Say goodbye to ISIS: Airstrikes begin in Syria

[squarecut1]

"ISIS is far more serious a threat". "We must destroy ISIS". "No safe haven"

I'd say we're about March 1965, when we weren't going to have a major conflict either.

I think that is a good analogy. The rhetoric is getting more dangerous. People like Boehner and other prominent people are already openly calling for ground troops. This can get very ugly.

 

[Angry Irishman]

The airstrikes are only as good as those directing the activity from the ground. There are not enough controllers on the ground to be effective and we gave ISIS way too much time to prepare for these strikes....we were busy advertising to the world that we didn't have a strategy in place yet. Also using Syrian rebels as our boots on the ground is going to fail miserably and we will complicate the situation even further.

That said, I've seen enough of our ground troops in that part of the world, I having been one of them. It is now a situation that "is what it is" and we'll be dealing with it for years and years to come.

 

[squarecut1]

The UK parliament is having a rigorous debate on getting involved in the air strikes. UK, which is barely even a side show in this thing.

Jon Stewart blasted the Ds and Rs for avoiding any debate or vote, because they don't know how it will play out in the election year.

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Democratic leaders in the Senate and Republican leaders in the House want to avoid a public vote to authorize force, fearing the unknown political consequences eight weeks before the midterm elections on Nov. 4.

“A lot of people would like to stay on the sideline and say, ‘Just bomb the place and tell us about it later,’ ” said Representative Jack Kingston, Republican of Georgia, who supports having an authorization vote. “It’s an election year. A lot of Democrats don’t know how it would play in their party, and Republicans don’t want to change anything. We like the path we’re on now. We can denounce it if it goes bad, and praise it if it goes well and ask what took him so long.”

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http://www.nytimes.com/2014/09/09/u...vided-on-campaign-against-militants.html?_r=0

This is American democracy in action. These cowards are our "leaders".

It is fair to say that there won't even be a debate in the Congress. The Congressional leaders are saying that Obama should call a Congress session for debate - even though Reid and Boehner have authority to call their respective sessions. But they won't do it. Obama won't call it because he doesn't want debate either, not knowing how it will play out for the Dems. It is quite sickening - everything is a political calculation.

 

[squarecut1]

The public does not care if we bomb from the skies or even put ground troops in - the troops after all are a tiny segment of the population. The masses at large are busy with their new Iphone 6.

Time to institute a national draft. Everyone should participate, and see and experience what war is like. Every congress person who is in favor of war should have their offspring serve in the war. Same goes for the offspring for all the major executives of defense companies.

 

[Nebor]

http://www.smbc-comics.com/?id=3496

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

The public does not care if we bomb from the skies or even put ground troops in - the troops after all are a tiny segment of the population. The masses at large are busy with their new Iphone 6.

Time to institute a national draft. Everyone should participate, and see and experience what war is like. Every congress person who is in favor of war should have their offspring serve in the war. Same goes for the offspring for all the major executives of defense companies.

I'm not sure that would matter much, but I do have an alternative. People cannot buy new iphones while there is armed conflict that the US is engaging in. There would be peace.

 

[Orignal Earl]

The airstrikes are only as good as those directing the activity from the ground. There are not enough controllers on the ground to be effective and we gave ISIS way too much time to prepare for these strikes....we were busy advertising to the world that we didn't have a strategy in place yet. Also using Syrian rebels as our boots on the ground is going to fail miserably and we will complicate the situation even further.

That said, I've seen enough of our ground troops in that part of the world, I having been one of them. It is now a situation that "is what it is" and we'll be dealing with it for years and years to come.

It's best not to use US controllers. You need people familiar with what's going on, on the ground
Example. US was ready to strike targets they thought were planting IED's
Called in Iraqi Army to make sure, and the targets were actually just turning on irrigation systems they keep buried until they need to use them

May I ask what you did in Iraq ?

 

[peonyu]

Waste of resources. The muslim cockroaches will just join other groups and morph those into fanatical allah-killers to. Atleast Assad kept his boot on their ugly bearded faces, we should back him up instead.

 

[MongGrel]

Islamic State fighters are threatening to overrun Iraq’s Anbar province

http://www.washingtonpost.com/world...b302f0-84e4-4d73-b220-2d91161363e5_story.html

 

[squarecut1]

Now that the genie is out of the bottle, the Arabs will have to sort things out between themselves in Iraq, Syria and other places. It's not going to be a peaceful change, just like it wasn't in Europe. It's going to be a long, bloody road.

 

[MongGrel]

Won't go there again.

NM

 

[Harabec]

Islamic State fighters are threatening to overrun Iraq’s Anbar province

http://www.washingtonpost.com/world...b302f0-84e4-4d73-b220-2d91161363e5_story.html

More tribal and religious fighting.
Let them fight - it is not your (The US and the rest of the world's) war. Why keep two top predators from natural competition? One side wins, one side loses, history moves on.

