Once in a while you run into a thesis that hits the nail on the head....

[Bowfinger]

Thanks MB, good read. He certainly calls out one of the key changes that has pushed me away from the modern GOP. In times long past, conservatism centered on traditional values like family, community, church, and country. It emphasized conformity, responsibility. respect for authority, and a strong work ethic. It embraced capitalism and making money, but it was within a framework of building one's career or business and supporting one's community.

From my perspective, this changed dramatically in the Reagan era, with the elevation of the greedy, self-serving, "I'm getting mine so screw you" mentality. The GOP, at least as a party, lost the focus on values and building one's success while being supportive of community. It became instead solely focused on grabbing as much money as possible through whatever means possible. It embraced "Greed is good", not as a cautionary tale, but as the foundation of its ideology.

That is destructive to a civilized society. As Obama noted (much to the anger of the right fringe), our success, America's success, comes from individual initiative but also from working together to build our land of opportunity. We are most successful when there is healthy balance.

"Build" is a key word here too, I think, and something this piece pointed out well. The right likes to tar the left as hating capitalism, but that's not the point. There are different kinds of capitalism. The old-fashioned, productive form of capitalism, where one builds a business through hard work, innovation, and quality goods or services is usually a boon to society. The modern capitalism, the so-called vulture capitalism, where the focus is extracting wealth while producing nothing is good for the elite few but very bad for society as a whole. It is naked greed.

This me-first, greed is good depravity is not sustainable, and is doomed to collapse under its own amorality. It weakens us and erodes the bonds that keep us civilized. History has shown again and again that the have-nots inevitably rise up to depose the have-everythings.

I do believe this piece dropped the ball, however, in failing to note that serving the greedy is not just for Republicans anymore. Democratic politicians are increasingly serving the same masters. They are not nearly so overt about it as many on the right, but they are corrupt nonetheless. They may be somewhat better than Republicans, but that bar is set terribly low.

 

[Moonbeam]

Another article "proving" how inferior conservative thinking is, posted by the stalwart bastion of clear concise logic, moonbeam.
We all know that moonie posts this stuff because he hates himself, and because he hates himself, he hates others as well.
Self hate folks, it's the heart and soul of liberal thinking.

Another post by another inferior projecting his inferiority onto others. Nobody gives a shit, Greenman, that you feel like a pile of shit. Everybody else does too. There is nothing special about you other than your sensitivity. But you waste your time pretending to be anything else but a moron. It is only how you feel. Try to get a grip on your self so you can grow up. You act like a pile of shit because it's how you feel. I know that beyond that pile of shit is a real person who was destroyed as a child. I am on your side as a human being. I simply oppose the depths of your denial. Your pain fills you full of defensive armor and pride whereas with me, I died. You strive to shove your shit up my ass because you can't face it, but I already died from it. All you do is make me sad to see a wasted human being. Try to have some humility and come alive. Your incessant pissing into the wind just blows it back in your face.

 

[Moonbeam]

Bowfinger: I do believe this piece dropped the ball, however, in failing to note that serving the greedy is not just for Republicans anymore. Democratic politicians are increasingly serving the same masters. They are not nearly so overt about it as many on the right, but they are corrupt nonetheless. They may be somewhat better than Republicans, but that bar is set terribly low.

Yup, I implied as much in my post above to marvdmartian.

 

[NoStateofMind]

Bowfinger: I do believe this piece dropped the ball, however, in failing to note that serving the greedy is not just for Republicans anymore. Democratic politicians are increasingly serving the same masters. They are not nearly so overt about it as many on the right, but they are corrupt nonetheless. They may be somewhat better than Republicans, but that bar is set terribly low.

Yup, I implied as much in my post above to marvdmartian.

My how four years changes things. Obama not messiah? Whodathunkit?

 

[Bowfinger]

My how four years changes things. Obama not messiah? Whodathunkit?

Pretty much everyone outside the right wing fringe, i.e., those connected to reality instead of mindlessly swallowing the RNC talking points. The whole Obama is the messiah schtick came from the right, not the left.

 

[lotus503]

The only people out of touch with reality are the ones who believe that ANY career politician, regardless of party affiliation, will serve their best interests.

They're ALL crooks, cheats, swindlers and liars. They want to stay in office for one reason, and that's power over YOU.

Exactly

 

[shira]

The right seems to be incapable of seeing that their view of the world increasingly depends on a dogma divorced from objective measures of reality.

For example, the right looks at the current state of the economy and insists that a weak economy "proves" that the "the stimulus" was a failure. Yet the strong consensus among economists is that the stimulus was very effective, and that the depth of the recession and the peak unemployment rate would have been far worse had no stimulus been enacted.

