Nvidia Kepler Yields Lower Than Expected –CEO. Fermi 2.0?

[SirPauly]

Being loud and proud last time didn't work, better to keep quiet until they catch up and not build up unreasonable hype just to let some people with wild expectations down again.

That is a fair view. I believe the eerily quiet is because nVidia desires to keep the data real close and may surprise. Time will tell.

 

[tviceman]

I think they're are doing the right thing by staying quiet this time when they have no product ready. Being loud and proud last time didn't work, better to keep quiet until they catch up and not build up unreasonable hype just to let some people with wild expectations down again.

Agreed.

 

[SirPauly]

It's actually very important that if they ARE trying to be sneaky/deceitful/etc that they put out statements that are quite ambiguous and open to interpretation. If they say "We expect to be shipping for revenue in Q3" that could mean that they calculate a 50.1% chance that they will send at least one unit to somebody somewhere and get paid for it in that period, but they really do expect that to come to pass. Not only can they get in trouble with the SEC or other regulatory agencies (unlikely as noted), but, much much more importantly, they can lose the trust of investors and analysts if they consistently make false/misleading statements.

They have to be careful what they say based on law suits from investors as well.

 

[AnandThenMan]

That is a severely misguided outlook. "It's inexcusable" ?? What is the "It's" ?. A lot of people will have us believe that Kepler is late because Tahiti launched already. That isn't the case at all. Nvidia is beating to it's own drum as I have said before. It was also rumored (no idea if it's true or not) that Tahiti was brutally rushed to market by AMD. I don't know if people can attest or are willing to attest to that and quality of launch drivers or lack thereof? I have no idea so I'll leave it to others to confirm or debunk on their own accord. As far as Kepler's tardiness? That is a fabrication.

You have anything to back up what I bolded? Anything? Your entire post is just a veiled attempt at FUD, I thought you were above this kind of crap.

Either way, anyone that doesn't think that Kepler is late is living in a dream world. Nvidia doesn't march to the tune of their own drummer, they march to the tune of the marketplace. The fact that AMD is selling 28nm product and Nvidia is not is a fabrication? No, Nvidia is late because their competitor beat them to the punch, that is how you define late. End of.

 

[AnandThenMan]

They have to be careful what they say based on law suits from investors as well.

If JHH can stand up in front of everyone and outright lie about a card he is holding in his hand, there is little chance anything else he says is going to end up in court.

 

[SirPauly]

How is AMD's current 79x0 pricing "uncompetitive"? Aren't they priced very much in line with the card's performance increase over gtx 580 1.5 gb? If you're comparing AMD's current pricing with its pricing in the past few releases then yes, it is much higher than we typically see from one of their launches. But couldn't that just be because (unfortunately to us) they finally have somebody at the helm who realizes that you don't "make it up in volume"?

And I don't think that intel has aliens on their side, though I wouldn't be surprised to hear it, either.



HUH? Maybe purple aliens will suddenly drop out of the sky and offer us tea and truffles this afternoon as well, but I don't think that will happen, either. Your first sentence is entirely possible, I'd even say that it's likely, but then you ruined it with the 2nd one. Nvidia consistently uses larger dies on their gpus, so isn't it more likely that, like last time, they're just having to work out some issues with their current dies? Did you even read IDC's posts on pgs 1-2 in this thread?

Why not? They redefined price/performance with Fermi.

 

[Lonyo]

If JHH can stand up in front of everyone and outright lie about a card he is holding in his hand, there is little chance anything else he says is going to end up in court.

Actually, it can end up court. If investors think they have had losses caused by JHH making misleading statements, they can sue.
In a conference call where he's replying directly to investors to answer questions they have asked, you can be pretty damned sure that what he says in that conference call can be taken to court if it was indeed misleading and causes harm to the investors.

 

[SirPauly]

If JHH can stand up in front of everyone and outright lie about a card he is holding in his hand, there is little chance anything else he says is going to end up in court.

It was a mock up he was holding -- a representation -- the early fermi hardware was running the demo he was talking about.

 

[AtenRa]

Does anyone remember where this slide came from ?? I cant verify if it was a legit NV slide or not.

 

[AnandThenMan]

Actually, it can end up court.

It can, but rarely does. But I understand your point perfectly.

It was a mock up he was holding -- a representation -- the early fermi hardware was running the demo he was talking about.

Can you prove that? You posted a video of the presentation saying at the 5:00 mark you can see the hardware. But all you saw was a simulation, I questioned you about it but you never responded.

What he held up was NOT Fermi, a mock up is not a real product. Everyone knows that which is why people make fun of that stunt to this day.

