NON_POLITICAL China Coronavirus THREAD

[pmv]

lol blaming the free market on Opioid abuse?

I would never blame the free market on opioid abuse. It's more the other way round.

Really? Have you been to many other countries?

Have you?

Also a lot of people in other countries don't turn to drugs a lot of times because instead of wondering where they are going to get their next hit they are instead asking "Where am I going to get my next meal?" or "Where can I sleep tonight?". Sadly in a lot of those countries food banks, sleeping bags, and homeless shelters aren't as available here.

I often see this claim that people in poor countries don't suffer from addictions or depression or suicide, but I don't see much evidence for it.

Look at the USSR - alcoholism rocketed with the move to embrace the free-market - an entire generation drank themselves to death.

I wouldn't argue that, say, communism, banished all such problems. Of course not, no system does. They all existed in the USSR before the collapse. But the more a society embraces a dog-eat-dog form of unregulated capitalism, the more these problems increase. Drugs pushers, whether the legal or illegal variety, work on the profit motive.

 

[eRacer]

HIV does not spread in anything like the same manner as this disease, so there's no relationship between the two issues.

It's the mindset that matters. Democrats wouldn't have cared a bit about lifting the HIV ban if it primarily affected impoverished heterosexual Russian slavs looking to immigrate to the US. But lifting the ban became a priority because it aligned with the views of the Black, LBGTQ and immigrant base of the Democrats.

Joe Biden complained that Trump wanted travel bans for ebola-affected African countries, and complained that Trump didn't want to bring ebola-infected people back to the US. Trump's view towards ebola travel bans sounds reasonable to the average person, especially given the situation today with this coronavirus. Do Democrats want candidates that campaign against travel bans related to infectious diseases?

The possibility of a pandemic is a challenge Donald Trump is unqualified to handle as president. I remember how Trump sought to stoke fear and stigma during the 2014 Ebola epidemic. He called President Barack Obama a “dope” and “incompetent” and railed against the evidence-based response our administration put in place — which quelled the crisis and saved hundreds of thousands of lives — in favor of reactionary travel bans that would only have made things worse. He advocated abandoning exposed and infected American citizens rather than bringing them home for treatment.

I actually wouldn't mind if Democrats in the House called for an investigation into why the CDC can't manage to ship out functional coronavirus test kits. Why haven't they started investigations already? I'd also like to hear the views of prominent Democrats on their travel ban litmus test for South Korea, Japan, Italy and other countries that may experience sizable outbreaks in the future.

 

[sdifox]

It's the mindset that matters. Democrats wouldn't have cared a bit about lifting the HIV ban if it primarily affected impoverished heterosexual Russian slavs looking to immigrate to the US. But lifting the ban became a priority because it aligned with the views of the Black, LBGTQ and immigrant base of the Democrats.

Joe Biden complained that Trump wanted travel bans for ebola-affected African countries, and complained that Trump didn't want to bring ebola-infected people back to the US. Trump's view towards ebola travel bans sounds reasonable to the average person, especially given the situation today with this coronavirus. Do Democrats want candidates that campaign against travel bans related to infectious diseases?




I actually wouldn't mind if Democrats in the House called for an investigation into why the CDC can't manage to ship out functional coronavirus test kits. Why haven't they started investigations already? I'd also like to hear the views of prominent Democrats on their travel ban litmus test for South Korea, Japan, Italy and other countries that may experience sizable outbreaks in the future.

If you want to talk mindset, explain rotten orange's obsession with erasing anything Obama touched.

 

[eRacer]

If you want to talk mindset, explain rotten orange's obsession with erasing anything Obama touched.

That ORANGE MAN BAD conversation would belong in the Politics and News forum.

 

[sdifox]

That ORANGE MAN BAD conversation would belong in the Politics and News forum.

You started it...

 

[rcpratt]

There's enough stupid in this thread without bringing politics into it. There's a forum for politics, and this is not it.

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

Have you?

Probably about 10+ total over my lifetime. So, yes, to a certain extent. I don't consider it some drastic amount, but I can definitely say I've seen a lot of different cultures and ways of life.

I often see this claim that people in poor countries don't suffer from addictions or depression or suicide, but I don't see much evidence for it.

Look at the USSR - alcoholism rocketed with the move to embrace the free-market - an entire generation drank themselves to death.

I wouldn't argue that, say, communism, banished all such problems. Of course not, no system does. They all existed in the USSR before the collapse. But the more a society embraces a dog-eat-dog form of unregulated capitalism, the more these problems increase. Drugs pushers, whether the legal or illegal variety, work on the profit motive.

Right, but the USSR was very much a developed country - and is to this day. I meant more from an undeveloped country perspective.

It wasn't until it completely fell to shit that people had to worry about getting food.

 

[eRacer]

You started it...

Actually, I didn't start introducing US politics into the conservation if you look through the post history.

In other news, a "funny" headline in The Atlantic: You’re Likely to Get the Coronavirus

Ok, let's do the math. "Likely" means more than half the world population becomes infected. Let's say just a bit over half: 4 billion out of 7.8 billion get infected. With a fatality rate of 2% (that may end up being too optimistic in a global pandemic) the death toll would be 80 million dead.

So the headline in The Atlantic could simply state: 80 Million Likely to Die from the Coronavirus

 

[allisolm]

Rcpratt said in a post above "There's enough stupid in this thread without bringing politics into it. There's a forum for politics, and this is not it."

Please heed his words.

admin allisolm

 

[pmv]

I did wonder why this wasn't in the P&N forum in the first place. It's hard to discuss public-health crises without being political, and at the very least it's certainly 'news'.

 

[mohit9206]

Most people are still not taking this seriously, well i guess they won't until god forbid they or their families get infected. WHO has removed the word pandemic from its dictionary and CDC refuses to test Americans who have not recently travelled to China, pretty dire situation. Keep everything under wraps until it can no longer be, let's see how this plays out.

