
10,408
10
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I don't know really it's hard to define, it just feels better, obviously very subjective, it's just to me the operating systems I have had problems with rank in the following order, Starting with the worst and working down.

Windows Vista, Windows ME, Windows 2000, Windows 3.1, Windows 7, Windows XP, Windows 95, LiveCD Linux Distro's, Mac OS 9, Mac OS X, Linux Distro's (particularly debian based)

So yeah I guess it's just an opinion based on my experiences. On a day to day basis I find some reason that windows pisses me off, In OSX I don't notice problems and in Linux I sit with a happy content grin on my face.


Yeah, just like European/German cars have more soul and soft interior. :)
 

HAL9000

Lifer
Oct 17, 2010
22,021
3
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Yeah, just like European/German cars have more soul and soft interior. :)

Please read my last post.

Eurpoean cars, like Italian cars/ English cars definately have more soul, but not a softer interior than american cars.
 

taltamir

Lifer
Mar 21, 2004
13,576
6
76
1. reboot is extremely rare in windows 7, and also happens in OSX about as often (that is, very rarely) as well (for the same kinds of apps; that is, mostly for certain types of OS updates)... You don't even have to reboot after installing drivers and the vast majority of OS updates in win7 anymore. likewise for uninstall.

2. Selecting a destination is optional AND an advantage, I can't use an OS that wouldn't let me select the install destination (as it allows me to have an SSD + Bulk storage HDD and manage what goes where for optimal performance).

3. Almost all apps have an "uninstall" link in their start menu entry. And the uninstaller does not have instructions, it has a confirmation button (are you SURE you want to uninstall)... in fact, it never had instructions since windows 95. Uninstalling in windows always was fully automatic, you get a confirmation window and at most a reboot request (which has been nearly eliminated); and for video games, it will sometimes ask if you want to keep / delete your saved games. IIRC, macosX also ask you if you are sure if you drag it to the trash, and if not, then it SHOULD.

D: Find the misc crap that is left and manually removed, very rare, only happens in improperly made uninstallers (thats the price of letting ANYONE make programs without approval MS itself; this is only a problem if you install amateur made programs), and is really OCD since said misc crap is a few EMPTY folder and config files the size of a few kb.

In conclusion:
A: you are not accurately describing the windows experience.
B: what you call an advantage is actually a disadvantage of being a crippled, controlled OS where you the user have no power to make decisions.
 
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HAL9000

Lifer
Oct 17, 2010
22,021
3
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1. reboot is extremely rare in windows 7, and also happens in OSX about as often (that is, very rarely) as well (for the same kinds of apps; that is, mostly for certain types of OS updates)... You don't even have to reboot after installing drivers and the vast majority of OS updates in win7 anymore. likewise for uninstall.

2. Selecting a destination is optional AND an advantage, I can't use an OS that wouldn't let me select the install destination (as it allows me to have an SSD + Bulk storage HDD and manage what goes where for optimal performance).

3. Almost all apps have an "uninstall" link in their start menu entry. And the uninstaller does not have instructions, it has a confirmation button (are you SURE you want to uninstall)... in fact, it never had instructions since windows 95. Uninstalling in windows always was fully automatic, you get a confirmation window and at most a reboot request (which has been nearly eliminated); and for video games, it will sometimes ask if you want to keep / delete your saved games. IIRC, macosX also ask you if you are sure if you drag it to the trash, and if not, then it SHOULD.

D: Find the misc crap that is left and manually removed, very rare, only happens in improperly made uninstallers (thats the price of letting ANYONE make programs without approval MS itself; this is only a problem if you install amateur made programs), and is really OCD since said misc crap is a few EMPTY folder and config files the size of a few kb.

In conclusion:
A: you are not accurately describing the windows experience.
B: what you call an advantage is actually a disadvantage of being a crippled, controlled OS where you the user have no power to make decisions.
A: I'm accurately describing my windows experience
B: there is no disadvantage. I didn't say that you HAD to drag it into the app folder, if you want (and I do) have an applications folder on a sperate drive, or just run it off the desktop, or your download folder or literally wherever you want, far more open than the windows "you have to install this to run it" method, no?"

