One downside of Intel canning BCLK OC on SKL

[Denithor]

First, I somewhat agree with the whole Iris Pro thing - never understood Intel's decision to only run that out on an expensive i5 chip. Makes basically zero sense there. Nobody buying an i5 is going to run integrated graphics, no matter how good. Should have released an i3 IP edition for like $150. That would have likely sold like hotcakes, for lower end gamers and HTPC people alike.

Now, overclocking. I would never, ever sell an overclocked system to a customer (even my close personal friends do their own overclocks if wanted/supported by hardware). Even with the near brain-dead OC possible these days on K chips. Just too many potential problems with overclocking someone else's system, I don't want to deal with systems that BSOD or won't boot if the OC fails six months or five years into the future.

 

[LTC8K6]

Slow down little dude. Give him time to respond.

Or maybe he is done talking about this and realizes the ethical choice hasn't been intel since they bought the designs for the second microprocessor (4004).

Calling people names doesn't do anything for your credibility at all. :thumbsdown:

Yes, those three posts probably should have been one.

 

[Arachnotronic]

First, I somewhat agree with the whole Iris Pro thing - never understood Intel's decision to only run that out on an expensive i5 chip. Makes basically zero sense there. Nobody buying an i5 is going to run integrated graphics, no matter how good. Should have released an i3 IP edition for like $150. That would have likely sold like hotcakes, for lower end gamers and HTPC people alike.

Now, overclocking. I would never, ever sell an overclocked system to a customer (even my close personal friends do their own overclocks if wanted/supported by hardware). Even with the near brain-dead OC possible these days on K chips. Just too many potential problems with overclocking someone else's system, I don't want to deal with systems that BSOD or won't boot if the OC fails six months or five years into the future.

It makes perfect economic sense. Bigger GPU takes up silicon real-estate, adding cost. Intel wants to be paid for that additional cost/value that it's bringing w/ the bigger iGPU.

Economics, nothing more.

 

[Arachnotronic]

Calling people names doesn't do anything for your credibility at all. :thumbsdown:

Yes, those three posts probably should have been one.

Love how the ADF attacks the quantity of your posts but not the content. The points you bring up are absolutely spot on.

I just feel sorry for VirtualLarry's "clients" that will be saddled with sub-par products over this.

 

[Arachnotronic]

It is. For a certain subset of people. Non-enthusiasts, that would rather a cheap (and slower) AM1 rig, and save their money to spend at the casino. Because as long as they have a working PC to get to Facebook, they don't care otherwise.

These people should just buy iPads.

 

[NTMBK]

These people should just buy iPads.

Or Chromebooks.

 

[Arachnotronic]

Or Chromebooks.

Ew.

 

[Flapdrol1337]

With sandy bridge intel started charging for overclocking, but at least there was real performance to be gained.

A 6700K has what? 15% headroom?

 

[ShintaiDK]

A 6700K has what? 15% headroom?

Closer to 20% it seems.

 

[Yuriman]

From my perspective, at this point there's very little reason to OC a processor. Unlocked Skylake chips are already near max performance, and cranking them up any higher tends to ruin performance per watt, and cause the need for significantly more expensive motherboards, power supplies, and coolers. Locked chips ditto, but with the added disadvantage of messing up power management. An i3 (or i5) + H110 is a superior choice to a Pentium + Z170 in 99% of cases.

I'm disinclined to believe that there's much value in going with slower AMD chips, just because they can overclock, either. It's even getting hard to make a case for the iGPU, given that Intel is closing the gap. A stock Skylake i3 is faster than any overclocked AMD quad (99% of cases), and is cheaper in 99% of cases, unless you're going to be overclocking on the same 350w PSU, motherboard, and stock cooler you'd be using if you weren't overclocking.

Frankly, at this point Larry, you might be best served with building customers some Haswell i3 systems. 1150 boards are cheap, DDR3 is cheap, and a Haswell i3 is definitely better than a Skylake Pentium,

 

[Flapdrol1337]

Closer to 20% it seems.

Depends on whether you look at the turbo or base frequency.

 

[hojnikb]

Btw, OCH110 will never be available via bios update. OC on non Z boards requires external clock generators (something supermicro is doing). Now with intel blocking it via microcode, i doubt any manufacturer would bother making such board.

OC is great and all, but do average users really need all that cpu power noways ?

J1900/N3150 for lightweight office/multimedia use (never understod the appeal of AM1), i3+ for budget gaming/power users.

Everything else just makes little sense. Yes, even APUs with "beefier" iGPUs make little sense, if you think about it. They cost more than equivalent athlons, require fast dual channel ram for any reasonable performance. And you come to a point, where it just makes more sense to get the cheapest pentium and a 250X+. APUs would make sense if they were cheaper and were not tied to fast memory (think fast ondie sram or something to compensate for lack of bandwidth).

 

[deasd]

I suggest you to wait for Excavator-based Athlon......

 

[hojnikb]

I suggest you to wait for Excavator-based Athlon......

