"salary commensurate with experience"...let's not waste anyone's time

[dfuze]

Since they were only looking for a 15 minute phone call I would have just gone with it and discussed what you wanted during that call. I'm not surprised they recinded the interview offer.

 

[Stuxnet]

Sorry, that was pretty unprofessional. Recruiters/scum-suckers piss me off as much as the next person, but they're a fact of life in IT and you need to learn to work with them. It would have taken 5 minutes to call her and get a feel for the position. Recruiters don't want their time wasted anymore than you do yours, and they're generally pretty good about giving you a ballpark salary within the first discussion.

 

[Capt Caveman]

i think OP's response is fine and would be appreciative of the directness, but i am of the same mold that time=money. however, i might not be in the majority, as other posters are replying with. i dont see it as arrogance, he isn't talking down to anyone, he is giving explicit facts, though terse. in all honesty, the person shouldnt be making demands of the OP (not that he is) considering it is a cold call to begin with.

And without knowing the OP(from interviewing), the company can not make a decision to re-level or re-budget the position if they decide that they truly desire to hire him.

 

[mizzou]

What a horrible email. Do you have aspergers?

You couldnt think of any other way to beat around the bush? If i were a HR rep or in charge of hiring, poor communication and people skills is a huge deterrant in any job class, especially IT.

At least try to make your letter sound reasonable and well written. That was pathetic lol.

I just can't imagine anyone being really appreciative of that tone, other than to not waste their time interviewing you.

I think the problem is you are half heartedly searching. Also, why give them a specific salary? Make them give you a reasonable offer and then you decide when to walk away.

.........i will admit i used that tone when i last bought a car and it was the best deal i ever got because eventually the dealer got back with me and sold me the car at my price

 

[Mike Gayner]

Never, never, never ever give a number first. That job could have paid twice what you're making or want but you just told them how low you would work for.

While spidey is almost always wrong on virtually any issue he ever comments on, this is actually correct.

 

[IndyColtsFan]

I had an interview for a consulting position today. They asked me my salary requirements and I gave them a range and told them that I couldn't pin it down to a more specific number until I learned more about their perks and benefits. They seemed fine with that answer and I have a second interview next week.

 

[spidey07]

I had an interview for a consulting position today. They asked me my salary requirements and I gave them a range and told them that I couldn't pin it down to a more specific number until I learned more about their perks and benefits. They seemed fine with that answer and I have a second interview next week.

Take what you're making now and double it. That's should be what you make as a true consultant.

 

[IndyColtsFan]

Take what you're making now and double it. That's should be what you make as a true consultant.

That isn't realistic given my current compensation package unless I am an independent consultant and then I'd expect 2 to 3 times what I make.

 

[pmv]

You never know if that position you are being called about is the only position available with the company, or if you can impress them so much that you convince them to pay beyond their original intent.

In my mind, it never pays to turn off a potential lead without at least talking to them.

What does it cost you but a few minutes of your time?

Logically the same applies in reverse - It never pays to turn off a potential good employee by being annoyingly opaque about what salary you might be offering. Why should the potential employee have to waste their time (surely an interview involves more than a few minutes)?

Presumably the convention works the first way rather than the latter because in the job market the balance of power tips the company's way. Its more about them choosing you than you choosing them.

Its all about relative power, surely?

 

[Rage187]

Your letter could have been better but I sense you have been burned before and feel your pain. I've had plenty of job recruiters waste my time even when I made sure to give them a ballpark number during the first call, so we didn't have to go through everything.

Nonetheless, it is amazing how many company's go shopping for a Lexus when they budget for a Kia.

 

[Lifted]

I'm sure I'm repeating others here, but that is the wrong way to go about things.

1) You are looking for a full time gig, so this is not a waste of your time. 20 minutes is really wasting your time when you are looking for a full time job?

2) Instead of impressing them enough so that they make you an offer and then agree to whatever your counter offer is, you basically put the nail in your coffin and will never hear from them. First you wow them, then you make them pay. If you are incapable of wowing them, then it doesn't really matter as you wouldn't have specified up front that you refuse to work for anything less than $x.

Now you know interview basics 101 and will not fuck up your next offer for an interview.

 

[FeuerFrei]

Your response gives me the impression you were raised on the internet with it's notorious lack of civility and lack finesse in interpersonal affairs.

By even uttering the term "waste of time" you're making them second-guess interviewing you. I wouldn't even go there. I'd just act grateful for an audience with the CIO and request clarification on the position type before proceeding.

And harping on salary expectations makes you seem all about the money rather than personal fit with the company.

The concluding sentence also comes across as sarcastic.

That's my take.

*ok just read her reply - not surprised hehe

 

[alkemyst]

I'm sure I'm repeating others here, but that is the wrong way to go about things.

1) You are looking for a full time gig, so this is not a waste of your time. 20 minutes is really wasting your time when you are looking for a full time job?

2) Instead of impressing them enough so that they make you an offer and then agree to whatever your counter offer is, you basically put the nail in your coffin and will never hear from them. First you wow them, then you make them pay. If you are incapable of wowing them, then it doesn't really matter as you wouldn't have specified up front that you refuse to work for anything less than $x.

Now you know interview basics 101 and will not fuck up your next offer for an interview.

20 mins? I'd be lucky if one way just to the interview site was 20 mins.

As someone technical my last few interviews have all been measured in an hour or more...usually about 2.

It's best to know upfront if they are at least in the ballpark salary-wise.

I have had one actually comment when I needed at least $25/hr back around the late 90s that "I can hire a 16 year old for less than half that".

I told them good luck with that.

 

[Lifted]

Just got a reply:

Wow, didn't even see that before.

Hopefully you've learned a valuable lesson here.

