R9 300 cards listed in new driver - R9 370 is a rebrand

[The Alias]

Well, the die is going to be huge and presumably HBM is super expensive.

Wait, do you are gonna go out and say AMD is putting out a 980 competitor for $700 ? Come on ! You think amd is going to put out an Nvidia competitor for $200, not $20, not even $50, but $200 dollars more? That has to be one of the stupidest theories I've ever heard.

 

[Cloudfire777]

I don't know I'm not a designer. I was just trying to clarify his position for you. Although, I'm of the opinion if that chart is true, then 370 is probably not pitcairn, because dropping clocks another 30 watts will leave it less powerful than the previous 270. which seems off.

Drivers and Device IDs doesnt lie (un)fortunately

 

[jpiniero]

Wait, do you are gonna go out and say AMD is putting out a 980 competitor for $700 ? Come on ! You think amd is going to put out an Nvidia competitor for $200, not $20, not even $50, but $200 dollars more? That has to be one of the stupidest theories I've ever heard.

Well, the rumor is that it's faster than Titan X, so yeah.

 

[Techhog]

Does Fiji have any other improvements over Tonga other than HBM? It may not make sense for AMD's limited resources to do a die with a 3072 core Tonga (for instance) without HBM for the second level.



Well, the die is going to be huge and presumably HBM is super expensive.

Then they might as well cancel it, since they'll just end up with tons of unsold inventory and million of dollars in losses, along with an even worse image. If it needs to be expensive and it can't compete with GM200, it doesn't need to exist.

 

[Shehriazad]

Even with those weird numbers n stuff in their drivers...that doesn't mean anything, yet.

So far this thread is like every other..full of camp AMD vs camp Nvidia speculations that try to favor either side.

Keep it real...we don't actually know enough to jump to conclusions. Sure, the same GPU types could be used again....so there could be a "Pitcairn" again, sure. But it could also be a modified and upgraded/improved Pitcairn...do we know anything for sure? Nah.

All we've seen so far is a bunch of more or less trustworthy leaks and this datamine from the driver that doesn't actually tell us anything conclusive...especially since that is for cards that haven't even been launched yet...for all I care...that info could be a placeholder put in there in preparation for the real thing (aka it wasn't even meant to be there in that form)


Please stop fussing around like a bunch of kids until we actually know conclusive and official things.

That some cards are going to be rebrands seem obvious...this happens with GPUs ALL the time. (I expect some GTX 910-940 rebrands really soon, as well. AMD 200 is full of rebrands, and so are GTX 700 and 600 series. I mean come on...Nvidia had rebrands all the way up to the GTX 770 in their lineup...that's quite a massive chunk. GTX 900 just happened to not have such a rebrand because they are trying to pull an entirely new line of cards...with the obvious problems that this had brought -> 3.5GB rage and so on)

 

[Cloudfire777]

See, I told you R9 380X would be Hawaii.

the Radeon R9 290 series and will not disappear, it will be renamed to Grenada

http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=37271609&postcount=1

R9 380X: Grenada XT
Which will be Hawaii XT (R9 290X) rebrand

R9 380: Grenada
Rebrand from Hawaii (R9 290)

This is seriously messed up. EVERYTHING except 390X/390 will be rebrands.

 

[Techhog]

See, I told you R9 380X would be Hawaii.
http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=37271609&postcount=1

R9 380X: Grenada XT
Which will be Hawaii XT (R9 290X) rebrand

R9 380: Grenada
Rebrand from Hawaii (R9 290)

This is seriously messed up. EVERYTHING except 390X/390 will be rebrands.

So, is there any reason for me to wait or can I just pick up a 290 now without missing out on anything? -_-

 

[Cloudfire777]

R9 360 (Tobago Pro, new name): R9 260 (Bonaire)
R9 370 (Trinidad Pro, new name): R9 270 (Pitcairne)
R9 380 (Grenada, new name): R9 290 (Hawaii)
R9 380X (Grenada XT, new name): R9 290X (Hawaii XT)
R9 390: Fiji
R9 390X: Fiji XT/Pro

So, is there any reason for me to wait or can I just pick up a 290 now without missing out on anything? -_-

If you don`t want Maxwell or 390/390X, most likely you wont miss anything it seems :/

 

[3DVagabond]

R9 360 (Tobago Pro, new name): R9 260 (Bonaire)
R9 370 (Trinidad Pro, new name): R9 270 (Pitcairne)
R9 380 (Grenada, new name): R9 290 (Hawaii)
R9 380X (Grenada XT, new name): R9 290X (Hawaii XT)
R9 390: Fiji
R9 390X: Fiji XT/Pro

This would be a best case scenario from nVidia's POV.

