Gotta question the legality of this. With people pouring coffee on their laps and all but intentionally flipping their SUVs and sueing for millions - and winning - it's entirely within the realm of plausibility for a thief to sue you in that scenario (or even in one where you beat him up, or worse didn't beat him up but he acts the part) and win. Not that I wouldn't have beaten the living sh*t out of him in SurgicalShark's situation, but I'd be fearful of a lawsuit afterwards.
3chordcharlie
Diamond Member
- Mar 30, 2004
- 9,859
- 1
- 81
It's almost hard to believe the coffee b1tch only got $2.9million. That seems like pocket-change for lawsuits now!
GrumpyMan
Diamond Member
- May 14, 2001
- 5,780
- 266
- 136
I live in Houston and am quite familiar with the third ward. You should of kicked his ass and beaten him to a pulp, that builds respect on the street. Now that they know you are a wuss they will come get the rest of your stuff. Please move from Houston since it has a bad rep already and you aren't helping the crime rate by just letting them walk away with your stuff right in front of your eyes. Holding a clothes basket? That's your excuse?
UnatcoAgent
Diamond Member
- Oct 25, 1999
- 5,462
- 1
- 0
exdeath
Lifer
- Jan 29, 2004
- 13,679
- 10
- 81
I don't really care about the bike; it's the principal behind it. The rights to life, liberty, the pursuit of happiness, and the right of private property ownership are essential to free people and are guaranteed by the US Constitution. If you allow someone to impose his or her will illegally against you in ANY way that violates those liberties, then where do you draw the line? To what extent do you compromise your freedom for the sake of political correctness?
Be it government tyranny or a trivial personal dispute like a bike theft, said freedoms are always worth standing up for even at the risk of personal harm. Otherwise someone else owns your life and you have no basis for living; nothing is sacred and nothing else matters at that point.
What next? You car? Your children? Your life?
If you let guys like this get away, you will be a pawn. If you do nothing because you might get sued, you are his AND the lawyer?s pawn. Living in fear or slavery is not living at all.
As an American you have an obligation to stand up for yourself! Just be sure you are capable of escalating a reasonable response in proportion to the threat and keep control of the situation. If that means being armed, so be it. For all you know, he could have pulled out a Glock just because you saw him. A guy like this only considers your life worth threatening for a $50 or even $5000 bike. Chances are he had not placed a value on his own life. Enlighten him.
Besides nobody needs to be hurt. All need be done is for the bike to be released and him to leave immediately. Let him make that choice.
I agree wholeheartedly, I'm just saying that in the pansy society we've been becoming there might be legal repurcussions for kicking the thief's ass. In the OP's situation, I'd have beaten the guy senseless for exactly the reasons you've stated - but I might be looking at a lawsuit for it, and I find that rather disgusting.
The following article appeared in the Baltimore SUN on November 12, 1999:
"The death of a man who was beaten during a robbery Saturday [November 6, 1999] has been ruled a homicide by the state medical examiner, police said yesterday."
"Jessy Hill, 31, of the 2400 block of W. Cold Spring Lane was attacked by four males in the 4000 block of Park Heights Ave., police said. The attackers stole his bicycle."
"Hill died of blunt force trauma to the head Tuesday [Novmber 9, 1999] at Sinai Hospital, police said. No arrests have been made in the case." What else is new?
Update - Thursday, 1 July 2004 11:03
An update to the murder at Clouds Hill Road, St George on Monday June 28.
Police are now in a position to name the dead man as Craig Ian Fussell, aged 27 from the Bristol area.
Police yesterday obtained a warrant of further detention in relation to a 32-year-old man and a 31-year-old woman. This allows them to continue to detain and question the pair until midnight tonight (Thursday).
The police are aware that the deceased was involved in a dispute with two young black men in St George?s Park, St George, during the afternoon/evening of Monday June 28. It is believed the dispute involved a bicycle.
A 21-year-old man accused of fatally shooting another man in a protracted dispute about a bicycle was booked into the Pima County jail after authorities found him in Phoenix late Monday.
