SCOTUS further destroys separation of church and state

[VashHT]

Hoping the church of satan goes hog wild with this one and plans ritual sacrifices or some shit at a football game. I fully expect this shit to get worse and we head towards a theocratic fascist state.

 

[fskimospy]

For the 'SCOTUS would never do X' crowd - in this opinion the majority simply rewrote the factual record here, basing their decision on demonstrably false 'facts'. They claimed he took a minute of his private time to quietly pray when what he really did was loudly lead students in prayer at midfield.

So... when they decided the law didn't support the outcome they wanted based on the facts they just made up new facts.

 

[Pens1566]

For the 'SCOTUS would never do X' crowd - in this opinion the majority simply rewrote the factual record here, basing their decision on demonstrably false 'facts'. They claimed he took a minute of his private time to quietly pray when what he really did was loudly lead students in prayer at midfield.

So... when they decided the law didn't support the outcome they wanted based on the facts they just made up new facts.

Also "outside his official duties". Last time I checked, extra-curricular activities are still school affiliated activities.

Complete fabrication of the situation.

 

[HomerJS]

Meanwhile no protections for Muslims when Trump tries to ban them and Rastafarians when they want to practice their religion.

Those fascists want a white Christian nation only

 

[SteveGrabowski]

If (big if) Trump wins in '24 and Betsy DeVos gets a repeat posting, in such a scenario I can see another victory for the conservative elite whereby much more of the nation's wealth is going to be directed away from our public school system in favor of those exclusive private schools, especially those religiously affiliated ones whereby a much wider economic gap will occur between the privileged and peasant classes, all endorsed by our present SCOTUS conservative majority.

Of course, this will all transpire with the approval of the Repub working class folks of whom are devoid of any sense that they will suffer along with the majority of the nation of whom these conservatives have this strange compunction to punish and eradicate out of their lives.

Pretty gross how they have used abortion for decades to convince the uneducated to vote for tax cuts for billionaires and millionaires.

 

[fskimospy]

So now public employees have a first amendment right to lead students in public endorsement of their preferred religion on public grounds during publicly funded events.

Imagine arguing that the school district has a first amendment obligation to permit the coach to give a speech endorsing LGBT rights. Would never happen. Religious liberty is now a super-right, standing above all other first amendment rights.

 

[fskimospy]

Also "outside his official duties". Last time I checked, extra-curricular activities are still school affiliated activities.

Complete fabrication of the situation.

Yes, in fact coaches are often paid for this extra work. They just made shit up.

 

[K1052]

Christian (only the good kind of course) liberty is now a super-right, standing above all other first amendment rights.

FTFY

 

[Pens1566]

So now public employees have a first amendment right to lead students in public endorsement of their preferred religion on public grounds during publicly funded events.

Imagine arguing that the school district has a first amendment obligation to permit the coach to give a speech endorsing LGBT rights. Would never happen. Religious liberty is now a super-right, standing above all other first amendment rights.

FTFY

Which will be super obvious when they just deny cert to the pending challenges (if they fail) from Jewish individuals that their religious beliefs are being trampled by this ruling.

 

[trenchfoot]

Pretty gross how they have used abortion for decades to convince the uneducated to vote for tax cuts for billionaires and millionaires.

The Repubs, through exploiting gerrymandering, "voter rights" issues and other such nefarious means at the state level, have virtually turned their states into dictatorships, especially those in the impoverished south, making things that much easier for their ruling class to pull off. Having an indentured working class beholden to their corporate masters is any dictator's dream come true.

 

[gothuevos]

Don't have a problem with this in principle, as long as it is not forced on students. Yes I know high school kids are impressionable and players want to impress the coach for more playing time, but this is where it's important to try to raise confident, well adjusted kids.

Public hospitals announce ____ prayer hour over the PA for anyone who wants to attend.

Would it be the same if it was a Muslim coach leading prayer? I'm not sure, but it is what it is.

 

[fskimospy]

Which will be super obvious when they just deny cert to the pending challenges (if they fail) from Jewish individuals that their religious beliefs are being trampled by this ruling.

