Malogeek
Golden Member
Volta IS just CUDA+Tensor cores though. And it's huge. Double precision takes a lot of die space.
n0x1ous
Platinum Member
- Sep 9, 2010
- 2,572
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I know this is hard for you to understand, but not everyone that bought rtx cards bought them for rtx effects. At least for the 2080ti, the extra 30% over 1080ti was what was needed.
ub4ty
Senior member
- Jun 21, 2017
- 749
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The 1080ti was a horrible value and so is the 2080ti (even moreso) which is why only 1-3% own it. It's not hard for me to understand as I work in the industry and sit in product meetings where price segments are decided. The high end is most always garbage value... and the consumers who buy it sold on marketing moreso than anything else. You'll argue different and the marketing/business groups will laugh at you.
97% of the market disagrees with you and that doesn't even include the massive amount of people playing on consoles w/ far less graphics capabilities. You spent lots of money on hardware. Congrats, the broader market doesn't care.
It's amazing what type of reality the 1-3% subscribe to...
n0x1ous
Platinum Member
- Sep 9, 2010
- 2,572
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So then I should buy a 1050ti and run my 4k monitor at 720p according to you? No of course not! You will say that 4k monitors are for sheep and have no value! How dare anyone want higher pixel density! If only these 1% could conform to everyone else....
I should probably pull out my old Sony trinitron TV since these new fangled flat panels are just for the 1%ers. /s
You are in the wrong forum pal with your love of pleb resolution, framerate and experience.
Most cant justify the cost or afford it to begin with.
Most people i know have high end PCs by one metric or another.
Consoles are for kids.
I dont need marketing to feel the benefits of 120 fps gsync 1440p or M.2 SSD speeds and 5ghz processing power.
A gaming PC is a minor cost compared to its useful life. I know people who suffer PC gaming on old crappy and even faulty hardware. Its not fun.
ub4ty
Senior member
- Jun 21, 2017
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The 1% never fail to impress.. you're either 4k gaming w/ a 2080ti or you're a pleb.
Literally 99% of the gaming market... the real enthusiast are plebs according to you.. ROFLCOPTER
I can't imagine what you think of the console gamer market...
Appeal to extremes is a bad way to win an argument btw.
Low, mid, high end.. You get screwed at either extreme. The value is almost always in the middle. 1080/1440p until pricing gets under control is what the mid/mid-high end settled on. Business Dev usually understands this about the market and positions the best value as such. Meanwhile, in the 'take my money I want 4k gaming' segment is where the fleecing occurs because its understand you give zero attention to value and will pay anything... which is why they go to town on you (I can't blame em).
Amazing how this elitist attitude wasn't present in computing some time ago before it went mainstream.
What great things get added when Mainstream consumers toss their hat into a market.
Anywhere from the low kdr noob w/ $5k worth gaming hardware who claims he's OP because he's got 10ms less latency to the 4k or pleb "enthusiast".
Consoles are for kids....
The nose is pointed sky high.
I know people who suffer PC gaming on old crappy and even faulty hardware
Ohh the humanity... whatever will a 1440p gamer do... such pleb tier
1080p is literal torture ....
Delusions of grandeur spawned from a lack of connection with the reality the majority of people live in and enjoy and a desperate need to try to segment out and claim elite status at some laugh worthy tier. Meanwhile, I log into my favorite FPS and some poor pleb @1080p is r0asting the living pants off 4k elite status pro everyday of the week... I inquire and the squeaker whose ranked #1 on the server replies that he's on poverty tier hardware because he spent his allowance on chicken tendies...
the absolute state of the 1%. Ferrari's driving 35mph to get groceries on weekends.
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You seem to fail to understand its not about winning.
Most high end gamers don't chase the top 1% and we certainly left 1080p behind a long time ago.
Could I spend double on a new pc for the last bits of performance.. Of course.
But that is not what it's about. It's about not compromising the fun and enjoyment to save money and making gaming fun no matter how good you are.
In the days of £1000 iPhones a good pc isn't that expensive now.
DeathReborn
Platinum Member
- Oct 11, 2005
- 2,786
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It's all gone Pete Tong in here, pleb this, elitist that... kinda makes me think this thread would now fit in at P&N.
I am happy with my 2080's, a good upgrade from ageing 290 4GB's (gave the 1070's to my nephews). Oh and I got them with 20% staff discount so didn't hurt the upgrade budget much at all.
I am happy with my 2080's, a good upgrade from ageing 290 4GB's (gave the 1070's to my nephews). Oh and I got them with 20% staff discount so didn't hurt the upgrade budget much at all.
That bf5 rtx perf even at lowest setting is a unmitigated disaster.
Little to no visual benefit
Performance is so pathetic its not usable
Dx12 version that rtx requires is still a stuttering mess in bf
Worst showcase ever. Everything went wrong.
Even if they invented a ultra low setting (who cares anyway one can say) it wouldnt run fast enough and dx12 would still stutter.
Good i cancelled my 2080 and 2080ti a month ago or so. These results would have made me explode. Lol.
