NON_POLITICAL China Coronavirus THREAD

[Muse]

I can't read it from my phone due to paywall.

Does a NYT author honestly believe that Vietnam has had no cases? LOL!

The opinion piece did not say no cases, it said no deaths.

 

[Ichinisan]

I suppose a question is, why does the NYT report that and not register suspicion. Has anyone heard about Vietnam with respect to their handling of the pandemic? I assume they have had deaths. It's hard to imagine otherwise.

Yes. It's laughable to believe they don't have lots of cases and lots of deaths. Vietnam is still very poor compared to China, though their economy is set to boom.

 

[Ichinisan]

I always just hit "Stop" before it finishes loading.

Well, the article is describing a video that doesn't load when I stop the page from finishing.

 

[Muse]

Welp, Arizona's fucked. This morning tons of people out and about and I'd say less than 1/10th of them had masks. They'll put them on immediately before entering a store but literally see people grabbing door handles then moving their hand up to their mouth to put the mask over their face, and pulling it off literally while walking out the door (while other people just putting masks on are entering, and then standing and talking in groups outside (without wearing masks).

Remind me never to move to AZ. I have a cousin there, Phoenix I think. AFAIK, have never stepped into the state. My dad drove us through the west through national parks in around 1957, don't know if we hit AZ. We did NOT hit the Grand Canyon, which I figure every American should see if possible.

That kind of stupidity, well, obviously most people don't know too much about this. The epidemiology of covid-19 I find fascinating. Partly from the standpoint of self preservation. I have developed my own protocols for a lot of things. When I realized the importance of viral dose, it became much easier.

 

[Muse]

From NYTimes.com today:



If this isn't irony I don't know what is.

Opinion | ‘That’s Ridiculous.’ How America’s Coronavirus Response Looks Abroad. (Published 2020)

From lockdowns to testing, we showed people around the world the facts and figures on how the U.S. has handled the pandemic.

www.nytimes.com

The video is real good. Here's the text:

The United States leads the world in Covid-19 deaths, nearing 150,000 lost lives. The unemployment figures brought on by the pandemic are mind-boggling. The Trump administration’s slow and haphazard response has been widely criticized. But what does it look like to young people around the world, whose governments moved quickly and aggressively to contain the coronavirus?
We wanted to know, so we reached out to quite a few and showed them charts, facts, photos and videos illustrating the U.S. response. Spoiler: They were not impressed.
Many advanced economies, from Germany to Singapore, directly supplemented salaries to save jobs. Other nations with fewer resources started mass testing at the first sign of an outbreak. Many countries mandated universal lockdowns — and successfully flattened the curve. In some parts of Europe, you could be fined for straying too far from your home. And Vietnam, a nation of 95 million people, has not seen a single Covid-19 death.
This Opinion video is a follow-up to a popular video we produced last year, which asked young Europeans to respond to American policies such as health care and parental leave. Many comments suggested we produce a sequel. Well, here it is — the Covid-19 edition.

 

[K1052]

Johnson & Johnson has started US dosing in phase 1/2 trials for their viral vector vaccine.

 

[thestrangebrew1]

Newsom said the Central Valley is a new covid hot spot in CA. And yet our offices are still opened to the public. SMH. Our local leaders are so short-sighted.

 

[manly]

I've been saying this that it isn't a "leadership" problem.

You've been wrong about virtually everything in this thread for months, so why change up now?

On the topic of pro sports, national TV contracts are very lucrative for the big 3 U.S. sports leagues. MLB owners actually claim they lose money per regular season game played this season, but they are doing it to protect revenues from the lucrative playoffs. In short, they lose more money if they shut down a season entirely.

Because the players wouldn't concede more money than contractually obligated to, the MLB commissioner unilaterally enacted a farcical 60 game season (player pay is pro-rated over games played).

I suppose a question is, why does the NYT report that and not register suspicion. Has anyone heard about Vietnam with respect to their handling of the pandemic? I assume they have had deaths. It's hard to imagine otherwise.

