One APU to rule the video card market?

[Enigmoid]

Well I don't know about kaveri, but here are some AMD run (so perhaps take with a grain of salt) benchmarks for richland.

http://www.amd.com/us/press-releases/Pages/amd_unveils_new_apus.aspx

Look at footnotes.

Condensed (I took this from tech report)
Richland (Piledriver-based APU. Mobile versions compared.)

Testbed:
* AMD A10-4600M (Trinity) with Radeon HD 7660G IGP
VS
* AMD A10-5750M (Richland) with Radeon HD 8650G IGP

* AMD A8-4555M (Trinity) with Radeon HD 7600G IGP
VS
* AMD A8-5545M (Richland) with Radeon HD 8510G IGP

All configurations:
=> 4GB DDR3-1600 (Dual Channel)
=> Windows 7 Home Premium 64-bit

3DMark 11
=> A10-4600M (Trinity): 1150
=> A10-5750M (Richland): 1400
and
=> A8-4555M (Trinity): 780
=> A8-5545M (Richland): 1100

PCMark 7 Overall benchmark
=> A10-4600M (Trinity): 1965
=> A10-5750M (Richland): 2175
and
=> A8-4555M (Trinity): 1650
=> A8-5545M (Richland): 1850

So a decent improvement in graphics (1400/1150=22%). PC mark improvement of (2175/1965= 10%). Actual cpu improvement should be slightly less as pc mark includes some gpu related tests.

Also a note on the legitimacy of 3d mark 11 for amd apus. They get really high scores on 3d mark but get whooped in games (7660G vs 630m have same 3dmark scores but the 630m whoops the amp).

http://www.anandtech.com/show/5831/amd-trinity-review-a10-4600m-a-new-hope/6

AMD said at CES richland would be 20-40% better.
http://www.engadget.com/2013/01/07/amd-temash-kabini-richland-kaveri-apu/
http://www.hardwarecanucks.com/foru...ni-temash-amd-s-2013-apu-lineup-examined.html
http://www.notebookcheck.net/AMD-un...ichland-and-Temash-APUs-and-SoCs.87121.0.html


Not seeing that even in their own tests.

Granted this is mobile but this also means that they cannot push performance at the expense of power. I'd take their claims lightly and wait for third party tests.

 

[ShintaiDK]

Might simply be the power consumption difference at the lower clocks thats improved, so that you then can use the delta for performance.

I assume those number represent the best case scenario for the differences between Richland and Trinity with any models.

The 4600M swings between 2.4 and 3.2Ghz on its 35W TDP. But no wattage is shown for Richland either, so could also just be a 45W part. Since I havent seen any model specifications yet,

 

[NTMBK]

From what I've read on the AMD boards, based on AMD lab measurements, Kaveri will ~ double Trinity's performance in the same power envelope. As 28nm was the fabrication node 'sweet spot' that opened the feasibility door across a spectrum of devices and applications, Kaveri is the 'sweet spot' of AMD's APU roadmap. It's where a lot of things become possible that weren't possible before. And of course it also hits that 28nm fabrication sweet spot.

Extracting lots of performance from the APUs will require effort from developers, and focusing their games at them more. Current engines are designed around a particular set of assumptions- the relevant one in this case, that it is always best to do a task either entirely on CPU or GPU. The high latencies and low bandwidth between the two, the split memory spaces with copying between the two required. This changes with Kaveri- but only if developers actually develop for it. If it does happen, its going to be a slow transition. But most developers will develop to the existing paradigm, with algorithms centred around discrete CPU and GPU, with little fine-grained interoperation between the two. This is how they are used to developing, and this is how the majority of their installed user base's PCs work.

I see Richland as an easily done incremental performance boost OEM/retail placeholder while the initial Kaveri production runs are shunted to the next gen consoles, and only after that need is met made available to retail.

Very doubtful that Kaveri itself is going in consoles, especially since Read referred to "semi-custom APUs". Potentially a similar HSA APU, though.