Little to no visual benefit
Performance is so pathetic its not usable
Dx12 version that rtx requires is still a stuttering mess in bf
Worst showcase ever. Everything went wrong.
Even if they invented a ultra low setting (who cares anyway one can say) it wouldnt run fast enough and dx12 would still stutter.
Good i cancelled my 2080 and 2080ti a month ago or so. These results would have made me explode. Lol.
n0x1ous
Platinum Member
- Sep 9, 2010
- 2,572
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What you aren't getting is that value is not the only thing that matters and winning in competitive FPS games isn't all that matters. People play other games for other reasons like RPGS or action adventure games and single player gamers just for immersion and fun. Also no one here in this forum cares what the common consumer market does or buys. This forum is for hardware enthusiast who by nature will gravitate toward the higher end. Which explains why you posting in here makes no sense since you seem to hate high end hardware
n0x1ous
Platinum Member
- Sep 9, 2010
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While I agree that RTX isn't ready yet and bfv is not the best type of game to start with here, go check out digital foundry's analysis today and interview with Dice. Apparently there are plenty of bugs with the current implementation and dice expects performance to improve a lot once they get things straightened out.
ub4ty
Senior member
- Jun 21, 2017
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After 45 pages of commentary and many other threads leading up to this one which is about Geforce Turing, it's clear that all the sensible Hardware Enthusiast understand Turing to be a disaster w/o value... But according to a small but vocal minority, I'm supposed to shut up and praise any silly old beta level prototype Nvidia drops out of the back of the trailer whom is still hiring significantly in the RTX team to develop the software stack. Yeah no buddy. This is a hardware enthusiast forum. See my profile Pic. That doesn't mean I buy overpriced overhyped products I can't even tell a difference from regarding RTX ON/OFF. Enthusiast != consumer. Enthusiast means you care deeply about the hardware, have technical understanding and can share critiques about a product for good/bad. Enthusiast doesn't mean you like tossing money at the most costly product. So, clearly what makes no sense is this product and those that continue to try to claim some unworldly experience when running higher tier hardware. It's not there. Sorry.. especially w/ these dumpster tier games that are being released lately. Maybe if you start talking about something like Cyperpunk 2077, you have an argument. However, it's not out yet.
I've been playing battlefield since the first one came out. They're all the same no matter how much lipstick they put on it. I don't need a 2080ti to have a wonderful experience playing the game. That being said, everyone's playing PuBG and CS:go for the most part.... and fortnite at that. A game doesn't have to be a performance hog to be immersive or fun. The consensus is also out on that. As opposed to the CPU section which focuses on enthusiast technical details and discussions the vocal minority here just seem to want to rant about 4k gaming being a necessity and everyone else being a pleb. There's nothing about being an enthusiast concerning that.
When you get nailed in a corner you jump from one topic to another claiming the enthusiast title. I absolutely destroyed the idea that insanely priced hardware makes you a better gamer and the idea that buying a 2080ti makes you a gaming enthusiast. Now you're claiming its not about being a gaming enthusiast.. it's about being a hardware enthusiast... even though there's absolutely zero technical discussions about the hardware..
Please. What makes no sense is the vocal minority speaking from an elitist platform. I can go to other places on the internet and hardware enthusiast are talking about Graphics pipelines, micro-architectures, innovative applications of new architectural features. I don't see any of that here.. So excuse me for revoking the claim of being a 'hardware enthusiast'. Money can buy you lots of things in this world. It doesn't buy you an 'enthusiast' title.
n0x1ous
Platinum Member
- Sep 9, 2010
- 2,572
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pretty sure people discuss graphics architecture here but even if they didn't it wouldn't matter. You can care and be interested in something without being an expert on it. Can you buy a nice car without knowing everything about how it works and enjoy it? Yeah I think so. You've made it pretty clear you don't like what is discussed here or the people that post so why keep subjecting yourself to ranting of the horrible 1%ers? Also no where did I claim people get competitive advantages from high end gpu's. They do offer higher framerates and higher resolutions though and that is nice. You may not care but some people clearly do. The car analogy you mentioned with the Ferrari is fitting. Should everyone in the world only buy toyota camry's or ford fusions because they are the best value?
Good to hear but I don't beliewe it.
Mantle was working for about 3 or 4 months or so in bf4 and only for 3gb cards. The rest of the time it stuttered. Bf1 and bf5 dx12 implementation is a mess and never worked at any time. They have had about 4 years to make the engine work.
I think we need a new gen of consoles for them to renew it properly.
Until then it doesn't matter if dice can fix rtx.
They said two months ago they would implement lower settings.
Now we have it.
It works in low. Very much so vs ultra. But performance is still useless.
We need 100% increase plus even for low setting!
It's not going to happen.
Now you can say you can just play without. Yes. No problem. Fine.
But then perf for aftermarket stock oc cards 1080ti vs 2080ti is like what 15-20% for game like bf5? For 1.5 year progress.
I hope amd and Intel get back or into this dgpu highend business. We need it.
My TV actually is an old Sony (720p/1080i). I've looked at 4K, but want HDR and FALD. I also hate "smart" TVs. I've settled for streaming on my computer monitors instead.
