Sackler family about to get immunity

[Moonbeam]

Being psychopaths, doesn't excuse them from the consequences of their actions.

As above, I agree, but there are differing ideas as to what consequences should be. You sound like one committed to the notion that a proper consequence is an eye for an eye thingi. Also it sounds like you believe you know what a psychopath is, but do you really? You know things, it seems to me, that I don't know.

 

[Moonbeam]

The taking of life apparently, unless you're disputing the results of what Purdue Pharma helped create.

Is greed a mental illness? I think it is when it generates this much suffering and death, and I'm far more interested in the effort to restore and heal the people and families who were the actual victims here. It's not a proposition of mutual exclusions moon, they can be punished and made to assist in the restoring of the people they knew they were harming and killing. I'm not sure I care what you think other's aims should be, it's irrelevant - this is a matter of a family with blood on it's hands using obscene wealth to buy immunity from justice, and leveraging the plight of families they helped destroy as a tool to achieve that.

My hatred and blame for the deaths of over half a million Americans is perfectly valid, and while I did wear black yesterday it wasn't a judge's robes so do feel free to cross that worry off your list. No, deterrence is the aim, so that ideally there is no need to restore and heal people to begin with. Sometimes that takes punishment, and I'm ok with that.

Yes, I know. But I am from another world where punishment is what made these people sick in the first place and your aim is more of what didn't work originally. There is a world in which your view looks completely insane, just as mine does to you. My only duty that I can see is to inform you of that fact. I am completely indifferent after that. I speak my truth and what you do with it is up to you.

 

[DaaQ]

Greed is what made these people sick. Pure unadulterated greed and power.

 

[Moonbeam]

Greed is what made these people sick. Pure unadulterated greed and power.

So I said to myself, self, if everything is greed and lust for power, do people differ in that regard. Are some extremely greedy and others rather generous? What could account for the difference. Is the difference somewhat related to the difference between a vacuum cleaner and a Cornucopia? And since billions seem not to fill the sickest needs, perhaps the difference lies not in what we have but what we feel we have.

Once Mulla Nasrudin saw a man walking along the road dejectedly head facing down, clearly mourning some sort of loss. So the Mulla sneeked k up behind him and stole his purse and ran ahead with it outpasing his victim in fleetness. Where the path narrowed to cross a bridge the Mulla placed the purse in a way it wouldn't be missed and when the man arrived at the bridge even more dejected than before, he found his purse and began to jump for joy. The Mulla said to himself there is more than one kind of happiness.

What kind of happiness do you imagine it is that generous people may have that the needy, those that rob and steal or lust for power do not? Perhaps the needy try to fill an inner emptiness created in the place where that happiness was stolen from them.

Perhaps greed and the need for power are just symptom descriptors of something far more fundamental.

 

[kage69]

Yes, I know. But I am from another world where punishment is what made these people sick in the first place and your aim is more of what didn't work originally. There is a world in which your view looks completely insane, just as mine does to you. My only duty that I can see is to inform you of that fact. I am completely indifferent after that. I speak my truth and what you do with it is up to you.

You're calling for subjective context for a objectively evil acts, acts that contributed greatly in creating half a million dead people. I contend we are in the same world and neither of us are insane. It's just that one of us is focusing on the horse and the other the wagon. I'm mad because of the number of dead people in the wagon, less interested in what farm the horse came from. This is really about how to help the victims recover from it, I'm not interested in helping the Sacklers with their attempt to look unfairly persecuted. Your comment on truth goes both ways, and I'm fine acknowledging that.

But regarding the bolded portion, do tell. What were these punishments, these trials and tribulations the Sackler family weathered on the road to expanding their extreme wealth, despite reports of widespread addiction and death? Inquiring 'offworld' minds want to know.

 

[Moonbeam]

You're calling for subjective context for a objectively evil acts, acts that contributed greatly in creating half a million dead people. I contend we are in the same world and neither of us are insane. It's just that one of us is focusing on the horse and the other wagon. I'm mad because of the number of dead people in the wagon, less interested in what farm the horse came from. This is really about how to help the victims recover from it, I'm not interested in helping the Sacklers with their attempt to look unfairly persecuted. Your comment on truth goes both ways, and I'm fine acknowledging that.

But regarding the bolded portion, do tell. What were these punishments, these trials and tribulations the Sackler family weathered on the road to expanding their extreme wealth, despite reports of widespread addiction and death? Inquiring 'offworld' minds want to know.

Ask yourself for now much money would you sell your decency. Then ask yourself what else would do the job. If you can answer that it will be you with the off world mind.

