Russia on brink of ... NOPE! Russia INVADES Ukraine!

[MichaelMay]

Cutting them off from SWIFT is something you probably only do if they halt energy exports to Europe or like nerve gas Kyiv. It's an extreme step way on one end of the options for economic retaliation.

It's going to happen because it's the only way to get them to stop. Full economic sanctions until they withdraw all troops is the only way out of this. It also gives Putin a way out, he's retreating for his people.

 

[hal2kilo]

It's going to happen because it's the only way to get them to stop. Full economic sanctions until they withdraw all troops is the only way out of this. It also gives Putin a way out, he's retreating for his people.

It's carrot and stick moves. No move, they will be banned from SWIFT.

 

[JTsyo]

Saw this on reddit about Russia vs Ukraine and how the US lost sight of fighting vs peer during WOT. 1 hour long though there was a TLDR in the thread.

 

[Pens1566]

Apparently SWIFT bans are off the table for now, due to push back from some EU countries that would cost them billions in outstanding debt.

 

[hal2kilo]

Apparently SWIFT bans are off the table for now, due to push back from some EU countries that would cost them billions in outstanding debt.

Playing with the world's money supply is not something to be taken lightly. Markets are already shaken.

 

[VRAMdemon]

In light of these new actions by Putin, will anyone hazard a guess on his goal(s)?

I used to think Putin was after Nordstream 2 going green asap. But while that could still be the case, given his bombastic language of late I'm beginning to doubt it.

Beginning to think that either he is crazy; fending off internal factions (unlikely - from what I understand he is by far the dominant alpha male in Russia), or truly seeing himself as the next Russian Tsar.

I found this article interesting - https://icds.ee/en/vladimir-putin-thinks-in-terms-of-empire/

In any case, his actions has had real effects inside Russia itself. Its stock market dropped 10% when Putin made his move.

To hazard a guess - This is another attempt to land-grab more of Ukraine in furtherance of Putin’s long term goal of restoring as much of the Soviet Union to Russian control as he possibly can. Russia’s desire for a certain security footprint, but more importantly, the settlement of historical revanchist grievances. Ukraine is a non-fungible goal here. Russia deployed over half their maneuver forces to the border, and when asked to back down, gave a list of utterly unserious demands.

It is always in Putin’s best interest to create chaos and division in the countries of his perceived enemies. He succeeded beyond his wildest dreams with his backing of Trump. No doubt that Trump is as compromised as a person can be in service to Putin. This included radicalizing the Republican Party; weakening our institutions; propagating propaganda aided by Fox “News” and other media outlets; helping Trump hollow out our intelligence agencies; driving wedges wherever he could in our NATO alliances. The list is long. It’s the same playbook Putin uses in his own country. Fomenting “rebellion” in in the name of "peacekeeping" in areas with ethnic Russians and lots of lying about what’s going on. Western powers have let Russian oligarchy traipse through the corridors of power for years. Western powers have let Russian agents kill people in western nations with little push back. The US had so many tests with Russia that basically the power button is looking worn out. The failure of democracy in Russia is a Putin problem driven by the West ideologically happy to overlook robber baron capitalism.

 

[bairon]

You're a moron. We have enough gas without Russia and we will simply stock up, we won't be importing gas from Russia, period.

The sanctions will be nation wide and the entirety of the EU are on board with this.

Russia will be in a blind economic downfall not seen since the Soviet era.

You may be in the US and have enough. In Europe where I am we certainly dont have enough. Winter is not finished yet and I expect the russians to hurry up before it is.

 

[bairon]

You may be in the US and have enough. In Europe where I am we certainly dont have enough. Winter is not finished yet and I expect the russians to hurry up before it is.

Can Europe survive painlessly without Russian gas?

If Russian gas stops flowing, measures to replace supply won’t be enough. The European Union will need to curb demand, implying difficult and costly d

www.bruegel.org

 

[bairon]

Russia is very different from Iran who had been living under US economic sanctions continuously since 1987. They have been in a vastly different position globally than Russia. If Russian banks are excluded from SWIFT it will have major impact on them and prompt some very scary times for the world.

Putin is not a fool. If he was scared of this he wouldnt start. It must be that he knows it wont stop him. In other words he knows there is nothing the west can do to stop him. Unlike the West he is not concerned that this will have an impact on his people. He is still a communist and the state comes before the people.

 

[dullard]

I expect the sanctions will be the same as to Iran which have not brought them to their knees and neither ones on Russia will. I expect them then to join with Iran. Russia will not stop anywhere once they start and will end up if they can with the whole of Europe. They have the gas which no one else has because of our enviromentalists so they can do what they want. Whatever sanctions we make will hurt us more.

Sanctions are not intended to bring countries to their knees. Never have been, never will be. That would be like claiming putting a kid in a time out for a minute would stop all bad behavior. It doesn't work that way.

Instead, sanctions are one part of a set of tools that includes diplomacy, punishments, incentives, and possibly war. With enough attempts at putting kids into time out, proper parenting, and rewards for good behavior, they generally become good kids over the span of many years.

You are correct that sanctions hurt others more. That is why we just don't slap on sanctions on everyone at all times just because we get upset.

 

[VRAMdemon]

Trump calls Putin a genius and a peacekeeper and very "savvy" Perfectly normal reaction from a leader of a serious political party Nobody's been tougher on Russia than meeeee!." Traitors gonna traitor.