 

[Silverforce11]

Jumping to conclusions based on beta driver inf with potentially placeholder numbers & decimals...

What makes you think Hawaii, which cannot compete with 970/980, is going to be relaunched to compete against 970/980?

Also who in their right minds would actively prepare more of to sell a 512bit bus 4GB 300W TDP SKU at ~$250? The only reason its been selling that low is because nobody wants to buy it at similar prices to the 970 and they have to clear inventory.

AMD may as well sell nothing because it would a waste of their time and their AIBs time to sell such a low profit part compared to the competition.

Why prepare to launch a dud that's already obsolete and failing to compete? Zero logic. Do you honestly believe AMD is THAT stupid?

 

[DownTheSky]

If this is true AMD just went full retard.

 

[Cloudfire777]

Its in the drivers (AMD make them you know) and VR-zone which is very reliable just said Grenada from 300 series will be R9 290 series. We already know what R9 370 is thanks to the drivers. And 360.
Leaving 380 and 390 left.

One of them got to be Grenada. The choice should be easy
One can argue with financials and subjective thoughts, but the evidence is pretty strong

This would be a best case scenario from nVidia's POV.

Its almost like CPUs. Except opposite.
Targeting the very high end while leaving mid/low end cards for Nvidia. This sucks. Not just for desktop but also mobile which needs efficient 256bit cards badly from AMD

 

[Techhog]

R9 360 (Tobago Pro, new name): R9 260 (Bonaire)
R9 370 (Trinidad Pro, new name): R9 270 (Pitcairne)
R9 380 (Grenada, new name): R9 290 (Hawaii)
R9 380X (Grenada XT, new name): R9 290X (Hawaii XT)
R9 390: Fiji
R9 390X: Fiji XT/Pro


If you don`t want Maxwell or 390/390X, most likely you wont miss anything it seems :/

I'm honestly considering just turning on my principles and buying the 970. >_>

 

[Silverforce11]

Its in the drivers (AMD make them you know) and VR-zone which is very reliable just said Grenada will be R9 290 series. We already know what R9 370 is thanks to the drivers. And 360.
Leaving 380 and 390 left.

"Jumping to conclusions based on beta driver inf with potentially placeholder numbers & decimals..."

As was said, the launch is coming soon. Let's see what happens, whether AMD is as stupid as some of you like to believe.

 

[nvgpu]

http://chinese.vr-zone.com/146560/a...inidad-and-tobago-for-computex-2015-03232015/

Tonga 更名為 Antigua（安地卡島）
Tonga renamed Antigua ( Antigua Island )

 

[Silverforce11]

If they are delaying the launch so much, may as well not launch anything and wait for 14nm ff from GF to be ready.

Launching obsolete parts to sell at much lower prices than the competition makes them so little (or none) profit, why bother? How would XFX or Sapphire feel selling break even or hardly profitable SKUs?

Because there's no way they can sell these outdated GPUs at prices remotely close to Maxwell SKUs. Even selling R290/X at $220/250 and they lost marketshare vs 970!!

Here's some food for thought.

390/X is rumored to be $599/$799 (source, AIB leakers). It's rumored to be very fast, from multiple sources including developers & journalist with first hand experience.
380/X is rumored to be $299/$399.

Now, how much sense does that make for 380/X to be R290/X with a new name? A) There's no way people would buy R290/X for that much when its so inefficient compared to the 970. B) There's no way the performance gap from 380X -> tier up would be 50% or greater. The usual gap between product tiers is 30%.

As for Tonga? Who would buy Tonga for $200 when they can get a 960?

So don't be daft. AMD isn't suicidal.

ps. There's ONE scenario where its possible for AMD to "re-brand" and sell at a higher price. 14nm ff shrinks with some minor bumps (+Freesync +codecs support). Otherwise I cannot see Lisa Su being that stupid.

