VirtualLarry
No Lifer
- Aug 25, 2001
- 56,587
- 10,225
- 126
If it's not about ensuring the constant supply of cheap oil into the US - do you think that we would bother wasting the $$$ to get involved? Sure, plenty of cheap computer goods are made in Taiwan, but so are they in mainland China, and somewhat cheaply in Japan too.
yllus
Elite Member & Lifer
- Aug 20, 2000
- 20,577
- 432
- 126
In this impossible scenario, yes, no matter who was in the White House - the U.S. would get involved. As cynical as may sound, it would be best to give China a little slap and keep their hands off of Taiwan rather than enbolden them to expand, knowing that the U.S. will do nothing. It's a must-do.
(The cynicism is completely fitting considering the scenario being discussed.)
Hmm reading my post I seemed very rude. Sorry about that.
I don't understand the attitude of apologists like you, though. Should we let the Chinese attain their dream of a one China that stretches across Asia. They don't play by any rules at all. How are they imperialist you ask? Over 1/3rd of their land was stolen after 1950. They have a horrible record with minorities and participate in assimilation. If they take Taiwan it will just be another example of their inability to work with the world at all.
National Security=Big Business=Money
This is a great compromise. Everyone, PRC, Russia, Japan and US would like the maniac in charge of NKorea be thrown out.
N Korea is part of the axis of evil according to Pres Bush.
We took out Iraq, next is Iran and then we can finish the job w/ N Korea. I think its responsbile to let China try to clean up this mess. Its in their backyard so they should do it.
Haven't we lost enough of your young men and women in Iraq. We will lose more in Iran.
Let the PRC take on the zealots in N korea! Taiwan is a minor issue.
PingSpike
Lifer
- Feb 25, 2004
- 21,758
- 603
- 126
I don't know on this one. I have a feeling this latest stuff in the news is just more idle chest beating between the two as usual.
It just seems like this would be an extremely costly war. I've heard "once we bomb the center of industry...we've won" before, it was called Iraq. We could almost certainly destroy China's ability to make war...but there is no way we could occupy and control China. It would take some sort of super draft to be able to do that. I doubt we would nuke the hell out of them.
China isn't stupid though. They're waiting until they are powerful and US is weak. Then they'll move in. They're an old nation, they know how to wait. Perhaps by that time they'll have become sufficently capitalistic that it would be a smooth transition though. I dunno. I don't like to think about the USA and China fighting though, but neither could really force the other into an unconditional surrender were they determined. Maybe the US if nukes were used.
Should the USA defend? I have no idea, it seems like it would be a sh|tty mess, especially since we aren't exactly rolling in friends around the world these days.
It just seems like this would be an extremely costly war. I've heard "once we bomb the center of industry...we've won" before, it was called Iraq. We could almost certainly destroy China's ability to make war...but there is no way we could occupy and control China. It would take some sort of super draft to be able to do that. I doubt we would nuke the hell out of them.
China isn't stupid though. They're waiting until they are powerful and US is weak. Then they'll move in. They're an old nation, they know how to wait. Perhaps by that time they'll have become sufficently capitalistic that it would be a smooth transition though. I dunno. I don't like to think about the USA and China fighting though, but neither could really force the other into an unconditional surrender were they determined. Maybe the US if nukes were used.
Should the USA defend? I have no idea, it seems like it would be a sh|tty mess, especially since we aren't exactly rolling in friends around the world these days.
We already have our hands full with the mid-East.
Let the Chinese duke it out themselves.... they've got a population crisis anyway.
Let the Chinese duke it out themselves.... they've got a population crisis anyway.
the US would not invade China, they would just destroy China's ability to transport troops to Taiwan in an invasion. Which could possibly be done just using the US Navy and Air Force from Japan and Guam.
Scouzer
Lifer
- Jun 3, 2001
- 10,358
- 5
- 0
Skoorb, fellow Canadian, your not going to find any common ground with Americans
That said, I agree it will be necessary to intervene against the Chinese. Stepping up now when China is still a fledgling superpower will be significantly easier than when they match or exceed the USA...
geecee
Platinum Member
- Jan 14, 2003
- 2,383
- 43
- 91
But according to Wikipedia:
So if you live in one of these countries, or are a REALLY, REALLY devout Catholic, Taiwan is a sovereign nation. But I digress, this belongs in P&N. Here, it just brings danger to the masses.
EDIT: While I support a defense of Taiwan, or at least all the necessary posturing to keep cooler heads prevailing and war from breaking out, I can't help but be reminded of this:
I dont know, you better ask bush if theres enough oil to steal, I mean save in there for us to go in there and loose more of our troops lives.
i say we stay out. we should clean up our own yard befor looking to clean up a neighbors
i say we stay out. we should clean up our own yard befor looking to clean up a neighbors
It depends on who you ask as to whether ROC has sovereignty. There are a lot of tests/definitions of sovereignty that ROC does fit. It does rule itself, and while it is a bit murky as to the "official" status, most nations do recognize taiwan as being under its own rule. I don't know where you are getting your seemingly biased information, skoorb, but it isn't really in keeping with international relations at the moment, which are more like recognizing taiwan without trying to upset china. In order to do so, we call our embassies pseudo embassies or quasi embassies. It's kind of like "civil union" versus "marriage". You seem to be suggesting that even "civil unions" don't exist.
You know you have a point.....lets let the South cede from the Union. I think the folks in Alabama have been oppressed too long too!
But what is to stop China from launching missles at Taiwan? Not necessariy nuclear, because that would just turn everyone against them.
PricklyPete
Lifer
- Sep 17, 2002
- 14,582
- 162
- 106
I don't think the US should step in like it did for Kuwait. The situation with Taiwan is different because their soveriegnty is debateable. Really, I believe the best course of action would be diplomatic at most....and this time with the UN...not just on our own.
Legally the US has to defend Taiwan if China attacks. It was enacted 10 April 1979, Taiwan Relations Act. This was passed when US moved official recognition of "China" from Taipei to Beijing (Peking).
As to whether China has legit "rights" to claim Taiwan as a province or not is debatable and changes with who you ask. If you ask my parents, no China has no claim on Taiwan. But if you ask people from mainland China, China has claim to Taiwan.
As to whether China has legit "rights" to claim Taiwan as a province or not is debatable and changes with who you ask. If you ask my parents, no China has no claim on Taiwan. But if you ask people from mainland China, China has claim to Taiwan.
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