Investigators with the Tucson Police Department developed information on Monday that Justin Avery Guyot was hiding out in a hotel in Phoenix and contacted the Phoenix Police Department, said Sgt. Judy Altieri, a Tucson police spokeswoman.
Phoenix officers went to the hotel and arrested Guyot without incident, holding him until Tucson police arrived and returned him to Tucson, she said.
Officials had obtained an arrest warrant for Guyot last Wednesday on charges of first-degree murder and drive-by shooting in the death of Edward Brown, also 21. Investigators believe Guyot, and, possibly others, drove by and exchanged words with Brown as he walked with a relative in the 5300 block of East 25th Street, near South Craycroft Road, about 7:15 p.m. on April 27.
BACKGROUND: Bicycle theft escalates to triple murder
Juha Valjakkala became a part of Finnish and Swedish crime history in 1988 when he was convicted of the murder of a family of three at a cemetery in the northern Swedish community of Åmsele.
The series of events that led to the killings began when the 23-year-old Valjakkala was released from a prison in Turku on May 1 1988, after which he started wandering through Sweden and Finland with his 21-year-old girlfriend Marita Routalampi.
On July 3 they arrived in Åmsele. At night Valjakkala stole a bicycle. He was pursued by Sten Nilsson and his 13-year-old son Fredrik. The chase ended at a cemetery where Sten and Fredrik Nilsson were shot. Later Sten's wife and Fredrik's mother, Ewa Nilsson went looking for the two and was stabbed to death outside the cemetery.
Valjakkala and Routalampi were caught in Odense, Denmark just over a week later.
Boy, 12, fires gun in fight over bicycle, police say
By ALICIA CALDWELL
© St. Petersburg Times, published May 17, 2000
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ST. PETERSBURG -- A dispute between two seventh-grade boys over a bicycle turned violent Monday night when one of them got a gun and shot at the other, police said.
A 12-year-old, who lives in the 1100 block of 16th Avenue S, was arrested and charged with two counts of aggravated assault with a firearm, said Dan Bates, St. Petersburg police spokesman. He was charged as a juvenile, and his name was withheld because of his age.
He is accused of firing a handgun at a 15-year-old, who lives in the 1500 block of 12th Street S. Both boys are students at Richard L. Sanders Exceptional Education Center in Pinellas Park. No one was injured.
Bates said the boys were arguing about a bicycle, taking it from each another and throwing bricks at each other. The 15-year-old ultimately took the bike. The younger boy left, and returned with at least one friend.
The argument continued in front of the older boy's house. The 12-year-old was given a handgun by his friend. The 15-year-old saw the gun and sprinted for his house, diving inside the door. He heard at least one shot.
The 12-year-old and his friend ran away. The 12-year-old was later arrested by police. His friend, who supplied the gun, was described as an older male. He was not apprehended, and the gun was not recovered.
Bias Crime or Biased Journalism?
A Hispanic mob beat a Bangladeshi man to death in Brooklyn Sunday. What it a bias crime? That depends which newspaper you read. The New York Times reports that "although several Bangladeshis and Hispanic residents interviewed yesterday in the neighborhood said there was some tension between the two groups, and the attacker was described as an Hispanic man, the police said they believed the attack--and others that night--stemmed from the initial dispute over the bicycle rather than from racial bias."The violence erupted in the neighborhood of East New York after a fight broke out over a stolen bicycle, police said. It allegedly began when a 12-year-old Bangladeshi American boy riding the bike accidentally grazed a Latino teen, who then stole the bike. The Bangladeshi American boy then called his friends for help. After a member of the Bangladeshi group was able to retrieve the bicycle, the fighting escalated and gunshots were fired, say authorities. According to investigators, the Latinos ? many of whom had allegedly been drinking earlier at the Dominican Day parade in Manhattan ? then began attacking Bangladeshi men they encountered at random. At least three were injured.
Prosecutors Say Dispute Over A Bicycle
POSTED: 1:13 pm CDT July 6, 2004
CHICAGO -- A Cook County judge has denied bail for a 16-year-old boy who has been accused of shooting a man after an apparent dispute over a bicycle.