Trump praises Putin's 'genius' plan to invade Ukraine: 'You gotta say that’s pretty savvy'

Former President Donald Trump on Tuesday called Vladimir Putin a "genius" after the Russian president made moves to take over parts of Ukraine.Trump made the remarks during an interview with conservative podcaster Buck Sexton."I went in yesterday and there was a television screen, and I said...

www.rawstory.com

 

[bairon]

Sanctions are not intended to bring countries to their knees. Never have been, never will be. That would be like claiming putting a kid in a time out for a minute would stop all bad behavior. It doesn't work that way.
nstead, sanctions are one part of a set of tools that includes diplomacy, punishments, incentives, and possibly war. With enough attempts at putting kids into time out, proper parenting, and rewards for good behavior, they generally become good kids over the span of many years.

You really think there is anything to stop him. I mean apart from war. And although Nato officially exists, most countries will not take on Russia so quickly

 

[Ajay]

Russia will not stop anywhere once they start and will end up if they can with the whole of Europe.

Really. This is very disappointing news. We kind of like Europeans.

Whatever sanctions we make will hurt us more.

Uh, no. It will hurt the Russian people worse, but maybe not the oligarchs. That said, Europe will be making a sacrifice, but it's worth it cripple the Russia economy. No money - no military adventurism. The Russian military was rebuilt on the back of sales of gas and oil.

 

[manly]

Trump calls Putin a genius and a peacekeeper and very "savvy" Perfectly normal reaction from a leader of a serious political party Nobody's been tougher on Russia than meeeee!." Traitors gonna traitor.

Trump praises Putin's 'genius' plan to invade Ukraine: 'You gotta say that’s pretty savvy'

Former President Donald Trump on Tuesday called Vladimir Putin a "genius" after the Russian president made moves to take over parts of Ukraine.Trump made the remarks during an interview with conservative podcaster Buck Sexton."I went in yesterday and there was a television screen, and I said...

www.rawstory.com

Make Russia Great Again!

Trump’s Republican Party, explained in one photo

A monument to what political scientists call "negative partisanship," one of the most important phenomena of our political time.

www.vox.com

 

[dullard]

You really think there is anything to stop him. I mean apart from war. And although Nato officially exists, most countries will not take on Russia so quickly

If it were up to me personally, we shouldn't stop him. Other countries should defend themselves. The US (where I'm from) has no treaty to protect Ukraine as far as I know. We should instead make Putin miserable. The more he does, the more miserable he should become. If he attacks the EU or NATO countries, THEN we should stop him and that would likely require war. But, that is just my personal political opinion.

 

[fskimospy]

You really think there is anything to stop him. I mean apart from war. And although Nato officially exists, most countries will not take on Russia so quickly

The fact that Putin is well aware that NATO could obliterate his entire army is probably a significant deterrent.

 

[cytg111]

Trump calls Putin a genius and a peacekeeper and very "savvy" Perfectly normal reaction from a leader of a serious political party Nobody's been tougher on Russia than meeeee!." Traitors gonna traitor.

Trump praises Putin's 'genius' plan to invade Ukraine: 'You gotta say that’s pretty savvy'

Former President Donald Trump on Tuesday called Vladimir Putin a "genius" after the Russian president made moves to take over parts of Ukraine.Trump made the remarks during an interview with conservative podcaster Buck Sexton."I went in yesterday and there was a television screen, and I said...

www.rawstory.com

What the fuck

 

[sandorski]

He's playing nth level Chess. You couldn't understand...

wherein n is his Ego.

 

[Lost_in_the_HTTP]

The fact that Putin is well aware that NATO could obliterate his entire army is probably a significant deterrent.

Yeah, remember a guy named Adolph thought that too. And maybe Napoleon? I don't recall too much about that one.




Meanwhile, is it any surprise that Donny Wuvs Vlad? We all knew that, right?

 

[nakedfrog]

You may be in the US and have enough. In Europe where I am we certainly dont have enough. Winter is not finished yet and I expect the russians to hurry up before it is.

He is, indeed, in Europe.

 

[interchange]

Trump calls Putin a genius and a peacekeeper and very "savvy" Perfectly normal reaction from a leader of a serious political party Nobody's been tougher on Russia than meeeee!." Traitors gonna traitor.

Trump praises Putin's 'genius' plan to invade Ukraine: 'You gotta say that’s pretty savvy'

Former President Donald Trump on Tuesday called Vladimir Putin a "genius" after the Russian president made moves to take over parts of Ukraine.Trump made the remarks during an interview with conservative podcaster Buck Sexton."I went in yesterday and there was a television screen, and I said...

www.rawstory.com

Reading the article, it seems Trump actually thinks Putin is acting peacefully and trying to help the people of Ukraine.

 

[cytg111]

Reading the article, it seems Trump actually thinks Putin is acting peacefully and trying to help the people of Ukraine.

There is a reason Trump rhymes with Treason.

 

[Ajay]

If it were up to me personally, we shouldn't stop him. Other countries should defend themselves. The US (where I'm from) has no treaty to protect Ukraine as far as I know. We should instead make Putin miserable. The more he does, the more miserable he should become. If he attacks the EU or NATO countries, THEN we should stop him and that would likely require war. But, that is just my personal political opinion.

If Putin attacks any NATO country, they will invoke article 5 and we are obligated to fight for them, all of NATO will fight on the side of the country within the alliance once it asks. That's how the alliance works.
Sadly for the Ukraine, they are in this situations because they started to process to become a NATO member. Putin couldn't accept that outcome.

 

[zinfamous]

I think we can change the thread title now.

no no. that will upset one very special snowflake.

 

[1prophet]

th

The reason Putin is free to invade Ukraine has nothing to do with the military power of NATO, which could crush Russia if we chose to.

The reason Putin is free to invade Ukraine and NATO won't do anything is because he has Nuclear weapons, all military confrontations between Russia and NATO will end up going nuclear, and unless Americans and Europeans want to see many of their cities go up in smoke they won't try to crush Russia.