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** Official Star Craft 2 Multiplayer Thread **

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Aikouka said:
I always wondered if Flux Vanes was a little excessive with the void rays. I guess the idea of being able to escape danger better is okay because they sacrifice their damage/charge?

I use marines often against void rays simply because how easy it is to mass them. The only problem is if the person just starts micro'ing them around.

The one thing with Corruptors... they're anti-massive units, which means they're just anti Brood Lord, Battlecruiser and Carrier units (for the most part). That's why I've been wondering what to use as Zerg against them... I've been trying to check replays to find out what others do, but I can't find anything.
Click to expand...

I agree mass VR are a pain to deal with but if your opponent manages to get them you are doign something wrong. Against a VR harass as terran rines and vikings do fine. As zerg you can use hydra or mutas or just kill him of with lings and roaches and go for a base race (easy win for zerg).
 
beginner99 said:
I agree mass VR are a pain to deal with but if your opponent manages to get them you are doign something wrong. Against a VR harass as terran rines and vikings do fine. As zerg you can use hydra or mutas or just kill him of with lings and roaches and go for a base race (easy win for zerg).
Click to expand...

The problem is... as Zerg, Hydralisks are Zerg T2 units. Zerg are the only race with no T1 ground unit that can attack air, and Terran are the easiest with their cheap, mineral-only unit.

Based on the following tech trees, isn't it also true that Zerg and Protoss can reach Void Rays and Hydras at about the same point?

http://sc2armory.com/game/protoss/tech_tree

http://sc2armory.com/game/zerg/tech_tree

I mean, based off this... Protoss doesn't have a true distinction between T2 and T3 given that both have the same requirement. Terran requires a Factory to build up further and Zerg requires the Hive. So, a Protoss could essentially skip the time required to even build T2 and just go straight to their Stargate and start using Void Rays.

In the one game we had, the Protoss player literally went straight for VRs and hid the stargate far away from his base. I Reaper rushed him and destroyed his economy, but that didn't stop him from getting one out. Given the lack of any anti-air, my friend was doomed and way too far for me to help.

Of course, it also didn't help that I still suck at macroing while microing a micro-heavy unit like a Reaper 😛.
 
beginner99 said:
I agree mass VR are a pain to deal with but if your opponent manages to get them you are doign something wrong. Against a VR harass as terran rines and vikings do fine.
Click to expand...
Still, fact is using rays tends to be much easier than defending against them on lower skill levels, charged rays aren't harmless to marine/viking, and the "harass" can turn into an instawin quite often.
As zerg you can use hydra or mutas or just kill him of with lings and roaches and go for a base race (easy win for zerg).
Click to expand...
Relying on that kind of base race sounds very much like a suicide against a good toss. Forcefields blocking ramp = autoloss. Not to mention the toss might already have random pylons across the map.
 
Aikouka said:
The problem is... as Zerg, Hydralisks are Zerg T2 units. Zerg are the only race with no T1 ground unit that can attack air, and Terran are the easiest with their cheap, mineral-only unit.
Click to expand...
Queen. T1, mineral-only, excellent AA with longer range than the ray has. 1 ray barely beats 1 queen, but 2 queens beat 2 rays if I recall correctly.
 
Pia said:
Still, fact is using rays tends to be much easier than defending against them on lower skill levels, charged rays aren't harmless to marine/viking, and the "harass" can turn into an instawin quite often.
Relying on that kind of base race sounds very much like a suicide against a good toss. Forcefields blocking ramp = autoloss. Not to mention the toss might already have random pylons across the map.
Click to expand...

I don't completely disagree but vikings are cheaper and build much faster than void rays so you should easly have more of them.
Zerg is more problematic but as you pointed out just make 2 queens. they easly beat 1 VR.
VR harass is annoying but manageable. I find ling or reaper rushes much more powerful because they are basically all-ins.
 
I had a cheeky zerg send two drones to scout me... which I didn't notice and they ended up killing a worker. Then it took even more workers to chase them around and make sure they didn't kill any more. Then of course, they just ran around my base until I got marines to kill them. So that's one worker dead and 2 more uselessly chasing drones to make sure they don't pick off any of my building SCV's.
 
