Discussion RDNA 5 / UDNA (CDNA Next) speculation

[Win2012R2]

Wish this were true — but this guy 100% makes up stuff for engagement bait

Works for RTG, so why won't somebody else try it too?

 

[reaperrr3]

Works for RTG, so why won't somebody else try it too?

Since when is RadeonTechnologyGroup putting out rumors ?

Nah, judging by the videos I bothered watching, RGT just copies other people's leaks and rumors.
IMO he doesn't understand tech well enough to come up with credible rumors by himself anyway (plus, that'd be more effort and carry elevated risk of being wrong, so why bother).

No volume = no monies.

Fixed costs pretty high, plus big opportunity cost of using expensive devs doing something that won't make big monies.

adroc said AMD has some bigger companies (cloud?) already lined up for AT0.
Why do people here assume AT0 has no market outside desktop gamers?
AMD will sell the good dies with lots of VRAM to companies and semi-pros for many 1000s of dollars and high margins, and then sell the crappy salvage chips with the cheapest reasonable memory config to us gamer peasants for some bonus pocket money on top.
R&D, masks etc. will already be paid for by the former customer groups, so fixed cost won't matter that much for gaming cards.
Otherwise they probably wouldn't bother with such a big chip for desktop gaming alone anymore, that much I agree with.

But the way I understood some older adroc comments, all ATx chips have at least 1 other bigger market and/or customer lined up, in addition to mere desktop gaming cards.
AT0: Some bigger companies, workstation/semi-pro market
AT2: Xbox Next
AT3: MDS Halo
AT4: MDS Premium

Probably the very reason there's no AT1, they couldn't find any other worthy customers/markets for that one to justify the engineering effort.

 

[marees]

But the way I understood some older adroc comments, all ATx chips have at least 1 other bigger market and/or customer lined up, in addition to mere desktop gaming cards.
AT0: Some bigger companies, workstation/semi-pro market
AT2: Xbox Next
AT3: MDS Halo
AT4: MDS Premium

& except for AT3 / MDSH everything has a tie-up with Microsoft

1. AT0 — xcloud
2. AT2 — (first party) series X2
3. AT4 — (third party) series S2 / steam box and/or (third party) handhelds / z3 extreme

Basically except for AT3 volume is guaranteed for others AT0, AT2, AT4

 

[poke01]

& except for AT3 / MDSH everything has a tie-up with Microsoft

1. AT0 — xcloud
2. AT2 — (first party) series X2
3. AT4 — (third party) series S2 / steam box and/or (third party) handhelds / z3 extreme

Basically except for AT3 volume is guaranteed for others AT0, AT2, AT4

Is the PS6 RDNA5 seperate?

 

[marees]

Is the PS6 RDNA5 seperate?

That is monolithic . Can't be repurposed for PC gaming

 

[marees]

& except for AT3 / MDSH everything has a tie-up with Microsoft

1. AT0 — xcloud
2. AT2 — (first party) series X2
3. AT4 — (third party) series S2 / steam box and/or (third party) handhelds / z3 extreme

Basically except for AT3 volume is guaranteed for others AT0, AT2, AT4

The AT3 / Medusa halo could potentially go into surface studio like devices. But the surface team don't play with AMD

 

[MrMPFR]

I'm more dubious of any claims of potential performance wins. We've been down this road before with DX12/Mantle, and we didn't see a great deal. Graphics hardware is constantly changing, as is the software running on top of it, and today's beautiful simple API will undoubtedly hold back tomorrow's exciting new idea. I'm sure when we're all doing neural shading and path tracing in 10 years' time we'll all be cursing how unsuitable DX13 is.

Most of those perf gains and benefits would prob come from WGS-style producer-consumer workoads running on completely on GPU. Ignoring it in DX12 considering how experimental it still is + overall API is not made from the ground up for new paradigm.

Yeah they need to make the API with that in mind and Sebbi's are bones API won't cut it and he admitted that and will adress with follow up posts. For certain tons of extensions and extra functionality are needed. Maybe by 2027-2028 the major players can begin defining the NG API spec.

But games made from RDNA5/PS6 from the ground up are a very long way off. Probably 2031 at the earliest assuming PS6 is in 2027 and even then most developers will want to run on pre-DX13 hardware like your RTX 4090s etc, can see the dumb discourse about developers in 2033 or so "discriminating" against 4090 owners.

