PSA - Comcast users - Data Cap

[brycejones]

Don't worry, when they privatize all schooling, they can curtail the heavy users cuz consumers want learning caps, who cares of your paid your taxes. Then when roadways are privatized, they can bill you for driving more than your allotted miles cuz consumers want mileage caps. I mean, who cares if you know how to use the library or paid to drive 65 instead of 55, wouldn't want to clog up those roads or fill those halls

He's gone full starbuck, he'll just post stupid shit just to be contrarian. Trolls gotta troll I guess.

 

[Fenixgoon]

Of it ends up with lower costs for them and higher costs for the data usage...

Sounds similar to our tax structure - I'm always okay with THEM paying more.

considering data caps are completely arbitrary and unnecessary, they're just an easy way for companies to bilk consumers out of more money. there's no technical reason why a data cap needs to be in place.

if i download 1.2 TB in 1.2s, I've used all my data for the month. If I download 1.2TB over the course of 30 days, I've used all my data for the month. That makes no sense, because the infrastructure required for the two scenarios is not based on the amount of data i used, but on how fast i used it. That's why internet service tiers are sold based primarily on speed. Bits are not finite resources, therefore there is no reason to bill based on bit usage. It's not like milk, oil, or any other resource that has to be "mined" and is consumed.

Hell, when covid first hit and everyone starting killing off data caps, what happened? jack shit. why? because the infrastructure limitation isn't the absolute amount of data usage but the throughput.

 

[sdifox]

considering data caps are completely arbitrary and unnecessary, they're just an easy way for companies to bilk consumers out of more money. there's no technical reason why a data cap needs to be in place.

if i download 1.2 TB in 1.2s, I've used all my data for the month. If I download 1.2TB over the course of 30 days, I've used all my data for the month. That makes no sense, because the infrastructure required for the two scenarios is not based on the amount of data i used, but on how fast i used it. That's why internet service tiers are sold based primarily on speed. Bits are not finite resources, therefore there is no reason to bill based on bit usage. It's not like milk, oil, or any other resource that has to be "mined" and is consumed.

Hell, when covid first hit and everyone starting killing off data caps, what happened? jack shit. why? because the infrastructure limitation isn't the absolute amount of data usage but the throughput.

This is one of those "Oh Spidey07, where art thou" moments

 

[Fanatical Meat]

Thinking about this as an IT person, the interesting thing is that there probably should be a data cap for misuse of the service. If someone on your network is downloading 50 TB of crap every month and slowing down the network for your neighbors, they probably should cut that person off at some point.

The real question is where the set the cap. Would 2 TB be fair? How about 5 TB? At what point are you really impacting the performance of the network for other users?

The variables here are entirely dependant on your neighborhood, town, etc.. and corp like comcast isn't going to micromanage each contracted town, that's costly, it's easier just to say "here, 1.2TB is your max or we charge you more". Obviously, that's what they did here. I'm sure they have a queried list of heavy users and 1.2 TB is probably on the low end but they want that money.

In terms of slowing it down for my neighbors, that's not my problem, I pay for my speeds, i want to use them whenever I want, even 24x7, it's not my problems if comcast doesn't invest in the infrastructure to support all the accounts they hold in a given area.

Just do what wireless does, the technology and ability already exist.
If you have one user impacting the experience of dozens of users just slow the connection down for the bandwidth hog.
The real solution is everyone in the country should have at least 3 choices of providers, two of which should be wired

 

[Fanatical Meat]

Damn all you guys talking about this. I had to log into my fios account to see how much data we use and it appears that is not part of our package. All my bill shows it 100/100 $39.99
*********until**********
1/25/2021 the a $15 promo credit expires.
I started shopping last night an it pissed me off.
Current Verizon fios promo $40 200/200
Just as before I churned my account best rate I can go to is $85 150/150
Started shopping with xfinity below is my chat

