Obama to raise minimum wage to $9.50 an hour by 2011.

[soccerballtux]

Originally posted by: ElFenix

Originally posted by: Xavier434

the majority of people making minimum wage live under mommy and daddy's roof.

But some don't and we need to adjust for inflation.


As stated in my previous posts though, my position on it depends on the state of the econ by 2011. I have confidence that Obama feels the same way. The man clearly has priorities.

historically the government inflation number has overstated inflation because it does not account for quality improvements or shifts in consumer spending.

inflation should not be taken into account for the minimum wage. rather, minimum wage should be set where the workers affected are able to gain the maximum aggregate benefit. that is actually where the FLSA says the minimum wage should be. but you won't find the politicians asking where that might be.

Hm, where does FLSA say it should be?

 

[soccerballtux]

Originally posted by: jbourne77

Originally posted by: heyheybooboo

Originally posted by: jbourne77

Originally posted by: heyheybooboo

Exhibit A:

Originally posted by: jbourne77

And to control inflation, Carter tried strongarming the Fed to bend to his will. Reagan got it under control, but he did it by simply getting the hell out of the way and letting the Fed do its job.

It is incumbent upon you to back up your fallacy which you clearly cannot.

Hey kid, it's not a fallacy just because you say so. The fact that you seem to think otherwise combined with the fact that all you do is troll around telling people they "fail" without giving any hint as to why you think so is precisely why I've gone no further with you. What would be the point; you're a child.

I agree I haven't presented much in terms of a case - no argument there - but you haven't even commenced a real discussion with me. Jimmy Carter interfered with Paul Volcker and the Fed; he in effect tried to make the Fed an arm and tool of the Executive Branch, and this prevented the Fed from doing its job. I'm prepared to go into this as deeply as you'd like, but you need to meet me halfway. Try actually engaging in a discussion rather than firing off one-liners from the hip and then accusing others of lack of thought. Get real. If you think the history is false or you disagree with the case-effect relationship I've described, tell me why and we can get a real back-and-forth going.

But you're not prepared for a real discussion and/or you're ignorant of the subject, so like I said earlier, fuck off.

You are a liar.

At least you've put in enough thought to change your mantra from one baseless, juvenile insult to another. Once again, you've proven you have nothing of value to add to what has otherwise been a rather civil discussion.

Thanks for showing us all what you're made of .

Oh, and I can back up JBourne77 on this if you like booboo.

 

[soccerballtux]

Originally posted by: BigDH01

Originally posted by: jbourne77

Originally posted by: heyheybooboo

Originally posted by: jbourne77

Originally posted by: heyheybooboo

Exhibit A:

Originally posted by: jbourne77

And to control inflation, Carter tried strongarming the Fed to bend to his will. Reagan got it under control, but he did it by simply getting the hell out of the way and letting the Fed do its job.

It is incumbent upon you to back up your fallacy which you clearly cannot.

Hey kid, it's not a fallacy just because you say so. The fact that you seem to think otherwise combined with the fact that all you do is troll around telling people they "fail" without giving any hint as to why you think so is precisely why I've gone no further with you. What would be the point; you're a child.

I agree I haven't presented much in terms of a case - no argument there - but you haven't even commenced a real discussion with me. Jimmy Carter interfered with Paul Volcker and the Fed; he in effect tried to make the Fed an arm and tool of the Executive Branch, and this prevented the Fed from doing its job. I'm prepared to go into this as deeply as you'd like, but you need to meet me halfway. Try actually engaging in a discussion rather than firing off one-liners from the hip and then accusing others of lack of thought. Get real. If you think the history is false or you disagree with the case-effect relationship I've described, tell me why and we can get a real back-and-forth going.

But you're not prepared for a real discussion and/or you're ignorant of the subject, so like I said earlier, fuck off.

You are a liar.

At least you've put in enough thought to change your mantra from one baseless, juvenile insult to another. Once again, you've proven you have nothing of value to add to what has otherwise been a rather civil discussion.

Thanks for showing us all what you're made of .

Carter appointed Volcker in 1979, less than 2 years before Reagan took office. Volcker had prime to 20% shortly afterwards.

Reagan usually gets credit for lowering interest rates and reducing inflation but, if anything, Volcker deserves the real credit.

This. All this.

 

[ICRS]

If waitstaff was making 9.50 an hour before tip, would any of you still tip?

I really do hope they remove this archaic law that allows 2 dollar wages to these people. IT DOES NOTHING to lower the cost of food. Here in California our resturants don't cost anymore than places on east coast yet we are required to pay all waitstaff $8 before any tip.

 

[SagaLore]

Originally posted by: Craig234
Read some facts, then post. There are decades of research in studies showing that the wages at that level are such a small part of the economy, the inflationary effect is negligible, and the increase, because poor people spend all their income, has benefits to the economy as well.

Basically, there's the truth, summarized in my post, and there are myths put out to attack minimum wage increases because the owners can't get cheap enough labor.

Sorry, my mistake, thought this was an open forum where everyone can offer their opinion and observations based on their socioeconomic perspective. I'll be sure to agree with everything you say. We really should rename this site to Craig234tech.com.

 

[Craig234]

Originally posted by: soccerballtux

Democrats are the worse arguers ever, they never source anything, just make more ridiculous claims.

No, actually, you are wrong - no big surprise there. I have posted at length on the minimum wage, and sourced studies.

