Info PSA- Public impeachments start today- UPDATE 2/5/2020- Trump wins.

[zinfamous]

This House was hired specifically to hold the president accountable. They've also passed a lot of legislation that turtle tosses straight into the circular file.

Exactly. Amazing that the Pubs don't accept that elections have consequences, and the results themselves specifically speak towards what precipitated those results.

 

[ivwshane]

First post in and nothing but Republican talking points? Do we have a bot or a previously banned member.

 

[SMOGZINN]

First, the Congressional (D)s pretended to hold an impeachment vote with their "impeachment resolution"

It is what Republicans asked for, so they gave it to them to make them happy. There was never any need for a vote to investigate the President.

the Congressional (D)s are pretending that these non-legal, non-binding, non-under-oath "hearings" are an actual impeachment process.

They are basing it on some obscure document called 'The Constitution'. It lays out how to impeach a President, and they are following it. Oh, and the hearing are under oath.

The President is in no danger whatever of actually being impeached by these ridiculous hearings.

Did your crystal ball tell you this? Because by my count there are 233 Democrats in the House, and it only requires 217 to impeach. Seems to me that he is in real danger of impeachment.

The ludicrous "whilsteblower" won't testify because Schiff and pals won't let him testify for fear of his having to reveal that he has no evidence at all that the President did anything wrong.

Who called 911 has no bearing on the police's investigation of a crime.
The whilsteblower[sic] won't testify because they are rightfully afraid of retribution for reporting what they saw as illegal activity by the Administration, and the right to report that anonymously is protected by law.

 

[zinfamous]

First post in and nothing but Republican talking points? Do we have a bot or a previously banned member.

Google is rolling out one of their latest troll-mimic bots.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

First, the Congressional (D)s pretended to hold an impeachment vote with their "impeachment resolution" vote which is a not a legal document, is non-binding, and is not a vote to impeach our sitting President--at all. Now, with the silly non-legal, non-binding "impeachment resolution" in play (which has no legal teeth whatsoever), the Congressional (D)s are pretending that these non-legal, non-binding, non-under-oath "hearings" are an actual impeachment process. But they are nothing of the kind. The President is in no danger whatever of actually being impeached by these ridiculous hearings. You know, Congressional (D)s in both the House and the Senate seem to have an abundance of contempt for the people in this country who vote (D) and who support them--apparently, they think their supporters are idiots. They are not impeaching the President because they have no grounds to do so and no real vote to impeach the President would ever meet the required number of Yeas in the House--ever--so the Congressional (D)s are giving their supporters a totally meaningless dog & pony show. Instead of a real impeachment, they do the only thing they've actually done for the last three years--which is to try to *smear* someone, usually a political opponent--with a blanket of lies, libel, and fraud they cannot prove and which they do not have to prove--because these hearings are fake as opposed to being real. The ludicrous "whilsteblower" won't testify because Schiff and pals won't let him testify for fear of his having to reveal that he has no evidence at all that the President did anything wrong. Ah, it's just like the Mueller lie fest that consumed years and millions of taxpayer dollars--and it will come to exactly the same end as the other fraudulent stunts the Congressional (D)s have been pulling for the last three years. I will be surprised to see more than a handful of Congressional (D)s retaining their seats of the ones who are up for reelection in 2020. The President will be reelected by a landslide vote--no doubt about it, however. I feel sorry for Pelosi and Schumer et al--it must physically hurt to be so stupid!...😉 Gaaaaaaa..😉

Who were before you were banned? This process has been recognized by the courts so everything you say is based on wishful fantasy. If this weren't "real" then arguments for compelling Mulvaney and others would have been dismissed as there would be no basis, however, no one on the judicial side has made this argument.

It's a poor troll. Spidey perhaps?