Spoiler

I give the dude credit he hung in there and tried to get it back to me buying. He handled it like I did with wireless “that’s the rule and I don’t make the rules”

 

[ch33zw1z]

Damn all you guys talking about this. I had to log into my fios account to see how much data we use and it appears that is not part of our package. All my bill shows it 100/100 $39.99
*********until**********
1/25/2021 the a $15 promo credit expires.
I started shopping last night an it pissed me off.
Current Verizon fios promo $40 200/200
Just as before I churned my account best rate I can go to is $85 150/150
Started shopping with xfinity below is my chat

Spoiler

View attachment 34600

View attachment 34601
View attachment 34602
View attachment 34603
View attachment 34605
View attachment 34604

I give the dude credit he hung in there and tried to get it back to me buying. He handled it like I did with wireless “that’s the rule and I don’t make the rules”

Don't forget, 200mbps will get to that data cap 2x as fast as me. Cost effective just means how high can we price and still get people to buy.

 

[ch33zw1z]

Just do what wireless does, the technology and ability already exist.
If you have one user impacting the experience of dozens of users just slow the connection down for the bandwidth hog.
The real solution is everyone in the country should have at least 3 choices of providers, two of which should be wired

That's one way to do it, I would rather see us make it a utility and get vendors offering connections over the lines maintain by a contractor, like we do for electricity

 

[Fanatical Meat]

Don't forget, 200mbps will get to that data cap 2x as fast as me. Cost effective just means how high can we price and still get people to buy.

yeah obviously it is market based pricing. The price is determined by what the market can bear which for a utility is a shitty practice
I forgot to ask if there was a cap but the T&C didn’t mention a hard cap. Honestly I have no idea how much data we use. Regardless I could always buy from a reseller, take the free install offer use it for a month then go back to fios as a shiny new customer that people will cheer over.

 

[ch33zw1z]

yeah obviously it is market based pricing. The price is determined by what the market can bear which for a utility is a shitty practice
I forgot to ask if there was a cap but the T&C didn’t mention a hard cap. Honestly I have no idea how much data we use. Regardless I could always buy from a reseller, take the free install offer use it for a month then go back to fios as a shiny new customer that people will cheer over.

Yep, you could do that. Also, I bet your FIOS account can tell ya how much data you're using. Fwiw, it's nice to not worry about it, and that's the rub here. For those of us who use more than the 1.2TB, there's no more set it and forget it. It's gonna be spend xx amount to go unlimited, spend xx amount for going over, or keep checking it to make sure I don't go over. And when you kids, that's a bit tougher

 

[Fanatical Meat]

Yep, you could do that. Also, I bet your FIOS account can tell ya how much data you're using. Fwiw, it's nice to not worry about it, and that's the rub here. For those of us who use more than the 1.2TB, there's no more set it and forget it. It's gonna be spend xx amount to go unlimited, spend xx amount for going over, or keep checking it to make sure I don't go over. And when you kids, that's a bit tougher

I can’t find total usage anywhere in the fios bill. Account settings are really basic
Push this for:
Router reset
Ask a question
Buy Verizon’s online security package
Print bill

 

[Brainonska511]

I can’t find total usage anywhere in the fios bill. Account settings are really basic
Push this for:
Router reset
Ask a question
Buy Verizon’s online security package
Print bill

RCN doesn't give total usage either. No cap, but impossible to see what I've used unless I turn on the traffic analyzer feature of my new router.

 

[Aikouka]

The $15 for a 1TB seems reasonable, however, imo

Frankly, I don't think it's a great idea to start considering any overage fees "reasonable". If we can agree that their only motivation is to extract more money from "power users", then one company is simply being less greedy than another. Last I checked, corporate greed isn't a good thing regardless of the extent.

 

[ch33zw1z]

Frankly, I don't think it's a great idea to start considering any overage fees "reasonable". If we can agree that their only motivation is to extract more money from "power users", then one company is simply being less greedy than another. Last I checked, corporate greed isn't a good thing regardless of the extent.

