Poll: If UFC was around when Bruce Lee was in his prime - how would he do?

[Gibson486]

Originally posted by: Pacfanweb
It would be hard to compare Lee to anyone, since he never actually fought anyone for real.

I'd go with the guy who we've actually seen fight for real.

What are you talking about....Bruce lee was in plenty of real fights. Infact, the whole thing behind his martial art was to have it be a martial art that could be used in the streets.

 

[GeneValgene]

a little off topic, but here is an EXCELLENT bruce lee interview...i found myself watching the entire thing

link

 

[astrocase]

Originally posted by: Greyd
Here are some cool quotes by people who knew Bruce Lee.
Herb Jackson - "The biggest problem in designing equipment for Bruce was that he'd go through it so damn fast. I had to reinforce his wooden dummy with automobile parts so he could train on it without breaking it. I had started to build him a mobile dummy that could actually attack and retreat to better simulate "Live" combat, sadly Bruce died before the machine was built. It would have been strung up by big high-tension cables that I was going to connect between two posts, one on either side of his backyard. The reason for the machine was simply because no one could stand up to his full force punches and kicks, Bruce's strength and skill had evolved to point where he had to fight machines. Bruce was very interested in strength training, you could say that he was obsessed with it".

Danny Inosanto - "Bruce was only interested in strength that he could readily convert to power. I remember once Bruce and I were walking along the beach in Santa Monica. All of a sudden this huge bodybuilder came walking by, and I said to Bruce "Man, look at the arms on that guy" I'll never forget his reaction, he said "Yeah, he's big, but is he powerful???".

Chuck Norris - "Lee, pound for pound, might well have been one of the strongest men in the world, and certainly one of the quickest".

Joe Lewis - "Bruce was incredibly strong for his size. He could take a 75lb barbell and from a standing position with the barbell held flush against his chest, he could slowly stick his arms out, lock them and hold the barbell there for 20 seconds, that's pretty damn tough for a guy who at the time only weighed 138lbs. I know 200lb weight lifters who can't do that."

Wally Jay - "I last saw Bruce after he moved from Culver City to Bel Air. He had a big heavy bag hanging out on his patio. It weighed 300lbs. I could hardly move it at all. Bruce said to me "Hey, Wally, watch this" and he jumped back and kicked it and this monster of a heavy bag went up to the ceiling, Thump!!! And came back down. I still can't believe the power that guy had".

Hayward Nishioka - "Bruce had this trademark "One Inch Punch", he could send individuals (Some of whom outweighed him by over 100lbs) flying through the air where they'd crash to the ground 15 feet away. I remember getting knocked up against the wall by that punch. I didn't think it was possible that he could generate so much power in his punch, especially when he was just laying his hand against my chest, he just twitched a bit and Wham!!!, I went flying backward and bounced off a wall. I took him very seriously after that."

Jesse Glover - "The power that Lee was capable of instantly generating was absolutely frightening to his fellow martial artists, especially his sparring partners, and his speed was equally intimidating. We timed him with an electric timer once, and Bruce's quickest movements were around five hundredths of a second, his slowest were around eight hundredths. This was punching from a relaxed position with his hands down at his sides from a distance between 18-24 inches. Not only was he amazingly quick, but he could read you too. He could pick up on small subtle things that you were getting ready to do and then he'd just shut you down".

Doug Palmer - "Bruce was like the Michael Jordan or Muhammad Ali in his prime, somebody who stood above everyone else. It's not that the other martial artists weren't good. It's just that this guy was great".

Danny Inosanto - "Bruce would always shadow box with small weights in his hands and he'd do a drill in which he'd punch for 12 series in a row. 100 punches per series, using a pyramid system of 1, 2, 3, 5, 7 and 10lb dumbbells and then he'd reverse the pyramid and go 10, 7, 5, 3, 2, 1 and finally zero weight. He had me do this drill with him and man what a burn you'd get in your delts and arms."

Linda Lee - "Bruce was forever pumping a dumbell which he kept in the house. He had the unique ability to do several things at once. It wasn't at all unusual for me to find him watching a boxing match on TV, while simultaneously performing full side splits, reading a book in one hand and pumping the dumbell up and down with the other. Bruce was a big believer in forearm training to improve his gripping and punching power. He was a forearm fanatic, if ever anyone came out with a new forearm course, Bruce would have to get it."

