Steve Jobs - Leading Candidate to Exterminate the PC

Page 5 - Seeking answers? Join the AnandTech community: where nearly half-a-million members share solutions and discuss the latest tech.

HAL9000

Lifer
Oct 17, 2010
22,021
3
76
There is no rule for ALL. MS can't satisfy EVERYONE's flavors.....Apple just makes it easier/dummy proof (nothing more).

I think MS reached a decent middle ground....but no, NOTHING is perfect.



LMAO

If it works for you, you like it better, go with Apple (I don't care). I think your point is silly and newbish....but that's just me.



Not even the hardware, I mean, yes apple overcharges you AND some for hardware...but most of what you pay for is white case/design.

That's true, but saying my opinion is "newbish" is a tad insulting, Apple dosen't make things easier/ dummy proof, for something's e.g. Design software there is a large consensus that it exceeds Windows. and for my job, computer networking then it's a very nice GUI over a BSD system meaning great compatibility with my linux servers.

Also you said earlier something about "hipster" what's that?
 

aigomorla

CPU, Cases&Cooling Mod PC Gaming Mod Elite Member
Super Moderator
Sep 28, 2005
20,894
3,246
126
That's true, but saying my opinion is "newbish" is a tad insulting, Apple dosen't make things easier/ dummy proof, for something's e.g. Design software there is a large consensus that it exceeds Windows. and for my job, computer networking then it's a very nice GUI over a BSD system meaning great compatibility with my linux servers.

Also you said earlier something about "hipster" what's that?

I am not saying apple users are noobish.
I am saying they are a niche.

And your absolutely 1000% correct.
Design software, CG, nothing touches apple software.
Pixar Studio if i remember correctly is/was entirely mac operated.
Although i dont know if they still are.

However the definition of a PC = Personal Computer.
What does a Personal Computer mean?

It means a Single User system.
How can a Mac destroy a PC when by definition its a PC?

You see, its just another sad and stupid attempt at apple in trying to be different, because they feel they NEED to be different.
When you gut both systems what do you ultimately see?

1. Intel Processor
2. Foxconn Board
3. DDR3
4. Hard Drive
5. PSU

Uhh... isnt that any PC?

Is apple declaring a full out war on AMD?
Since apple doesnt use anything AMD (ignoring ATi)?
 
Last edited:

taltamir

Lifer
Mar 21, 2004
13,576
6
76
Design software, CG, nothing touches apple software.
Actually this is not true at all.
a long time ago, apple had the advantage because powerPC was first to have 64bit support.
However, in modern times the vast majority of design software is available for both macos and windows. Some of which is actually better on windows.

the "graphic design is better on the mac" is an outdated and obsolete anachronism that hasn't been true in years.

However the definition of a PC = Personal Computer.
What does a Personal Computer mean?
Absolutely right! also, look at my earlier posts, I posted photo evidence showing apple calling their macs "personal computers". Apple just decided one day that the name no longer suits them, but they used to actually call their PCs PCs. Also, apple commercials are the only ones who ever call "windows" "PC"... everyone else would say windows / linux / solaris / etc. Apple invented the PC = Windows thing.
 
Last edited:

aigomorla

CPU, Cases&Cooling Mod PC Gaming Mod Elite Member
Super Moderator
Sep 28, 2005
20,894
3,246
126
I think i figured it out...

IF apple becomes a PC, then Microsoft will no longer be required to pay all the other companies billions of dollars in monopoly law suits because another rival business entity has risen which can / could compete with microsoft?

So its apple's attempt at keeping the sleeping dragon at bay, by saying there not a PC, otherwise they free the flying window golath to crush them even further?

No seriously... how can apple stomp a PC when by definition its a PC.
And dont say because it has tiger OS.

ANY OS by default as long as it is used by a single user, is by definition a PC.
The Operating System, as long as it has a single user mode, is by definition a PC.
 
Last edited:

HAL9000

Lifer
Oct 17, 2010
22,021
3
76
I am not saying apple users are noobish.
I am saying they are a niche.

And your absolutely 1000% correct.
Design software, CG, nothing touches apple software.
Pixar Studio if i remember correctly is/was entirely mac operated.
Although i dont know if they still are.

However the definition of a PC = Personal Computer.
What does a Personal Computer mean?

It means a Single User system.
How can a Mac destroy a PC when by definition its a PC?