In technology the saying 'the past does not predict the future' is a colossal understatement. AMD's 'Gaming Evolved' is kicking Nvidia's TWIMTBP into the gutter. 'AMD - Gaming Evolved' is going to be plastered on nearly every upcoming AAA PC game and of course it will be on all of the next gen console games. Developers and Publishers are in the thick of seeing where the industry in headed and it's all AMD. AMD - Gaming Evolved ... it's f*cking brilliant branding. Simple, evocative, COMPLETELY relays the desired message. That logo is going to be plastered on every advertisement, game box, website, computer AMD can get it on, and wherever else AMD can think up to put it. It won't take long before gamers and consumers associate AMD with, well, Gaming Evolved. And what they will come to not associate Intel or Nvidia with.

Wow, the hype is strong in this one! D: It's just a "me-too" hype campaign. It's not "kicking Nvidia's TWIMTBP into the gutter". What other big name do they have, apart from Far Cry 3, and Battlefield 3 over a year ago? It's really, really not a big deal.

Nvidia regained market share when they finally came out with their high end and then midrange 6xx chips. I expect AMD and Nvidia are currently in market share stasis. What I don't doubt is starting with 8xxx followed by the next gen console releases and into the indefinite future Nvidia will be steadily losing market share to AMD. Nvidia's ONLY potential salvation is if they are chosen for Steam Box.

Yay for wild, unfounded speculation... :\ I wouldn't write off NVidia yet. I'll comment on their fate when I see the numbers for the next generation of GPUs, and APUs.

 

[psoomah]

Right. It was then speculated that AMD, with all it's financial hardships, pulled funding from SA. Charlie no longer has to talk them up. Makes sense because now SA is charging a 50.00 membership?

All speculation of course but it doesn't take a vivid imagination to see how this unfolded. :thumbsup:

I don't knooooow ... Charlie just doesn't seem the hot headed reactive type.

 

[psoomah]

Wow, the hype is strong in this one! D: It's just a "me-too" hype campaign. It's not "kicking Nvidia's TWIMTBP into the gutter". What other big name do they have, apart from Far Cry 3, and Battlefield 3 over a year ago? It's really, really not a big deal.

Dirt Showdown, Nexuiz, Sniper Elite, Fire Fall, Sleeping Dogs, Warfighter, Hitman Absolution, Dishonored, Bioshock Infinite, Tomb Raider ... ... pretty much all the upcoming AAA PC releases.

It should be obvious anything next gen on PC will be Gaming Evolved titles.

It's simple logic. If AMD is in all next gen consoles, ALL console game and game engine developers will of necessity be in close contact with AMD on multiple levels. For console games Nvidia isn't even at the table. For PC ports, AMD has an automatic inside track and seat at the head of the table, the best Nvidia can hope for is to BE at the table.

By this time next year TWIMTBP will be a fading memory. Simple logical deduction.

 

[psoomah]

Extracting lots of performance from the APUs will require effort from developers, and focusing their games at them more.

Hence HSA. Compared to Cell technology programming for the Kaveri architecture and extracting it's power will be a stroll in the park.

Very doubtful that Kaveri itself is going in consoles, especially since Read referred to "semi-custom APUs". Potentially a similar HSA APU, though.

??? There is no 'similar' APU. Kaveri IS the APU. It is Kaveri that will be semi-customized.

Yay for wild, unfounded speculation... :\ I wouldn't write off NVidia yet. I'll comment on their fate when I see the numbers for the next generation of GPUs, and APUs.

I suppose simple logical deduction from information to hand might be interpreted by the unfortunate as 'wild, unfounded speculation'. No skin off my back.

 

[psoomah]

Really? http://www.guru3d.com/news_story/amd_says_it_will_not_support_google_android.html

http://kotaku.com/5973498/weapons-of-mass-disruption-3-how-and-why-consoles-will-die

As far as I can tell these links have squadoosh to do with the points they referenced.