This was just one demo of how OSX streamlines basic operations and how it's just as open as windows.

Other than The hardware compatibility issues, I really don't know what this "freedom limiation" that you refer to is...? Any explanation.
 

Vdubchaos

Lifer
Nov 11, 2009
10,408
10
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Please read my last post.

Eurpoean cars, like Italian cars/ English cars definately have more soul, but not a softer interior than american cars.

European cars only give your wallet soul, when the wallet smacks you upside of your head as it's being emptied out to fix your "over engineered" marvel....:biggrin:

PLEASE
 

Vdubchaos

Lifer
Nov 11, 2009
10,408
10
0
I suppose the other things that add to it for me are just how easy things are, and how everything is to me, "how it should be" example:

Installing a program in Windows:

Download program.
Open installation file
Select destination to install to
Wait will installation completes
Finish
Reboot
//Then Uninstalling
Open control panel
select application and any other bits in installed
select uninstall
follow uninstall instructions
wait while uninstall completes
Reboot
find the misc. crap that's left and remove

Installing a program in OSX

Download the program
Drag to applications folder
Wait while files copy.
//Then Uninstalling
Drag app to trash
Empty trash
Wait while trash empties.

Just one example of how we do things in different OS's

Yeah, OS is great for dummies that don't have a clue how to do things proper. What else is new?
 

HAL9000

Lifer
Oct 17, 2010
22,021
3
76
European cars only give your wallet soul, when the wallet smacks you upside of your head as it's being emptied out to fix your "over engineered" marvel....:biggrin:

PLEASE

And american cars a cheap, nasty and slow and only cheap until they fall apart for being under engineered :) assuming you can call the people who build american cars "engineers"

PLEASE
 

HAL9000

Lifer
Oct 17, 2010
22,021
3
76
Yeah, OS is great for dummies that don't have a clue how to do things proper. What else is new?

I never said anything about dummies, nor did I mention at any point that things in Mac OS arn't done "propper" I just gave an example of how a simple operation is overly complex and irritation in Windows, and blindingly simple in OSX
 

Vdubchaos

Lifer
Nov 11, 2009
10,408
10
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I never said anything about dummies, nor did I mention at any point that things in Mac OS arn't done "propper" I just gave an example of how a simple operation is overly complex and irritation in Windows, and blindingly simple in OSX

It's just a perception to make you think that it's better....when the reality is, not really.

I like the way it's done in Windows (ANY version really). It takes 5 seconds. Even if it's done "quicker" on OS....you are talking SECONDS here. What's the big deal, chances are are most likely wasting your left over time drinking latte or Twitting away.....whatever.

DIFFERENT is not "BETTER".
 

HAL9000

Lifer
Oct 17, 2010
22,021
3
76
It's just a perception to make you think that it's better....when the reality is, not really.

I like the way it's done in Windows (ANY version really). It takes 5 seconds. Even if it's done "quicker" on OS....you are talking SECONDS here. What's the big deal, chances are are most likely wasting your left over time drinking latte or Twitting away.....whatever.

DIFFERENT is not "BETTER".

Believe me when it comes to an operating system faster is better, more streamlined, simpler, is BETTER and DIFFERENT

Whilst this operation may only save seconds, it was just an example of the way OSX works compared to Windows, all those seconds add up.



I don't drink coffee or have a twitter account, I'm poorly dressed, network engineer, not some stupid holier than thou apple fan boy.
 

Vdubchaos

Lifer
Nov 11, 2009
10,408
10
0
And american cars a cheap, nasty and slow and only cheap until they fall apart for being under engineered :) assuming you can call the people who build american cars "engineers"

PLEASE

I warn you, I am a big car enthusiast.....