Taki Kimura - "If you ever grabbed hold of Bruce's forearm, it was like getting hold of a baseball bat".

Van Williams - "Bruce used to pack up Linda and Brandon and drive over to visit my wife and me at the weekends. He'd always bring with him some new gadget that he'd designed to build this or that part of the body. He was always working out and never smoked or drank. He was a real clean-cut, educated and wonderful person. I've got to admit that when I last saw him, which was a month or so before his death, he was looking great, his physique was looking as hard as a rock. Bruce had great respect for me and as a joke he placed a sticker in the back window of his automobile that read, "This car is protected by the Green Hornet".

Mito Uhera - "Bruce always felt that if your stomach wasn't developed, then you had no business doing any hard sparring".

Linda Lee - "He was a fanatic about ab training, he was always doing sit ups, crunches, roman chair movements, leg raises and V-ups".

Bolo Yeung - "Bruce had devised a particularly difficult exercise that he called "The Flag". While lying on a bench, he would grasp the uprights attached to the bench with both hands and raise himself off the bench, supported only by his shoulders. Then with his knees locked straight and his lower back raised off the bench, he'd perform leg raises. He was able to keep himself perfectly horizontal in midair. He was incredible, in 100 years there will never be another like him". -Me(never try this excersise u will prolly hurt urself bruce hurt his back doing this and it hurt him for the rest of his life)

Bob Wall - "Bruce was pretty much of a five mile runner, but then Bruce was one of those guys who just challenged the heck out of himself. He ran backwards, he ran wind sprints where he'd run a mile, walk a mile, run a mile. Whenever I ran with Bruce, it was always a different kind of run. Bruce was one of those total athletes. It wasn't easy training with him. He pushed you beyond where you wanted to go and then some".

Jhoon Rhee - "You could show him a tremendously difficult technique that took years to perfect and the next time you saw him, he would do it better than you".

James Coburn - "Bruce and I were training out on my patio one day, we were using this giant bag for side kicks, I guess it weighed about 150lbs. Bruce looked at it and just went Bang, it shot up out into the lawn about 15ft in the air, it then busted in the middle. It was filled with little bits and pieces of rag, we were picking up bits of rag for months".

Danny Inosanto - "Bruce told me to come along with him one day to Joe Weider's store in Santa Monica to help him buy a 110lb cast iron weight set for his son Brandon. I thought this was an odd gift since Brandon was only 5 years old. Bruce bought this beautiful Weider barbell/dumbell set from Joe's store, and when we pulled into my driveway, he said "I'm just joking, Dan. I bought this for you".

Those quotes are great, especially if you know the person quoted. Everyone knows Norris, but some of the others, like Grand Master Wally Jay are amazing on their own.

I don't think any professional out there would vote against Lee. He would have adapted.

 

[Pacfanweb]

Originally posted by: Gibson486

Originally posted by: Pacfanweb
It would be hard to compare Lee to anyone, since he never actually fought anyone for real.

I'd go with the guy who we've actually seen fight for real.

What are you talking about....Bruce lee was in plenty of real fights. Infact, the whole thing behind his martial art was to have it be a martial art that could be used in the streets.

Show me one.

I went looking once, and the only fight that there is any description of was one he fought privately against another martial arts master.
Accounts differ, but the only thing that saved Lee from losing this fight was that this guy couldn't use his killing finishes to end it.
Otherwise, it was a draw.

All those quotes a few posts back are great, but they really just tell me that Lee was way ahead in his workout techniques. Today's best are ahead of even what he did back then.
Sure, he probably would have evolved, and I'm not saying by any means that he wasn't good, but the bottom line is, he is legendary because he died, just like anyone else who has died in their prime.

Had he lived, he'd have eventually gotten his ass beat and it would have gotten out to the public, and he'd be nowhere near the mythical figure he is now.

