NON_POLITICAL China Coronavirus THREAD

[Ajay]

Thanks for that cdc data link. That's very interesting and supports the view of parents who don't think risk/reward of the covid vaccine is worth it for their kids. I can see why that data is not front page news. Because parents wouldn't vaccinate their kids if that data was common knowledge.

Teachers and schools want kids vaccinated because they don't want covid. It's not for the kids. It's for them. But it's going to be hard to convince people to vaccinate their kids if that cdc data is all we have. Because when I look at that cdc data, it says risk/reward is not there and maybe parents shouldn't vaccinate their kids. I think you can make case either way and you can't convince or force parents based on that weak data.

Children with long covid

Almost half of children who contract covid-19 may have lasting symptoms, which should factor into decisions on reopening schools, reports Helen Thomson

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

This is a U.K summary of ongoing studies and arising health concerns for children that are suffering from long term, post Covid-19 infection symptoms. Maybe you are happy with 'chancing' it, but, perhaps, you should dig a bit deeper an reconsider the possible risks to your children.

With respect to your second statement, please provide some evidence for your conjecture.

Ugh, forgot link...

 

[Zorba]

Children with long covid

Almost half of children who contract covid-19 may have lasting symptoms, which should factor into decisions on reopening schools, reports Helen Thomson

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

This is a U.K summary of ongoing studies and arising health concerns for children that are suffering from long term, post Covid-19 infection symptoms. Maybe you are happy with 'chancing' it, but, perhaps, you should dig a bit deeper an reconsider the possible risks to your children.

With respect to your second statement, please provide some evidence for your conjecture.

Ugh, forgot link...

It's always the teacher's unions fault, remember? How dare they not be willing to die for 35k/yr.

 

[njdevilsfan87]

I watched my wife rush my 2-year-old daughter to the ER with covid. She had severe headaches and could do nothing but scream. I remember briefly hiding from my eldest daughter so I could cry and process the fact that I had no idea what was going to happen to my child, and then I had to recompose myself and be strong for my eldest. She recovered, thank God, but she barely ate or drank anything for weeks because she said it all tasted "old." Who knows what the long-term effects will be.

This all before we had vaccines available to us, and this was not a delta infection.

If vaccines area available for kids, then fucking get them vaccinated.

In June we finally started 2 year old at day care. Between May and June, he got sick like 4-5 times almost all back-to-back. Then on July 4th we had to rush him to the ER a because of a rhinovirus that caused asthmatic bronchiolitis. It was one of the most traumatic things we had to go through. It's one thing to be older and understand you need to go to the hospital, but trying reasoning to your toddler that he needs and IV and oxygen tubes stuck up his nose. I cried as he screamed out for help to me while they were trying to get the IV in him.

He's recovered, but there's zero chance we're putting him back in daycare until a vaccine is available. We're also avoiding playgrounds, but instead are sticking to the community pools. It's less likely sick kids show up to the pool, plus there's chlorine. Otherwise, a full on lockdown is just mental insanity for everyone involved. It's doable up until about 2 years of age, and then a switch flips and unless you're fine with sitting them in front of a TV all day, it just gets more difficult by the day. As we enter cooler weather beyond October, I don't really know what we will do. Hopefully some vaccine is available by then for his age group.

 

[Svnla]

Companies are paying cold hard cash to employees to get the vaccine. Why can't I get some cash too..booohooo <sad panda>.

Vanguard will pay vaccinated workers $1,000 | CNN

In other news, S. Korea is saying it has 2 new cases of the "newer Delta" variance. Look like another "newer" mutation of covid. Good grief. Like we are living in a horror Hollywood movie.

.

 

[Muse]

I'm talking about kids under 18. There's no data I've seen anywhere that says kids under 18 are dying at elevated rate from covid. Is there even data available that compares covid death vs flu death for kids under 18? I want to see that data. Right now in many parents mind, risk of side effects and future unknown from covid shots are greater than risk of covid hospitalization and death from covid for their kids. And they might be right. We don't have the data to say they're right or wrong one way or other. Or we have the data and they're either withholding or haven't released it yet. Regardless, it's hard to fault the parents who haven't vaccinated their 12-17 year olds when you haven't given them good enough data and reason to vaccinate their kids.

What you (and those selfish-ass or ignorant parents) are missing is the monster issue here, the fact that anyone contracting the delta variant is infecting on average 7 other people! We need to deplete the vector population or we're in for a WORLD of hurt. This shit is as infectious as measles!


5 days ago — Experts think the COVID-19 Delta variant is much more contagious than the flu and chickenpox, and on par with the measles.

 

[Captante]

Not sure how anyone with any kind of common sense is arguing against the vaccine(s) for nearly everyone at this point and I'm REALLY getting tired of hearing the same nonsensical arguments based on flawed reasoning over and over.

I just told a guy I used to be friends with IRL off based on him advocating for GOP election and anti-vaccine conspiracy bullshit. The time to be calling out ALL misinformation directly AND loudly has come like it or not.

 

[jpiniero]

Can't comment on Houston because I've never been there.