 

[blackangst1]

Legit question (and not a personal attack)—is being horribly uninformed about the greatest political crisis in modern history a choice? Are you unable to source information from multiple sources, separate facts from opinions and correct for source bias to distill a truth? Or are you simply disinterested and couldn’t care less what actually happens (I.e. you choose to invest your time and brain power elsewhere because this doesn’t really matter to you)? Honestly trying to understand why you aren’t paying attention to the facts here.

Show me where I have said the allegations against Trump are false. Youre creating a narrative that isnt there.

 

[[DHT]Osiris]

Show me where I have said the allegations against Trump are false. Youre creating a narrative that isnt there.

Then why are you dancing around the actual issue to try to find some way in which the House is wrong? Why ad homenim attack when you know for a fact that they're doing what they are supposed to be doing?

 

[brycejones]

This really needs to be quoted over and over again for people to read. There are literal events being fabricated by specific individuals then repeated over and over until they somehow manifest their own reality. Like the tail wagging the dog except the dog never existed and the tail was stitched together from some other animal.

It's provable nonsense, cite-able, repeatedly. You can claim it's a thing a thousand million times, it still will not be fact, and there still won't be a 'Thing' to investigate.

like I said there is observable reality and GOP reality now. Blackangst1 appears to only source information from GOP reality.

 

[blackangst1]

Then why are you dancing around the actual issue to try to find some way in which the House is wrong? Why ad homenim attack when you know for a fact that they're doing what they are supposed to be doing?

You have failed to understand my complaint. Ill try one more time.

I dont think the House is wrong to investigate, and agree its their job. Ive never said otherwise. Even in the Mueller threads I stated I thought the the investigation should continue. I even quoted myself from one of those threads a page or two ago. My frustration is that IMHO they certainly must have enough to impeach on, and dont understand why they're dragging this newest one out. They dont need it. Their previous 12 investigations had to have revealed enough (Lord knows many on this forum think so based on previous threads). It has nothing to do with embarrassing the administration. It has everything to do with spending even more taxpayer money to get an impeachment vote, even though they have enough already.

 

[Fenixgoon]

You have failed to understand my complaint. Ill try one more time.

I dont think the House is wrong to investigate, and agree its their job. Ive never said otherwise. Even in the Mueller threads I stated I thought the the investigation should continue. I even quoted myself from one of those threads a page or two ago. My frustration is that IMHO they certainly must have enough to impeach on, and dont understand why they're dragging this newest one out. They dont need it. Their previous 12 investigations had to have revealed enough (Lord knows many on this forum think so based on previous threads). It has nothing to do with embarrassing the administration. It has everything to do with spending even more taxpayer money to get an impeachment vote, even though they have enough already.

if congress wanted to piss away money there are much better and faster ways than impeachment hearings.

On the other hand, if you have one chamber saying they will refuse to impeach before even seeing the evidence, then your only option is to find such a mountain of evidence that they have no choice but to impeach. This is where we are now.

 

[IJTSSG]

Enjoying the Kabuki dance?

 

[SMOGZINN]

My frustration is that IMHO they certainly must have enough to impeach on, and dont understand why they're dragging this newest one out.

So, here is the question I would like to ask then: Do you think that if they voted to impeach right now and sent it over to the Senate they would vote to convict?

 

[ewdotson]

You have failed to understand my complaint. Ill try one more time.

I dont think the House is wrong to investigate, and agree its their job. Ive never said otherwise. Even in the Mueller threads I stated I thought the the investigation should continue. I even quoted myself from one of those threads a page or two ago. My frustration is that IMHO they certainly must have enough to impeach on, and dont understand why they're dragging this newest one out. They dont need it. Their previous 12 investigations had to have revealed enough (Lord knows many on this forum think so based on previous threads). It has nothing to do with embarrassing the administration. It has everything to do with spending even more taxpayer money to get an impeachment vote, even though they have enough already.

And yet you've also said, "I never said I want a vote." I'm not sure you're actually being as clear as you intend to be.

 

[[DHT]Osiris]

You have failed to understand my complaint. Ill try one more time.