ANYWAYS, feel free to find me a faster car for $30k than say.....Mustang 5.0 (410hp).

Heck find me 1 European car that comes even REMOTELY close to performance of a $45k Corvette.

Your American car perception is stuck in the 80s. Things have changed DRAMATICALLY past 10 years +........perhaps a long overdue news flash to you.

Figure 10 more years and you will know your shiiiiit on Apple end too......
 

zsdersw

Lifer
Oct 29, 2003
10,505
2
0
MacsForDummies.jpg


A bit redundant, isn't it?
 

Vdubchaos

Lifer
Nov 11, 2009
10,408
10
0
Believe me when it comes to an operating system faster is better, more streamlined, simpler, is BETTER and DIFFERENT

Whilst this operation may only save seconds, it was just an example of the way OSX works compared to Windows, all those seconds add up.



I don't drink coffee or have a twitter account, I'm poorly dressed, network engineer, not some stupid holier than thou apple fan boy.

Head explodes
 

HAL9000

Lifer
Oct 17, 2010
22,021
3
76
I warn you, I am a big car enthusiast.....

ANYWAYS, feel free to find me a faster car for $30k than say.....Mustang 5.0 (410hp).

Heck find me 1 European car that comes even REMOTELY close to performance of a $45k Corvette.

Your American car perception is stuck in the 80s. Things have changed DRAMATICALLY past 10 years +........perhaps a long overdue news flash to you.

Figure 10 more years and you will know your shiiiiit on Apple end too......

Excuse me captain patronise, I know my shit on apple. This is one area that you cannot lecture me in.

I'm quite into cars, and don't get me wrong I never described american cars as expensive, your right if you want a cheap peice of shit that has a lot of horsepower then america is the place to look.

But when it comes to buying a CAR look else where and as for an European car that out performs a $45k corvette, try googling any of the manufacturers below and see where they come from.

Ferrari
Lamborghini
Porsche
Aston Martin
Bugatti

I could go on, but I'm confident my point has been made.
 

HAL9000

Lifer
Oct 17, 2010
22,021
3
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That's not what your posts suggest.

I never said "HEY EVERYONE Your stupid and my computer is better than your computer" I've said "Hey Everyone, In my personal opinion Mac OS offers a better day to day experience than Windows as an operating system"
 

Vdubchaos

Lifer
Nov 11, 2009
10,408
10
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Excuse me captain patronise, I know my shit on apple. This is one area that you cannot lecture me in.

I'm quite into cars, and don't get me wrong I never described american cars as expensive, your right if you want a cheap peice of shit that has a lot of horsepower then america is the place to look.

But when it comes to buying a CAR look else where and as for an European car that out performs a $45k corvette, try googling any of the manufacturers below and see where they come from.

Ferrari
Lamborghini
Porsche
Aston Martin
Bugatti

I could go on, but I'm confident my point has been made.

You call American car a cheap POS when above makers sell you similar performance for 2-5x the price and are HARDLY or REMOTELY even reliable?

You are comparing 150-200k/1 million dollar cars to $45k.

You failed. Show me one car at $45k that Europe produces that comes even remotely close to Vettes performance.

THERE IS NONE and mark my words, there never will be.

European cars are JUST like Apple. Sell you WORST crap for double the price (if not more). They prey on people's ignorance and "brand" image.

Reliability is what dictates "cheap or POS" and everyone and their mother knows that unless you are talking 80s Diesel Mercedes......European cars are unreliable and too complex for their own good.

As an owner of European cars, I would never EVER recommend having a European car outside of warranty (heck even WITH warranty at times).

Heck even the best German study out there labeled German cars as POOR reliability. I believe Kia and Hyundai won the awards for more reliable.

Once you get over the badge and see the reality....it starts to make sense. Face it, most people buy BADGES to impress other people....rather than a GOOD PC or a GOOD car.

THe days of "you get what you pay for" are somewhat over. More you pay....more they bend you over backwards. ESPECIALLY when we talk cars!!!