I think MF is. I own Xin so I'm pretty sure he's 3150 or less.
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I think MF is. I own Xin so I'm pretty sure he's 3150 or less.
FYI if you keep a few AP runes but go back to your normal runes otherwise you can jungle tryndamere from level 1. His heal scales well enough with AP that he can successfully start at dual golems and roll from there.
Has anyone read the patch notes? Why are they buffing those champs? All three (Galio, Garen, Caitlyn) are viable as is. I honestly feel that Caitlyn's range is so insane at level 1 that she is damn near impossible to lane against. Galio is clearly at an ok point as I can run him successfully even against a mostly AD team. Garen is still beastly and hard to kill while dishing decent damage so I don't really think he needs a huge buff like extra move speed and a better courage... ugg all in all I think I hate this patch.
Speaking of the metagame, how would you guys fix tanky DPS?
I had a thought which I posted on another board which fails completely. My original idea was that a BF sword is +50 attack and could be split into two stats +25 attack and +50% base attack. The problem with this is that the 'bruisers' tend to have higher base attack but lower attack speed than the pure DPS champs. Sadly according to this: http://leagueoflegends.wikia.com/wiki/Champion_Base_Statistics Malphite, Cho'gath and Alistar seem to be 3 of the hardest hitting characters in the game (with Yi being fourth). Of course all three have to be in melee range which is a slight downside. I guess I understand the reasoning for the base damage to be different, but why does Alistar also scale better than Ashe in the AD department? Anyway I turned that wiki table into a spreadsheet and having fun doing simple DPS comparisons that ignore range, movement speed and skills =) I'll let you know if there's anything really interesting.
* In pure DPS (AS * AD) at level 1, your top 6 are Maokai, Warwick, Olaf, Gangplank, Yi, Trynd
* The same calulation but using level 18 values yields Kassadin, Evelynn, Nasus, Malphite, Jax
* At level 18 Kassadin has the second highest base attack speed (to Eve) suggesting that he was originally designed to be a melee fighter or at least a hybrid (also see his mana drain skill)... also see the note above this
Edit: Why is poppy always played AD nowadays? I used to play her AP with Lichbane/zhona's etc and she put out some amazing damage. Did I miss a nerf?
Speaking of the metagame, how would you guys fix tanky DPS?
I had a thought which I posted on another board which fails completely. My original idea was that a BF sword is +50 attack and could be split into two stats +25 attack and +50% base attack. The problem with this is that the 'bruisers' tend to have higher base attack but lower attack speed than the pure DPS champs. Sadly according to this: http://leagueoflegends.wikia.com/wiki/Champion_Base_Statistics Malphite, Cho'gath and Alistar seem to be 3 of the hardest hitting characters in the game (with Yi being fourth). Of course all three have to be in melee range which is a slight downside. I guess I understand the reasoning for the base damage to be different, but why does Alistar also scale better than Ashe in the AD department? Anyway I turned that wiki table into a spreadsheet and having fun doing simple DPS comparisons that ignore range, movement speed and skills =) I'll let you know if there's anything really interesting.
* In pure DPS (AS * AD) at level 1, your top 6 are Maokai, Warwick, Olaf, Gangplank, Yi, Trynd
* The same calulation but using level 18 values yields Kassadin, Evelynn, Nasus, Malphite, Jax
* At level 18 Kassadin has the second highest base attack speed (to Eve) suggesting that he was originally designed to be a melee fighter or at least a hybrid (also see his mana drain skill)... also see the note above this
Edit: Why is poppy always played AD nowadays? I used to play her AP with Lichbane/zhona's etc and she put out some amazing damage. Did I miss a nerf?
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NikolaeVarius
Lifer
Nice buffs to turrets. I like it.
As for fixing tanky DPS, I have no idea. I'm a bit biased because I love my Cho' Gath and so can't really think of ideas to fix tanky DPS.
I will never forgive riot for nerfing my feast.
As for fixing tanky DPS, I have no idea. I'm a bit biased because I love my Cho' Gath and so can't really think of ideas to fix tanky DPS.
I will never forgive riot for nerfing my feast.
ImpulsE69
Lifer
How would I fix tanky DPS? I'd get rid of it. Either DPS OR Tanky, not both. Make them choose. I get very annoyed playing characters where I must choose whether to dish out damage and be squishy or tank and deal no damage only to go up against a team of characters who do both. They scale too high.
The only ones I really have a big problem with though is Mundo and Poppy, both tank like beasts and deal quite a bit of damage.
This affect is really seen depending on your character. I tend to play ranged chars so while Cho is both as well, I don't tend to get close enough for him to do much damage. I've also never had many issues with Garen.