Just google it. You have to be pretty delusional to be unaware of what the consensus of economists is - not politicians playing politics. A couple of examples:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2008–2009_Keynesian_resurgence#Efficacy

Writing in July 2010 for the Financial Times, economics journalist Robin Harding stated that American economists are close to consensus in agreeing that the US stimulus did have a large influence on the economy, though he mentions there are high profile dissenters such as Robert Barro and John Taylor. Barro's arguments against the effectiveness of the stimulus have been addressed by Keynesian economics professor Brad Delong. A July 2010 paper by Moody's chief economist Mark Zandl and former Federal Reserve vice chairman Alan Blinder predicted that the US recession would have been far worse without the government intervention. They calculate that in the absence of both a monetary and fiscal response, unemployment would have peaked at about 16.5% instead of about 10%, the peak to trough GDP decline would have been about 12% instead of 4%. Despite the lack of deficit spending, the 2010 and 2011 U.S. government deficit was forecast to be almost twice as large due to the predicted collapse of tax receipts. In August 2010, a report from the non partisan Congressional Budget Office found the US stimulus had boosted growth by as much as 4.5%. House of Representatives Minority Leader John Boehner expressed skepticism about the report's accuracy. In March 2011, citing studies on the effectiveness of fiscal stimulus from several dozen economists and international bodies, David Romer told the IMF that "we should view the question of whether fiscal stimulus is effective as settled."

http://www.usatoday.com/money/economy/2010-08-30-stimulus30_CV_N.htm

Earlier this month, Zandi and co-author Alan Blinder, former vice chairman of the Federal Reserve, released the most detailed assessment of the government's efforts to combat the so-called Great Recession. Neither economist is regarded as a partisan firebrand. Zandi, for example, backed John McCain in the 2008 presidential campaign and has advised members of both parties.

Their conclusion: The fiscal stimulus created 2.7 million jobs and added $460 billion to gross domestic product. Unemployment would be 11% today if the stimulus hadn't been passed and 16.5% if neither the fiscal stimulus nor the banks' rescue had been enacted, according to Zandi and Blinder. "It's pretty hard to deny that it had a measurable impact," Zandi said.

But what do the righties on ATPN believe? They consistently say the the stimulus was an utter failure. And if they really believe that, what does that say about their ability to separate ANY truth from the fiction of their dogma?

 

[LumbergTech]

Exactly

When the requirements for the job are to be a liar and a crook...you will get liars and crooks...people get what they ask for

 

[trenchfoot]

Pretty much everyone outside the right wing fringe, i.e., those connected to reality instead of mindlessly swallowing the RNC talking points. The whole Obama is the messiah schtick came from the right, not the left.

The problem with that is how some righties seem to conveniently forget small details like that and then proceed to believe what they're told to believe because it's what they wanted to hear and the folks that told them what they wanted to hear knew just that, which then perpetuates the whole cycle of lies and distortion. I'd like to shake the hand of the Repub who thought up that gimmick, but then I'd try to rip his arm off and beat him over the head with it.

Conversely, some righties take note of what the left observed about them, "fix it" and turn it against the originators, then use the notion like they thought of it themselves, all while again, conveniently forgetting who thought up the notion in the first place.

 

[umbrella39]

Another article "proving" how inferior conservative thinking is, posted by the stalwart bastion of clear concise logic, moonbeam.
We all know that moonie posts this stuff because he hates himself, and because he hates himself, he hates others as well.
Self hate folks, it's the heart and soul of liberal thinking.

He swings... he misses. Keep trying!

 

[MrColin]

I don't feel like digging up the source but I once came across an article that used evolutionary psych to explain why we have people that seem to naturally polarize right-left. Common sense would dictate that if we had all conservative mindsets the species would still be in caves as anybody that invented anything or tried to improve society would get their brains bashed in with a rock. Conservatism provides an evolutionary advantage during times of extreme crisis. I don't remember how but I think it has to do with the fact the liberals won't eat their own children during a famine.

 

[cybrsage]

Another post by another inferior projecting his inferiority onto others.

I see you are projecting again.

 

[cybrsage]

The right seems to be incapable of seeing that their view of the world increasingly depends on a dogma divorced from objective measures of reality.

Wow, that is a good bit of dogma which is divorced from objective measures of reality. You must consider yourself to be part of the right.

 

[cybrsage]

A nice way to confess the worthlessness of your thinking or really inability to think with any seriousness. I am a rock, I am an island and nothing touches me. Such a waste of a brain. The pooh pooh man.

Moonbean says everyone who does not agree with him is worthless and/or has a brain defect. News at 11.

 

[nehalem256]

That is destructive to a civilized society. As Obama noted (much to the anger of the right fringe), our success, America's success, comes from individual initiative but also from working together to build our land of opportunity. We are most successful when there is healthy balance.

Too bad liberal values have worked to eviscerate the family, which is the fundamental building block of working together, but normalizing divorce and having bastard children.

 

[nehalem256]

Moonbean says everyone who does not agree with him is worthless and/or has a brain defect. News at 11.