Patrick Buchanan, of the 1500 block of South Karlov Avenue, appeared for the hearing at noon in Violence Court. He was charged as an adult with first-degree murder in the fatal shooting of Cordell Davidson, police News Affairs Officer Laura Kubiak said.
Davidson, 18, was shot around 3 p.m. on June 23 at 4032 W. 16th St., after an apparent dispute over a bicycle, Kubiak said. At least two witnesses identified Buchanan as Davidson's killer, Assistant State's Attorney Nick Kondelis said.
Witnesses said Davidson and the boy had been quarreling over the bicycle at 1614 S. Komensky Ave., Marquette District Lt. John Kenny said. The boy left the scene and returned a short while later with a handgun and fired an unknown number of shots at the victim, he added. The boy then allegedly ran off with the handgun.
When police arrived, they found the victim in the street with gunshot wounds to the chest and thigh, police News Affairs Sgt. Robert Cargie said.
8 people dead over bicycle disputes
You may have done the smart thing.
"The death of a man who was beaten during a robbery Saturday [November 6, 1999] has been ruled a homicide by the state medical examiner, police said yesterday."
"Jessy Hill, 31, of the 2400 block of W. Cold Spring Lane was attacked by four males in the 4000 block of Park Heights Ave., police said. The attackers stole his bicycle."
"Hill died of blunt force trauma to the head Tuesday [Novmber 9, 1999] at Sinai Hospital, police said. No arrests have been made in the case." What else is new?
Update - Thursday, 1 July 2004 11:03
An update to the murder at Clouds Hill Road, St George on Monday June 28.
Police are now in a position to name the dead man as Craig Ian Fussell, aged 27 from the Bristol area.
Police yesterday obtained a warrant of further detention in relation to a 32-year-old man and a 31-year-old woman. This allows them to continue to detain and question the pair until midnight tonight (Thursday).
The police are aware that the deceased was involved in a dispute with two young black men in St George?s Park, St George, during the afternoon/evening of Monday June 28. It is believed the dispute involved a bicycle.
A 21-year-old man accused of fatally shooting another man in a protracted dispute about a bicycle was booked into the Pima County jail after authorities found him in Phoenix late Monday.
Investigators with the Tucson Police Department developed information on Monday that Justin Avery Guyot was hiding out in a hotel in Phoenix and contacted the Phoenix Police Department, said Sgt. Judy Altieri, a Tucson police spokeswoman.
Phoenix officers went to the hotel and arrested Guyot without incident, holding him until Tucson police arrived and returned him to Tucson, she said.
Officials had obtained an arrest warrant for Guyot last Wednesday on charges of first-degree murder and drive-by shooting in the death of Edward Brown, also 21. Investigators believe Guyot, and, possibly others, drove by and exchanged words with Brown as he walked with a relative in the 5300 block of East 25th Street, near South Craycroft Road, about 7:15 p.m. on April 27.
BACKGROUND: Bicycle theft escalates to triple murder
Juha Valjakkala became a part of Finnish and Swedish crime history in 1988 when he was convicted of the murder of a family of three at a cemetery in the northern Swedish community of Åmsele.
The series of events that led to the killings began when the 23-year-old Valjakkala was released from a prison in Turku on May 1 1988, after which he started wandering through Sweden and Finland with his 21-year-old girlfriend Marita Routalampi.
On July 3 they arrived in Åmsele. At night Valjakkala stole a bicycle. He was pursued by Sten Nilsson and his 13-year-old son Fredrik. The chase ended at a cemetery where Sten and Fredrik Nilsson were shot. Later Sten's wife and Fredrik's mother, Ewa Nilsson went looking for the two and was stabbed to death outside the cemetery.
Valjakkala and Routalampi were caught in Odense, Denmark just over a week later.
Boy, 12, fires gun in fight over bicycle, police say
By ALICIA CALDWELL
© St. Petersburg Times, published May 17, 2000
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ST. PETERSBURG -- A dispute between two seventh-grade boys over a bicycle turned violent Monday night when one of them got a gun and shot at the other, police said.