I agree about Cait's range and laning. The thing with her though is she has tells.
I think Galio could use some minor buffs, people tend not to play him, and when he is played, he's mediocre at best.
crownjules
Diamond Member
Galio definitely needs the buffs. He's not bad, it's just the other tanks are much better. And I'd rather them buff Galio up to relevance than nerf the others down to his level.
After playing Cait a bunch this past week, I can see her needing a few buffs too. Her range is great and that's it. I found her quite boring actually even when I was doing well.
Garen isn't that good anymore and he needs the buffs. The problem is he walks a fine line between being OP or UP, especially at the lower ELO levels.
After playing Cait a bunch this past week, I can see her needing a few buffs too. Her range is great and that's it. I found her quite boring actually even when I was doing well.
Garen isn't that good anymore and he needs the buffs. The problem is he walks a fine line between being OP or UP, especially at the lower ELO levels.
I don't really have any problems with Poppy. She's more of an anti-carry than a true tanky DPS. Just wait until her ult is down and she dies fast enough.
My favorite change this patch is this one:
* Made Shroud of Darkness Shroud of Darkness shield brighter and easier to see.
As a side note every so often I get into a ranked game where everyone plays 'their champ' rather than making a good team and since I've picked first or second I've been unable to adjust. This usually leaves me with Sion and one to three niches to fill. Naturally if I pick last, I'd pick a better champ for the team.
Niche A: We don't have a jungler. I know Sion can be jungled but I need to figure out how... I think AP/AS /HP runes, start with... enrage + cloth armor + HP pots?
Niche B: No Tanks: Usually we need to carry hard early and just win so I play this normally (AP) and after my sheen I'll consider buying some CDR in order to spam stun more often (Morello's Evil Tome may be perfect for this though Frozen heart has been my standby). If I own early I'll just buy a Nashor's but those are sooo expensive I usually won't.
Niche C: We end up with tank + 4 AP characters so I build AD.... I'm not set up to do this at all. I imagine that Ult> enrage > stun > shield, build AS + lifesteal (zeal, boots, brutalizer, starks, ? black cleaver/triforce/ghostblade???). My main problem is this type of build can easily be denied early while a AP Sion cannot. Any ideas on runes/masteries?
Niche A: We don't have a jungler. I know Sion can be jungled but I need to figure out how... I think AP/AS /HP runes, start with... enrage + cloth armor + HP pots?
Niche B: No Tanks: Usually we need to carry hard early and just win so I play this normally (AP) and after my sheen I'll consider buying some CDR in order to spam stun more often (Morello's Evil Tome may be perfect for this though Frozen heart has been my standby). If I own early I'll just buy a Nashor's but those are sooo expensive I usually won't.
Niche C: We end up with tank + 4 AP characters so I build AD.... I'm not set up to do this at all. I imagine that Ult> enrage > stun > shield, build AS + lifesteal (zeal, boots, brutalizer, starks, ? black cleaver/triforce/ghostblade???). My main problem is this type of build can easily be denied early while a AP Sion cannot. Any ideas on runes/masteries?
Hey guys, since I play with my son and his friend (who both play Shen and Noc) a lot and thinking about Zebano's (I think it was his) comment that a TF-Noc-Shen-Panth team is so annoying; I've been thinking about dusting off the Panth that Riot gave me when I stopped playing for a bit and see if we could work out some ownage with a trio of Shen-Noc-Panth.
I've never really found a good way to play Panth...what's a good build/strat for him? I've been harrasing with Q and initiating with Q-W-E, which seems mostly sound, and of course, looking for gank opportunities with his ult. Does that sound about right?
As far as build goes, I have *no* ideas. I've tried AD/AS/Crit and that didn't really seem to get it done, I've tried starting on AP and tank builds, but we lost those games so fast (thanks to enemy being fed) I couldn't really get far enough into it to tell if they were going to work out or not. I looked up a couple of guides, but nothing out there really struck me as being good *and* suited to my playstyle.
I've never really found a good way to play Panth...what's a good build/strat for him? I've been harrasing with Q and initiating with Q-W-E, which seems mostly sound, and of course, looking for gank opportunities with his ult. Does that sound about right?
As far as build goes, I have *no* ideas. I've tried AD/AS/Crit and that didn't really seem to get it done, I've tried starting on AP and tank builds, but we lost those games so fast (thanks to enemy being fed) I couldn't really get far enough into it to tell if they were going to work out or not. I looked up a couple of guides, but nothing out there really struck me as being good *and* suited to my playstyle.
