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OPEC deal collapse sparks price war: ‘$20 oil in 2020 is coming’

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Greenman

Lifer
Oct 15, 1999
16,655
2,168
126
Correct, and that 26 in basic V6 trim, how many opt for that?, no one around here. Most are glorified grocery-getters anymore it seems. Not that I give a shit, drive what you want but anyone claiming pickups are Eco-freindly are laughable.
I believe the 26 number is from the twin turbo'd v6. Big horsepower and big torque.
 

Commodus

Diamond Member
Oct 9, 2004
7,873
4,874
136
The impending wave of electric crossovers, SUVs and trucks (Model Y, Mustang Mach-E, VW ID.4 and the like) can't come soon enough. Gotta get the US weaned off of this dependency on a resource that's both harmful to the planet and subject to a volatile market.
 

brycejones

Lifer
Oct 18, 2005
19,266
10,073
136
I believe the 26 number is from the twin turbo'd v6. Big horsepower and big torque.
Yeah you're only getting that if you drive like a nun, most people will be well under that. If you are doing actual pick up things it is much lower as well.
 
Dec 10, 2005
20,505
1,828
126
The impending wave of electric crossovers, SUVs and trucks (Model Y, Mustang Mach-E, VW ID.4 and the like) can't come soon enough. Gotta get the US weaned off of this dependency on a resource that's both harmful to the planet and subject to a volatile market.
What's crazy is we have technology now where you can get gas cars getting 40-50+ mpg on both highway and city, but low gas prices just encourage people to keep buying monstrously wasteful vehicles.
 

local

Golden Member
Jun 28, 2011
1,681
381
136
I don't own a single vehicle that gets over 20mpg, in fact I had disabled the cylinder deactivation on my truck within 1 hour of getting it. I also have a company fuel card though.
 
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Wreckem

Diamond Member
Sep 23, 2006
9,059
435
126
Too bad. Gas prices shouldn't be that low anywhere. It's why people keep buying gas guzzlers.
I’ve seen it as low as $1.78 and that was before Saudi Arabia declared their intent to blowup the oil industry.
 

Hayabusa Rider

Admin Emeritus & Elite Member
Jan 26, 2000
50,874
4,203
126
We need to make it easier for ordinary people to declare bankruptcy so they can pay the taxes and help with loss of good jobs and real income.
 

Wreckem

Diamond Member
Sep 23, 2006
9,059
435
126
What's crazy is we have technology now where you can get gas cars getting 40-50+ mpg on both highway and city, but low gas prices just encourage people to keep buying monstrously wasteful vehicles.
My hybrid gets about 35Mpg while driving 70 unobstructed on the highway and about 55mpg in city and highway traffic. I avg about 50mpg combined during my commute which is basically 1.5hrs in traffic for 38 miles each way.
 

BoomerD

No Lifer
Feb 26, 2006
55,457
3,857
126
Correct, and that 26 in basic V6 trim, how many opt for that?, no one around here. Most are glorified grocery-getters anymore it seems. Not that I give a shit, drive what you want but anyone claiming pickups are Eco-freindly are laughable.
I have a 2018 F-150 supercrew. 3.5l eco-boost twin turbo, 10 speed transmission, 4x4. It's our daily driver. We've gotten as much as 24 mpg on flat open highway...but average closer to 20.
 

[DHT]Osiris

Diamond Member
Dec 15, 2015
8,007
3,826
146
As someone that actually works in excise tax (particularly with motor fuels that you are referring to)... they ABSOLUTELY should. That means all your hybrids, Tesla's, etc... need to pay their fair share of it as well as it relates to roads, bridges, pothole, etc... maintenance. So, they need to figure out a way to convert the current tax (based on per gallon of gasoline/diesel) into a price per kwH for electircs.

But yes - I'm in full favor of jacking up that federal rate that hasn't been touched in ~20 years.

I mean, in addition to paying for it on the basis of inflation, it should also be adjusted on the basis of fuel efficiency.
I'd be fine with electrics/hybrids paying their fair share of the road repair tax, as long as semis and delivery trucks do the same.
 

IronWing

No Lifer
Jul 20, 2001
60,238
12,750
136
I think some variation on miles x GVW for all vehicles is the way to go for road taxes.
 

BoomerD

No Lifer
Feb 26, 2006
55,457
3,857
126
Why not weight? Weight is what kills the roads, not mpg or mileage driven.
gvw is weight. Gross vehicle weight..

But if you're gonna go there, shouldn't the calculations include weight per sq. Inch on the road surface
 

[DHT]Osiris

Diamond Member
Dec 15, 2015
8,007
3,826
146
gvw is weight. Gross vehicle weight..

But if you're gonna go there, shouldn't the calculations include weight per sq. Inch on the road surface
Sorry, I misread that somehow as some weirdie acronym for mpg. Distracted brain.

I actually agree, should be GVW applied to road surface. Fortunately that's mostly linear I think, barring anything weird like 1-ton motorcycles.
 