 

[kage69]

Ask yourself for now much money would you sell your decency. Then ask yourself what else would do the job. If you can answer that it will be you with the off world mind.

I'd rather ask you again to substantiate your claim regarding the punishment you mentioned. That which can be asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence. If you want to discuss space travel, show me you understand basic flight first.

 

[Moonbeam]

I'd rather ask you again to substantiate your claim regarding the punishment you mentioned. That which can be asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence. If you want to discuss space travel, show me you understand basic flight first.

Show me your willingness to board a rocket. He who tastes knows. Suppose I were to tell you that if you spin around for a while you will get dizzy but you claimed I have no evidence. I would have to tell you that no proof is available to you if you refuse to spin. Then you could tell me that extraordinary claims can be dismissed without evidence. Unless you empty your tea cup first, no fresh tea will be given.

 

[Lost_in_the_HTTP]

Anybody know what the Moonie is babbling about?

 

[shortylickens]

Anybody know what the Moonie is babbling about?

Yes.

Thats why he's on ignore.

 

[JD50]

Anybody know what the Moonie is babbling about?

I haven't read a single Moonbeam post in 10 years, there's really no point.

 

[Moonbeam]

Anybody know what the Moonie is babbling about?

Something like this: kage has expressed a deep contempt for people like the Sackler family, an apparent family of heartless psychopaths and I find that worrying. That is because I believe that all contempt has its origin in self hate, the result of having personally been exposed to that very king of contempt, being equated in childhood as if one also were a ruthless psychopath, that non-conformity to the moral norms of our family will earn us just that sort of contempt as punishment for stepping out of line. He finds that claim extraordinary and asks for proof, but one can only know the truth of such a claim if it is true by reliving such traumatic events. I claim they are so deeply buried and the motivation not to feel them is so great that very few people will have want to see my truth. I am saying also that I know what I am saying is true because I have cracked open that door on occasions and experienced suffering I would have never imagined could be there.

To sum up then: It is punishment as children via violence and threat, being put down as worthless that we learn contempt, contempt for ourselves, contempt that is not consciously bearable and gets externalized via projection. This turns us into Stockholm survivors who become the next generation of tortures, believers that punishment is the solution to crime rather than the cause of it. The worst self haters hate life itself and take pleasure only in proving our guardians were right, by acting in the worst ways we can, indifferent to the value of other people's lives.

I can do nothing for the Sackler family and don't care about them. I care about kage. Contempt for others is what makes self forgiveness impossible because the real thing that is hated is buried deeply in repressed memory.

There is a Sufi saying, 'There are riches in the sea beyond compare but if you seek safety it is on the shore. Looks like the rabbits also rely on ignore.

 

[Bitek]

You're calling for subjective context for a objectively evil acts, acts that contributed greatly in creating half a million dead people. I contend we are in the same world and neither of us are insane. It's just that one of us is focusing on the horse and the other wagon. I'm mad because of the number of dead people in the wagon, less interested in what farm the horse came from. This is really about how to help the victims recover from it, I'm not interested in helping the Sacklers with their attempt to look unfairly persecuted. Your comment on truth goes both ways, and I'm fine acknowledging that.

But regarding the bolded portion, do tell. What were these punishments, these trials and tribulations the Sackler family weathered on the road to expanding their extreme wealth, despite reports of widespread addiction and death? Inquiring 'offworld' minds want to know.

I think it's insane that you can sell billions of dollars of opiates (heroin), callously kill 500,000 people, but since its an Inc and you are a billionaire, you get a slap on the wrist and a fine paid by other people.

But if you possess or sell a tiny amount of illegal drugs, you get Fd by the legal system.

Duerte pushes drug dealers out of helicopters.
If anyone deserves that punishment, it's these fucks.

 

[Lost_in_the_HTTP]

Duerte pushes drug dealers out of helicopters.
If anyone deserves that punishment, it's these fucks.

Can we send them there?

 

[digiram]

No one is above the…..nevermind.

 

[kage69]

Show me your willingness to board a rocket. He who tastes knows. Suppose I were to tell you that if you spin around for a while you will get dizzy but you claimed I have no evidence. I would have to tell you that no proof is available to you if you refuse to spin. Then you could tell me that extraordinary claims can be dismissed without evidence. Unless you empty your tea cup first, no fresh tea will be given.

Come now, you know how this works; the burden of proof is on the claimant. My willingness is to hear facts, show me your willingness to use them.

Where is the evidence != You have no evidence.

What I actually refuse to do is to take vague assertions as facts. Don't let my contempt for pure evil bother you too much. It's more appropriate then you know, and has been somewhat assuaged by the Sacklers failing in their bid to trade money for immunity from prosecution. Don't worry, be happy.