That's fair! And I think so because @Fenixgoon made a solid point in post #127 that applies

 

[Viper1j]

Hey, so not "politics" per sey, but for those of us who are limited in our ISP options (Comcast is essentially my only feasible choice, for now), their expanding their data cap enforcement to 12 more states

https://www.theverge.com/2020/11/23/21591420/comcast-cap-data-1-2tb-home-users-internet-xfinity

And once again, the bully ISP's use bullshit logic to do it.

If 95% of their customers only use ~300GB, why are they punishing those 5% who use more?

Am I expected to buy a service and NOT use it?

I thought getting rid of Net Neutrality would open up the ISP's abilities? (yea right, lol)

In January and February, Comcast will give its Xfinity customers not on an unlimited plan a “credit” for any data usage charges over 1.2TB during those months to ease them into the new limits. "

I personally don't know anybody that's NOT on an unlimited plan.

I pay 49.99 for a 375 Mb down rate.(The "Blast" package) because I'm a "cord cutter", and I'm locked into a promotional package for the next three years.

If they try to impose a data cap on me, I'll sue them into oblivion.

 

[ultimatebob]

This is one of those "Oh Spidey07, where art thou" moments

Yeah, the last time Comcast tried instating a (300 GB?) data cap, I was one of the guys arguing with Spidey07 over it. If he was still here, he's probably say something along the lines of:

"Hey, if you want unlimited downloads, go get yourself a dedicated business fiber line. They're only $1,000 a month now"

Comcast's data cap 2.0 seems a bit more reasonable, though, so I'm quite so angry over it. Give me an option to boost it to 2.4 Tb for something reasonable like an extra $8 a month, and I'd have no problems with it at all.

 

[Aikouka]

That's fair! And I think so because @Fenixgoon made a solid point in post #127 that applies

I was tempted to post the following in the Ars comment thread a few days ago. In regard to usage, I look at it this way... I don't think anyone would consider 1MB/s to be a huge strain on a network, but there are 86,400 seconds in a day, which means you would use 84.375 GB per day. So, with just a constant 1MB/s stream, you would go through the Comcast cap in 14.5 days.

In January and February, Comcast will give its Xfinity customers not on an unlimited plan a “credit” for any data usage charges over 1.2TB during those months to ease them into the new limits. "

I personally don't know anybody that's NOT on an unlimited plan.

I pay 49.99 for a 375 Mb down rate.(The "Blast" package) because I'm a "cord cutter", and I'm locked into a promotional package for the next three years.

Isn't Unlimited where you pay an extra $25 a month to not have a cap?

 

[ch33zw1z]

In January and February, Comcast will give its Xfinity customers not on an unlimited plan a “credit” for any data usage charges over 1.2TB during those months to ease them into the new limits. "

I personally don't know anybody that's NOT on an unlimited plan.

I pay 49.99 for a 375 Mb down rate.(The "Blast" package) because I'm a "cord cutter", and I'm locked into a promotional package for the next three years.

If they try to impose a data cap on me, I'll sue them into oblivion.

Comcast runs their ans different everywhere you get based on factors for that area. Good luck suing them, maybe check the link for your state, and if not then keep on keeping on!

 

[pmv]

considering data caps are completely arbitrary and unnecessary, they're just an easy way for companies to bilk consumers out of more money. there's no technical reason why a data cap needs to be in place.

if i download 1.2 TB in 1.2s, I've used all my data for the month. If I download 1.2TB over the course of 30 days, I've used all my data for the month. That makes no sense, because the infrastructure required for the two scenarios is not based on the amount of data i used, but on how fast i used it. That's why internet service tiers are sold based primarily on speed. Bits are not finite resources, therefore there is no reason to bill based on bit usage. It's not like milk, oil, or any other resource that has to be "mined" and is consumed.