Panth is essentially an AD nuke via his e and as such you should aim for AD, more AD then some defense. Personally I like to get a brutalizer first as the ArPen is awesome and follow that up with boots, a BF Sword > I.E. then defensive items like banshees and perhaps a GA and finish up (if the game goes that long) by purchasing more AD.
I like ghost + exhaust as his summoner spells though there is something to be said for teleport.
Early game: Start with Meki + 2 hp pots so you can harrass with Q but make sure you last hit to get money then the build above works well. Once you have one point in w& e you can start combo-ing people but note that you don't get very good damage our of 'e' until you buy some damage and get a couple levels in it. Once you have brutalizer (and ult) try to coordinate ganks on overextended enmies.
Mid Game: Continue to gank/push/farm open lanes, you're strong enough that a full 'e' can kill squishier champs. Be very careful of teamfights as you will be focused. Stunning their carries is good but your main job is to land 'e' on as many enemies as possible.
Late game (14+): Most enemies have some armor now and almost everything is a teamfight. Make sure you know your teams kill priorities and try to hit as many champions as you can with 'e'. Even with a banshees or Chain mail you are squishy and you need to be extremely careful in teamfights. If you can coordinate with Nocturnes' ult you have a better chance of diving in > killing someone and getting out alive. The hardest part to learn is when you go from being a 1v1 menace, picking off stragglers to being a squishy nuke like Annie.
crownjules
Diamond Member
I forsee many terrible Nocturnes in the coming days.
Thanks for the response zebano.
Cool, I've started with Meki's + health pots...just always gone downhill from there. 🙂 I was ok, just not a really big contributor to the wins when we won, and not a big contributor when we lost.
I'll give your build a try the next time I play him...what about runes? AD runes there as well? I'm building up a crit damage set for Trist, right now, so once I finish that (going to be awhile...those things are expensive!) I'll start tailoring one for Panth.
Ya. I was already bored of the previous heroes list. I think I fell in love with blitzcrank today. I only played one 20 minute game before I had to leave, but he seems really fun and helpful to team play.
I cant wait to play some more when I get home to mess around with some of the other heroes.
I cant wait to play some more when I get home to mess around with some of the other heroes.
RPD
Diamond Member
You would be correct. There will be two Noc's in every game for the next week.
RPD
Diamond Member
If you are a low level and want some real fun, pick blitz and get a buddy to pick Alastair and lane together. Oh the ways you can smash people with these two.
Please do not buy IE on Pantheon.
If you haven't noticed, the majority of Pantheon's damage comes from his spells, not his autoattack. IE is a dead end for Panth. There is nothing like seeing a Pantheon destroy your team and then go glass cannon or get a dead-end item like IE with a huge gold investment. Makes you think you're still in the game =).
Pantheon is an AD caster. He focuses on dominating the early to mid game, destroying the AD carry mid and then systematically taking the other team apart when he gets his ult with his ganks.
Because his spells do so much damage early on, and scale off of physical damage, you should be looking into armor pen. A strong pantheon will pick up something along the lines of brutalizer -> BF sword -> youmuu's/bloodthirster, and then starting to build survivability along the lines of a merc treads/frozen mallet/neg cloak. If you are destroying people without the need of survivability, something like an Atma's would work as well.
edit: For skill build, please remember that the bulk of Pantheon's damage now comes from his E. IIRC, your priorities should be R, E, W, Q. One point in Q early on for ranged harass/last hits is likely necessary.
Tristana -> Arpen Red, armor yellow, magic resist blues
NikolaeVarius
Lifer
Nocturne is so awesome and fun. First game ever with him and i went 10/0/something. He punishes stupidity so heavily it's hilariously awesome.
I see a nerf coming in the near future because he is simply too fun and awesome.
He is the BANE of idiots.
I see a nerf coming in the near future because he is simply too fun and awesome.
He is the BANE of idiots.
novasatori
Diamond Member
I can't stand the people who die a lot at the start then when they start destroying towers or something start trying to surrender saying we lose, and continue to keep up their way of failure trying to solo 1v5 getting owned.
Then they're like game is over surrender, despite the fact everyone else has positive k/d ratio.
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
(I only rant about this now because I was playing my trundle build, which I build late game tanky so he is basically invulnerable at end game, but not so useful early/mid and if people would just hold out till then we will basically steam roll them, but nooooooooo)
Then they're like game is over surrender, despite the fact everyone else has positive k/d ratio.
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
(I only rant about this now because I was playing my trundle build, which I build late game tanky so he is basically invulnerable at end game, but not so useful early/mid and if people would just hold out till then we will basically steam roll them, but nooooooooo)
novasatori
Diamond Member
all you really need on poppy is trinity force and the just gank
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