Question about common Christian belief

[Gunslinger08]

Okay, so I always hear people say that "God put them in situations for a reason" and "God brought people into their lives." Basically, I think this means that these people believe in fate and unavoidable events in your life.

However, there is also the issue of free will. How can we truly have free will, if our lives are pre-determined? If everything that happens in our lives is because of God, how do we have a choice? I see life as the result of your actions and the actions of every other person before you (and currently living at the same time as you).

Any thoughts?

 

[exilera]

/thread

 

[eigen]

fairy tales dont have to be consistent.Only comforting.

 

[TitanDiddly]

The actions of others due to free will impacts others.

As for cancer and stuff, I don't know.

 

[ElFenix]

no, that means that in that particular situation god brought someone into their lives, not that their lives are totally pre-determined, or even that god chose to bring that particular situation to that person until instantaneously before that time.

 

[Hyperblaze]

God wants all of us to go through a path in life. But we have the freewill to decide what choices we make. God brings people in our lives to help us along. But we can just as easily refuse their help.

 

[NikPreviousAcct]

Flamebait.

 

[cjgallen]

It's a test.

:roll:

 

[nakedfrog]

Ring ring ring ring ring ring ring
Bananaphone!

 

[KarenMarie]

It is mho that the whole predestination stuff is not true. Also, God putting people in situations is also not true. I think that things happen as a direct result of people's free will.

Supposedly, Christ came to fulfill the 10 commandments, and now people are no longer servants, but children of God. Therefore, they have the free will to be good or bad and the world revolves around that. The actions of one not only influences their own lives, but the lives of those around them.

At least that is what I was taught in religious instructions when i was a kid. I am not an actively/strictly practicing anything now...so it all kinda passes me by.



edit: someone mentioned cancer... we were taught that all diseases and stuff are a direct result of eco and lifestyle practices.

 

[NikPreviousAcct]

Originally posted by: nakedfrog
Ring ring ring ring ring ring ring
Bananaphone!

<a target=_blank class=ftalternatingbarlinklarge href="http://vnfiles.ign.com/starwars/movies/ws_fettsvette.wmv">MYYYYYYY backpack's!
got jets!
I'm Boba!
the Fett!</a>

 

[ITJunkie]

Originally posted by: joshsquall
Okay, so I always hear people say that "God put them in situations for a reason" and "God brought people into their lives." Basically, I think this means that these people believe in fate and unavoidable events in your life.

However, there is also the issue of free will. How can we truly have free will, if our lives are pre-determined? If everything that happens in our lives is because of God, how do we have a choice? I see life as the result of your actions and the actions of every other person before you (and currently living at the same time as you).

Any thoughts?

I'm not sure "fate" would be as accurate as "divine guidance"....maybe.
I prefer to believe that Freewill, and the choices I make, determine my fate. But that doesn't mean there isn't room for God in all this too.

 

[JetsFanatic]

Originally posted by: Hyperblaze
God wants all of us to go through a path in life. But we have the freewill to decide what choices we make. God brings people in our lives to help us along. But we can just as easily refuse their help.

Ditto

I would like to add that GOD knows what are choices are going to be, because
he is the begining and the end, the alpha & the omega. There is no time in GOD.
So we have free will to choose. But GOD knows what are choice will be.

can be very confusing at times.

 

[Amused]

The human mind has a strange need to apply patterns and "reasons" to random things.

This is why we see shapes in clouds, bagels, and freeway overpasses.

We also apply this to actions and events. The "3" myth, the full moon myth, and so on...

 

[SouthPaW1227]

Don't look so hard into it. I'm a Christian but I just don't try to make things more difficult than they are. It's better to say "there's a reason for everything"...to me that sums it up nicely.

 

[Gunslinger08]

Originally posted by: JetsFanatic

Originally posted by: Hyperblaze
God wants all of us to go through a path in life. But we have the freewill to decide what choices we make. God brings people in our lives to help us along. But we can just as easily refuse their help.

Ditto

I would like to add that GOD knows what are choices are going to be, because
he is the begining and the end, the alpha & the omega. There is no time in GOD.
So we have free will to choose. But GOD knows what are choice will be.

can be very confusing at times.

If he knows what our choices will be, then that means that they are predetermined. That contradicts free will, doesn't it?