100% which is why I said 2030s would be truly NG.

The speculative stuff I talked about sounds more like HW optimizations and less like something current GPUs just outright can't do. Devs can prob still bolt it unto older HW with emulation and those already supports work graphs in HW but it won't run anywhere near as efficiently. And that's the most crackpot implementation of the API and implementation will prob come in three flavors: Matching the base spec defined by Aaltonen in the blog, PT + WGS + ML (40 series via extensions)) and the fully fledged out PS6/RDNA5 implementation (tons of extensions).
Entire early run of PS6 only games will prob be DX12 + WGS, but anything built with a hypothetical DX13 isn't coming anytime soon unless it's a completele no brainer for game engine teams. We'll see.

Yeah people will complain but will NVIDIA realistically support 40 series for that long?

 

[Win2012R2]

Since when is RadeonTechnologyGroup putting out rumors ?

DOH!

Of course I meant RGT, who also got very irritating voice and manners!

 

[ToTTenTranz]

That is monolithic . Can't be repurposed for PC gaming

Being x86 with a RDNA5 ISA means it can, but it won't be because its a semicustom ordered by Sony so it's up to them.

 

[poke01]

Being x86 with a RDNA5 ISA means it can, but it won't be because its a semicustom ordered by Sony so it's up to them.

I don’t think anyone else is doing custom Zen6/RDNA5 SoCs but Sony. AMDs happy to accept it cause it’s PlayStation. It’s prints money.

Now Sony might allow a x86 Linux or FreeBSD virtual environment, I could see that happening.

 

[adroc_thurston]

Now Sony might allow a x86 Linux or FreeBSD virtual environment

lmao.

 

[poke01]

lmao.

I mean IF the Xbox PC/console breaks sales records right??
😂

 

[adroc_thurston]

I mean IF the Xbox PC/console breaks sales records right??
😂

Xbox can't break sales records since they don't have games.
And they don't have the default multiplat option aura after the Xone launch disaster.

 

[dangerman1337]

Yeah the Xbox brand is cooked and the only next-gen Xbox we're getting is a PC device that looks and feels like a Console that is about long term library transfer to Windows.

 

[adroc_thurston]

Yeah the Xbox brand is cooked and the only next-gen Xbox we're getting is a PC device that looks and feels like a Console that is about long term library transfer to Windows.

uh, no, it's still an Xbox.

 

[jpiniero]

uh, no, it's still an Xbox.

It's both

 

[adroc_thurston]

It's both

no, just an Xbox.

 

[jpiniero]

no, just an Xbox.

Microsoft calls everything an XBox now.

 

[adroc_thurston]

Microsoft calls everything an XBox now.

It's been an Xbox since Windows 10.
Doesn't change their hardware roadmaps at all.

 

[jpiniero]

It's been an Xbox since Windows 10.
Doesn't change their hardware roadmaps at all.

Just because MS calls it an XBox doesn't mean it's a traditional console.

 

[adroc_thurston]

Just because MS calls it an XBox doesn't mean it's a traditional console.

It is a traditional console.

 

[marees]

Just because MS calls it an XBox doesn't mean it's a traditional console.

The expectation is that magnus (series x2) will be a traditional console — but maybe dual boot option to windows to support steam store

By contrast, medusa premium (series s2) should be a proper pc (like rog 'xbox' ally x stuff) with special software changes to windows to accommodate backwards compatibility to xbox stores

So magnus (first party) should be priced just above current series x

But medusa premium would be priced more like a steam machine — by asus, lenovo etc.

 

[adroc_thurston]

By contrast, medusa premium (series s2) should be a proper pc (like rog 'xbox' ally x stuff) with special software changes to windows to accommodate backwards compatibility to xbox stores

So magnus (first party) should be priced just above current series x

But medusa premium would be priced more like a steam machine — by asus, lenovo etc.

uhhhh no that's not how any of that works.
Do not project your hopes and dreams onto someone's product roadmaps.

 

[jpiniero]

uhhhh no that's not how any of that works.
Do not project your hopes and dreams onto someone's product roadmaps.

Or your "Leaker" friends are wrong. As usual.

 

[adroc_thurston]

Or your "Leaker" friends are wrong. As usual.

I know PC ppl are hyper-desperate for slightly subsidized hardware, but what you're getting is a normal console.
I wish MS made games also. alas.