Seattle autonomous zone

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zzyzxroad

Diamond Member
Jan 29, 2017
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Message from Seattle police chief to the fellow officers. I have no dog in this fight. Just getting what's going on out to you. She did not make the decision to abandon the precinct.

Is she getting her information from fox? Am I missing something in this story. Why did the her and her friends need to remove these protesters in the first place.
 

Vic

Elite Member
Jun 12, 2001
50,422
14,337
136
context

Isn't it interesting how over at 'fair and balanced" Fox news, openly armed protesters of one political persuasion are 'patriots upholding their sacred 1a and 2a rights' while even allegedly armed protesters of another political persuasion are 'bands of armed antifa militants?" I'm sure that's just a coincidence.

Anyway, seems like lots of sovereign citizens are getting triggered by the word autonomous.
 

Starbuck1975

Lifer
Jan 6, 2005
14,698
1,909
126
Interesting that they want to establish autonomy from the local government they overwhelmingly voted into office.
 

Vic

Elite Member
Jun 12, 2001
50,422
14,337
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Interesting that they want to establish autonomy from the local government they overwhelmingly voted into office.
You do know that just because you like to arbitrarily assign people into groups doesn't mean everyone within any of those groups is actually all the same, right?

And BTW, the SPD, just like every other big city police dept in the country, is overwhelmingly Republican. Something many don't seem to realize. And their unions have been bleeding our cities dry while their members have been acting unjustly towards the citizenry, often for political reasons. Maybe you should apologize for that.
 
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brandonbull

Diamond Member
May 3, 2005
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You do know that just because you like to arbitrarily assign people into groups doesn't mean everyone within any of those groups is actually all the same, right?

And BTW, the SPD, just like every other big city police dept in the country, is overwhelmingly Republican. Something many don't seem to realize. And their unions have been bleeding our cities dry while their members have been acting unjustly towards the citizenry, often for political reasons. Maybe you should apologize for that.

Awww. Did the poor little liberal just say something about not arbitrarily assigning people into groups? The Progressheviks are an amazing bunch. Russians and white neo notsees behind every corner.
 
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Feb 4, 2009
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Awww. Did the poor little liberal just say something about not arbitrarily assigning people into groups? The Progressheviks are an amazing bunch. Russians and white neo notsees behind every corner.

Your predictions are crap.
You refuse to man up and admit you were wrong.

 

Starbuck1975

Lifer
Jan 6, 2005
14,698
1,909
126
You do know that just because you like to arbitrarily assign people into groups doesn't mean everyone within any of those groups is actually all the same, right?

And BTW, the SPD, just like every other big city police dept in the country, is overwhelmingly Republican. Something many don't seem to realize. And their unions have been bleeding our cities dry while their members have been acting unjustly towards the citizenry, often for political reasons. Maybe you should apologize for that.
The people of Seattle should apologize to me for ruining what used to be a very cool city.
 
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shortylickens

No Lifer
Jul 15, 2003
80,287
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its so cute how the people brainwashed by Donald think everyone else is stupid.
Wait, not cute. Thats not the word for grownups acting psychotic.
Scary, thats the word.
 

Vic

Elite Member
Jun 12, 2001
50,422
14,337
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Awww. Did the poor little liberal just say something about not arbitrarily assigning people into groups? The Progressheviks are an amazing bunch. Russians and white neo notsees behind every corner.

The blatant hypocritical irony in this post is simply mindblowing. It seems that all you have to do is just pretend that I must arbitrarily assign people into groups because you've arbitrarily assigned me into some group. And then that justifies whatever fucking stupidity you can come up with to distract away from what I really said. Which is that your bias is showing.
 
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Vic

Elite Member
Jun 12, 2001
50,422
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The people of Seattle should apologize to me for ruining what used to be a very cool city.
As someone who lived in that city for many years, I think you're just bitter. True, my old house in Ballard really was torn down to build condos but people have to live somewhere and they choose to live in cities for a reason. Plus, that place was a dump.
 
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Starbuck1975

Lifer
Jan 6, 2005
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As someone who lived in that city for many years, I think you're just bitter. True, my old house in Ballard really was torn down to build condos but people have to live somewhere and they choose to lives in cities for a reason. Plus, that place was a dump.
I lived in and visited Seattle frequently for many years. It was once the blue collar city that gave us the Wilson Sisters, Jet City Woman and Jerry Cantrell. The home you referred to and the reasons it was torn down is more directly correlated to the inequity of our society than the police.
 

Vic

Elite Member
Jun 12, 2001
50,422
14,337
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I lived in and visited Seattle frequently for many years. It was once the blue collar city that gave us the Wilson Sisters, Jet City Woman and Jerry Cantrell. The home you referred to and the reasons it was torn down is more directly correlated to the inequity of our society than the police.

I disagree and I'll tell you why. Because I grew up in Portland and Seattle. I remember quite clearly what they were like in the 70s and 80s. And not through those rose-tinted glasses of yours but what they were really like. And it weren't that great. Crime and poverty were both way higher then than they are now. (Adjusted) wages may have been better for some, but interest rates were obscene which kept homeownership out of reach for most even as home prices were low. And during the late 80s recession, both cities were absolutely crushed with unemployment and homelessness even as property values and rents declined, and crime skyrocketed.
To say the cities are worse now is just crazy IMO.
 