From what I've seen/read, Vietnam is mostly believable w.r.t to their incredible Covid-19 outcome thus far. Not to compare an authoritarian regime to free states, but a couple other places have also done unbelievably well: Taiwan and New Zealand. To my knowledge, Vietnam doesn't suppress social media the same way China does, so there is some reporting out of Vietnam on what's going on. In general, SE Asia has done extremely well and nobody really knows why or how.

Newsom said the Central Valley is a new covid hot spot in CA. And yet our offices are still opened to the public. SMH. Our local leaders are so short-sighted.

Unfortunately you give them too much credit. Short-sighted implies they've done the cost/benefit analysis and have chosen a trade-off weighted towards the near term. In reality they're being ignorant and probably haven't even properly done the risk analysis.

 

[K1052]

Pfizer/BioNTech select vaccine candidate and move into phase 3. Better response in older people is v good indication since often vaccines aren't terribly effective in older immune systems. Regulatory submittal anticipated as early as October.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1287870381546594304

 

[Muse]

From what I've seen/read, Vietnam is mostly believable w.r.t to their incredible Covid-19 outcome thus far. Not to compare an authoritarian regime to free states, but a couple other places have also done unbelievably well: Taiwan and New Zealand. To my knowledge, Vietnam doesn't suppress social media the same way China does, so there is some reporting out of Vietnam on what's going on. In general, SE Asia has done extremely well and nobody really knows why or how.

Every video and picture I've been seeing of SE Asia has everyone wearing masks. I think that's as big a reason as any why they've done so well. The assholes in the USA who resist mask wearing need to have those pictures shoved in their face along with a few facts. But Trump doesn't have the balls. Or the savvy.

 

[Ichinisan]

You've been wrong about virtually everything in this thread for months, so why change up now?

On the topic of pro sports, national TV contracts are very lucrative for the big 3 U.S. sports leagues. MLB owners actually claim they lose money per regular season game played this season, but they are doing it to protect revenues from the lucrative playoffs. In short, they lose more money if they shut down a season entirely.

Because the players wouldn't concede more money than contractually obligated to, the MLB commissioner unilaterally enacted a farcical 60 game season (player pay is pro-rated over games played).


From what I've seen/read, Vietnam is mostly believable w.r.t to their incredible Covid-19 outcome thus far. Not to compare an authoritarian regime to free states, but a couple other places have also done unbelievably well: Taiwan and New Zealand. To my knowledge, Vietnam doesn't suppress social media the same way China does, so there is some reporting out of Vietnam on what's going on. In general, SE Asia has done extremely well and nobody really knows why or how.


Unfortunately you give them too much credit. Short-sighted implies they've done the cost/benefit analysis and have chosen a trade-off weighted towards the near term. In reality they're being ignorant and probably haven't even properly done the risk analysis.

There's simply no way Vietnam has controlled it. I've seen plenty of raw video showing how porous their border is (at least, with China). Also most of the country is incredibly poor and polluted. I was just watching an ADVchina vlog earlier today as they were driving through Vietnam and choking on the polluted air (most of their stuff was recorded last year before the vloggers came to USA).

Pretty sure Vietnam could do almost nothing to stop COVID from spreading uncontrollably. I assume anyone who suggests otherwise just isn't familiar with Vietnam (certainly can't be compared with Taiwan and New Zealand).

Maybe I'm wrong. I hope I'm wrong. I imagined it's like North Korea: getting ravaged while reporting nothing to the world.

 

[Ichinisan]

Every video and picture I've been seeing of SE Asia has everyone wearing masks. I think that's as big a reason as any why they've done so well. The assholes in the USA who resist mask wearing need to have those pictures shoved in their face along with a few facts. But Trump doesn't have the balls. Or the savvy.

Yeah. Maybe enforcing mask-wearing alone would be enough to severely diminish the spread. I got a mask while I was in Thailand in January and had to reuse it for a while because there were no masks in USA when I got back. I got lots of strange looks from people before most people realized this would be a panemic. I've been telling everyone that Americans just need to get over this aversion to masks.