You see, its just another sad and stupid attempt at apple in trying to be different, because they feel they NEED to be different.
When you gut both systems what do you ultimately see?

1. Intel Processor
2. Foxconn Board
3. DDR3
4. Hard Drive
5. PSU

Uhh... isnt that any PC?

Is apple declaring a full out war on AMD?
Since apple doesnt use anything AMD (ignoring ATi)?

Ugh... This has been gone into in depth in the previous posts, for me a Mac is not a PC, the origins of the term PC, are on previous posts on this thread, a Mac is a personal computer, but the term PC has now changed from just an abreviation to a synonym for Windows computer, don't ask me why, frankly I don't care why, but it has so Mac!=PC, Windows Computer=PC, don't care why but popular culture has dictated it to be so.
 

aigomorla

CPU, Cases&Cooling Mod PC Gaming Mod Elite Member
Super Moderator
Sep 28, 2005
20,894
3,246
126
Ugh... This has been gone into in depth in the previous posts, for me a Mac is not a PC, the origins of the term PC, are on previous posts on this thread, a Mac is a personal computer, but the term PC has now changed from just an abreviation to a synonym for Windows computer, don't ask me why, frankly I don't care why, but it has so Mac!=PC, Windows Computer=PC, don't care why but popular culture has dictated it to be so.

wait... whose popular culture?

Mac OS users dont occupy anywhere near enough people to say general popular culture.

If were looking at all the OS's for Personal Computers, then Mac OS's have even a smaller share.

You are aware Apple only has a 10.5% market share currently right over HP, Dell, Acer, and the other big giants.

pc_market_share_3q10.001-thumb-640xauto-17216.png


that's 1.5/10... since when was that considered general popular?
To me its called minority.

Why are you trying to make Mac users so much superior then All the other PC users?
That's what it sounds to us, and that's whats pissing us off.
Its like a little Chihuahua trying to punk a fight with a st. bernard, saying its not a dog because its too big.
 
Last edited:

Lonbjerg

Diamond Member
Dec 6, 2009
4,419
0
0
Ugh... This has been gone into in depth in the previous posts, for me a Mac is not a PC, the origins of the term PC, are on previous posts on this thread, a Mac is a personal computer, but the term PC has now changed from just an abreviation to a synonym for Windows computer, don't ask me why, frankly I don't care why, but it has so Mac!=PC, Windows Computer=PC, don't care why but popular culture has dictated it to be so.

Reality distortion field detected...
 

HAL9000

Lifer
Oct 17, 2010
22,021
3
76
wait... whose popular culture?

Mac OS users dont occupy anywhere near enough people to say general popular culture.

If were looking at all the OS's for Personal Computers, then Mac OS's have even a smaller share.

I wasn't talking about Mac users culture I was talking about the fact that when you say to someone "Do you use a Mac?" and they reply with "No I use a PC" you don't start thinking "But Mac's are personal computers!" you say "OK" as you know they mean windows.
 

Lonbjerg

Diamond Member
Dec 6, 2009
4,419
0
0
wait... whose popular culture?

Mac OS users dont occupy anywhere near enough people to say general popular culture.

If were looking at all the OS's for Personal Computers, then Mac OS's have even a smaller share.

You are aware Apple only has a 6.4% market share currently right over HP, Dell, Acer, and the other big giants.

It's more ~3.6% market share worldwide...something Apple fans calls "massive" :whiste:
 

HAL9000

Lifer
Oct 17, 2010
22,021
3
76
It's more ~3.6% market share worldwide...something Apple fans calls "massive" :whiste:

I don't understand were not talking about what market share Mac's have were talking about Windows Machines being called PC's, and in any event, when I said Massive, I meant relatively speaking, as in relative to previous market share, in my area. Which I would definately call a massive increase. Massive... Massive.
 

HAL9000

Lifer
Oct 17, 2010
22,021
3
76
You are aware Apple only has a 10.5% market share currently right over HP, Dell, Acer, and the other big giants.

pc_market_share_3q10.001-thumb-640xauto-17216.png


that's 1/10... since when was that considered general popular?
To me its called minority.

That's alot more of a market share than I thought they had! Impressive, that's a definite improvement. Paricularly considering their are showing the biggest increase in market share over 12 months, that must be the massive difference I noticed in my surrounding area, but It is probably higher in universities.
 

taltamir

Lifer
Mar 21, 2004
13,576
6
76
I wasn't talking about Mac users culture I was talking about the fact that when you say to someone "Do you use a Mac?" and they reply with "No I use a PC" you don't start thinking "But Mac's are personal computers!" you say "OK" as you know they mean windows.