Here's a fully-reflective floor from Unreal:
This was possible 20 years ago, on a software-rendered Pentium 166MMX.
Now we have small patches of reflective mud reducing a $1200 graphics card to 25% of its performance, and this special mud requires the failure that is DX12 running on metrosexual OS(tm).
Something's very wrong here, people.
Where are you getting this is "fully reflected"? It's just a projection, not even real time. Easy to do when you don't have any actual dynamic lighting to work with and just procedural textures. Even 2D games had this kind of "reflections" back then.
Did you even stop and think about how today's Unreal Engine 4 handles "reflections"? "The Reflection Environment works by capturing the static scene at many points and reprojecting it onto simple shapes like spheres in reflections. Artists choose the capture points by placing ReflectionCapture Actors. Reflections update in realtime during editing to aid in placement but are static at runtime. " Even today's modern Unreal engine isn't "fully reflected".
IntelUser2000
Elite Member
- Oct 14, 2003
- 8,686
- 3,786
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Of course not.
But they can surely help. Soon they'll be putting 16 cores for mainstream. Offload some to the GPU and some to the CPU.
How much of that is actual work? You can make it use all 8 threads, but if it doesn't use it properly, it doesn't matter. I saw a benchmark for a game that scaled well in performance with multiple cores. The problem was, for the image quality the performance sucked. So for that game, the whole multi-threaded optimization was pointless anyway.
n0x1ous
Platinum Member
- Sep 9, 2010
- 2,572
- 248
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hard to a find a TV without any smart features even at the low end. have you considered oled? peak brightness isnt as high as LCD but no need to worry about backlight zones.
n0x1ous
Platinum Member
- Sep 9, 2010
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Fair enough. But I expect that 15-20% (closer to 30% to be fair) to turn into 40-50% as CAS and DLSS get adopted and more games use HDR which hurts pascal. I'll take any increase I can get at 4k lol.
I did at one time. Unfortunately, recently retiring hammered my disposable income.
ub4ty
Senior member
- Jun 21, 2017
- 749
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You can be something but don't claim to be something you're not is the moral of the story.
Don't try out one corner of your mouth to diminish 99% of a market from an elitist platform then feign like you're all about the community and the true nature of being an enthusiast. Per your words, 99% of gamers are plebs. This is laughable and shows the nature of the commentary coming from people who toss money at the high end only to reflect that they can do so. I said the 1% are a vocal minority. If you've been in this thread and others, the lionshare of people think Geforce Turing is a turd and the prices are horrible. So, I'm not subjecting myself to the rants of the 1%.. You're the minority here and in other places as spoken by raw numbers.
The car analogy is fitting.. So let me clarify... If you buy a Ferrari only to drive 35mph up and down the street on weekends in order to get groceries, it doesn't make you Michael Schumacher. The assertion that you are because you bought a "Ferrari" is laughable. The assertion that 99% of people are plebs having pleb experiences because they don't have a Ferrari is laughable. Once you take that Ferrari to a track and beat a car enthusiast with an S2000 that knows how to drive one properly and knows his car in and out then we can talk about the man behind the machine.
Being 1% on paper translates nowhere outside of your home. No one knows your spec sheet or cares on a server and the lionshare are on pleb/poverty tier hardware. My commentary doesn't come from a sentiment of feeling suffered by the occasional outlandish commentary that comes from people who spend a lot of money on things but know little about them nor use them to their fullest.. It comes from finding it highly laughable and absurd.
The most hilarious and laughable of them all is some delusional idea that someone's jealous because they can't afford something only to often be proven wrong when the range of hardware is referenced. So, over-all... Come back to reality. No one's buying the absurd assertions.
Turing is a turd ... Months after launch and still no one can say for sure how it performs.
By the time they iron out all of the bugs and get the software spec right, 7nm GPUs will be here.
If anything, I'd like to send a heartfelt thnx from the 99% for being loyal beta testers and subsidizers. Without you, who knows where us poor plebs would be.
*Shuffles thousands of dollars of Pascal GPUs around in the background because pleb
ub4ty
Senior member
- Jun 21, 2017
- 749
- 898
- 96
https://www.avsforum.com/
For your audio/visual needs.
There are a number of TVs w/o invasive technology in them.
If you have issue w/ the media center module, just don't configure wifi on it.
It's really not that serious at the end of the day. The big issue was w/ the Camera/Microphone TVs.
I'm running on a beautiful plasma until OLEDs drop to reasonable prices.
I bought high end LCD tvs and returned them all after the horrid picture quality in normal home conditions.
I happened across Plasmas in the Magnolia center before they were discounted and was stunned at the picture.
That being said, I get lazy sometimes and watch a lot of content on a basic 27" IPS or my laptop.
It's been years since I've been on avsforum. I'll have to see if my account is still active. Thanks.
n0x1ous
Platinum Member
- Sep 9, 2010
- 2,572
- 248
- 106
You act like you're some great representative of the masses of v&g yet you are pretty new here. You put words in my mouth every post. Talking to you is pointless. We're done here.
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