Yes, anyone who thinks SCOTUS is going to require access to abortion for anyone who claims to have a sincere religious requirement for it is delusional. They will invent whatever reasoning they need to declare it magically doesn't count there.

 

[fskimospy]

Don't have a problem with this in principle, as long as it is not forced on students. Yes I know high school kids are impressionable and players want to impress the coach for more playing time, but this is where it's important to try to raise confident, well adjusted kids.

Public hospitals announce ____ prayer hour over the PA for anyone who wants to attend.

Would it be the same if it was a Muslim coach leading prayer? I'm not sure, but it is what it is.

Courts have long held that public schools/facilities can offer time for prayer so long as they don't specifically endorse a religion.

This ruling is that public schools are REQUIRED to permit public employees to lead students in sectarian religious practices on public grounds during publicly financed events.

 

[pmv]

Those fascists want a white Christian nation only

I find it interesting how racialised Christianity seems to have become in the US. It's as if something happened to it when it crossed the Atlantic, and it cross-fertilized with white supremacy. Seems there are lots of manifestations of that - things like the "Christian Identity Movement" that was the ancestor of much of the far-right, or the overlap between the push for Christianity in schools and segregation.
I reckon it has everything to do with the centrality of slavery to the early US economy.

In the US a lot of white Christians seemed to interpret their beliefs very differently to the likes of the Clapham Sect or John Brown, and other religiously-motivated abolitionists, instead morphing Christianity to be compatible with a system of slavery,

 

[Sunburn74]

Courts have long held that public schools/facilities can offer time for prayer so long as they don't specifically endorse a religion.

This ruling is that public schools are REQUIRED to permit public employees to lead students in sectarian religious practices on public grounds during publicly financed events.

This is the craziest ruling yet. It makes zero sense. Also if you're a non Christian kid and you're trying to make the team or get playing time and your coach is out there praying up a storm and it's against your beliefs to join him him, what are you supposed to do? I mean from a practical standpoint its just wrong.

 

[HomerJS]

Don't have a problem with this in principle, as long as it is not forced on students. Yes I know high school kids are impressionable and players want to impress the coach for more playing time, but this is where it's important to try to raise confident, well adjusted kids.

Public hospitals announce ____ prayer hour over the PA for anyone who wants to attend.

Would it be the same if it was a Muslim coach leading prayer? I'm not sure, but it is what it is.

Don't have a problem with this in principle, as long as it is not forced on students. Yes I know high school kids are impressionable and players want to impress the coach for more playing time, but this is where it's important to try to raise confident, well adjusted kids.

Public hospitals announce ____ prayer hour over the PA for anyone who wants to attend.

Would it be the same if it was a Muslim coach leading prayer? I'm not sure, but it is what it is.

Not sure? Do you recall this history of conservatives. Have they ever stood up for Muslims?

 

[gothuevos]

This is the craziest ruling yet. It makes zero sense. Also if you're a non Christian kid and you're trying to make the team or get playing time and your coach is out there praying up a storm and it's against your beliefs to join him him, what are you supposed to do? I mean from a practical standpoint its just wrong.

Look, I get it. And I agree. The amount of peer pressure will be tremendous. But it would be impossible to prove that was the reason for discrimination/retaliation unless the coach explicitly said it was ("join in this prayer or you're off the team). That's how they know they would be legally shielded.

Although with this SCOTUS they would probably rule even an outright act of discrimination/retaliation simply as religious freedom so who knows?? All I know is that there's nothing we can do to stop it at this point.

 

[quikah]

I find it interesting how racialised Christianity seems to have become in the US. It's as if something happened to it when it crossed the Atlantic, and it cross-fertilized with white supremacy. Seems there are lots of manifestations of that - things like the "Christian Identity Movement" that was the ancestor of much of the far-right, or the overlap between the push for Christianity in schools and segregation.
I reckon it has everything to do with the centrality of slavery to the early US economy.