Hell, when covid first hit and everyone starting killing off data caps, what happened? jack shit. why? because the infrastructure limitation isn't the absolute amount of data usage but the throughput.

But there is a relationship/correlation between the total amount a user regularly downloads, and the stress they are likely to be putting on the infrastructure at any one moment. Perhaps one could say that daily limits make more sense than monthly, as they'd get closer to the truth of that relationship. But I suppose billing is done monthly so that works better for the companies.

I admit I'm not that bothered by the issue. I don't think I have a data cap, not one that I ever come near to reaching anyway. I think I used to have one, but it was only an issue during, or immediately after, Steam sales

I guess what is needed is better infrastructure all-round. I wonder if it will ever entirely be able to keep up with demand, though?

 

[Brainonska511]

If they try to impose a data cap on me, I'll sue them into oblivion

Have fun with the binding arbitration that's probably in their agreement

 

[ch33zw1z]

I was tempted to post the following in the Ars comment thread a few days ago. In regard to usage, I look at it this way... I don't think anyone would consider 1MB/s to be a huge strain on a network, but there are 86,400 seconds in a day, which means you would use 84.375 GB per day. So, with just a constant 1MB/s stream, you would go through the Comcast cap in 14.5 days.



Isn't Unlimited where you pay an extra $25 a month to not have a cap?

They have some plans that include the unlimited. When I checked their website yesterday, only the 1Gbps was unlimited, and it was $190 (up from $120 in the spring) per month as Internet only package, all the plans had gone up drastically from earlier this year

 

[Viper1j]

Heres a screen cap of mine recently

A lot of mine is my work laptop, but my family streams a lot and download a lot of new games around bdays and holidays when the kids have money.

My plan is to not give them a penny more than I have to, so habits will change.

So glad ISP's can stifle progress so much.

I'm doing a little better than you.

 

[Viper1j]

Have fun with the binding arbitration that's probably in their agreement

If binding arbitration is part of the contract, and THEY breached their own contract, I'm thinking they can't force it into binding arbitration.

By their own actions they have voided the contract.

 

[Fanatical Meat]

Yeah, the last time Comcast tried instating a (300 GB?) data cap, I was one of the guys arguing with Spidey07 over it. If he was still here, he's probably say something along the lines of:

"Hey, if you want unlimited downloads, go get yourself a dedicated business fiber line. They're only $1,000 a month now"

Comcast's data cap 2.0 seems a bit more reasonable, though, so I'm quite so angry over it. Give me an option to boost it to 2.4 Tb for something reasonable like an extra $8 a month, and I'd have no problems with it at all.

Pretty much this. I am not against high usage people paying a little more but that should come with better low options, like a $20 500mb rate. Also they should auto step you to the next plan for example someone signs for $20 minimum usage rate and greatly exceeds it. They shouldn’t get billed $100 when the next appropriate tier for them is $50.
Additional data shouldn’t be pay per use, it should be a big bucket at a reasonable cost like above and the customer should get texts, emails and even pop up alerts when they are approaching a data cap.
Maybe it does work that way because I have never had a data cap other than a cap on my wireless hotspot.

 

[Fanatical Meat]

If binding arbitration is part of the contract, and THEY breached their own contract, I'm thinking they can't force it into binding arbitration.

By their own actions they have voided the contract.

Good luck fighting a company with effectively unlimited resources and time in court.

 

[Viper1j]

I was tempted to post the following in the Ars comment thread a few days ago. In regard to usage, I look at it this way... I don't think anyone would consider 1MB/s to be a huge strain on a network, but there are 86,400 seconds in a day, which means you would use 84.375 GB per day. So, with just a constant 1MB/s stream, you would go through the Comcast cap in 14.5 days.



Isn't Unlimited where you pay an extra $25 a month to not have a cap?

Personally, I've never paid more than $60 a month, since I've dumped the TV