 

[psoomah]

It's just a rumor mentioned in a few posts on other forums. I don't want to say any more and spread mis info in case it's fake, or get the people in trouble if it's true. :|

:twisted::twisted🙁)🙂:twisted::twisted:

 

[psoomah]

However, the levels of hype in this thread are pretty insane. 😱

Have to agree. The way people are reactively zonkering my common sense logical deductions is 😵 way 😕 over the top. Thank you for pointing it out.

 

[SirPauly]

Mobile devices and technologies are APUs.

I assume you're referring to Nvidia. AMD wins regardless.

Kaveri is looking to skirt very close to that line. Whatever comes after cross over it.

Will see! It's not common sense and simple logic deductions to offer blanket views on products that have not been released yet -- never mind blanket views on the industry itself, imho!

 

[NTMBK]

Hence HSA. Compared to Cell technology programming for the Kaveri architecture and extracting it's power will be a stroll in the park.

HSA will require them to compile to HSAIL, and ship entirely different binaries for HSA capable APUs- not to mention having to rewrite big chunks of engine. This is a big inconvenience (and hence cost) for developers, especially compared to just chipping a standard binary linked against DirectX which will still run on Kaveri, even if sub-optimally.

??? There is no 'similar' APU. Kaveri IS the APU. It is Kaveri that will be semi-customized.

Ah, I was only using Kaveri in the strict sense. There may well be Steamroller cores and GCN (or Jaguar cores and GCN, as some rumours indicate), but it won't be the Kaveri die. I'm waiting until we hear firm details about the new Playstation and Xbox, there have been too many divergent rumours for my liking (just take a look at that frankly mental thread over at S|A).

I suppose simple logical deduction from information to hand might be interpreted by the unfortunate as 'wild, unfounded speculation'. No skin off my back.

It's not logical deduction when you take great leaps without adequate justification. 😛 I err on the side of caution when it comes to rumours, I don't want to be disappointed.

 

[psoomah]

Well I don't know about kaveri, but here are some AMD run (so perhaps take with a grain of salt) benchmarks for richland.

Richland = limited relevance. Kaveri is where the real action takes place.

The relevant metric is it's looking pretty solid Kaveri will provide ~x2 the performance of Trinity in the same power envelope.

That's enough all by itself to run current gen PC games at 1080p at decently high settings. Enough to make it a real gaming chip and be considered as such. As an unmodified console chip high end graphics are easily within reach. In Steam Box running a customized Linux and drivers, it should be able to play ported games at very high settings. Certainly good enough for the average PC or console player. For those looking for more, go non Valve Steam Box or roll your own and add the GCN2 AIB board of choice.

 

[NTMBK]

Dirt Showdown, Nexuiz, Sniper Elite, Fire Fall, Sleeping Dogs, Warfighter, Hitman Absolution, Dishonored, Bioshock Infinite, Tomb Raider ... ... pretty much all the upcoming AAA PC releases.

Huh, it's doing a lot better than I thought. Not too shabby a list.

It should be obvious anything next gen on PC will be Gaming Evolved titles.

It's simple logic. If AMD is in all next gen consoles, ALL console game and game engine developers will of necessity be in close contact with AMD on multiple levels. For console games Nvidia isn't even at the table. For PC ports, AMD has an automatic inside track and seat at the head of the table, the best Nvidia can hope for is to BE at the table.

By this time next year TWIMTBP will be a fading memory. Simple logical deduction.

Not necessarily- consider the opposite point of view. Assuming AMD APUs in next gen consoles (which looks likely), that means that all game developers will have already had access to optimisation manuals, tools and advice specifically tailored to AMD architectures in order to make their game work well on consoles. If you were then given the choice between receiving the same advice again (Gaming Evolved) and advice on how to optimise your code to also run well on the other 50% of graphics cards (TWIWMTBP), which seems like the better choice? Developers could "double dip"- AMD experience from their console work, and nVidia advice for the PC port.

 

[Lonyo]

Have to agree. The way people are reactively zonkering my common sense logical deductions is 😵 way 😕 over the top. Thank you for pointing it out.