BoomerD

No Lifer
Feb 26, 2006
55,457
3,857
126
Sorry, I misread that somehow as some weirdie acronym for mpg. Distracted brain.

I actually agree, should be GVW applied to road surface. Fortunately that's mostly linear I think, barring anything weird like 1-ton motorcycles.
Of course, that could lead to people putting stupidly large and wide tires on their Hondas trying to increase the tire footprint and reduce taxable weight... :p
 

akenbennu

Senior member
Jul 24, 2005
544
95
91
He's doing better than any of the other candidates in head to head matchups against Trump. Saying he cant beat Trump isnt saying anything other than what we already know, which is beating incumbent presidents is hard, that's not unique to Sanders as a challenger.

If anything if the party elites get what they want and nominate Bloomberg in a contest convention, its showing likely a drubbing we haven't seen since Reagan beat Mondale.

Ironically enough some pundits like Chris Matthews are already saying the quiet part out loud and wondering if maybe it's better if the democratic establishment stop Bernie even if it causes the Dems to lose the general election because maybe 4 more years of Trump isnt so bad.
I think the idea we are going to have some massive outbreak is also an unfounded assumption. We very well may but it's far from certain. My gut says this whole thing has pretty limited upside for Trump and very serious potential downsides. If the outbreak doesn't happen in any significant way people will probably have forgotten by November. If the outbreak is bad he looks incompetent. Seems the only way it ends up good for Trump is if the outbreak is pretty bad in a lot of other places but not bad here.
Oh I'm only 39 so I'm not too terribly old, I just dislike working.
Of course, that could lead to people putting stupidly large and wide tires on their Hondas trying to increase the tire footprint and reduce taxable weight... :p
Monster truck, highway edition. Sunday! Sunday! Sunday!
 

brycejones

Lifer
Oct 18, 2005
19,266
10,073
136
Fortunately that's mostly linear I think, barring anything weird like 1-ton motorcycles.
Actually road damage increases dramatically with extra weight in greater than linear manner. It’s what Michigan roads are pulverized to shit because we have highest allowed weights in the country.
 
Mar 11, 2004
20,542
2,667
126
Why are people just talking about road maintenance costs? We should be taxing vehicles for their full externalities. And yes absolutely we should for EVs too.
 
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Vic

Elite Member
Jun 12, 2001
47,637
7,708
126
Let's stay on topic here. Oil stocks closed down about 30% across the board today. Chevron and Exxon Mobil are down 33% and 40% YTD respectively. Who wants to guess what's going to happen next?
 

IronWing

No Lifer
Jul 20, 2001
60,238
12,750
136
Let's stay on topic here. Oil stocks closed down about 30% across the board today. Chevron and Exxon Mobil are down 33% and 40% YTD respectively. Who wants to guess what's going to happen next?
The juniors collapse, majors take the free money the Fed is offering to buy up the juniors' assets, M&A goes crazy across the fossil fuel industry, and we end up, finally, seeing the reassembly of Standard Oil? Oh, and Trump slaps tariffs on imported oil.
 

Vic

Elite Member
Jun 12, 2001
47,637
7,708
126
The juniors collapse, majors take the free money the Fed is offering to buy up the juniors' assets, M&A goes crazy across the fossil fuel industry, and we end up, finally, seeing the reassembly of Standard Oil? Oh, and Trump slaps tariffs on imported oil.
Well yes, this. But not right away. I was thinking more about the massive layoffs coming short-term.
 

IronWing

No Lifer
Jul 20, 2001
60,238
12,750
136
Well yes, this. But not right away. I was thinking more about the massive layoffs coming short-term.
I think M&A is going to happen very, very fast. Free money, a friendly DOJ, and banks with nothing better to do will grease the skids. But, yes, layoffs are coming to oil patch. The U.S. is the biggest producer of oil but it is a high price producer will will bear the brunt of the price collapse (which benefits both the Sauds and the Russians long term).
 

herm0016

Diamond Member
Feb 26, 2005
7,312
375
126
well shit. anyone want to buy my stuff?

its not about Russia trying to control the price of fuel or get us to buy more large cars.

it's about them hating that we are on a path to export crude and NG. they still want to kill our production, last time they tried, they did not think we would be able to cut the total production cost 30% in a matter of months by getting better and more efficient at it. we are close to our efficiency limits on production. they can still beat us on price if they really want to. they REALLY dont want us to start exporting NG, Russia supplies most of Europe with NG and ours is way way cheaper. wholesale NG is more than 50% cheaper in the US than it is in Europe.

hopefully because I am a one man team I can just expand the scope of my job to include other people who get let go.

yes, i work in o&g. more than 11 years now.
 

hal2kilo

Lifer
Feb 24, 2009
15,250
3,476
136
There's going to be some bankruptcies out there in shale land. Some over leveraged outfits are soon to be history.
 

ElFenix

Elite Member
Super Moderator
Mar 20, 2000
101,022
4,766
126
if you want a ford raptor now is the time to pick one up with low miles
 
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