I have never had a conversation go like that... did you really do that or is this hypothetical?

And if I did ask someone if he uses a mac and he said "no i use a PC" I will carefully explain to him the terms. I wouldn't even be able to tell if he means "I use windows"... what if he uses linux but just said it as a form of derision? (aka, macs are not REAL computers) I know linux users who do that.
 
Last edited:

HAL9000

Lifer
Oct 17, 2010
22,021
3
76
I have never had a conversation go like that... did you really do that or is this hypothetical?

You mean you've never heard someone refer to their windows computer as a PC instead of a Mac, if that's the question then yes I've had a....lot of conversations like that, in fact I think everytime I ever asked someone what operating system they use it's generally phrased like that.
 

HAL9000

Lifer
Oct 17, 2010
22,021
3
76
And if I did ask someone if he uses a mac and he said "no i use a PC" I will carefully explain to him the terms. I wouldn't even be able to tell if he means "I use windows"... what if he uses linux but just said it as a form of derision? (aka, macs are not REAL computers) I know linux users who do that.

Fair enough, feel free, I just go with it, if that's how people are naming things then it's fine by me, it works, it's simple enough for anyone to understand. I've never had someone attempt to give a slight to Mac users in the way you suggest, but I guess it's doable if you like that sort of thing.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9V7NoRjI0H0

Above is a Microsoft ad, with Microsoft calling themselves PC's granted it's an amusing take on apple ad's but none the less it further expresses Windows = PC
 
Last edited:

aigomorla

CPU, Cases&Cooling Mod PC Gaming Mod Elite Member
Super Moderator
Sep 28, 2005
20,894
3,246
126
You mean you've never heard someone refer to their windows computer as a PC instead of a Mac, if that's the question then yes I've had a....lot of conversations like that, in fact I think everytime I ever asked someone what operating system they use it's generally phrased like that.

ive heard mac users even call there systems PC.
When someone says i have problems with my PC, i ask what OS is it.

Given true they say windows 99% of the time, that's only because of the low market share mac users have.

What were trying to say is there ALL PC's.

Windows, linx, some prototype AI OS your designing for the military for single user.

Its all moot.

boil down to it, does a single person use the station?
Yes... then its a PC

GAH... i had a simular debate with HTPC's not wanting to be in the same group with PC's when the ending of HTPC is PC!
 

HAL9000

Lifer
Oct 17, 2010
22,021
3
76
ive heard mac users even call there systems PC.
When someone says i have problems with my PC, i ask what OS is it.

Given true they say windows 99% of the time, that's only because of the low market share mac users have.

What were trying to say is there ALL PC's.

Windows, linx, some prototype AI OS your designing for the military for single user.

Its all moot.

boil down to it, does a single person use the station?
Yes... then its a PC

GAH... i had a simular debate with HTPC's not wanting to be in the same group with PC's when the ending of HTPC is PC!

Lol true, and very valid, I'm just curious to see what people call different platforms, I've always been taught, and it's always been accepted in my area that a PC is a Windows Machine, a Mac is a Mac and everything else is everything else, even though Mac's are by definition Personal computers.

Another good point is that the OP, obviously adheres to "my" definition.
 
Last edited:

sham63

Member
Apr 29, 2010
55
9
71
I have never had a conversation go like that... did you really do that or is this hypothetical?

And if I did ask someone if he uses a mac and he said "no i use a PC" I will carefully explain to him the terms. I wouldn't even be able to tell if he means "I use windows"... what if he uses linux but just said it as a form of derision? (aka, macs are not REAL computers) I know linux users who do that.

I think this is being carried too far. The term PC is associated with Windows, and before that dos. It probably stems from when IBM named their first pcs the IBM Personal Computer. Even computer magazines in the early 90's referred to them as PCs, especially in the Mac vc PC articles.
 

HAL9000

Lifer
Oct 17, 2010
22,021
3
76
I think this is being carried too far. The term PC is associated with Windows, and before that dos. It probably stems from when IBM named their first pcs the IBM Personal Computer. Even computer magazines in the early 90's referred to them as PCs, especially in the Mac vc PC articles.