 

[Moonbeam]

Come now, you know how this works; the burden of proof is on the claimant. My willingness is to hear facts, show me your willingness to use them.

Where is the evidence != You have no evidence.

What I actually refuse to do is to take vague assertions as facts. Don't let my contempt for pure evil bother you too much. It's more appropriate then you know, and has been somewhat assuaged by the Sacklers failing in their bid to trade money for immunity from prosecution. Don't worry, be happy.

Of what use is a claim to look at facts from a person who refuses to open his eyes. You are not willing to acknowledge the simple reality that nobody can prove what wine tastes like but that anybody who is willing to taste it knows. And beyond the taste there is that special effect we have not even begun to consider. From one who is drunk on wine to one who is a teetotaler, you to your form of evidence and me to mine. And why would I worry. I am not the one who doesn't know that his contempt for evil is rooted in his contempt for himself. You are the one who refused to take the shitless end of the stick. Your problem is that while you say you are full of contempt you have never really allowed that feeling to reach the limits of rage. I suggest it is you who has no idea as to the depth of that contempt. May I suggest a therapeutic setting before you really open that door.

I love your contempt for evil. What I do not love is the price you pay for not understanding it.

 

[trenchfoot]

Sackler immunity deal tossed out by judge. Hope it sticks.

U.S. judge tosses $4.5 bln deal shielding Sacklers from opioid lawsuits

A federal judge overturned a roughly $4.5 billion settlement that legally shielded members of the Sackler family who stand accused of helping fuel the U.S. opioid epidemic, a decision that threatened to upend the bankruptcy reorganization of their company, OxyContin maker Purdue Pharma LP.

www.reuters.com

 

[Lost_in_the_HTTP]

Update ...

Supreme Court blocks OxyContin maker's bankruptcy deal that would ...​

https://apnews.com › article › supreme-court-opioid-crisis-purdue-bankruptcy-bd417e036d9f6db4b2916fdfbdb56252
Today Members of the Sackler family would contribute up to $6 billion. But a key component of the agreement would shield family members, who are not seeking bankruptcy protection as individuals, from lawsuits. The U.S. Bankruptcy Trustee, represented by the Justice Department, opposes releasing the Sackler family from legal liability.

 

[SteveGrabowski]

I would happily be the one to slit their throats if they were sentenced to death by a court. Worst serial killers in American history. They almost took my aunt and turned her into a walking zombie for years. Can't imagine what her withdrawals were like from that shit.

 

[Lost_in_the_HTTP]

I have no idea what motivates or triggers people to over use.


I got a bottle of 30 Oxy tablets when I got out of the hospital two weeks ago. Script was for one every four hours as needed.

There are still about 20 in the bottle and I'm thinking about using the neutralizer packet they gave me to dispose of the remainder.

 

[GodisanAtheist]

I have no idea what motivates or triggers people to over use.


I got a bottle of 30 Oxy tablets when I got out of the hospital two weeks ago. Script was for one every four hours as needed.

There are still about 20 in the bottle and I'm thinking about using the neutralizer packet they gave me to dispose of the remainder.

- The constipation alone ensures I won't ever become a user. Ive had surgeries where I just gave up on the oxy and just downed 1000mg of Ibuprofin because my need to take a shit overrode the intensity of the pain.

 

[nakedfrog]

I have no idea what motivates or triggers people to over use.


I got a bottle of 30 Oxy tablets when I got out of the hospital two weeks ago. Script was for one every four hours as needed.

There are still about 20 in the bottle and I'm thinking about using the neutralizer packet they gave me to dispose of the remainder.

Near as I can tell it just doesn't affect everyone in the same way, I got a prescription after surgery, took one to help with the flight home & 2 hour drive back to the house. Seemed to deal with the pain well enough, but other than that I just felt kind of vaguely out of it. Nothing there that made me interested in taking more than was necessary.

 

[Lost_in_the_HTTP]

I didn't even feel out of it. I had some lingering pain that made it hard to sleep, so one before bedtime to ease that and make it easier to fall asleep.

 

[SteveGrabowski]

- The constipation alone ensures I won't ever become a user. Ive had surgeries where I just gave up on the oxy and just downed 1000mg of Ibuprofin because my need to take a shit overrode the intensity of the pain.

Opioids have scared the shit out of me for 30 years. Got Vicodin and Tylenol-3 prescribed to me in the past for kidney stones and as bad as those hurt I have refused to take anything harder than aspirin or OTC acetaminophen for them because I'm scared as hell I'd like taking opioids based on what I had seen heroin do to friends.