 

[GundamW]

Just got a reply:

Quote:
Wheresmybacon,

Thank you, we will forgo the interview process with you.

Somelady

You reply:

I am hungry, SomeLady. Where's My Bacon?

 

[angminas]

Hi Somelady. Thank you for your prompt reply. In the continued interest of expediency, I would like to make certain that we are both looking for the same thing. Please allow me to clarify a couple of points.

First- this is a full-time position and not a contract, correct?

Also, based on my experience and what I'm currently making, I'm looking for positions offering compensation in the range of about $X/hour or approximately $X/year. If that's in the ballpark for what this position will offer, I'll be happy to call you on my next break, which will be at approximately time o'clock time zone.

If our goals do not match up at this time, then I wish you luck in your search for the right candidate. Thank you for your consideration, and please feel free to contact me in the future with other offers.

Regards,

Neverburnabridge Duetolazycommunication

 

[wheresmybacon]

Hi Somelady. Thank you for your prompt reply. In the continued interest of expediency, I would like to make certain that we are both looking for the same thing. Please allow me to clarify a couple of points.

First- this is a full-time position and not a contract, correct?

Also, based on my experience and what I'm currently making, I'm looking for positions offering compensation in the range of about $X/hour or approximately $X/year. If that's in the ballpark for what this position will offer, I'll be happy to call you on my next break, which will be at approximately time o'clock time zone.

If our goals do not match up at this time, then I wish you luck in your search for the right candidate. Thank you for your consideration, and please feel free to contact me in the future with other offers.

Regards,

Neverburnabridge Duetolazycommunication

Much much better. I agree here.

 

[Tweak155]

What I found annoying during my last job interview is I specified $x to $y and they were like lets interview - asking me if I was negotiable. I said sure depending on benefits, etc.

Well they came back trying to match my current benefits (but still couldn't) and came in at $1k under my minimum. I said add to it or no thanks. They came back and wouldn't even add $1k. I said peace, I'm not working for less than I feel I'm worth (in line with the job description).

 

[Gibson486]

Lol...you pretty much burned bridges...

 

[alkemyst]

What I found annoying during my last job interview is I specified $x to $y and they were like lets interview - asking me if I was negotiable. I said sure depending on benefits, etc.

Well they came back trying to match my current benefits (but still couldn't) and came in at $1k under my minimum. I said add to it or no thanks. They came back and wouldn't even add $1k. I said peace, I'm not working for less than I feel I'm worth (in line with the job description).

I can't say I ever had a job that was made or broken over a grand.

Benefits yeah. I have taken pay cuts for opportunities. I think once you begin to get over $70-75k, sometimes your next salary may not be as important as benefits.

My current company used to contribute 10% of W2 earnings to a pension, that was cut recently due to a merger...we still get 50% up to 5% total match on the 401K and now are opened up to a ROTH IRA as an option.

401K matching is a great overlooked benefit. It doesn't seem like a lot on paper, but it really adds up.

Today I really look for corporate culture more than chasing paychecks though.

 

[poopaskoopa]

Nothing wrong with asking, but you'll gain more by changing your tone.

 

[D1gger]

Logically the same applies in reverse - It never pays to turn off a potential good employee by being annoyingly opaque about what salary you might be offering. Why should the potential employee have to waste their time (surely an interview involves more than a few minutes)?

Presumably the convention works the first way rather than the latter because in the job market the balance of power tips the company's way. Its more about them choosing you than you choosing them.

Its all about relative power, surely?

You have it completely backwards. In todays job market yes, the employers have all the power, and they use that power to pick and choose the best employee. They also have many many potential employees to choose from, so it is easy to dismiss someone from the list for being perceived to have a bad attitude.

The OP gave the company an easy way to dismiss him and move on to the next candidate, while he did not even give them a chance by talking with them for 20 or 25 minutes to ask the questions he wanted to ask in a less confrontational manner.

 

[RedCOMET]

Benefits yeah. I have taken pay cuts for opportunities. I think once you begin to get over $70-75k, sometimes your next salary may not be as important as benefits.
<snip>
401K matching is a great overlooked benefit. It doesn't seem like a lot on paper, but it really adds up.

Yeah, 401K matching is awesome. If my previous employer didn't do that, I wouldn't have invested as much into my 401k.

I had an interview for a consulting position today. They asked me my salary requirements and I gave them a range and told them that I couldn't pin it down to a more specific number until I learned more about their perks and benefits. They seemed fine with that answer and I have a second interview next week.

Exactly. I have used that line more than once myself when looking at firms that were upfront about asking for salary expectations. To me, a big fat salary is great, but salary is just one component of a compensation package. Its the perks / benefits / intangibles, that can make up for a lower salary.

OP.

Always be polite when dealing with company representatives. Like others have said, its easier to be polite and not burn bridges than burn the bridge and try to repair them. Lesson learned.

 

[IndyColtsFan]

401K matching is a great overlooked benefit. It doesn't seem like a lot on paper, but it really adds up.

My benefits now are extremely good and that is why it will be tough to leave. We get a 100&#37; match on the first 3% we contribute, a 50% on the next 2% we contribute, and on top of that, they contribute an amount equal to 10% of your salary to the 401K. Plus I don't have to pay any premiums for my health insurance and there are tons of other perks too (you can get loans at 1% under the going rate, free legal advice/work on basic things like wills, etc). It is a great place to work (people are shocked when they find out where I work but want to leave) but I want exposure to more things and a bigger paycheck. If it comes down to leaving and they counter, I'd seriously consider staying even though I have always said you never accept a counter.

 

[wheresmybacon]

I agree the tone of my email was bad. It could've been written in such a way as to communicate my requirements without coming off as arrogant. I failed there and have admitted as such. Next time I'll avoid problems with word games altogether and just do the phone interview.