Common sense logical deductions based on the existing market.
5 years ago, Nintendo were a mobile gaming powerhouse. Now it's all mobile.
The next gen of consoles will arrive soon, right as mobile devices are taking people away from their TV screens and consoles.

You are basing your "common sense logical deductions" on the current marketplace.

Common sense dictates that in 5 years, the gaming marketplace is incredibly unlikely to look like it does now, as it shifts at a rapid pace and people change how they interact with technology.
You also ignore developing nations like China.

NV are focusing on their vision of the future.
AMD's APUs are based on the needs of the present. That's not to say that they aren't also doing things with an eye to the future, but just because you don't see NV doing things to survive based on today doesn't mean they won't be around tomorrow, because tomorrow's challenges will be very different.

http://arstechnica.com/gaming/2013/...is-nvidias-new-cloud-gaming-server-explained/
NV's tomorrow. It's "slightly" different to yours.
Common sense indicates the status quo won't continue. That doesn't mean NV's bet will be the correct one, but it's going to be more correct than your vision, because it assumes change.

 

[cytg111]

More unlikely than likely, happening or not, it does imo lay out a reasonable vector for AMD. Hope they can win those three (ms, sony & valve)... then maybe they can stay in business and keep the ecosystem flowing.

edit: also, descrete cards will stay more than relevant on the PC front, if APU's are going into the consoles then the level of lowlevel optimizations to get *everything* out of the hardware is something that cannot be done on the windows PC (going through layer upon layer of HAL/DX etc before hitting hardware).

 

[Fx1]

Common sense logical deductions based on the existing market.
5 years ago, Nintendo were a mobile gaming powerhouse. Now it's all mobile.
The next gen of consoles will arrive soon, right as mobile devices are taking people away from their TV screens and consoles.

You are basing your "common sense logical deductions" on the current marketplace.

Common sense dictates that in 5 years, the gaming marketplace is incredibly unlikely to look like it does now, as it shifts at a rapid pace and people change how they interact with technology.
You also ignore developing nations like China.

NV are focusing on their vision of the future.
AMD's APUs are based on the needs of the present. That's not to say that they aren't also doing things with an eye to the future, but just because you don't see NV doing things to survive based on today doesn't mean they won't be around tomorrow, because tomorrow's challenges will be very different.

http://arstechnica.com/gaming/2013/...is-nvidias-new-cloud-gaming-server-explained/
NV's tomorrow. It's "slightly" different to yours.
Common sense indicates the status quo won't continue. That doesn't mean NV's bet will be the correct one, but it's going to be more correct than your vision, because it assumes change.

Who gives a crap about mobile gaming. Im a huge gamer and you know how many games i have on my Samsung S3? ONE!

Mobile games are for people who actually dont really game. 3DS is a toy and the Vita whilst good is a failure and yes ive owned both.

You think the future is mobile gaming? Your wrong. Mobile gaming sucks. Gaming on a notebook SUX. Not just because its less powerful but because the screen sucks the keyboard sucks and the laptop its self sucks.

Nvidias stupid shield thing will suck. Its no better than a PS Vita and will have less support too. Its ugly and pointless and wont sell or take off in numbers that even get close to the 3DS. Did i mention the 3DS is a toy?

I like sitting in front of my PC and gaming and i like gaming on my console on my 50" plasma with my friends.

Everyone thinks the future is mobile and its NOT. Mobile is for casual chumps who arent gamers. And no AAA developer will ever make any money focusing on mobile.

The big money spenders are real gamers who buy LOTS of games and hardware. Mobile are 99p chumps who have no interest in spending money on hardware or games. Focus on those at your peril Nvidia.

 

[SirPauly]

I like to see growth from AMD!

 

[BenSkywalker]

Per the CES AMD roadmap Kaveri will be available Q4, 2013.

Not ready in time for the launch of the next gen console manufacturing starts? Doesn't sound like a good way to start your story. When trying to author good fiction, at least *lie* to make it all work 😉

Kaveri - Steamroller cores, extensive HSA implementation, unified address space, fully shared memory, GCN 2.0 ... add in AMD's 'mix and match' interface ... what else comes within a country mile of meeting next gen console performance/power/future proofing needs?