 

[Yossarian]

Originally posted by: eigen
fairy tales dont have to be consistent.Only comforting.

 

[Fenixgoon]

Originally posted by: joshsquall

Originally posted by: JetsFanatic

Originally posted by: Hyperblaze
God wants all of us to go through a path in life. But we have the freewill to decide what choices we make. God brings people in our lives to help us along. But we can just as easily refuse their help.

Ditto

I would like to add that GOD knows what are choices are going to be, because
he is the begining and the end, the alpha & the omega. There is no time in GOD.
So we have free will to choose. But GOD knows what are choice will be.

can be very confusing at times.

If he knows what our choices will be, then that means that they are predetermined. That contradicts free will, doesn't it?

not necessarily. all depends on how you look at it, IMO.

 

[Literati]

These are said on depending situations.

For instance, if a man is going downhill, by free will of course, doing drugs etc. and he meets a girl, whom he cleans up for and lives a better life because of, then someone might say that she was a Godsend.

So in fact, the person is and still can excersize free will, first by being put into that situation by choice, while also excersizing freewill to change for that person, or in some cases, not to change.

These "God sent" situations or people are not infact infringing upon a persons freewill, but put there in so doing so as to give the person an opportunity to excersize his or hers freewill to change accordingly. Regardless the person remains in control throughout any of those ordeals.

 

[JackBurton]

The SH!T is BANANAS, B-A-N-A-N-A-S!



But seriously, asking this questions to Christians, is like pointing out a flaw in Star Trek to Trekkies. The flaw will just get filled in with more fiction until they can make some sense of it.

And yes, it's just that simple.

 

[JetsFanatic]

Originally posted by: joshsquall

Originally posted by: JetsFanatic

Originally posted by: Hyperblaze
God wants all of us to go through a path in life. But we have the freewill to decide what choices we make. God brings people in our lives to help us along. But we can just as easily refuse their help.

Ditto

I would like to add that GOD knows what are choices are going to be, because
he is the begining and the end, the alpha & the omega. There is no time in GOD.
So we have free will to choose. But GOD knows what are choice will be.

can be very confusing at times.

If he knows what our choices will be, then that means that they are predetermined. That contradicts free will, doesn't it?

That is the quandry..............

 

[Trevelyan]

Free will is how you respond to the things that happen to you, not just being able to determine what happens to you. You have free will in that you can always make a decision to submit to God, or reject God, regardless of the situation you find yourself in. Now, whether your whole life is pre-determined or not, it doesn't really effect you because you still don't know your whole life ahead of time. No one really doubts their ability to make their own choices... it is evident every day that we do.

 

[Kipper]

It's been my experience that people who are believers in a deity and ALSO believe in free will suspend it when it is very convenient for them to do so.

Free will only exists when it is convenient for the possessor to claim he/she has it.

 

[Gunslinger08]

Originally posted by: Literati
These are said on depending situations.

For instance, if a man is going downhill, by free will of course, doing drugs etc. and he meets a girl, whom he cleans up for and lives a better life because of, then someone might say that she was a Godsend.

So in fact, the person is and still can excersize free will, first by being put into that situation by choice, while also excersizing freewill to change for that person, or in some cases, not to change.

These "God sent" situations or people are not infact infringing upon a persons freewill, but put there in so doing so as to give the person an opportunity to excersize his or hers freewill to change accordingly. Regardless the person remains in control throughout any of those ordeals.

Looking at the other side of your example: Didn't the woman also exercise her freewill to be there to meet the man, to love him, and to try to clean him up? If you don't consider her side, you are saying that God placed her there.. which goes against free will.

 

[Kipper]

Originally posted by: Trevelyan
Free will is how you respond to the things that happen to you, not just being able to determine what happens to you. You have free will in that you can always make a decision to submit to God, or reject God, regardless of the situation you find yourself in. Now, whether your whole life is pre-determined or not, it doesn't really effect you because you still don't know your whole life ahead of time. No one really doubts their ability to make their own choices... it is evident every day that we do.

If that bolded statement is true then the actual freedom of will is an illusion. Free will is generally acknowledged in the ethical literature to mean "to have been able to have done otherwise." The presence of actual courses of action which could have been taken in a deterministic (fate) path is ONE, and any other seemingly available courses of action are precluded because there is only one path to follow. Your statement is contradictory.