In the US a lot of white Christians seemed to interpret their beliefs very differently to the likes of the Clapham Sect or John Brown, and other religiously-motivated abolitionists, instead morphing Christianity to be compatible with a system of slavery,

US Evangelical Christianity is based on Puritanism which is mostly based on Calvinism. Calvinism is a purely evil form of Christianity IMO. They believe that everyone has already been preselected for heaven or hell regardless of what they do. Since they are already going to heaven in their minds, anything they do must be with god's blessing.

 

[SteveGrabowski]

I find it interesting how racialised Christianity seems to have become in the US. It's as if something happened to it when it crossed the Atlantic, and it cross-fertilized with white supremacy. Seems there are lots of manifestations of that - things like the "Christian Identity Movement" that was the ancestor of much of the far-right, or the overlap between the push for Christianity in schools and segregation.
I reckon it has everything to do with the centrality of slavery to the early US economy.

In the US a lot of white Christians seemed to interpret their beliefs very differently to the likes of the Clapham Sect or John Brown, and other religiously-motivated abolitionists, instead morphing Christianity to be compatible with a system of slavery,

The largest American evangelical sect, the Southern Baptist Convention, was created in 1845 specifically in support of slavery.

 

[K1052]

Look at the horse shit the conservatives on the court want you to swallow

https://twitter.com/x/status/1541462264221519873

 

[hal2kilo]

Don't have a problem with this in principle, as long as it is not forced on students. Yes I know high school kids are impressionable and players want to impress the coach for more playing time, but this is where it's important to try to raise confident, well adjusted kids.

Public hospitals announce ____ prayer hour over the PA for anyone who wants to attend.

Would it be the same if it was a Muslim coach leading prayer? I'm not sure, but it is what it is.

From you? I'm shocked.

 

[brycejones]

Christian Religious liberty is now a super-right, standing above all other first amendment rights.

Ftfy

 

[brycejones]

I find it interesting how racialised Christianity seems to have become in the US. It's as if something happened to it when it crossed the Atlantic, and it cross-fertilized with white supremacy. Seems there are lots of manifestations of that - things like the "Christian Identity Movement" that was the ancestor of much of the far-right, or the overlap between the push for Christianity in schools and segregation.
I reckon it has everything to do with the centrality of slavery to the early US economy.

In the US a lot of white Christians seemed to interpret their beliefs very differently to the likes of the Clapham Sect or John Brown, and other religiously-motivated abolitionists, instead morphing Christianity to be compatible with a system of slavery,

In the South it was part of the system of control. Slaves were “converted” and taught they needed to obey their masters in this life to be rewarded in heaven. If they didn’t they would go to hell. That authoritarian ideal has remained in southern evangelicalism ever since.

 

[ch33zw1z]

US Evangelical Christianity is based on Puritanism which is mostly based on Calvinism. Calvinism is a purely evil form of Christianity IMO. They believe that everyone has already been preselected for heaven or hell regardless of what they do. Since they are already going to heaven in their minds, anything they do must be with god's blessing.

not all evangelicals believe that though. In my evangelical Christian upbringing, I went to Christian school grade 8-12. I was taught outside of the school that “backsliding “ was a thing, but none of my classmates were. They were taught predestination, a completely new idea to me when exposed, and it seemed like a pile of hogwash designed to excuse atrocious behaviors. And wouldn’t you know it, that’s how they behaved. I very much remember the few debates we had about it.

 

[quikah]

not all evangelicals believe that though. In my evangelical Christian upbringing, I went to Christian school grade 8-12. I was taught outside of the school that “backsliding “ was a thing, but none of my classmates were. They were taught predestination, a completely new idea to me when exposed, and it seemed like a pile of hogwash designed to excuse atrocious behaviors. And wouldn’t you know it, that’s how they behaved. I very much remember the few debates we had about it.

Mea culpa. I just always want to point out how vile Calvinism is. It is very unfortunate that so much of our countries values have been tainted by them. I can respect Christian values / arguments as long as they don't start with the Calvinist BS. When I was taught about the reformation in HS I was horrified when we got to Calvin.