Why do you think any of this in any way imaginable makes this part anything but a complete failure in the PC space? It doesn't just sound bad, it sounds terrible. The thought of a $400 motherboard doesn't sound even slightly appealing to me, check out the amount of traces you are asking for and how many layers that is going to require. The only way this APU does anything but suck, and suck hard, is to have *massive* bandwidth far beyond anything we have in the PC space. You can make a GPU 10000 times more powerful then a 690, in a current CPU socket it would get stomped by a 670.

Including Steam Box.

The first couple Steam Box projects have already been announced, don't worry, no AMD parts were used at all. Nothing. Given Gabe's recent interest in Linux, AMD wouldn't be coming close to the SteamBox- they can't afford to have 30% of the potential performance on the 10% of titles that actually work. Just isn't going to cut it, no matter how high on ideals they may be.

Based on a working assumption AMD is getting their Kaveri architecture into the Xbox 3, PS 4 and Steam Box, there are wide ranging implications.

Gabe refers to everything now concerning graphics based on nVidia terminology. They have no chance on the Steam Box front. Also, if the next gen consoles truly do use an APU they are going to fail anyway, at which point their impact will be enormously reduced on the broader market. Another player will emerge to take their place, but witness the WiiU and what shipping a pathetic GPU gets you in a new console today- failure.

They may run the consoles in some sort of Crossfire configuration which could certainly give AMD a big hand in native game performance, although as we have seen this generation they aren't likely to do anything to leverage the extra power that PCs will have over time. You also can not count out the fact that retarded monkeys are better managers then the folks running AMD. The designs they sold for $65 million a few years back are now turning larger profits *per quarter* then AMD's entire *net worth*. AMD redefines stupid, always keep this in mind before making any potential mistakes with your investment dollars.

 

[Lonyo]

Who gives a crap about mobile gaming. Im a huge gamer and you know how many games i have on my Samsung S3? ONE!

Mobile games are for people who actually dont really game. 3DS is a toy and the Vita whilst good is a failure and yes ive owned both.

You think the future is mobile gaming? Your wrong. Mobile gaming sucks. Gaming on a notebook SUX. Not just because its less powerful but because the screen sucks the keyboard sucks and the laptop its self sucks.

Nvidias stupid shield thing will suck. Its no better than a PS Vita and will have less support too. Its ugly and pointless and wont sell or take off in numbers that even get close to the 3DS. Did i mention the 3DS is a toy?

I like sitting in front of my PC and gaming and i like gaming on my console on my 50" plasma with my friends.

Everyone thinks the future is mobile and its NOT. Mobile is for casual chumps who arent gamers. And no AAA developer will ever make any money focusing on mobile.

The big money spenders are real gamers who buy LOTS of games and hardware. Mobile are 99p chumps who have no interest in spending money on hardware or games. Focus on those at your peril Nvidia.

The link wasn't to mobile gaming, it was to NV's cloud gaming concept, which would be to bring PC GAMING to NEW DEVICES.

That's also one element of Shield, being able to play a game from your PC in another place in your house
Good job on NOT EVEN CLICKING THE ARTICLE I LINKED though, and then proceeding to tell me I am wrong.

You may also want to read articles about "Shield", such as the one from AT, which talks about "Grid".

http://www.anandtech.com/show/6549/...eld-console-project-shield-powered-by-tegra-4

NV is talking about the future with internal cloud gaming where your own PC powers another display in another room for gaming, or sends the PC game to "Shield".
This is also something Gabe has mentioned in relation to the "Steam Box" or future of PC gaming.

The point I made (if you read what I said...) is that mobile gaming has changed.
I ALSO said that NV is looking at the future of gaming, rather than the present of gaming.
I used mobile to highlight a changing area of gaming. Then I said NV is looking at the future of gaming with their future technologies, and linked an example of where they are doing this, which wasn't anything related to Shield... or Android devices. Or Tegra at all.