 

[Fern]

More tribal and religious fighting.
Let them fight - it is not your (The US and the rest of the world's) war. Why keep two top predators from natural competition? One side wins, one side loses, history moves on.

Do you think ISIS will stop at just Syria and Iraq?

Fern

 

[bradly1101]

More tribal and religious fighting.
Let them fight - it is not your (The US and the rest of the world's) war. Why keep two top predators from natural competition? One side wins, one side loses, history moves on.

I agree about the causes and the belief that it is not our fight, but the vacuum created by Operation Iraqi Freedom and the 'Arab Spring' which we encouraged brings this war right to our door. And we step over the threshold and into the fight because of the oil at risk.

Bad people are doing bad things all over the world and many want to draw us in, fight us and defeat us. We're just giving them what they want. We haven't really succeeded over there. Can/Should we be the world's police? We are already sliding into a police state at home.

 

[Jaskalas]

Do you think ISIS will stop at just Syria and Iraq?

Fern

Most of their present territory is within their own loyal Sunni population. They may fight to claim the entirety of the nations they are presently in, but to continue their spread beyond that requires a significant loyalist population in the threatened country.

They might have friends in Jordan or Suadi Arabia, but Turkey and Iran are probably off limits.

 

[squarecut1]

From here
http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?p=36797485

Indeed, there is no clear division in Islam between state and church. But what I'm saying is that acts that make the news have nothing to do with Islam. No strand of Islam allows beheading of a journalist or aid worker. Groups like ISIS do not have backing of any properly trained scholars of Islam. Their Islam is self taught and applied, since they have no scholars with credentials in their midst. Same goes for groups like Al-Qaeda or Al Shabab. They have nothing going for them in the long run. For now, they are exploiting the immense inner anger in their societies against the tyrannical dictators, the actions of the west, and so on. But by the very nature of such groups, they lose support over time and burn out.

 

[squarecut1]

Of course if we keep bombing, that would only draw more recruits to them. Such is the anger in the Arab lands towrds American government's foreign policy, the invasion of Iraq, and its unqualified support to Israel's actions

 

[Abwx]

Most of their present territory is within their own loyal Sunni population. They may fight to claim the entirety of the nations they are presently in, but to continue their spread beyond that requires a significant loyalist population in the threatened country.

When you have a few thousands psychopaths hanging in your city i dont think that you can express any disagreement, even if havily armed...

Meanwhile, in Damascus, photos from a russian journalist..

http://www.lemonde.fr/proche-orient...-vitrine-de-bachar-al-assad_4503817_3218.html

 

[Harabec]

Do you think ISIS will stop at just Syria and Iraq?

Fern

Hmm...yes. As it is, they have no way of successfully attacking and spreading into areas with actual power - Turkey, Iran, Israel...not sure about Jordan.
The US and allies are forcing themselves into a fight - once again - and are forcing ISIS to focus on THEM instead of just the local ME area. This is how you make the next 9\11.

As to the post about ISIS not being Islamic - pooh! history will write them down as Islamic, that is their banner and how they present themselves. If the rest of Islam wishes to distance itself from the barbaric horde, it may wish to try harder.
So far this is simply the 3495786th reincarnation of the Sunni vs Shia war.

 

[Abwx]

So far this is simply the 3495786th reincarnation of the Sunni vs Shia war.

You mean criminals that were entirely raised and financed by western countries and retarded gulf kingdoms.?.

Was there shias in Lybia.?.

 

[Angry Irishman]

It's best not to use US controllers. You need people familiar with what's going on, on the ground
Example. US was ready to strike targets they thought were planting IED's
Called in Iraqi Army to make sure, and the targets were actually just turning on irrigation systems they keep buried until they need to use them

May I ask what you did in Iraq ?

Its best to use both. The Iraqi's aren't trained well enough or effective. I was USAF...

 

[Jaskalas]

With ISIS eight miles from Baghdad, Iraqis beg for US ground forces.

 

[Knowing]

Can we get a show of hands: Who originally believed we wouldn't have boots on ground? Who still believes this?

Who doesn't understand that some of the foreign fighters (that we armed) are members of radical groups linked to AQ, and that AQ and ISIS changed their relationship status to "it's complicated" just early this year?

Generally speaking when we screw the pooch, it's by arming rebels that we feel the burning desire to fight a decade or so later. We're really accelerating this by arming them in Syria and then fighting them in Syria and Iraq.

 

[squarecut1]

Generally speaking when we screw the pooch, it's by arming rebels that we feel the burning desire to fight a decade or so later. We're really accelerating this by arming them in Syria and then fighting them in Syria and Iraq.

Yup, like in Afghanistan, where the good guys and freedom fighters of yesterday are the bad guys of today. It's always the same story. As I said, this is a self perpetuating, never ending conflict.

 

[Genx87]

With ISIS eight miles from Baghdad, Iraqis beg for US ground forces.

The OP should change the title of this thread. Clearly we arent saying goodbye to ISIS.