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

I did wonder why this wasn't in the P&N forum in the first place. It's hard to discuss public-health crises without being political, and at the very least it's certainly 'news'.

47 pages in - Can't say anyone has gotten really hot-headed or found a need to argue. Seems like a valid discussion.

 

[TheVrolok]

People who bring this up are rotten to the core.

Dude's also pretty clueless. Loves coming to conclusions about things he doesn't really understand.

 

[eRacer]

Most people are still not taking this seriously, well i guess they won't until god forbid they or their families get infected.

It won't take that long. Boomers and Gen Xers will take it seriously if they see their retirement savings vanishing in a stock market crash and their Caribbean cruises get cancelled. The younger generations will take notice if lock downs start kicking in and luxuries like spring break vacations, shopping at the mall, going to the movie theater with friends, music concerts, etc. are in jeopardy. Not to mention a potential bloodbath in the job market.

 

[TheVrolok]

Actually, I didn't start introducing US politics into the conservation if you look through the post history.

In other news, a "funny" headline in The Atlantic: You’re Likely to Get the Coronavirus

Ok, let's do the math. "Likely" means more than half the world population becomes infected. Let's say just a bit over half: 4 billion out of 7.8 billion get infected. With a fatality rate of 2% (that may end up being too optimistic in a global pandemic) the death toll would be 80 million dead.

So the headline in The Atlantic could simply state: 80 Million Likely to Die from the Coronavirus

It could say that, but it would be another sensationalist headline.

 

[eRacer]

It could say that, but it would be another sensationalist headline.

Yes, both the actual headline and my headline could both be considered sensationalist then, as the hypothetical event in the actual headline would likely translate into a grim outcome similar to my headline.

 

[[DHT]Osiris]

Gen Xers ... retirement savings ... Caribbean cruises

*laughs in paycheck to paycheck*

 

[pmv]

Probably about 10+ total over my lifetime. So, yes, to a certain extent. I don't consider it some drastic amount, but I can definitely say I've seen a lot of different cultures and ways of life.

[thinks and counts on fingers....19...20 if you count 'England', that strange country beyond the M25]

Right, but the USSR was very much a developed country - and is to this day. I meant more from an undeveloped country perspective.

It wasn't until it completely fell to shit that people had to worry about getting food.

I'm not quite sure what the point being made is here.

Thinking about it, it seems to me that self-destructive behaviours like drug and alcohol addictions, tend to be more common in countries and cultures that lack a strong collective sense of purpose, directly, or identity. Whether that collective identity is provided by religion or communism.

Free-market fundamentalism seems to be very destructive of that kind of solidarity or sense of collective purpose. It isolates people, encouraging the feeling of being in competition with everyone else and hence increases the likelihood of people turning to forms of self-harm.

Of course those collective identities have their own downsides. There's probably no ultimate solution for these problems of human nature.

What I disagree with is the idea that Obama's failure to fix the problems of an individualist free-market society is some sort of special black-mark against 'the left'. Obama wasn't particularly left-wing anyway.

 

[local]

While not exactly a trainwreck, the local effect has begun for Tallahassee. A company here has announced that they are stopping production of their product due to lack of parts needed. And they make oil-free,
energy-efficient centrifugal compressors for air conditioning, heating and refrigeration systems worldwide. I'm sure this is happening elsewhere as well and does not bode well for many other companies.

That's going to hurt, we are already experiencing shortages with other manufacturers as well.

 

[Svnla]

S. Korea's number of infections is up from a handful to over 830 in less than 1 week and Italy's number is over 200. Those two have the largest infection cases outside of china. Yike.

Apple already said it last week but today companies such as MasterCard, United Airlines, and others big corporations are saying that their earnings will be lower this quarter because of this virus. Stock market is down over 1,000 points today mainly because of grace concerns about this matter.

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

S. Korea's number of infections is up from a handful to over 830 in less than 1 week and Italy's number is over 200. Those two have the largest infection cases outside of china. Yike.

Apple already said it last week but today companies such as MasterCard, United Airlines, and others big corporations are saying that their earnings will be lower this quarter because of this virus. Stock market is down over 1,000 points today mainly because of grace concerns about this matter.

Heh,. never would have thought that the action that finally brings us a long awaited recession will be an disease spreading epidemic....

 

[ponyo]

CDC is advising older Americans and those with medical conditions to avoid traveling to South Korea.
https://wwwnc.cdc.gov/travel/notices/alert/coronavirus-south-korea

Israel and Hong Kong have barred South Koreans from entering. I've read reports Vietnam and China have as well but I can't find sources to confirm if that's true or not. With population density of South Korea, I would avoid going there right now.

 

[Mai72]

Heh,. never would have thought that the action that finally brings us a long awaited recession will be an disease spreading epidemic....

Trump says coronavirus is ‘under control,’ stock market looks ‘very good’

President Donald Trump said Monday that the spread of the deadly coronavirus was “under control” in the US and that the stock market looked “very good” to him — following a dismal day on Wall Stree…

nypost.com

 

[TheVrolok]

Trump says coronavirus is ‘under control,’ stock market looks ‘very good’

President Donald Trump said Monday that the spread of the deadly coronavirus was “under control” in the US and that the stock market looked “very good” to him — following a dismal day on Wall Stree…

nypost.com

Do you think he has any idea that the performance of our stock market still relies fairly heavily on what happens in other countries (at least, certainly China).

 

[Mai72]

Do you think he has any idea that the performance of our stock market still relies fairly heavily on what happens in other countries (at least, certainly China).

TBH, I don't think he knows about much. But, lets be optimistic. It could always be worse.

This isn't the black plague now.