Meanwhile everyone in NYC is trying to find the best spot for brunch.

Maybe not for long. I would worry about the moves by DiBasio is just a step to another lockdown. Looked at the vax rates and they are pretty high too.

 

[ponyo]

You are astoundingly bad at analyzing data if that's the conclusion you drew.

I see low death from covid in children in that cdc data. Basically little worse than the flu. We don't require kids to get the flu shots. You can say I'm heartless but that's what I see when I look at the cdc data.

 

[Roger Wilco]

In June we finally started 2 year old at day care. Between May and June, he got sick like 4-5 times almost all back-to-back. Then on July 4th we had to rush him to the ER a because of a rhinovirus that caused asthmatic bronchiolitis. It was one of the most traumatic things we had to go through. It's one thing to be older and understand you need to go to the hospital, but trying reasoning to your toddler that he needs and IV and oxygen tubes stuck up his nose. I cried as he screamed out for help to me while they were trying to get the IV in him.

He's recovered, but there's zero chance we're putting him back in daycare until a vaccine is available. We're also avoiding playgrounds, but instead are sticking to the community pools. It's less likely sick kids show up to the pool, plus there's chlorine. Otherwise, a full on lockdown is just mental insanity for everyone involved. It's doable up until about 2 years of age, and then a switch flips and unless you're fine with sitting them in front of a TV all day, it just gets more difficult by the day. As we enter cooler weather beyond October, I don't really know what we will do. Hopefully some vaccine is available by then for his age group.

Poor kiddo, that's terrifying. Happy to hear he's recovered, and happy to hear you are being cautious.

 

[MrSquished]

Can't comment on Houston because I've never been there.



Maybe not for long. I would worry about the moves by DiBasio is just a step to another lockdown. Looked at the vax rates and they are pretty high too.

So you can't parse very simple data? Are you unable to have any discussions about anywhere you have never personally visited before? That doesn't speak highly to your intellect and in fact seems like a serious mental deficiency. Or, it's just a terrible cop out for, I suspect, you prefer to help propagate this propaganda/misleading narrative. Houston is 3x deadlier than NYC, and yet there is no misinformed population that thinks Houstonites live in an a city of anarchy cowering in their homes or otherwise being murdered when they leave their homes. It's clear as day what is going on here.

There will be no lockdown in NYC unless some insane new variant comes out that defeats the vaccines. You don't have any idea of what you are talking about. Vaccine mandates for indoor dining are to help prod those who are not very anti vax, but just lazy or indifferent, to go get the vax. Get the vax, or enjoy less stuff around other people. Thus boosting the total vax rate to the range needed for herd immunity.

 

[manly]

You are astoundingly bad at analyzing data if that's the conclusion you drew.

He is the guy who said in May the pandemic is over and folks who choose to continue wearing masks were living life "scared."

 

[JujuFish]

You are astoundingly bad at analyzing data if that's the conclusion you drew.

This is the kind of response that only further keeps people stuck in their ways. It helps no one. It provides no information. It sets an aggressive and negative tone.

 

[jpiniero]

There will be no lockdown in NYC unless some insane new variant comes out that defeats the vaccines.

I can't say if DeBasio believes Delta is that variant; but that's what's being used as the reason to push the mandate. It's going to kill NYC tourism.

 

[Roger Wilco]

I see low death from covid in children in that cdc data. Basically little worse than the flu. We don't require kids to get the flu shots. You can say I'm heartless but that's what I see when I look at the cdc data.

Is death the only metric you are concerned about? What about long covid?

Vaccinating your kid against the flu is a very good idea, despite the fact that it isn't required. And if it were required, it would still be a good idea.

Not saying you are heartless, just that your logic is confusing.

 

[manly]

I took my vaccine a few months ago, but if the data really shows that a third shot significantly bolsters immunity, then I will probably try to figure out how to get one asap.

Honestly, ASAP is a bit premature. The data that exists shows neutralizing antibody levels produced by the mRNA vaccines to be pretty durable for about a year. We may need a booster shot down the line, but currently it would be a bit wasteful.

Source:

Researchers show neutralizing antibodies correlate with COVID protection

Antibodies produced by vaccines and infections declined at roughly similar rates.

arstechnica.com

 

[Roger Wilco]

Honestly, ASAP is a bit premature. The data that exists shows neutralizing antibody levels produced by the mRNA vaccines to be pretty durable for about a year. We may need a booster shot down the line, but currently it would be a bit wasteful.

Source:

Researchers show neutralizing antibodies correlate with COVID protection

Antibodies produced by vaccines and infections declined at roughly similar rates.

arstechnica.com

asap meaning as soon as CDC gives the OK. But then we have to consider all of the people around the world who are still waiting for their first shot while we mull our third shot upon ivory towers.

WHO calls for moratorium on vaccine booster shots; Los Angeles considering proof-of-vaccine requirements: COVID-19 updates

The highly contagious delta variants\u00a0now account\u00a0for more than 90% of new coronavirus infections across the U.S. Latest COVID-19 news.

www.usatoday.com

 

[Muse]

He is the guy who said in May the pandemic is over and folks who choose to continue wearing masks were living life "scared."

