Proof that Toyota is going to take over the world...

[b0mbrman]

$2.164 - National unleaded average for regular gasoline
Source: FuelGaugeReport.com

38 mpg - Real world combined mileage of Civic Hybrid
Source: Edmunds.com

$0.056947368421052631578947368421053 - Gas cost per mile of Civic Hybrid based on those numbers (Woah! Significant digits! )

27 mpg - Real world combined mileage of Civic LX Sedan
Source: Edmunds.com

$0.080148148148148148148148148148148 - Gas cost per mile of Civic LX Sedan based on those numbers

$0.023200779727095516569200779727096 - Difference per mile based on those numbers

 

[b0mbrman]

176589 - Miles necessary to make up the difference

And there you have it. Not included are insurance costs, maintenance costs, and X-factors which I figure will be a push.

Insurance: The additional horsepower of the LX would increase its premiums but the additional purchsae price of the Hybrid would increase its premiums as well.

Maintenance: The maintenance costs of the Hybrid will be at least marginally higher because there is at least one more thing that needs maintenance and you are more likely to be unable to find a mechanic qualified to work on a hybrid.

X-factors: The most attractive part of the Civic Hybrid is definitely the little "Hybrid" placard that exclaims to the world that you care about stuff. The biggest X-factor in the LX's favor is cargo space. Not only does the LX have three more cubic feet of trunk space (30% more) becaue of the Hybrid's battery location, but that same location makes it so you cannot fold down the rear seats to get a large cargo area. When I found that out at the dealership, I knew the Hybrid would be unacceptable.

 

[OS]

heh, you insist on keep using numbers that favorably twist the calculations in your favor.

My original point is, for certain markets and buyers, buying a hybrid is starting to make sense.

In urban areas of CA, gas is consistently $2.50 a gallon now. I seriously doubt the largest market of hybrids has a 26K individual income. Maintenance is a minor issue, there is nothing inherently troublesome in the electric motor, computer and batteries if properly built.

Which using all the rest of your numbers, takes ~150K miles to recover the cost. At 500 miles per week, it takes 5.9 years to recover the cost. The difference becomes less as gas prices increasing, or mileage per time increases.

Given that gas price increases HAVE exceeded inflation the past 10 years. Don't give me BS about measuring gas prices relative to a 1980s post OPEC embargo spike. Given the current worldwide supply/demand relationship is only going to get worse, it's pretty realistic to expect the technology will becomes more cost effective as time passes.

 

[b0mbrman]

Originally posted by: OS
heh, you insist on keep using numbers that favorably twist the calculations in your favor.

Are you sure it isn't that real life numbers twist the calculations in my favor?

My original point is, for certain markets and buyers, buying a hybrid is starting to make sense.

In urban areas of CA, gas is consistently $2.50 a gallon now. I seriously doubt the largest market of hybrids has a 26K individual income. Maintenance is a minor issue, there is nothing inherently troublesome in the electric motor, computer and batteries if properly built.

Which using all the rest of your numbers, takes ~150K miles to recover the cost. At 500 miles per week, it takes 5.9 years to recover the cost. The difference becomes less as gas prices increasing, or mileage per time increases.

Given that gas price increases HAVE exceeded inflation the past 10 years. Don't give me BS about measuring gas prices relative to a 1980s post OPEC embargo spike. Given the current worldwide supply/demand relationship is only going to get worse, it's pretty realistic to expect the technology will becomes more cost effective as time passes.

I'm one step ahead of you. Here's a spreadsheet showing every possible income tax bracket and gas prices - Text. According to FuelGaugeReport.com, the current highest in the nation is Santa Barbara at $2.542.

 

[OS]

Originally posted by: b0mbrman

Originally posted by: OS
heh, you insist on keep using numbers that favorably twist the calculations in your favor.

Are you sure it isn't that real life numbers twist the calculations in my favor?

You're smoking cock if you think someone making 26K/year, in an area with 2.15/gal gas is a target market for hybrids. There's a reason why trucks still outsell cars.

 

[b0mbrman]

Originally posted by: OS

Originally posted by: b0mbrman

Originally posted by: OS
heh, you insist on keep using numbers that favorably twist the calculations in your favor.

Are you sure it isn't that real life numbers twist the calculations in my favor?

You're smoking cock if you think someone making 26K/year, in an area with 2.15/gal gas is a target market for hybrids. There's a reason why trucks still outsell cars.

Ha ha. Simmer down .

Look at the spreadsheet; Even someone making $100k+ and buying gas in San Francisco will be in the red for almost 140,000 miles.

Text

 

[b0mbrman]

Edmunds.com's true cost to own ratings

Civic Hybrid
Civic LX

 

[b0mbrman]

Long-Term Test: 2005 Honda Accord Hybrid

Some key quotes:

Offering the most horsepower, and the highest fuel efficiency, of any 2005 Honda Accord, our hybrid model promises the best of both worlds: excellent performance and a reduced fuel bill. But after three months of driving the car, we're finding it doesn't quite deliver on either promise.

Instead, we were left with a best 0-to-60 time of 7.48 seconds and a quarter-mile time of 16 seconds flat at 89 mph. Those figures are nearly identical to the 2004 Accord V6 in our 2003-2004 Family Sedan Comparison test (7.5 seconds and 15.7 seconds, respectively).... While not slow, it does verify that the 255-hp hybrid drivetrain doesn't imbue the Accord Hybrid with class-leading straight-line performance.

But after five months of driving the Accord, our best average for a single tank is 30.2 mpg. More disturbing is the average mpg over the first 3,920 miles, which is only 22 mpg.

:wine:

 

[b0mbrman]

Oh yeah, as a reference for the "but all cars get lower than their EPA estimates" crowd, Edmunds got 26 mpg with the gas only Accord V6 - Text

Oh yeah. And 26 > 22