Sometimes I spend the hours to do that, and sometimes I respond to a fact-free assertion by people like you with a summary of the results, a reference to earlier posts.

Why don't you post *your* in-depth studies for a change? It's your turn, but you won't, you'll just make your ignroatn attack and leave it at that.

You are not in a position to say someone is not arguing right.

Had you done the basic research, you would not be saying what you say.

 

[Craig234]

Originally posted by: chess9

Originally posted by: Ronstang

Originally posted by: Genx87

Originally posted by: KK
Good, I wish they would raise it even higher. Say in the 22.43 to 22.78 range. How can a family of 8 live off of 9 dollars an hour. I mean the 7 kids will go hungry, maybe it would help if daddy was around, but he's in jail for armed robbery of the package store two doors down.

How did they do it 40 years ago on 2 bucks an hour? Raising it to 22.43 will only raise the poverty line to 22.43 an hour. Are you under the impression all things stay the same after you triple the minimum wage? If so why not make us all millionaires and dictate companies need to pay us 1 million a year?

Democrats apply the concept of "ceteris paribus" to everything they analyze. They are foolish enough to believe they can control things and that people's behavior does not change when conditions change. It amazes me that they always think that they can simply raise taxes on those doing well and rake in tons of cash when the minute they do people like me change our business plans to make sure we keep as much of our money as possible. Unfortunately Democrats are either blind or evil since they always hurt the people they claim to be trying to help the most. EVERYONE is tax averse you idiots. I guess no Democrat ever studied or maybe they just failed to understand the wage-price spiral effect.

So, Nobel Laureate Stieglitz is an idiot?

-Robert

Ronstang, you are a member of the right-wing cult - your ideology is intense and wrong.

Let's just take one egregious error:

...they always hurt the people they claim to be trying to help the most.

So, liberals in passing the 40-hour work week hurt workers they were trying to help. In passing social security (which lowered elder poverty from 90% to 10%) they hurt the elderly they were trying to help. In passing Medicare they hurt the poor they were trying to get care for. In the 1960's war on poverty that permanently lowered the percent of Americans below the poverty line by a third, they hurt the poor. In trying to help consumers with consumer protection laws, they hurt them. And so on.

Your claim is outrageously perverse.

Of course you can find anecdotes where government programs backfire, but you are extremely wrong to call that the norm.

There's no getting through to you, though, I'm sure, you need right-wing detox.

 

[Craig234]

Originally posted by: SagaLore

Originally posted by: Craig234
Read some facts, then post. There are decades of research in studies showing that the wages at that level are such a small part of the economy, the inflationary effect is negligible, and the increase, because poor people spend all their income, has benefits to the economy as well.

Basically, there's the truth, summarized in my post, and there are myths put out to attack minimum wage increases because the owners can't get cheap enough labor.

Sorry, my mistake, thought this was an open forum where everyone can offer their opinion and observations based on their socioeconomic perspective. I'll be sure to agree with everything you say. We really should rename this site to Craig234tech.com.

Why don't you lecture us on brain surgery, next, then, because the forum is well served by people writing things they are utterly ignorant about.

We shouldn't rename the site to Craig234tech.com, we should rename it to worthlessinformationwherebeinginformedisanegative.com.

Your trying to change the subject from you having any standards for your posts to the simple 'right to post' is like when the KKK answers criticisms of what it chooses to say with statements about its right to free speech no one challenged. I did not say you can't say what you want, I was discussing the merit of your choice and judgement, which is the purpose of the forum as well, not to simply have no standards for what's right and what's wrong.

What would be the point in anyone further trying to inform you of anything when you say that you have no interest in the accurate information, you just want to say whatever?

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: Blueychan
The democrat party will become the socialist party in 20 years.

Why do they hate small businesses so much.

Awwwwwww you unhappy?

Good, hope you are packed and get your tickets out of here.

 

[SagaLore]

Originally posted by: Craig234
Why don't you lecture us on brain surgery,

I don't know anything about brain surgery. However, if you want my opinion of what people are like having had it, then sure, I'll give my observation on that.

Its not that I think any of your points are invalid, its that you come off as an elitist ass. I'm sure you've won arguments in other threads, but I haven't read those threads, so I can't assume you know what you're talking about just because you say so.

 

[Moonbeam]

I believe in personal responsibility and incentive. If he keeps raising the minimum wage I am going to be sorely tempted to get off welfare and get a job.

 

[SagaLore]

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
I believe in personal responsibility and incentive. If he keeps raising the minimum wage I am going to be sorely tempted to get off welfare and get a job.

LOL!

 

[NoShangriLa]

Wow, so many negative posts.

I think minimum wage in my province is $8.50, and KFC/Walmart paid at least $1.00 an hour over the minimum wage to attract employees.

IMHO, the high minimum wage hasn't lowered my purchasing power nor destroyed the local economy.

 

[soccerballtux]

Originally posted by: Craig234

Originally posted by: soccerballtux

Democrats are the worse arguers ever, they never source anything, just make more ridiculous claims.

No, actually, you are wrong - no big surprise there. I have posted at length on the minimum wage, and sourced studies.

Sometimes I spend the hours to do that, and sometimes I respond to a fact-free assertion by people like you with a summary of the results, a reference to earlier posts.

Why don't you post *your* in-depth studies for a change? It's your turn, but you won't, you'll just make your ignroatn attack and leave it at that.

You are not in a position to say someone is not arguing right.

Had you done the basic research, you would not be saying what you say.

2/10