RAID0 trim and SRT seems possible on 6-series and 5-Series

Discussion in 'Memory and Storage' started by Dufus, Nov 8, 2012.

  1. MaxICH

    MaxICH Member

    Joined:
    Nov 19, 2012
    Messages:
    30
    Likes Received:
    0
    In my case all I did was change "07 1C 00 00 01" to "07 1C 00 00 07" and "06 1C 00 00 01" to "06 1C 00 00 07".

    Maybe for my Z68 board only the last one was needed, but I changed both just in case.
     
  2. Evildeffy

    Evildeffy Junior Member

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2009
    Messages:
    13
    Likes Received:
    0
    Hi Dufus,

    First off you just made a whole lot of my friends with a P67/Z68 chip very happy.

    Second, considering that X58/6-series/7-series are all the ICH10R family, you think you can alter that Option ROM to include the X58 series for RAID0 Trim?

    You would make me beyond happy with this.

    Thanks for all your effort in any case!
     
  3. Makaveli

    Makaveli Diamond Member

    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2002
    Messages:
    3,828
    Likes Received:
    1
    wow great find guys.

    I think now I will finally look at updating the OROM on my board.
     
  4. Engineer

    Engineer Elite Member

    Joined:
    Oct 9, 1999
    Messages:
    37,893
    Likes Received:
    2
    Just posting to give :thumbsup: and a huge Thank You to Dufus (and Fernando and everyone else who has helped along the way in the quest for TRIM for RAID 0).

    You guys are awesome and happy Thanksgiving! :)
     
  5. davidm71

    davidm71 Member

    Joined:
    Nov 13, 2008
    Messages:
    50
    Likes Received:
    0
    Was wondering if you guys know the alternate id for an X58 motherboard like the evga classified? Going to investigate right now in device manager and see if I can find it and try that mod,

    Thanks
     
  6. davidm71

    davidm71 Member

    Joined:
    Nov 13, 2008
    Messages:
    50
    Likes Received:
    0
    Hi again..

    I tried to mod my 11.6.0.1702 bios file with these 8086 ids: 3a20, 3a25, and 3a05 and set the flag to 07. I'm running 11.6.2.1002 on an Evga Classified 759 X58 motherboard with two HyperX3Ks in raid 0 slave drive. I ran the Trim test routine using the hex editor and the OS did not Trim the drive. Running Win 7 64 also...

    Anyhow would this only work Windows 8? Do I need to reset the raid array? Reinstall the drivers?

    Thanks.
     
  7. MaxICH

    MaxICH Member

    Joined:
    Nov 19, 2012
    Messages:
    30
    Likes Received:
    0
    Where did you find those id's? Are you sure they are the right ones?
     
  8. davidm71

    davidm71 Member

    Joined:
    Nov 13, 2008
    Messages:
    50
    Likes Received:
    0
    I googled my chipset and assumed its an ich10r and googled those terms until I found a list of hardware ids. I looked up my raid controller in device manager 8086 2822 and found subsys of 3A20 which was close to the other ids found with a google search so I added them all in there. I even tried running Aida64 and hardware info but didn't know or couldn't find the alternate ids..

    Thanks
     
  9. Fernando 1

    Fernando 1 Senior member

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2012
    Messages:
    325
    Likes Received:
    0
    @ davidm71:

    You will find the possible internal DeviceIDs of all Intel 5-Series SATA Controllers on page 14 of >this< official paper published by Intel.
    AFAIK the correct DeviceID for your X58 RAID Controller is 3B25. That would be in hex code "25 3B".
     
    #34 Fernando 1, Nov 22, 2012
    Last edited: Nov 22, 2012
  10. davidm71

    davidm71 Member

    Joined:
    Nov 13, 2008
    Messages:
    50
    Likes Received:
    0
    Thanks but I looked at that data sheet and none of the chipsets mention the x58 platform. Are you sure that's correct for x58? I thought mine was 3A25?

    Thanks
     
  11. Fernando 1

    Fernando 1 Senior member

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2012
    Messages:
    325
    Likes Received:
    0
    I am not sure about that, but I thought, that the X58 Express chipset belongs to the Intel 5-Series.
    All official Intel 5-series SATA AHCI Controllers DeviceIDs begin with "3B".
     
  12. davidm71

    davidm71 Member

    Joined:
    Nov 13, 2008
    Messages:
    50
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ill try it out but the thing is in device manager for the Raid Controller properties the hardware is 8086 2822 with subsys 3A25. Maybe that has nothing to do with it..