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shortylickens

No Lifer
Jul 15, 2003
80,287
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I lived in and visited Seattle frequently for many years. It was once the blue collar city that gave us the Wilson Sisters, Jet City Woman and Jerry Cantrell. The home you referred to and the reasons it was torn down is more directly correlated to the inequity of our society than the police.

Dont forget Ray Charles.
He was unable to be discovered in the hideously racist deep south. Seattle welcomed him with open arms and made him a star.
 

Starbuck1975

Lifer
Jan 6, 2005
14,698
1,909
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I disagree and I'll tell you why. Because I grew up in Portland and Seattle. I remember quite clearly what they were like in the 70s and 80s. And not through those rose-tinted glasses of yours but what they were really like. And it weren't that great. Crime and poverty were both way higher then than they are now. (Adjusted) wages may have been better for some, but interest rates were obscene which kept homeownership out of reach for most even as home prices were low. And during the late 80s recession, both cities were absolutely crushed with unemployment and homelessness even as property values and rents declined, and crime skyrocketed.
To say the cities are worse now is just crazy IMO.
That is true for most American cities, I remember a time when Times Square and Penn Station were not safe. The rise of the law and order police state was largely in response to those conditions, and the autonomy zone in Seattle is going to evoke comparisons to those times, inadvertently undermining the very cause for the movement.
 

Vic

Elite Member
Jun 12, 2001
50,422
14,337
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That is true for most American cities, I remember a time when Times Square and Penn Station were not safe. The rise of the law and order police state was largely in response to those conditions, and the autonomy zone in Seattle is going to evoke comparisons to those times, inadvertently undermining the very cause for the movement.

If you're so concerned about the effects of right-wing propaganda, maybe you should blame the right-wing propagandists spreading it.
 
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pauldun170

Diamond Member
Sep 26, 2011
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That is true for most American cities, I remember a time when Times Square and Penn Station were not safe. The rise of the law and order police state was largely in response to those conditions, and the autonomy zone in Seattle is going to evoke comparisons to those times, inadvertently undermining the very cause for the movement.

I remember helping my sister move into mid town Manhattan back in the "bad times" in 1990.
Dinkins (acknowledging the leg work done under Koch) deserved credit for changing Time Square and Penn Station, the places that "Tourists" have memories of. Rezoning combined with a many factors led to cleaning up that area. "The Police State" that existed prior was not much different than the one that came after the revitalization of Time Square and Penn.
Crime rates in Brooklyn, Queens, the Bronx is another matter

If rezoning never occurred, it would not have mattered how many cops flooded that area.
 

pauldun170

Diamond Member
Sep 26, 2011
9,323
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An old NYT artical from 1995

Crime in New York City is dropping. And dropping fast.
Murders, which had been falling gradually over the previous three years, dropped sharply, by nearly a fifth, in 1994. Over all, 350 fewer people were slain in 1994 than in the year before, and 650 fewer than in 1990, when murders, many of them fueled by the crack epidemic, reached a peak.
Shootings dropped by more than 15 percent, the latest police statistics show. And virtually every type of reported felony declined in frequency last year, with auto theft, grand larceny, burglary and robbery all dropping by better than 10 percent.
True, violent crime remains a constant menace of city life. The nearly 1,600 homicides that were committed in 1994 are still about four times the 390 killings that the city recorded in 1960. And a growing number of crimes are committed by teen-agers, whose vicious and often random acts of violence have raised fear to a level that statistics cannot overcome.

But coming after the staggering increases in crimes through the late 1980's -- a lethal period that culminated in mid-1990 with a string of senseless killings and a tabloid headline plea to Mayor David N. Dinkins to "Do Something, Dave" -- the latest figures show a surprising reversal.

...

Even Mayor Rudolph W. Giuliani, who took office with a pledge to crack down on street-level drug dealing and a variety of "quality of life" offenses, says his policies and the aggressive tactics of Police Commissioner William J. Bratton can explain only about half the decline in crime rates.

"Nobody can be sure exactly what is going on," he said in an interview last week.


• Violent crime in New York began falling three years before Giuliani took office in 1994, U.S. Justice Department records show. Property crime began falling four years before. The decline accelerated during his administration, but the "turnaround" he claims credit for started before him.

• New York was no anomaly, but was part of a trend that saw crime fall sharply nationwide in the 1990s, particularly in big cities. The city with the best record for reducing violent crime during this period? San Francisco.

• Independent studies generally have failed to link the tactics of the Giuliani administration with the large decrease in crime rates.



As for what happens when the Police stay home and take a break from bad policing
 

Jaskalas

Lifer
Jun 23, 2004
35,412
9,606
136
Fox News would have us believe Seattle has fallen to Left Wing Terrorists, and the military needs to move in and put them all down.

Their viewers are in a panic that such anarchy is coming soon to a city near them. And they need a stockpile of guns to protect them from the Left.