 

[Stuka87]

How many people here believe that Kepler was supposed to launch with Tahiti on January 9th 2012? Raise your hands. Because all this talk of Kepler being late is kind of BS. Kepler is on it's OWN schedule and has NOTHING to do with AMD's schedule. I hope this is realized sooner than never. There are no official launch dates and never were in the past to give anyone the notion that Kepler is late. So stop acting like it is. Kepler gets here when it is good and ready. That is all. hehe.

Dude, this is so wrong its not even funny. nVidia has to march to the pace of the marketplace or they wills imply go out of business.

Ask the former 3Dfx exec's what happens when you march to your own drum instead of that of the industry.

The fact that nVidia has not so much as mentioned a launch date means IMHO that they are not close enough to be able to nail a time frame down yet. AMD announced a launch period back in September (Or pretty sure it was september). Yes, they did end up only doing a aper launch in december, but the product did ship within 3 weeks of that launch. So they were late to what they said.

But nVidia has not even mentioned a launch time frame to my knowledge. And feel free to correct me on that if you have direct quotes stating otherwise. But the fact is, if they were getting ready to launch inside 2 months, they would have mentioned it. And it would give investors something to be happy about. And without happy investors, the company will not survive for long.

 

[AnandThenMan]

Why not? They redefined price/performance with Fermi.

They did?

 

[SirPauly]

It can, but rarely does. But I understand your point perfectly.

Can you prove that? You posted a video of the presentation saying at the 5:00 mark you can see the hardware. But all you saw was a simulation, I questioned you about it but you never responded.

What he held up was NOT Fermi, a mock up is not a real product. Everyone knows that which is why people make fun of that stunt to this day.

http://www.xbitlabs.com/news/graphi...irst_Graphics_Cards_on_Track_for_Q4_2009.html

 

[SirPauly]

They did?

Why do you do things like that? There was the GTX 470, GTX 460 and many other Fermi derivatives that provided strong performance/value.

 

[notty22]

Look where the 7970 ends up ?
Halo cards are never the best bang for the buck leaders in a database.

 

[Imouto]

Look where the 7970 ends up ?

Aside GTX 580 1.5 Gigs lol?

 

[Keysplayr]

You have anything to back up what I bolded? Anything? Your entire post is just a veiled attempt at FUD, I thought you were above this kind of crap.

Either way, anyone that doesn't think that Kepler is late is living in a dream world. Nvidia doesn't march to the tune of their own drummer, they march to the tune of the marketplace. The fact that AMD is selling 28nm product and Nvidia is not is a fabrication? No, Nvidia is late because their competitor beat them to the punch, that is how you define late. End of.

What in the name of hell are you talking about? Above "what" kind of crap?
Are you itching again?

 

[Grooveriding]

Mid-range is where you find performance/$, not high end. This argument is getting so tired it should of keeled over long ago. You want performance/$, you buy a mid-range card or you wait a few years. This is probably the best price/performance card on the market right now.

If you're someone who is die hard nvidia and only buy their stuff and are waiting for Kepler, I would buy that EVGA card and do a step-up to their 6XX card. Of course they would have to release it before May 18th Which could easily not happen.

 

[moriz]

What in the name of hell are you talking about? Above "what" kind of crap?
Are you itching again?

About the part that the 7900 series are "rushed". In my experiences, short of ccc being bad, which is nothing new, the card and drivers are in perfect working order. There's no indication that they are rushed.

 

[Obsoleet]

I hope this isn't taken the wrong way but honestly.. I think AMD is slaying Nvidia in the standalone GPU market. I've been on Radeons since the 4870 series, when they had HDMI output with audio long before Nvidia did, then the 1st DX11 card. I bought the 5870 on launch day and have never regretted it. If I needed a new card I'd pickup a 7000series Radeon hands-down, and not wait 1 day for Kepler.
While I have little interest in Nvidia anymore because AMD has been providing the goods for quite some time for me.. but they need to get something out now, not later to compete with the 7000 series. That said, who really cares anymore with the Radeon lineup as good as it is and has been for years now.

I'm more excited about the next RADEON more than what Nv has on the way. That's not fanboy speak that's just the damn truth for a lot of us anymore.

 

[Lonyo]

I hope this isn't taken the wrong way but honestly.. I think AMD is slaying Nvidia in the standalone GPU market. I've been on Radeons since the 4870 series, when they had HDMI output with audio long before Nvidia did, then the 1st DX11 card. I bought the 5870 on launch day and have never regretted it. If I needed a new card I'd pickup a 7000series Radeon hands-down, and not wait 1 day for Kepler.
While I have little interest in Nvidia anymore because AMD has been providing the goods for quite some time for me.. but they need to get something out now, not later to compete with the 7000 series. That said, who really cares anymore with the Radeon lineup as good as it is and has been for years now.