 

[newbiepcuser]

Originally posted by: her209
Wing Tsung > *

Then why did Chinese National Wing Tsung team get their asses handed to them by medicore Thai boxers (not even Baukaw level fighters) when China went to Thailand a few years ago in friendly exhibition and recently in Hong Kong MMA and Muay Thai interests has pickup. There is even BJJ clubs in the mainland now. Even San Shou (Chinese Kickboxing) is being taught in now instead traditional martial arts in China's military.

 

[UNCjigga]

Wow, a serious "Bruce Lee vs." thread!! Will wonders never cease!

 

[astrocase]

Originally posted by: Pacfanweb

Originally posted by: Gibson486

Originally posted by: Pacfanweb
It would be hard to compare Lee to anyone, since he never actually fought anyone for real.

I'd go with the guy who we've actually seen fight for real.

What are you talking about....Bruce lee was in plenty of real fights. Infact, the whole thing behind his martial art was to have it be a martial art that could be used in the streets.

Show me one.

I went looking once, and the only fight that there is any description of was one he fought privately against another martial arts master.
Accounts differ, but the only thing that saved Lee from losing this fight was that this guy couldn't use his killing finishes to end it.
Otherwise, it was a draw.

All those quotes a few posts back are great, but they really just tell me that Lee was way ahead in his workout techniques. Today's best are ahead of even what he did back then.
Sure, he probably would have evolved, and I'm not saying by any means that he wasn't good, but the bottom line is, he is legendary because he died, just like anyone else who has died in their prime.

Had he lived, he'd have eventually gotten his ass beat and it would have gotten out to the public, and he'd be nowhere near the mythical figure he is now.

I disagree. In martial arts circles he's not famous because he died but because he was very good.

Nobody says he had to be unbeatable. Everyone hits their prime and goes downhill.

 

[Shlong]

He would've learned some BJJ, wrestling, etc & with his strength/quickness would've beat everyone in his weight class.

 

[Pacfanweb]

Originally posted by: astrocase
Nobody says he had to be unbeatable. Everyone hits their prime and goes downhill.

Right, but according to the fanboys here, Lee WAS unbeatable.

Yet he never fought anyone, other than once, and accounts differ.....and once Lee broke his own request that nobody talk about the fight, the other guy challenged him to a public fight in the freaking paper, and Lee said nothing....and this was the guy who supposedly would fight at the drop of a hat.

I'm sure Lee was very good.

But there needs to be some gauge of how good.

Chuck Norris won 6 world championships, and numerous smaller ones.

Retired undefeated.

THAT is a pretty good indicator of how good he was.

So how can a guy who never fought the best in the world over and over again, in any sort of formal, controlled situation be thought of so highly......unless it was because he died in his prime?

 

[Reckoner]

Tony Jaa vs Bruce Lee, who wins?

 

[Shlong]

"It?s a little tough for the traditional martial artists to swallow, because one system doesn?t do it. You?ve got to cross-train in many different systems. Actually, the father of mixed martial arts, if you will, was Bruce Lee. If you look at the way Bruce Lee trained, the way he fought, and many of the things he wrote, he said the perfect style was no style. You take a little something from everything. You take the good things from every different discipline, use what works, and you throw the rest away." Dana White

 

[scrawnypaleguy]

Bruce never had to learn groundfighting techniques because no one could ever get him on the ground. He's just too quick. The fight would be over before gracie could get it to the ground.

 

[astrocase]

Although I'm not sure about his actual "fighting" experience, his actual sparring performance was phenominal. I am curious why he wouldn't have competed in a tournament though....

 

[erikistired]

let's see one was a movie star, one was an ultimate fighting machine (still is?). yeah, hard choice there.

 

[rhino56]

1.you got Bruce Lee

2.you got Royce Gracie



3. you got Bruce lee vs Gracie

 

[Pacfanweb]

Originally posted by: astrocase
Although I'm not sure about his actual "fighting" experience, his actual sparring performance was phenominal. I am curious why he wouldn't have competed in a tournament though....

That kept up the aura of invincibility. If he had competed in actual tournaments, he'd have been beaten and his movie career was better off with an 0-0 record in tournaments.