I dont think the House is wrong to investigate, and agree its their job. Ive never said otherwise. Even in the Mueller threads I stated I thought the the investigation should continue. I even quoted myself from one of those threads a page or two ago. My frustration is that IMHO they certainly must have enough to impeach on, and dont understand why they're dragging this newest one out. They dont need it. Their previous 12 investigations had to have revealed enough (Lord knows many on this forum think so based on previous threads). It has nothing to do with embarrassing the administration. It has everything to do with spending even more taxpayer money to get an impeachment vote, even though they have enough already.

If you're seriously asking this question, then you have not been paying attention to the actual impeachment proceedings (or the last 3 years). Laying out all the evidence in the court of public opinion is required when you have a selection of elected officials (Read: Republicans) that choose to make a goddamned circus of the proceedings. It has to be so overwhelming, so incontrovertible that even those spineless twats cannot disregard it without sacrificing every remaining shred of dignity and constituent support they have left, and then you have to go one step further, you have to guarantee that the entire party will fall if the Republicans don't get off their lazy asses and impeach him for the crimes he's clearly committed.

THEN it can go to the Senate, and not one day sooner.

 

[Stryke1983]

You have failed to understand my complaint. Ill try one more time.

I dont think the House is wrong to investigate, and agree its their job. Ive never said otherwise. Even in the Mueller threads I stated I thought the the investigation should continue. I even quoted myself from one of those threads a page or two ago. My frustration is that IMHO they certainly must have enough to impeach on, and dont understand why they're dragging this newest one out. They dont need it. Their previous 12 investigations had to have revealed enough (Lord knows many on this forum think so based on previous threads). It has nothing to do with embarrassing the administration. It has everything to do with spending even more taxpayer money to get an impeachment vote, even though they have enough already.

Again, the Republicans have publicly and privately made it clear that they will not go against a Republican President no matter what crimes he commits. Therefore the only way the President can be held accountable is when public pressure grows to a level that Republicans think will hurt them politically. The only way for that to happen is to ensure that any investigations are completed and the evidence is laid out in full. Half measures result in no accountability, which will just encourage the Republican party to become even more corrupt than they already are.

 

[blackangst1]

And yet you've also said, "I never said I want a vote." I'm not sure you're actually be as clear as you intend to be.

Ah that was a typo. Forgot the word "said". Thanks for pointing it out!

 

[blackangst1]

If you're seriously asking this question, then you have not been paying attention to the actual impeachment proceedings (or the last 3 years). Laying out all the evidence in the court of public opinion is required when you have a selection of elected officials (Read: Republicans) that choose to make a goddamned circus of the proceedings. It has to be so overwhelming, so incontrovertible that even those spineless twats cannot disregard it without sacrificing every remaining shred of dignity and constituent support they have left, and then you have to go one step further, you have to guarantee that the entire party will fall if the Republicans don't get off their lazy asses and impeach him for the crimes he's clearly committed.

THEN it can go to the Senate, and not one day sooner.

Got it. Fine.

 

[mect]

So, here is the question I would like to ask then: Do you think that if they voted to impeach right now and sent it over to the Senate they would vote to convict?

I did see an interesting point made that does give me the slightest bit of hope. In the senate, a simple majority vote could be used to make the conviction vote secret. If it was a secret vote, then I think it is possible the senate would convict.

 

[[DHT]Osiris]

Got it. Fine.

No retort? No contortion of the facts to present a way in which the Democrats are somehow not doing what they should be doing? Do you finally concede that this isn't something that's a failing on their part, and that they are indeed doing their job exactly the way it needs to be done, specifically because the majority Republicans are not, or at least refuse to do so in public?

 

[ewdotson]

I did see an interesting point made that does give me the slightest bit of hope. In the senate, a simple majority vote could be used to make the conviction vote secret. If it was a secret vote, then I think it is possible the senate would convict.