I'm more excited about the next RADEON more than what Nv has on the way. That's not fanboy speak that's just the damn truth for a lot of us anymore.

All depends on who adds the features you are most interested in.
I'm not interested in 3D anything, so I don't care that NV has better 3D support.
I'm not interested in the handful of PhysX games.

I have an HTPC with an AMD graphics card which outputs my audio and video.
I'm setting up a second PC for racing games, using 3 monitors in Eyefinity. Something I did years ago on a 7800GT and 7200GS (gaming across 3 monitors), and now AMD has given me the ability to do it from one graphics card.

Like you, I find what AMD have added more interesting than what NV has added, while other people care more about features NV are better at/with. Doesn't mean one is better or worse at adding new things, but you can be biased based on what they have added, if it's more in tune with your desires.

 

[Madcatatlas]

I think in this case, the best news for Nvidia is NO news. The big talk of last time with a failed 580 was just such a letdown for very many people. And despite the efforts of those with preferances like sirpauly and notty, in general people did not wait, but went out and bought the 5870, enjoying 7 months of premium dx11 graphics with a low price.

I have no doubt that Nvidia will be launching a GPU to battle AMDs Radeons, but lets not be silly like some seem to be, they are late to the fight again.

What is more interesting though is this: who will win the midrange performance fight? will it be the 7870 or will it be some mythical as of yet unheard of ... 660 ti part?
Just look at my sig, i dislike Nvidia to hell and back, but still buy based on price performance.

What in the name of hell are you talking about? Above "what" kind of crap?
Are you itching again?

Why am i not surprised to see you making snide, derogatory comments about someone with a different view than yours. What is this itching, is it related to hardware fever? or are you insinuating he is some kind of dog? Are you itching for the same thing you are asking him about Keysplayr?

 

[Keysplayr]

I think in this case, the best news for Nvidia is NO news. The big talk of last time with a failed 580 was just such a letdown for very many people. And despite the efforts of those with preferances like sirpauly and notty, in general people did not wait, but went out and bought the 5870, enjoying 7 months of premium dx11 graphics with a low price.

I have no doubt that Nvidia will be launching a GPU to battle AMDs Radeons, but lets not be silly like some seem to be, they are late to the fight again.

What is more interesting though is this: who will win the midrange performance fight? will it be the 7870 or will it be some mythical as of yet unheard of ... 660 ti part?
Just look at my sig, i dislike Nvidia to hell and back, but still buy based on price performance.





Why am i not surprised to see you making snide, derogatory comments about someone with a different view than yours. What is this itching, is it related to hardware fever? or are you insinuating he is some kind of dog? Are you itching for the same thing you are asking him about Keysplayr?

Stay out of it.

@AnandThenMan, expect PM.

 

[AtenRa]

NVIDIA 8800GTX 11/08/2006 vs ATI 2900XT 5/14/2007 (NVIDIA launched first)
NVIDIA 8800GT 10/29/2007 vs ATI HD3870 11/15/2007 (NVIDIA launched first)
NVIDIA GTX280 06/16/2008 vs ATI HD4870 6/25/2008 (NVIDIA launched first)
NVIDIA GTX285 1/15/2009 vs ATI HD4890 4/2/2009 (NVIDIA launched first)
NVIDIA GTX480 3/26/2010 vs ATI HD5870 9/23/2009 (AMD launched first)
NVIDIA GTX580 11/09/2010 vs AMD HD6970 12/15/2010 (NVIDIA launched first)
NVIDIA GTX680 00/00/2012 vs AMD HD7970 01/09/2012 (AMD launched first)

NVIDIA launched 5 times ahead of ATI/AMD in the last 7 GPU releases.

Edit: GTX580 11/09/2010

 

[Keysplayr]

NVIDIA 8800GTX 11/08/2006 vs ATI 2900XT 5/14/2007 (NVIDIA launched first)
NVIDIA 8800GT 10/29/2007 vs ATI HD3870 11/15/2007 (NVIDIA launched first)
NVIDIA GTX280 6/16/2008 vs ATI HD4870 6/25/2008 (NVIDIA launched first)
NVIDIA GTX285 1/15/2009 vs ATI HD4890 4/2/2009 (NVIDIA launched first)
NVIDIA GTX480 3/26/2010 vs ATI HD5870 9/23/2009 (AMD launched first)
NVIDIA GTX580 9/11/2010 vs AMD HD6970 12/15/2010 (NVIDIA launched first)
NVIDIA GTX680 00/00/2012 vs AMD HD7970 01/09/2012 (AMD launched first)

NVIDIA launched 5 times ahead of ATI/AMD in the last 7 GPU releases.

Wow, nice research there. This is, how did they put it, inexcusable?