 

[manly]

There's simply no way Vietnam has controlled it. I've seen plenty of raw video showing how porous their border is (at least, with China). Also most of the country is incredibly poor and polluted. I was just watching an ADVchina vlog earlier today as they were driving through Vietnam and choking on the polluted air (most of their stuff was recorded last year before the vloggers came to USA).

Pretty sure Vietnam could do almost nothing to stop COVID from spreading uncontrollably. I assume anyone who suggests otherwise just isn't familiar with Vietnam (certainly can't be compared with Taiwan and New Zealand).

Maybe I'm wrong. I hope I'm wrong. I imagined it's like North Korea: getting ravaged while reporting nothing to the world.

Vietnam recently had 4 confirmed cases in the resort city of Da Nang, and they immediately expelled 80,000 domestic tourists (presumably some thorough testing and quarantining would be involved as well). Few other countries go to such lengths, so how do you know they haven't effectively controlled the virus? There are ex-pats in Vietnam sharing their experiences on YouTube so if the bodies were piling up like in LATAM, I think we'd know. Vietnam does not have the Great Internet Firewall to any extent like China. Of course we have doubts that they have 0 deaths, but outbreaks would likely have been reported by now. Vietnam is not a black box like North Korea is.

As you said in the follow-up post, the general scientific consensus is that universal masking alone makes a huge difference in coronavirus transmission. As polluted as HCM City is, perhaps they already had a culture of mask wearing there (I'm not aware either way but it's likely considering the air pollution). Like I said, many countries in that general area have done well despite inadequate public health systems. And to be very clear, I wasn't comparing VN to Taiwan or NZ. My point is that there are a few countries that have done so well as to defy belief.

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

Vietnam recently had 4 confirmed cases in the resort city of Da Nang, and they immediately expelled 80,000 domestic tourists (presumably some thorough testing and quarantining would be involved as well). Few other countries go to such lengths, so how do you know they haven't effectively controlled the virus? There are ex-pats in Vietnam sharing their experiences on YouTube so if the bodies were piling up like in LATAM, I think we'd know. Vietnam does not have the Great Internet Firewall to any extent like China. Of course we have doubts that they have 0 deaths, but outbreaks would likely have been reported by now. Vietnam is not a black box like North Korea is.

As you said in the follow-up post, the general scientific consensus is that universal masking alone makes a huge difference in coronavirus transmission. As polluted as HCM City is, perhaps they already had a culture of mask wearing there (I'm not aware either way but it's likely considering the air pollution). Like I said, many countries in that general area have done well despite inadequate public health systems. And to be very clear, I wasn't comparing VN to Taiwan or NZ. My point is that there are a few countries that have done so well as to defy belief.

They also have a culture of being in small confined spaces with eachother in sweatshops and tiny ass apartment living. Whats your point?

You would have to be a complete bumbling idiot to think that countries like Vietnam have COVID19 contained. It's the same rationality (as Ichinisan pointed out) as suggesting that North Korea has it under control.

 

[Spacehead]

No idea if you can compare these countries but there seems to be some unknowns & some pretty low numbers in SE Asia.

Bangladesh
Confirmed - 226,225
Dead - 2,965
Tests - 1,124,417

Thailand
Confirmed - 3,295
Dead - 58
Tests - 685,316

Vietnam
Confirmed - 431
Dead - Unknown
Tests - 275,000

Myanmar
Confirmed - 350
Dead - 6
Tests - 111,425

Cambodia
Confirmed - 226
Dead - Unknown
Tests - 60,029

Laos
Confirmed - 20
Dead - Unknown
Tests - 25,875

https://ncov2019.live/data/asia

 

[Spacehead]

Latest word is the largest school district here will be open for in school classes as long as we remain in a green or yellow phase.

At least one of the local collages has re-thought in school classes & opted for online learning unless you're taking a class that requires hands-on learning.

 

[K1052]

Vietnam very aggressively confronted SARS in 2003. It is entirely conceivable they did it again.

 

[manly]

They also have a culture of being in small confined spaces with eachother in sweatshops and tiny ass apartment living. Whats your point?