 

[Cloudfire777]

http://chinese.vr-zone.com/146560/a...inidad-and-tobago-for-computex-2015-03232015/

Im gonna add it to my list where I think it will be

R9 360 (Tobago Pro, new name): R9 260 (Bonaire)
R9 370 (Trinidad Pro, new name): R9 270 (Pitcairne)
R9 370X (Antigua, new name): R9 285 (Tonga)
R9 380 (Grenada, new name): R9 290 (Hawaii)
R9 380X (Grenada XT, new name): R9 290X (Hawaii XT)
R9 390: Fiji
R9 390X: Fiji XT/Pro

 

[jpiniero]

Because there's no way they can sell these outdated GPUs at prices remotely close to Maxwell SKUs. Even selling R290/X at $220/250 and they lost marketshare vs 970!!

Prices have drifted back up, esp after 3.5gbgate. It's more like $270/$310 now. As to how many they are selling... well...

As for Tonga? Who would buy Tonga for $200 when they can get a 960?

The 285 and 960 are pretty comparable. Full Tonga would be in a higher performance class just like the 280X is.

 

[futurefields]

guys its because consoles. if they make a GPU that can run MGS5 @ 4k/60fps for $300 people will jump the console ship. expect improvements to slow down for awhile.

 

[Silverforce11]

The 285 and 960 are pretty comparable. Full Tonga would be in a higher performance class just like the 280X is.

They are not comparable at all. The power difference alone puts them into different class. A 960 is very comfortable in a HPTC or low power or weak PSU rigs. 285 is a dud.

I wouldn't even buy a R290X at $250 if I can get a 970 at $330. OC v OC they are close, except one card uses 350W while the other ~200W. I'm brand agnostic and I feel that way. Imagine the masses who think NV is superior.

 

[jpiniero]

They are not comparable at all. The power difference alone puts them into different class.

Performance wise it is pretty comparable. Power consumption and nVidia's marketing... yeah.

But it also explains the relabeling. Without the power savings of HBM, it's probably not worth the design effort to do that 1.5x Tonga I mentioned. Which is where the gap is. And HBM is too expensive at this point to be on anything but the top end.

 

[DearLord]

Performance wise it is pretty comparable. Power consumption and nVidia's marketing... yeah.

In the cases where the power consumption of a card requires the end user to purchase a new psu, then the price of that psu must, practically speaking, be built into the cost of the card. Additionally, if one card at stock generates more heat or sound than another, the end user employing stock parts might also take that into account. On another note, personally I have been really underwhelmed by the titan x, and regardless of the rebranding issue, am really excited to see what's going to happen with the 390x.

 

[JDG1980]

270X never use 180W of power. Not even close.

TechPowerUp's R9 270X reference card tests found peak power usage of 172W, not far off from the rated 180W TDP.

A test on a Sapphire R7 265 (the former 7850) topped out at 132W. (Rated TDP is 150W.) Considering the fact that AMD is usually very aggressive with their voltage and that Pitcairn and Tahiti can often save power by undervolting (even in 100%, 24/7 loads like cryptomining), it's certainly plausible that AMD could get the power usage of Pitcairn to the 110W-130W range, especially if it's only running 1024 shaders instead of the full 1280. But that's not going to be a competitive product at anything above the $150 price point, considering it won't be a modern card with modern features. More than one full year ago, that same TPU review described the R7 265 as being "based on the aging HD 7850". And this was before the release of GM204 and GM206.

 

[Enigmoid]

TechPowerUp's R9 270X reference card tests found peak power usage of 172W, not far off from the rated 180W TDP.

A test on a Sapphire R7 265 (the former 7850) topped out at 132W. (Rated TDP is 150W.) Considering the fact that AMD is usually very aggressive with their voltage and that Pitcairn and Tahiti can often save power by undervolting (even in 100%, 24/7 loads like cryptomining), it's certainly plausible that AMD could get the power usage of Pitcairn to the 110W-130W range, especially if it's only running 1024 shaders instead of the full 1280. But that's not going to be a competitive product at anything above the $150 price point, considering it won't be a modern card with modern features. More than one full year ago, that same TPU review described the R7 265 as being "based on the aging HD 7850". And this was before the release of GM204 and GM206.

You have to be very careful here. Maximum could be the 100 microsecond blip depending on the granularity of the measurement.

In the same review the average power is 112W. AMD could easily counter with a SKU that drops clocks under very heavy loads to maintain a 130W envelope.

 

[Vesku]

Only way this would be remotely viable as a lineup to last until sometime in 2016 would be if they have ported everything to GF28nm and implemented Tonga, or better, improvements while doing so.