Yep, your not the first one to say that, I said it a couple of posts ago, :) Good to know someone agrees :p

Welcome to the thread on a side note!
 

taltamir

Lifer
Mar 21, 2004
13,576
6
76
I think this is being carried too far. The term PC is associated with Windows, and before that dos. It probably stems from when IBM named their first pcs the IBM Personal Computer. Even computer magazines in the early 90's referred to them as PCs, especially in the Mac vc PC articles.

Please do not falsify history. Observe post 31 of this very thread: http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=30801650&postcount=31

Copy Pasta:
An early use of the term "personal computer" appeared in a November 3, 1962, New York Times article reporting John W. Mauchly's vision of future computing as detailed at a recent meeting of the American Institute of Industrial Engineers. Mauchly stated, "There is no reason to suppose the average boy or girl cannot be master of a personal computer".

That is 20 years before the IBM-PC existed.

also, http://www.kelleyad.com/histry.htm

5 years before the IBM-PC existed... in 1977 apple introduced the apple 2 which was marketed as a PC.
Observe the second picture from the bottom where it says: "Introducing the Apple II" and "You have just run out of excuses for not owning a Personal Computer"
Years before the IBM and intel takeover of the PC market in the 1980s

The IBM PC (which used intel 8088 processor) was released on August 12, 1981

The first PC I used was a Macintosh Personal Computer... with a monochrome monitor, command line interface, and one game... pong.
That is, of course, before apple computers decided they don't want to be called PCs anymore, and when their OS didn't suck (compared to the competition)
 

HAL9000

Lifer
Oct 17, 2010
22,021
3
76
Please do not falsify history. Observe post 31 of this very thread: http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=30801650&postcount=31

Copy Pasta:


That is 20 years before the IBM-PC existed.

also, http://www.kelleyad.com/histry.htm

5 years before the IBM-PC existed... in 1977 apple introduced the apple 2 which was marketed as a PC.
Observe the second picture from the bottom where it says: "Introducing the Apple II" and "You have just run out of excuses for not owning a Personal Computer"
Years before the IBM and intel takeover of the PC market in the 1980s

The IBM PC (which used intel 8088 processor) was released on August 12, 1981

The first PC I used was a Macintosh Personal Computer... with a monochrome monitor, command line interface, and one game... pong.
That is, of course, before apple computers decided they don't want to be called PCs anymore, and when their OS didn't suck (compared to the competition)

I remember what was posted, I said the IBM bit, you pointed out the difference in time between Personal Computer and the IBM PC, then I pointed out that I was arguing for PC having different connotations that PC.
 

sham63

Member
Apr 29, 2010
55
9
71
Please do not falsify history. Observe post 31 of this very thread: http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=30801650&postcount=31

Copy Pasta:


That is 20 years before the IBM-PC existed.

also, http://www.kelleyad.com/histry.htm

5 years before the IBM-PC existed... in 1977 apple introduced the apple 2 which was marketed as a PC.
Observe the second picture from the bottom where it says: "Introducing the Apple II" and "You have just run out of excuses for not owning a Personal Computer"
Years before the IBM and intel takeover of the PC market in the 1980s

The IBM PC (which used intel 8088 processor) was released on August 12, 1981

The first PC I used was a Macintosh Personal Computer... with a monochrome monitor, command line interface, and one game... pong.
That is, of course, before apple computers decided they don't want to be called PCs anymore, and when their OS didn't suck (compared to the competition)

Look you are going to the extreme on this. Popular usage of the term PC means a Windows pc. It does not mean it was the first pc, but it has changed over time to mean an IBM PC, then just dos based when the clones came out, and now Windows based. It may have started out meaning any home computer (apple, atari, commodore, etc) but that has changed. It happens to words and phrases. I do not recall Apple calling their Macs a pc, they have always strived to differentiate them, first from dos and then windows based computers.
 

HAL9000

Lifer
Oct 17, 2010
22,021
3
76
Look you are going to the extreme on this. Popular usage of the term PC means a Windows pc. It does not mean it was the first pc, but it has changed over time to mean an IBM PC, then just dos based when the clones came out, and now Windows based. It may have started out meaning any home computer (apple, atari, commodore, etc) but that has changed. It happens to words and phrases. I do not recall Apple calling their Macs a pc, they have always strived to differentiate them, first from dos and then windows based computers.

I know but it's fun to debate don'tcha think :)