You would have to be a complete bumbling idiot to think that countries like Vietnam have COVID19 contained. It's the same rationality (as Ichinisan pointed out) as suggesting that North Korea has it under control.

A bumbling idiot has a better track record in this thread than you've had. Vietnam doesn't have much in common with North Korea.

Vietnam very aggressively confronted SARS in 2003. It is entirely conceivable they did it again.

It's widely reported that an aggressive and coordinated response is exactly what they did; whether outsiders believe the outcome is up for some debate. But it's extreme hubris to think that because America fucked things up so badly, a poor country couldn't possibly have done so well and must be lying.

As an aside and recently reported by NYT, Thailand had one of the original COVID-19 cases that came from Wuhan. If their official numbers are accurate (keep in mind infections in all countries are massively underreported), then they've also done quite well at controlling outbreaks. But this story is far from over; many countries are dealing with new outbreaks and earlier success stories such as Australia have a mess on their hands currently.

 

[Svnla]

Imagine we do it here in the US, 80K people evacuated.

Vietnam to evacuate 80,000 tourists from Da Nang after three residents contract Covid-19

Vietnam is evacuating 80,000 tourists from the popular resort city of Da Nang after three residents tested positive for coronavirus, the government said.

www.cnn.com

I am still leery about the zero death claim from the government.

 

[Muse]

... But it's extreme hubris to think that because America fucked things up so badly, a poor country couldn't possibly have done so well and must be lying.

... this story is far from over; many countries are dealing with new outbreaks and earlier success stories such as Australia have a mess on their hands currently.

It is quite unfortunate that America is so prone to partisanship in the present time. It's been our undoing in this pandemic. If we can't sober up and face the facts (wear a mask, moron!) it's a bad lookout.

 

[Muse]

Pfizer/BioNTech select vaccine candidate and move into phase 3. Better response in older people is v good indication since often vaccines aren't terribly effective in older immune systems. Regulatory submittal anticipated as early as October.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1287870381546594304

They interviewed their medical expert Dr. John Torres tonight on NBC news. He said there will be several vaccines in play. Some will be better for some demographics, age groups, risk factors than others. There are over 25 vaccines in trials presently.

 

[manly]

Well, the article is describing a video that doesn't load when I stop the page from finishing.

I pulled out the video URL, and it doesn't appear to be behind the paywall. YMMV.

https://www.nytimes.com/video/opinion/100000007227777/covid-19-global-response.html

I haven't watched this one yet, but previous general news articles have already reported that numerous people around the world are stupefied at how badly the U.S. has fumbled the coronavirus football since day 1.

 

[PingSpike]

If I can keep this up I might not ever have to buy the crappy Ethyl alcohol stuff everyone is selling due to isopropyl shortages. You know... the kind the FDA keeps recalling due to denaturing toxins that can be absorbed through the skin... and it stinks terribly even when it isn't toxic.

Hmmm I might have some of this. My wife bought some generic sounding brand hand sanitizer and I used it bunch when I was out last weekend. Its smell was woody, reminded me of hamster cage bedding. Then I made the mistake of sniffing my hand with a glob of it on there and it about knocked me on my ass.

 

[brainhulk]

Hmmm I might have some of this. My wife bought some generic sounding brand hand sanitizer and I used it bunch when I was out last weekend. Its smell was woody, reminded me of hamster cage bedding. Then I made the mistake of sniffing my hand with a glob of it on there and it about knocked me on my ass.

FDA Says Reports of Methanol Poisoning From Hand Sanitizers Are Rising

Consumers were advised Monday to take care when shopping for and using hand sanitizer, with the U.S. Food and Drug Administration warning that reports of methanol poisoning from such products have continued to rise nationwide. A statement by the regulatory agency highlighted efforts to recall...

www.nbclosangeles.com

 

[Fanatical Meat]

@zinfamous you are smart with this stuff.
I had a small bottle of hand sanitizer I used up months ago when it was impossible to find hand sanitizer, the smell was very strong and very gag inducing.

Are people getting poisoned from the methanol by drinking it?
Seems like something that isn’t very skin permeable.

Edit: forgot to quote, see above