    Thanks
     
  13. tweakboy

    tweakboy Diamond Member

    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2010
    Messages:
    9,498
    Likes Received:
    1

    Nice, but its gonna copy at around 600mbps,,, not worth the trouble. Wait 2014 and buy a potential 1000mbps single SSD. thx gl

    Let's get rid of the screenshots
    -ViRGE
     
    #38 tweakboy, Nov 22, 2012
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 22, 2012
  14. Evildeffy

    Evildeffy Junior Member

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2009
    Messages:
    13
    Likes Received:
    0
    And this has exactly WHAT to do with the topic at hand?
    We're not benching SSD speed here, we're praying for TRIM on chipsets prior to Z/Q/H-77.
     
  15. Fernando 1

    Fernando 1 Senior member

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2012
    Messages:
    325
    Likes Received:
    0
    @ tweakboy:
    Why do clutter up this interesting thread by fully quoting a post containing at least 9 screenshots, which by the way have nothing to do with your contribution.
     
  16. organshifter

    organshifter Junior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2012
    Messages:
    19
    Likes Received:
    0
    I changed the flags to reflect exactly what you did above, and all went well. I then incorporated the OROM into the most recent bios for my board, and the flash went perfectly. However, after running the TRIM test here, it doesn't appear to be working. Initially, I tested with Intel RST v11.6.2.1002, and it didn't work. So, I removed that version and installed RST v11.6.0.1030. Same results.

    Could this be a problem with Win 8 Pro, as there have been reports of TRIM/RAID 0 not working with it? Or maybe I shouldn't have modified as many flags? Any Ideas?

    Motherboard: ASUS P8Z68 DELUXE/GEN3
    SSD Drives: 2x 128GB Transcend SSD320 RAID0

    I'm starting to wonder if I should have changed only those two flags as well. Did you re-create your array?
     
  17. davidm71

    davidm71 Member

    Joined:
    Nov 13, 2008
    Messages:
    50
    Likes Received:
    0
    When those 1000mbs ssds come out you bet your bottom dollar someone will raid them up as raid is more than just speed but also redundancy and you will want your trim working!
     
  18. Fernando 1

    Fernando 1 Senior member

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2012
    Messages:
    325
    Likes Received:
    0
    Since the TRIM in RAID0 feature works for my Z77 system with Win7 and Win8, I think, that the OS will not be the problem.
     
  19. Soundmanred

    Soundmanred Lifer

    Joined:
    Oct 26, 2006
    Messages:
    10,784
    Likes Received:
    1
    I recommend using the "block user" feature, it will save you from the mind blowing stupidity.
     
  20. davidm71

    davidm71 Member

    Joined:
    Nov 13, 2008
    Messages:
    50
    Likes Received:
    0
    Any X58 people out there willing to give this mod a try? I tried without success. Pretty sure the x58 raid controller id is 3a25. Couldn't get trim working...

    Thanks
     
  21. MaxICH

    MaxICH Member

    Joined:
    Nov 19, 2012
    Messages:
    30
    Likes Received:
    0
    Did you try with 3b25 as suggested? The id you see in Device Manager is not the same you need to enter in the LUT. I have a Z68 and device manager says this:

    [​IMG]

    while the right id I used is 1C06 (061C in the orom) which also matches what Intel says in this document at page 11.
     
    #46 MaxICH, Nov 22, 2012
    Last edited: Nov 22, 2012
  22. MaxICH

    MaxICH Member

    Joined:
    Nov 19, 2012
    Messages:
    30
    Likes Received:
    0
    I finally got time to take screenshots of the tests.

    System info

    Asus P8Z68-V Pro, BIOS 3402 with Intel orom 11.6.0.1702.

    The orom was edited using the LUT info provided by Dufus as follows:

    "07 1C 00 00 01" to "07 1C 00 00 07" and "06 1C 00 00 01" to "06 1C 00 00 07"​

    then saved back in the BIOS and re-flashed. The SSD drives are 2 OCZ Vertez 4 256GB. The raid 0 was created before editing the orom.

    [​IMG]

    Testing

    Copied a jpeg file in the root of C: then used Winhex to check the drive

    [​IMG]

    Deleted the file and emptied the recycle bin, then after few seconds reopened the drive in winhex pointing to the same location:

    [​IMG]

    Just as Dufus said the Vertex 4 drives use FF instead of 00 when "trimming".
     
    #47 MaxICH, Nov 22, 2012
    Last edited: Nov 22, 2012
  23. Dufus

    Dufus Senior member

    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2010
    Messages:
    469
    Likes Received:
    0
    Sorry for the late reply, I'm quite preoccupied with other things non computer related.