I never said "the future of gaming is mobile and NV are moving to mobile only and it's the future".

Oh, and it's "you're" not "your".

You're welcome.

 

[cytg111]

.. AMD redefines stupid, always keep this in mind before making any potential mistakes with your investment dollars.

- Aww :-( .. dont get all realistic up on os here .. while continued failfacepalm(tm) may indeed be the path ahead for amd, it is all, at this point in time, all probabilistic futures we're dicsussing .. Unless you're a time traveller or got the crystal ball of all-seeing (and being a level 9 sorcerer). The story outlined would be a much needed !fail for said company, and not sub, say ... 5% chance?

 

[NTMBK]

Not ready in time for the launch of the next gen console manufacturing starts? Doesn't sound like a good way to start your story. When trying to author good fiction, at least *lie* to make it all work 😉

If the APU will be available in Q4, it will have been in production months and months before that- potentially in production already. Not to mention console parts would get priority over the PC market, as console launches are more time sensitive.

Why do you think any of this in any way imaginable makes this part anything but a complete failure in the PC space? It doesn't just sound bad, it sounds terrible. The thought of a $400 motherboard doesn't sound even slightly appealing to me, check out the amount of traces you are asking for and how many layers that is going to require. The only way this APU does anything but suck, and suck hard, is to have *massive* bandwidth far beyond anything we have in the PC space. You can make a GPU 10000 times more powerful then a 690, in a current CPU socket it would get stomped by a 670.

What in particular would require a $400 motherboard? What would require so many traces and layers? Fast dual channel DDR3 will be about good enough for something at 7750/7770 level. Hopefully it will have a good fat graphics cache on package/die, a la Haswell GT3e. Not to mention the PCIe bottleneck in the system is removed, and if applications are aware of the shared memory nature of the processor then they will be able to make use of zero-copy.

The first couple Steam Box projects have already been announced, don't worry, no AMD parts were used at all. Nothing. Given Gabe's recent interest in Linux, AMD wouldn't be coming close to the SteamBox- they can't afford to have 30% of the potential performance on the 10% of titles that actually work. Just isn't going to cut it, no matter how high on ideals they may be.

So the Xi3 box using an AMD APU never happened, huh? http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2013-01-08-valves-steam-box-revealed-as-piston-and-made-by-xi3 A compact PC with decent power usage, with enough power to game at 720p/1080p? Sounds like a perfect use case for an AMD APU.

They may run the consoles in some sort of Crossfire configuration which could certainly give AMD a big hand in native game performance, although as we have seen this generation they aren't likely to do anything to leverage the extra power that PCs will have over time. You also can not count out the fact that retarded monkeys are better managers then the folks running AMD. The designs they sold for $65 million a few years back are now turning larger profits *per quarter* then AMD's entire *net worth*. AMD redefines stupid, always keep this in mind before making any potential mistakes with your investment dollars.

Oh jesus, I hope not. Going with a Crossfire/dual graphics arrangement destroys all the benefits of having an APU in consoles- namely shared memory, and programming simplicity. I'm not a massive believer in HSA revolutionising PC gaming any time soon, but a HSA APU is a great fit for console designs.

 

[Enigmoid]

Richland = limited relevance. Kaveri is where the real action takes place.

The relevant metric is it's looking pretty solid Kaveri will provide ~x2 the performance of Trinity in the same power envelope.

That's enough all by itself to run current gen PC games at 1080p at decently high settings. Enough to make it a real gaming chip and be considered as such. As an unmodified console chip high end graphics are easily within reach. In Steam Box running a customized Linux and drivers, it should be able to play ported games at very high settings. Certainly good enough for the average PC or console player.

AMD said richland gives 20-40%. By THEIR OWN FIGURES it gives max 20% for the top mobile chip (mobile is much more limited by tdp than desktop) gpu, about 10% for cpu.

Its not looking solid that kaveri can double trinity. If richland only gets half of what they promised for it on THEIR OWN TESTS, then I doubt their claims about kaveri are true.

I'm going to call it AMD marketing BS.