A 12-year-old, who lives in the 1100 block of 16th Avenue S, was arrested and charged with two counts of aggravated assault with a firearm, said Dan Bates, St. Petersburg police spokesman. He was charged as a juvenile, and his name was withheld because of his age.
He is accused of firing a handgun at a 15-year-old, who lives in the 1500 block of 12th Street S. Both boys are students at Richard L. Sanders Exceptional Education Center in Pinellas Park. No one was injured.
Bates said the boys were arguing about a bicycle, taking it from each another and throwing bricks at each other. The 15-year-old ultimately took the bike. The younger boy left, and returned with at least one friend.
The argument continued in front of the older boy's house. The 12-year-old was given a handgun by his friend. The 15-year-old saw the gun and sprinted for his house, diving inside the door. He heard at least one shot.
The 12-year-old and his friend ran away. The 12-year-old was later arrested by police. His friend, who supplied the gun, was described as an older male. He was not apprehended, and the gun was not recovered.
Bias Crime or Biased Journalism?
A Hispanic mob beat a Bangladeshi man to death in Brooklyn Sunday. What it a bias crime? That depends which newspaper you read. The New York Times reports that "although several Bangladeshis and Hispanic residents interviewed yesterday in the neighborhood said there was some tension between the two groups, and the attacker was described as an Hispanic man, the police said they believed the attack--and others that night--stemmed from the initial dispute over the bicycle rather than from racial bias."The violence erupted in the neighborhood of East New York after a fight broke out over a stolen bicycle, police said. It allegedly began when a 12-year-old Bangladeshi American boy riding the bike accidentally grazed a Latino teen, who then stole the bike. The Bangladeshi American boy then called his friends for help. After a member of the Bangladeshi group was able to retrieve the bicycle, the fighting escalated and gunshots were fired, say authorities. According to investigators, the Latinos ? many of whom had allegedly been drinking earlier at the Dominican Day parade in Manhattan ? then began attacking Bangladeshi men they encountered at random. At least three were injured.
Prosecutors Say Dispute Over A Bicycle
POSTED: 1:13 pm CDT July 6, 2004
CHICAGO -- A Cook County judge has denied bail for a 16-year-old boy who has been accused of shooting a man after an apparent dispute over a bicycle.
Patrick Buchanan, of the 1500 block of South Karlov Avenue, appeared for the hearing at noon in Violence Court. He was charged as an adult with first-degree murder in the fatal shooting of Cordell Davidson, police News Affairs Officer Laura Kubiak said.
Davidson, 18, was shot around 3 p.m. on June 23 at 4032 W. 16th St., after an apparent dispute over a bicycle, Kubiak said. At least two witnesses identified Buchanan as Davidson's killer, Assistant State's Attorney Nick Kondelis said.
Witnesses said Davidson and the boy had been quarreling over the bicycle at 1614 S. Komensky Ave., Marquette District Lt. John Kenny said. The boy left the scene and returned a short while later with a handgun and fired an unknown number of shots at the victim, he added. The boy then allegedly ran off with the handgun.
When police arrived, they found the victim in the street with gunshot wounds to the chest and thigh, police News Affairs Sgt. Robert Cargie said.
8 people dead over bicycle disputes
You may have done the smart thing.
This just in:
Website forum users involved in theft
Posted 4:00 PM EDT July 21, 2004
CALIFORNIA - Members of the Anandtech forums took a trip to a boys house, took his belongings, and empties his savings account.
The boy involved in this case who identifies himself as surgicalshark says this, "I posted about a bicycle robbery on the forums and members of the forum decided to come to my house. Several members PMed me asking for my address. I replied and gave them my address as well as a time to meet."
The following day about 100 people showed up to his house and politely asked for the boys belongings including his TV, computers, clothes etc. SurgicalShark then invited them to take his belongings. One of the culprits asked for money afterwhich surgicalshark handed him his debit card along with the pin number.