DangerAardvark said:
If you wanna learn how to counter cheese just play Agria Valley melee games and 90% of the time Protoss will cannon rush or proxy gateway. I learned that bunkering up is NOT the way to go if they're mixing lots and cannons, because cannons outrange bunkers. There really is no option but to scout it early and pull workers to help your first marine.
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what exactly is a melee game?
 
Pia said:
Still, fact is using rays tends to be much easier than defending against them on lower skill levels, charged rays aren't harmless to marine/viking, and the "harass" can turn into an instawin quite often.
Relying on that kind of base race sounds very much like a suicide against a good toss. Forcefields blocking ramp = autoloss. Not to mention the toss might already have random pylons across the map.
Click to expand...

how can you tell when a VR is charged?
how long does it stay charged?
 
A melee game is a custom game played on a regular Blizzard map. It's like playing matchmaking without recording wins/losses.

You can tell how much a VR is charged by: 1) the thickness of the beam, or 2) how many arms are firing the beam. It's much easier to tell just from the thickness of the beam, so just play a practice game versus a computer and test it out for yourself to see.

The full beam stays charged as long as you're hitting any target (so the answer is indefinitely). If your question is how long can a VR not attack and still retain it's full charge, it's about 3 seconds.
 
Ugh, I still suck at this game. I always end up in a macro war and lose even when I have the advantage early on. Time to watch some replays. . .
 
SpicyCurry said:
A melee game is a custom game played on a regular Blizzard map. It's like playing matchmaking without recording wins/losses.

You can tell how much a VR is charged by: 1) the thickness of the beam, or 2) how many arms are firing the beam. It's much easier to tell just from the thickness of the beam, so just play a practice game versus a computer and test it out for yourself to see.

The full beam stays charged as long as you're hitting any target (so the answer is indefinitely). If your question is how long can a VR not attack and still retain it's full charge, it's about 3 seconds.
Click to expand...


yes thanks, that's what i meant.
so how many levels of charge are there? and how long between each increase of levels?

when losing charge, does it lose all of it completely (after the ~3 seconds), or it drops to a weaker level (e.g., every second, it loses a level, and finally loses all charge after ~3s)?
 
Trouble for zerg I think is that they need a lot of gas for AA. When using ground units to counter air, you give up a lot of mobility. While marines/Hydra can take out VR, VR can run away and hit something else.
 
BlahBlahYouToo said:
[/b]

yes thanks, that's what i meant.
so how many levels of charge are there? and how long between each increase of levels?

when losing charge, does it lose all of it completely (after the ~3 seconds), or it drops to a weaker level (e.g., every second, it loses a level, and finally loses all charge after ~3s)?
Click to expand...

i think 3 levels, normal, med, full. and when it falls off it falls off completely and has to start charging from the beginning again.
 
JTsyo said:
Trouble for zerg I think is that they need a lot of gas for AA. When using ground units to counter air, you give up a lot of mobility. While marines/Hydra can take out VR, VR can run away and hit something else.
Click to expand...

Yeah, not having to commit is the magic of air units.
Mutalisks can also be sort-of hard for low level players to deal with, but at least they do stop by spamming enough static defenses, and take ages to kill whole buildings, whereas void rays need active and immediate response.
 
Glitchny said:
i think 3 levels, normal, med, full. and when it falls off it falls off completely and has to start charging from the beginning again.
Click to expand...

http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/Void_Ray#Abilities
level 1: one arm, default damage
level 2: two arms, thicker beam, but still default damage
level 3: three arms, double damage. maintains charge for 5 seconds after switching targets; each time it targets a new target this 5 second counter is reset.
 
shortylickens said:
Its better than the old system where you got mercilessly stomped by veterans.
Unless you are like me and save that Bronze 99th place just for yourself.
Click to expand...
The ranking system is great. The convoluted way it decides to demote/promote (or lack thereof) is what's annoying.
 
Last edited:
I think the ranking system might need some slight changes... in WoW, they grew tired of people abusing rankings by simply joining new teams and instituted a personal rating. I have no idea if SC2 has this, but the fact that I find people with the following placement...

1v1: Silver
2v2: Silver
3v3: Gold
4v4: Platinum

Why the hell do I get placed against them as Bronze when it's obvious that they have enough experience to jump to much higher ranks in other areas?
 
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