Well a bit improved IPC and half less L2 cache.
Color me unimpressed.

 

[LTC8K6]

With sandy bridge intel started charging for overclocking, but at least there was real performance to be gained.

A 6700K has what? 15% headroom?

Well, it also has a base clock speed boost over the 6700, so it's 5-10% faster before you overclock it.

 

[Insert_Nickname]

Edit: I might be willing to spec SKL i3-6100 CPUs, if they were closer to $90 USD retail. (Will Intel make a 3.5Ghz i3-6000?)

They do. Its 3.6GHz though.

http://ark.intel.com/products/93366/Intel-Core-i3-6098P-Processor-3M-Cache-3_60-GHz

I'd not recommend it though. For some odd reason the MSRP is the same as the 6100, and this thing has the cut-down 510 graphics (12 vs 24EU on the 520).

 

[dave_the_nerd]

Honestly, VL, I'm surprised. This stinks of sour grapes - Intel took your toy (overclocking) away, so you build/sell your customers arguably inferior (single-threaded performance matters, dadgummit) systems instead? Why?

Frankly, it's not doing either you or your customers any favors: it takes you twice as long to build a box, and it gets them an inferior overclocked CPU that will burn itself out that much faster.

If you want to build computers for n00bs, focus on system reliability and power use, sell them annual computer checkups, or a "support subscription" for $20/month. Do remote support with TeamViewer. Etc., etc. Get them the product they need, and get you the money you need to do what you want with your own systems in your own time.

"I overclocked your system so the CPU is 10-50% percent faster, which you may or may not ever notice, and which will likely cause random crashes 2-3 years down the line when the PSU voltages start to sag and the layers of dust cause heat retention*... but then I'll look at it and offer to sell you another low end overclocked system!" is not a good way to do business.

* I swear to god you've complained about EXACTLY this thing happening before; I don't _think_ I'm pulling this out of my hind-end.

 

[poofyhairguy]

I will admit I feel a little vindicated picking G3258 plus z97 over SkyOC. It just sounded too good to stay true.

Intel is like the mom of the tech industry- she never lets you keep the pet that accidently followed you home.

 

[Avalon]

Wait, what happened to BLCK overclocking? I've been under a rock the past month or two.

 

[DAPUNISHER]

Not sure how that fits in with budget desktop bang-for-buck. Yeah, it's a great CPU, with a great IGP, but ... pricewise, it seems a bit... out of reach?

You see what happens here. Bullying, ridicule, upselling. There is only one right answer, for every question, that answer is Intel. The part that amuses me most, is someone may launch into a sales pitch explaining why that is just the way things are. And AMD products make baby Jesus cry.

I sometimes do light duty builds for others too. How many components for the build can you buy for almost $300? Thanks to MS letting me recycle their old OEM PC or notebook win 7 keys into win 10 on the new build, I seldom have to budget OS cost. I get a good bit of the build done for 3 bills right now. $275 CPU to use iGPU? And in a thread about budget constrained builds at that. :biggrin:

 

[crashtech]

...the ethical choice hasn't been intel since they bought the designs for the second microprocessor (4004).

What a fascinating story, tell us more, and link to your sources!

 

[MiddleOfTheRoad]

Utter BS. I assume you are simply misinformed since you claim it. Or just dont understand how a company works.

There is no such thing as an ethical company. AMD, VIA, IBM, ARM etc are all equally "evil".

Yeah, you're totally wrong on this:
http://worldsmostethicalcompanies.ethisphere.com/honorees/

It's a good business model to be ethical and environmentally responsible.

 

[dark zero]

Utter BS. I assume you are simply misinformed since you claim it. Or just dont understand how a company works.

There is no such thing as an ethical company. AMD, VIA, IBM, ARM etc are all equally "evil".

But even evil has standards. And they doesn't want to subside each processor to enter to the tablet market and ruin it hard.

At least that is not working on phones and despite not having bad hardware, there are no software that uses Intel CPU on phones. Unless you want to use a laptop as a phone.

And don't tell me the Asus Zenfone which I have and despite is great, the OS is BS for it.

 

[LTC8K6]

You see what happens here. Bullying, ridicule, upselling. There is only one right answer, for every question, that answer is Intel. The part that amuses me most, is someone may launch into a sales pitch explaining why that is just the way things are. And AMD products make baby Jesus cry.

I sometimes do light duty builds for others too. How many components for the build can you buy for almost $300? Thanks to MS letting me recycle their old OEM PC or notebook win 7 keys into win 10 on the new build, I seldom have to budget OS cost. I get a good bit of the build done for 3 bills right now. $275 CPU to use iGPU? And in a thread about budget constrained builds at that. :biggrin:

One poster suggested a $275 Intel chip.

One.

 

[ShintaiDK]

Yeah, you're totally wrong on this:
http://worldsmostethicalcompanies.ethisphere.com/honorees/

It's a good business model to be ethical and environmentally responsible.

Yes, as long as you can make people believe so. Google for example fooled a lot of people with their motto alone. Clever PR move.