"Heh... I was just looking for some change to get a busride back home... but heck, if he wanted me to have $10000 who was I to say no?" said the user who wouldn't identify himself.
Shortly after, SurgicalShark contacted the police and complained that he had been robbed.
"Well technically, we don't have a case... he allowed them to take the money. Oh and BTW, I asked the boy for his new Corvette and he gave me his keys, for FREE!"
----
Hehehe... I'm just joking OP. We are having a lot of fun in this thread... don't take it seriously. Maybe you did the right thing, if you think you did thats all that matters!
Website forum users involved in theft
Posted 4:00 PM EDT July 21, 2004
CALIFORNIA - Members of the Anandtech forums took a trip to a boys house, took his belongings, and empties his savings account.
The boy involved in this case who identifies himself as surgicalshark says this, "I posted about a bicycle robbery on the forums and members of the forum decided to come to my house. Several members PMed me asking for my address. I replied and gave them my address as well as a time to meet."
The following day about 100 people showed up to his house and politely asked for the boys belongings including his TV, computers, clothes etc. SurgicalShark then invited them to take his belongings. One of the culprits asked for money afterwhich surgicalshark handed him his debit card along with the pin number.
"Heh... I was just looking for some change to get a busride back home... but heck, if he wanted me to have $10000 who was I to say no?" said the user who wouldn't identify himself.
Shortly after, SurgicalShark contacted the police and complained that he had been robbed.
"Well technically, we don't have a case... he allowed them to take the money. Oh and BTW, I asked the boy for his new Corvette and he gave me his keys, for FREE!"
----
Hehehe... I'm just joking OP. We are having a lot of fun in this thread... don't take it seriously. Maybe you did the right thing, if you think you did thats all that matters!
I think half of you sissies who are saying they would have kicked is ass probably would have just shat themselves and proceded to run away embarassed.
While the whole thing is pretty funny it's sad that most of you are saying the guy deserves the bike. I hope you all get ripped off and come whining about it so we can say that they deserved what they stole.
While the whole thing is pretty funny it's sad that most of you are saying the guy deserves the bike. I hope you all get ripped off and come whining about it so we can say that they deserved what they stole.
BurnItDwn
Lifer
- Oct 10, 1999
- 26,355
- 1,867
- 126
hmm ... Beat him up and then steal his wallet and keys. Stuff his injured @ss in a dumpster or something, so when he comes to, he will think about what he did, and he will be very smelly (eww), and maybe change his ways.
I am being nice here, since I think anyone who is going to come into MY house and steal MY stuff should be killed on the spot no questions asked, however, the law does not necessarely agree with my personal opinions.
I am being nice here, since I think anyone who is going to come into MY house and steal MY stuff should be killed on the spot no questions asked, however, the law does not necessarely agree with my personal opinions.
I understand not wanting to try and jump the guy from fear of gun or knife. But you should have just confronted him about it and said that it was your bike. That would have caught him off guard and most likely he would have ran...or...well now you never know.
flashbacck
Golden Member
- Aug 3, 2001
- 1,921
- 0
- 76
That's true, but my point is that he would have done the same thing, regardless of what the guy was stealing. The guy probably could have been stealing his WIFE and the OP would have said something that didnt make any sense (see earlier remarks) and would have just stood there while the guy carted his stuff off.
Personally, i don't think the OP really thought the guy had a weapon on him. He was just scared of the confrontation. Personally, i'd rather fight, even at the risk of getting my ass royally kicked, because at least in the morning i can look myself in the mirror. I've backed down ONCE in my life, and even though it was nearly a decade ago, i've never forgotten it. Unless it puts others in danger, it will NEVER happen again.
So someone explain to me, if he was carrying the bike, what are his chances of pulling a knife or a gun for that matter when you take him to the ground and put him in a submission?
This definately sounds like a joke to me..
This definately sounds like a joke to me..
it's a bike dude, I would let the guy take it. If someone is desperate enough to steal a bike who knows what they would do? If it was my car, different story, my bike, forget it
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