    Fernando the alternate ID's are really the true ID of the controller, 2822 is used to make things easier by enabling a generic driver to be used. There are quite a few different ID's, for instance 7 series 1e04, 1e06, 1e07, 1e0e? and 6 series 1c04, 1c05, 1c06, 1c07?. I don't know what 1c07 is for, maybe used on servers :confused:. The 6 you see with some of the 7 series (starting with 1E) are probably for the 7 series boards that do not have SRT but have trim in RAID0. To incorporate many boards would mean expanding the LUT, something for Intel to do.

    Evildeffy, that's a good question. I have no experience with X58 so unfortunately can not answer it. :( X58 comes before PCH so is not really the same as a normal 5 series, a bit like X79 is not really the same as normal 7 series.

    davidm71, if the X58 is using a standard ICH10R then AFAIK the ID should be 3a05. ID's can be found in the Intel chipset specification update doc's down-loadable from Intel, if however you can check it with software then all the better. I've ran on both W8 (DP) and W7 with drivers from 11.0 to 11.5, although I prefer the RST driver over RSTe, so there should not be a problem utilizing trim on those systems. A windows trim command can also be sent successfully using vista with the 11 series drivers installed, it's just that MS did not implement or update the vista OS to send trim commands on delete/format.

    MaxICH, nice work and thank you for showing trim working on your Z68 but please remember this testing was only done as "a proof of concept" and not as a means to provide trim support.

    Some things to consider when running trim tests. Some drives have broken trim firmware. Trim is not always guaranteed to happen right away or sometimes even at all. I have noticed in some instances where a trim command was successfully sent but no changes were seen at the LBA level (includes 7 series) until after reboot or running a quick disk check (without autofix) or sometimes simply logging off for a couple of minutes. I don't know if this happens because of the OS/driver side or SSD firmware side, a mystery yet to be solved. If you have been running without trim for a while and finally get a working system remember to run some trim optimizing to clean up the older LBA's that had been deleted before. AFAIK W8 can do this via defrag which doesn't defrag SSD's but re-trims, however W7 will require 3rd party software.

    Thanks to all who posted, appreciated. I'll try to update when I can but seems I have little "play" time these days.
     
  24. davidm71

    davidm71 Member

    Joined:
    Nov 13, 2008
    Messages:
    50
    Likes Received:
    0
    Dufus,

    I'm pretty sure now that its 3a25 and not 3b25. That intel 5-series specification PDF doesn't mention x58 which has a different raid controller. Not only that the subsys id in device manager for the raid controller is 3A25. Second someone's lspci output in linux of their x58 system I found on a google search says 3a25 for their raid controller. Try googling x58 against 3a25 and you get hits where with 3b25 nothing. So I'm convinced I'm using the right device id. Anyhow thanks for your input and work. Maybe it's a delayed operation..

    Thanks
     
  25. Fernando 1

    Fernando 1 Senior member

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2012
    Messages:
    325
    Likes Received:
    0
    You obviously are right. I thought, that boards with an X58 chipset have 5-Series SATA Controller chips, but obviously they haven't.
    By the way: >Here< is a list with the DeviceIDs of nearly all SATA Controllers.
    My conclusion until now after having seen the test results layed down within this thread:
    1. Users with an Intel 7-Series SATA RAID Controller automaticly get the TRIM in RAID0 feature by using an actual Intel RST driver(s)/RAID ROM combination v11.x.x.xxxx or higher.
    2. Users with an Intel C600 (e.g. X79) Series SATA RAID Controller will get TRIM into their SSD RAID0, if they are able to use an actual Intel RST driver(s)/RAID ROM combination v11.x.x.xxxx (precondition: the mainboard manufacturer offers a BIOS containing such Intel RAID ROM version).
    3. Intel 6-Series SATA RAID Controllers obviously are able to support TRIM in RAID0, but this feature is still locked by the hex code of the currently available Intel RAID ROM modules. It seems possible, that Intel will unlock the TRIM in RAID0 feature for 6-Series SATA RAID Controllers in the near future. Users, who do not want to wait for an Intel RAID ROM version with enhanced TRIM in RAID options, may get this feature already now by a simple hex code modification of the actual Intel RAID ROM v11.6.x.xxxx according to the findings of Dufus (see above).
    4. The future will answer the question, if users with an Intel 3-Series, 4-Series, 5-Series SATA RAID Controller will get TRIM into their SSD RAID0.