 

[Reckoner]

Royce would've had his ass handed to him if he faced Bruce

 

[astrocase]

Originally posted by: Pacfanweb

Originally posted by: astrocase
Although I'm not sure about his actual "fighting" experience, his actual sparring performance was phenominal. I am curious why he wouldn't have competed in a tournament though....

That kept up the aura of invincibility. If he had competed in actual tournaments, he'd have been beaten and his movie career was better off with an 0-0 record in tournaments.

It's really tough for me to speculate like that. Norris went 65-5. I think it's safe to say that nobody here would second guess him. Yet Lee, who helped train Norris, is second guessed.

He's considered the father of mixed martial arts. If he were still alive he would have advanced it even further and I struggle to believe that he wouldn't have been the best, for at least a short period of time. You gotta remember that there was no UFC back then so comparing to Gracie is a bit tough.

 

[Josh]

There's no way that Royce Gracie's speed matched up to Bruce's. And, in the end, it really is whoever gets the first correct punch off. Bruce would've hit that fool so fast and in the right spot, so quickly, that Royce wouldn't have time to react.

He probably could have even killed him with one hit if he wanted to considering Bruce is kicking 300lb punchbags to the ceiling and what not :Q

 

[Dean]

In something like the UFC where there are actual rules to the fighting, Lee would be somewhat vulnerable. If there were no rules that had to be abided by, nobody in their right mind would have wanted to fight this guy.

 

[Greyd]

Originally posted by: Pacfanweb

Originally posted by: astrocase
Nobody says he had to be unbeatable. Everyone hits their prime and goes downhill.

Right, but according to the fanboys here, Lee WAS unbeatable.

Yet he never fought anyone, other than once, and accounts differ.....and once Lee broke his own request that nobody talk about the fight, the other guy challenged him to a public fight in the freaking paper, and Lee said nothing....and this was the guy who supposedly would fight at the drop of a hat.

I'm sure Lee was very good.

But there needs to be some gauge of how good.

Chuck Norris won 6 world championships, and numerous smaller ones.

Retired undefeated.

THAT is a pretty good indicator of how good he was.

So how can a guy who never fought the best in the world over and over again, in any sort of formal, controlled situation be thought of so highly......unless it was because he died in his prime?

Bruce Lee trained Chuck Norris, Joe Lewis among many others. These guys have tremendous respect for him and his abilities. While these guys were famous for their "competition" fights - they would not train or respect someone who could not fight. In interviews they always talk about sparring matches with him. Granted sparring and real fights are different - but the respect they indicate of him points to the fact that even in sparring, they realized that he was a incredible fighter.

Just because he didn't go out and beat on people all the time or compete doesn't mean crap. If people like Chuck and Lewis didn't think he could fight, their words and responses would have indicated it.

 

[lyssword]

If bruce lee trained with modern methods and beefed up to 155 weight class he would own. He has tremendous speed advantage over anyone else.. He has much better strikes than anyone in ufc @ 155lb and if he adapts (or invents) to defend vs takedowns he would definetly b at the top..

 

[Babbles]

Originally posted by: fisher
let's see one was a movie star, one was an ultimate fighting machine (still is?). yeah, hard choice there.

Don't know much about Bruce Lee, eh? Or just didn't bother to read the thread?

 

[yhelothar]

I don't believe half those quotes..
Hayward Nishioka - "Bruce had this trademark "One Inch Punch", he could send individuals (Some of whom outweighed him by over 100lbs) flying through the air where they'd crash to the ground 15 feet away. I remember getting knocked up against the wall by that punch. I didn't think it was possible that he could generate so much power in his punch, especially when he was just laying his hand against my chest, he just twitched a bit and Wham!!!, I went flying backward and bounced off a wall. I took him very seriously after that."

If someone punched you really hard, your bones would break, but you wouldn't fly back too much.
It's like if someone had a sledge hammer and whacked it sideways to your chest. Your bones would shatter rather than you flying back. The force would be absorbed by your body, rather than creating an elastic momentum.

 

[JSFLY]

If Bruce and Gracie fought during Bruce's Prime, Bruce would win because Gracie was still a baby then.

If Bruce and Gracie fought during Gracie's PRime, Gracie would win because Bruce is 6 feet under already. RIP

They are fighters from different eras. You cant compare legends.