He is simply demonstrating liberal tolerance for us all!

 

[OrByte]

empathy deficit disorder

interesting.

thanks for the post OP. Alot of thoughtful musing not only about politics but about individual thought.

 

[cybrsage]

He is simply demonstrating liberal tolerance for us all!

Oh yeah, the type of tolerance where the person claims that showing intolerance means they are tolerant. You are right.

 

[soulcougher73]

He thinks that but gives our President a free ride when he scolds business owners like a 3 year old "You didn't build that"

Still haven't figured out context yet huh?

 

[shira]

Wow, that is a good bit of dogma which is divorced from objective measures of reality. You must consider yourself to be part of the right.

My previous post and Cybrsage's response here provides a perfect contrast between the left- and right-wing perceptions of reality.

I make a statement, and then provide links to reputable sources supporting my statement. That's called "fact-based reality."

Cybrsage makes a statement and then offers nothing to support his position. In fact, Cybrsage's statement is nonsensical on it's face, since he labels as "dogma" a fact-based statement.

Thanks, Cybrsage. Your post is a clear-cut example supporting Moonie's point.

 

[Moonbeam]

My previous post and Cybrsage's response here provides a perfect contrast between the left- and right-wing perceptions of reality.

I make a statement, and then provide links to reputable sources supporting my statement. That's called "fact-based reality."

Cybrsage makes a statement and then offers nothing to support his position. In fact, Cybrsage's statement is nonsensical on it's face, since he labels as "dogma" a fact-based statement.

Thanks, Cybrsage. Your post is a clear-cut example supporting Moonie's point.

Well my point was that what would be clear-cut to you or me would be incomprehensible to somebody like cybrsage because he exhibits the very disability described by the notion of non-reality based thinking. Conservatives know the truth in their guts by a process called truthiness and do not really need their brains. Reality never enters the picture. The rest of the thinking world has to figure things our by using reason accompanied by the acquisition of knowledge. They lack the gift and have to actually do work to know anything. This is why you can never win an argument with fools. They simply have to vomit up some inanity that truthiness offers and every other fool like them will instantly agree. We don't live in a world where people are knowledgeable and have learned how to think.

 

[Kadarin]

The only people out of touch with reality are the ones who believe that ANY career politician, regardless of party affiliation, will serve their best interests.

They're ALL crooks, cheats, swindlers and liars. They want to stay in office for one reason, and that's power over YOU.

This is a tactic I've seen used by conservatives; when called out on something, they respond to say that everyone is equally bad (whether or not that's actually the case).

 

[sandorski]

Still haven't figured out context yet huh?

More like, ignores context.

 

[Doppel]

This is a tactic I've seen used by conservatives; when called out on something, they respond to say that everyone is equally bad (whether or not that's actually the case).

I'm neither republican nor democrat; the guy is right. The blind partisan ship my party vs yours is a sports-fan mentality and it is helping to destroy the country.

 

[boomerang]

It still amazes me to see folks vote against their own best interests.

The facts are laid bare for all to see irt what the Repub agenda has been, especially over the last fifty years where the tax code has been corrupted heavily in favor of the financial elite, where deregulation in the name of higher and higher profit irregardless of harm is pursued with a vengeance, where weakening the government to strengthen the control the rich and powerful have over it and where the total elimination of the ever diminishing power the middle class have over its elected officials is a priority of the highest order for the party leaders.

Yet, I bear witness to the complete disregard many conservative middle class and poor folks exhibit to these debilitating forces that work against them. To my utter amazement, these same folks rail against how much money "big bloated government" is wasting on excessive spending while expressing concern over losing their gov't paid pensions, health care and SS benefits and gladly take any increases in benefits they can get.

This behavior expresses the sheer irony this situation creates wherein these folks possess the ideology and profit oriented goals of the rich, yet must rely on their government handouts to satisfy the tenets of said ideology and "profit" driven goals. To these folks, it's just fine and dandy to think that way. Again, simply amazing.

To top it all off, the rich and powerful rely on just this kind of blind faith and ignorance to keep on robbing from the poor and giving to the rich. They're laughing all the way to the bank and the victims are laughing right along with them.

But, hey, it's all good because the believers are devout and resolute to "their" cause, no matter what. Yikes!

Make a case that Obama policies are working. Show us the budget he has laid out and his plan to restore employment, the economy, our well being and our stature in the world. Show us that and convince us it's going to work we'll vote for him. While you're at it, explain why the first four years things got so much worse and why the next four years are going to be the game changer.

But don't lay blame. Obama is not the only President to have inherited a steaming pile of shit. No blame. I will let you ignore the rich and powerful that Obama hob nobs with and you can ignore the $38,000 a plate luncheons he's attending to raise funds for his campaign. Ignore that and tell us why he's different, what his plan is, why he didn't get it done the first four years and why the second four are going to be different.