 

[Fx1]

The link wasn't to mobile gaming, it was to NV's cloud gaming concept, which would be to bring PC GAMING to NEW DEVICES.

That's also one element of Shield, being able to play a game from your PC in another place in your house
Good job on NOT EVEN CLICKING THE ARTICLE I LINKED though, and then proceeding to tell me I am wrong.

You may also want to read articles about "Shield", such as the one from AT, which talks about "Grid".

http://www.anandtech.com/show/6549/...eld-console-project-shield-powered-by-tegra-4

NV is talking about the future with internal cloud gaming where your own PC powers another display in another room for gaming, or sends the PC game to "Shield".
This is also something Gabe has mentioned in relation to the "Steam Box" or future of PC gaming.

The point I made (if you read what I said...) is that mobile gaming has changed.
I ALSO said that NV is looking at the future of gaming, rather than the present of gaming.
I used mobile to highlight a changing area of gaming. Then I said NV is looking at the future of gaming with their future technologies, and linked an example of where they are doing this, which wasn't anything related to Shield... or Android devices. Or Tegra at all.

I never said "the future of gaming is mobile and NV are moving to mobile only and it's the future".

Oh, and it's "you're" not "your".

You're welcome.

Cloud crap is a waste of time. Its just another way for the poor to get access to games without paying for hardware. Ping will always defeat Cloud streamed games the same reason i use a mouse with a wire and not a wireless connection. Its been around for a while now and onlive went bust for a very good reason.

Everyone is working hard to predict the next big thing and the next big things are ALL worse than what we have currently. Cloud gaming, Mobile gaming, Virtual reality??? ARE YOU KIDDING. Who wants to stand up and play games? if i wanted to run around and wave my arms about id take up a sport ... you know in the real world.

Gaming is fun in 2 places. On my leather sofa or my fat leather office chair which is like a sofa. If you can make these 2 experiences better then thats the future of gaming.

Visual experience
Controller interface
Sound experience
Communication experience
Home theatre experience

Thats the future that people should be working on. The rest are gimmicks just like Kinect and Move and Onlive and all the other crap that keeps coming out.

The nvidia Grid thing is another waste of time. Why would i want to run my 600w PC to my TV? thats crazy. Why would i want to use some ugly ass PC controller on my TV?

There is a reason Xbox and Ps3 work so well in the living room and the PC has never moved from the desk.

 

[SirPauly]

It's not what you like or what I like but to be in position for potential growth opportunities that the market may allow for, imho!

 

[Lonyo]

Cloud crap is a waste of time. Its just another way for the poor to get access to games without paying for hardware. Ping will always defeat Cloud streamed games the same reason i use a mouse with a wire and not a wireless connection. Its been around for a while now and onlive went bust for a very good reason.

Everyone is working hard to predict the next big thing and the next big things are ALL worse than what we have currently. Cloud gaming, Mobile gaming, Virtual reality??? ARE YOU KIDDING. Who wants to stand up and play games? if i wanted to run around and wave my arms about id take up a sport ... you know in the real world.

Gaming is fun in 2 places. On my leather sofa or my fat leather office chair which is like a sofa. If you can make these 2 experiences better then thats the future of gaming.

Visual experience
Controller interface
Sound experience
Communication experience
Home theatre experience

Thats the future that people should be working on. The rest are gimmicks just like Kinect and Move and Onlive and all the other crap that keeps coming out.

The nvidia Grid thing is another waste of time. Why would i want to run my 600w PC to my TV? thats crazy. Why would i want to use some ugly ass PC controller on my TV?

There is a reason Xbox and Ps3 work so well in the living room and the PC has never moved from the desk.

Enjoy being a luddite. Hope it works out for you.
And I highlighted one thing that one company is doing, and didn't say it was the right thing, just what they thought might be good for the future/their future.

There are companies working on other areas as well.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=re1EatGRV0w
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rJwln8seKhs

Just because NV hasn't said it's t doing all the things you want to see, doesn't mean no one is, or that NV isn't. Companies don't reveal all their projects.