There are a few of those posting in these forums. A few come to mind but I won't name names.

 

[K1052]

Boosters are probably going to be recommended for the elderly and immunocompromised who don't mount a good response in the first place. They're mostly the people who are landing in hospitals alongside the unvaccinated. Doubtful for gen population unless something unusual happens.

 

[MrSquished]

I can't say if DeBasio believes Delta is that variant; but that's what's being used as the reason to push the mandate. It's going to kill NYC tourism.

It's actually pretty clear he doesn't believe that Delta is that variant, as the article below clearly shows that he realizes the vaccine is protecting people against Covid in all its current forms, as the vaccines are holding up well to Delta, but it is clear they want even more people to get the vaccines to get to that herd immunity number, and using the indoor vaccine mandate for dining as a big impetus for that. If on the fence or just lazy and aloof people have just not bothered to get jabbed, inconvenience can easily push them to get the shot. DeBlasio's goal is to get shots in arms:

https://www.amny.com/news/de-blasio-releases-covid-19-vaccination-data/



You should visit Houston, because apparently that's what has to happen for you to consider data why one major US city that has 3x the murder rate of another and higher murder increases gets .000001% of the coverage comparatively that creates a completely false narrative of life in one city vs the other. And this is duplicated over many other cities in the US.

 

[Torn Mind]

I see low death from covid in children in that cdc data. Basically little worse than the flu. We don't require kids to get the flu shots. You can say I'm heartless but that's what I see when I look at the cdc data.

This thing's mechanism is substantially different enough from the flu that vaccination may indeed be necessary. For the most part, the flu doesn't invade the lungs proper but rather give the sinuses, noses, and head a temporary whack. This, on the other hand, nukes lung tissue and possibly the heart as well.

There is a preciousness to children that is not extended to adults, so there will be mounting pressure as more kids die.

With that said, there is potential for vaccine complications with too great frequency as well.

I don't believe vaccination is particularly useful in stopping spread of Delta, just mitigating symptoms.

 

[Muse]

I can't say if DeBasio believes Delta is that variant; but that's what's being used as the reason to push the mandate. It's going to kill NYC tourism.

Which city would you prefer to visit? Houston or NYC?

 

[K1052]

I don't believe vaccination is particularly useful in stopping spread of Delta, just mitigating symptoms.

The vaccinated have a lower viral load (going by the 50K person UK study that just came out), are transmitting for less time, and are sicker for less time than the unvaccinated. Then there is the keeping people out of hospitals and graves angle.

 

[Captante]

Which city would you prefer to visit? Houston or NYC?

Apologies to anyone from Houston, but why would I want to visit there at all for any reason never mind compared to NYC?

Seriously I'm sure there are nice, scenic and/or historic places of interest in the Houston area but I can't think of one without using Google.

 

[MrSquished]

Apologies to anyone from Houston, but why would I want to visit there at all for any reason never mind compared to NYC?

Seriously I'm sure there are nice, scenic and/or historic places of interest in the Houston area but I can't think of one without using Google.

I was there for work once. Definitely one of the most mass transit and pedestrian unfriendly places I've ever been. There was like no must see thing to do, no like super neat natural attractions, no cool waterfront promenade, no real architectural attractions, really no big draw besides the Houston Space center, but it wasn't enough to jam it in my free time. I was also staying near the Galleria, like a huge mall downtown. It was a nice mall. So that's nice. But I went out to eat each night I was there, that's always a great part of visiting a new place, big or small. For one night when I didn't want to hang with my colleagues, I asked some attendees for a rec, and a couple of them said, I guess what was considered the gay neighborhood is how they called it, had some cool hip spots. I took a taxi. The neighborhood definitely had a nice vibe, and I had a nice meal.

The one thing I'll remember about Houston is the cab ride back to the hotel from that meal. Cowboy hat wearing latino looking fella, loved to talk. Pink zebra floor mats in the back. I don't remember the stories he told me except the end of one story was him saying very emphatically, with a bit of a drawl -

'cause I fight like a fuck and I fuck like I fight!'

 

[Torn Mind]

The vaccinated have a lower viral load (going by the 50K person UK study that just came out), are transmitting for less time, and are sicker for less time than the unvaccinated. Then there is the keeping people out of hospitals and graves angle.

Spread doesn't need symptoms nor hospitalization.

The counterbalanced is that the sense of safety then leads to more frequent contact and other reckless behaviors. No different than football helmets enabling players to engage in helmet-to-helmet contact. In short, basic risk compensation theory at work.

Immune responses are by nature, reactive. Meaning cells get blown up first and then the body detects it.

Where I'm at, I live in a "rational" county where 92% of people over age 12 have at least one dose. But even here, the map turns yellow on the CDC, indicating moderate community spread. Hospitalizations and deaths are indeed low. But if it's spread that needs control, then people cannot just let their guard down because they're vaccinated or simply "blame" unvaccinated when the mechanism of spread is not so simple.