The problem there is the inevitable accusations of fraud. I fear the fallout would be ugly.

 

[SMOGZINN]

I did see an interesting point made that does give me the slightest bit of hope. In the senate, a simple majority vote could be used to make the conviction vote secret. If it was a secret vote, then I think it is possible the senate would convict.

I think it improves the odds, but I think that as of right now even that would not be enough. The plain truth is that many of them that would want to vote to convict would not do so because they are worried about the effect it will have on the down ballot come next year.

If Republicans convict Trump it is going to all but destroy the GOP for at least a few years. I honestly think it could cause a big enough schism in the party to cause it to splinter into several smaller parties. The GOP is not very unified on issues. On more real issues they vote like 3-4 distinct different parties. That is why they can't even agree on 302(b) numbers just between their own party right now. They just caucus together so they can get elected, if Trump is impeached a lot of them will want to no longer caucus together.

 

[soundforbjt]

I did see an interesting point made that does give me the slightest bit of hope. In the senate, a simple majority vote could be used to make the conviction vote secret. If it was a secret vote, then I think it is possible the senate would convict.

Mitch would never allow that to happen, unless his seat was in grave danger.

 

[[DHT]Osiris]

I think it improves the odds, but I think that as of right now even that would not be enough. The plain truth is that many of them that would want to vote to convict would not do so because they are worried about the effect it will have on the down ballot come next year.

If Republicans convict Trump it is going to all but destroy the GOP for at least a few years. I honestly think it could cause a big enough schism in the party to cause it to splinter into several smaller parties. The GOP is not very unified on issues. On more real issues they vote like 3-4 distinct different parties. That is why they can't even agree on 302(b) numbers just between their own party right now. They just caucus together so they can get elected, if Trump is impeached a lot of them will want to no longer caucus together.

And if they don't convict it'll probably destroy the GOP entirely. Millenials won't forget this, and after another 8 years of a Democrat in 2028, a whole pile of boomers will be dead. If they don't sacrifice their dignity and suck up the L that is this presidency, they may be running against two parties come 2028.

EDIT: an impeachment conviction and 'return to order and morals' could easily be a unifying battlecry, if they wanted to just grab it.

 

[Jhhnn]

You have failed to understand my complaint. Ill try one more time.

I dont think the House is wrong to investigate, and agree its their job. Ive never said otherwise. Even in the Mueller threads I stated I thought the the investigation should continue. I even quoted myself from one of those threads a page or two ago. My frustration is that IMHO they certainly must have enough to impeach on, and dont understand why they're dragging this newest one out. They dont need it. Their previous 12 investigations had to have revealed enough (Lord knows many on this forum think so based on previous threads). It has nothing to do with embarrassing the administration. It has everything to do with spending even more taxpayer money to get an impeachment vote, even though they have enough already.

Excuse me, but the intelligence committee received the actual complaint less than two months ago. We've had numerous delays because witnesses refused to appear. Those time slots were lost.

Remember when you said this?

And allow the Republicans bring whatever witnesses they want.

Questioning Nellie Ohr obviously won't speed things up but it plays into Barr's spying conspiracy theory. Or Hunter Biden, as if he had any knowledge of what Trump was doing when he did it. It's all about talking about everybody but Trump & his obvious malfeasance.

I'm intereste in what Lev Parnas has to say now that Trump gave him the kiss-off of death. Maybe he & the SDNY will put Rudy in the mood to rat. Probably not. He & Trump go way back & I'm sure he has enough dirt on Trump to receive a pardon the day after the election along with the ever stalwart Paul Manafort. Rudy would be out on appeal bond, at the worst. Like Scooter Libby, only different.

 

[blackangst1]

Excuse me, but the intelligence committee received the actual complaint less than two months ago. We've had numerous delays because witnesses refused to appear. Those time slots were lost.

For the quid pro quo complaint, yes I know this. This isnt the first investigation by the senate though.