Originally posted by: Thin Lizzy
Originally posted by: Philippine Mango
Originally posted by: Excelsior
Originally posted by: FreshPrince
Originally posted by: Excelsior
Support Intel Celeron CPU=lose.
no, it supports it...but you can put a regular pentium 4 in there as well...
plus it supports 2 GB ram: woohoo!
it's also thinner and narrower than the mac mini
yes, it is ugly, but being able to put XP on it is a big plus
Yeah..wow..I am retarded. Big plus? Pssssshhhtt...OSX is awesome.
Uh, I think you can do A LOT MORE on XP then ANY OSX distro/system combo. Having that little box as your computer would be awesome.
Ok, thats simply not true. Be specific when you say you can do a lot more on XP than any OS X distro/system combo, so people would at least know what you are talking about. Dont say there is more software on Windows, because I will certainly prove you wrong.
And the Mac would be better at gaming.
(I do believe it's the first time those words have been uttered.
)- M4H
It's standard DDR RAM. Macs have used standard RAM for a long time. Same with hard drives, optical drives, keyboards, mice, power cables, etc etc etc..
but still...you have to think and say to yourself....
it's apple being apple again....always trying to screw people with add ons...people less in the know would've dropped $425 for the 1GB memory...while the better informed would've paid $150 for the upgrade...
just a thought
it's apple being apple again....always trying to screw people with add ons...people less in the know would've dropped $425 for the 1GB memory...while the better informed would've paid $150 for the upgrade...
just a thought
no, thats one area that apple IS retarded in, is RAM prices/speeds. they could have EASILY used PC3200 ram, which is the minimum these days. wth were they thinking?!!?
"people less in the know would've dropped $425 for the 1GB memory."
if someone was not "in the know", why would they pay $425 bucks (almost what the system costs in the first place!!!) for a ram upgrade? i think ANYONE can realize that they are being screwed over in that case..
And MetalMat has no idea what he is talking about, so when he is proved wrong he says something childish like "Alright Steve Jobs, thanks for the sales pitch.".
"people less in the know would've dropped $425 for the 1GB memory."
if someone was not "in the know", why would they pay $425 bucks (almost what the system costs in the first place!!!) for a ram upgrade? i think ANYONE can realize that they are being screwed over in that case..
And MetalMat has no idea what he is talking about, so when he is proved wrong he says something childish like "Alright Steve Jobs, thanks for the sales pitch.".
hmm I thought it wasn't user upgradable. well it is but you'll have to crack the case open voiding the warranty. if anyone knows that's not the case do tell.
I believe you would have to crack the case voiding the warranty, but then again lots of people have done that with iMacs.
Anyone know whether the hard drive is a notebook drive or standard drive?
Anyone know whether the hard drive is a notebook drive or standard drive?
Its pretty much the guts of an iBook stuck in a different form factor. I will buy one. As a once hard core PC guy and a real life network admin I love my 12" powerbook. This is an awesome device for my needs (well, wants).
Kaido
Elite Member & Kitchen Overlord
- Feb 14, 2004
- 51,468
- 7,218
- 136
man, you can get a mac mini and a 20" lcd for like $1500...same as a full-featured PC that most regular users buy. Neat!
I'm not really for or against any PC or OS. I've used Windows, Linux, Mac, and some other strange stuff. I used to like screwing around with computers a lot more, but now, a computer is either a tool or a toy. The right computer = whatever gets the job done. Right now PCs work best for me because a majority of the software I use is only available for Windows.
Although I'm not emotionally invested in anything in particular, right now I do prefer Windows XP or Windows 2000 running on Athlon processors. The hardware price and flexibility as well as the operating system flexibility are what do it for me. I just upgraded to a laptop that is more powerful than anything I've had in the past. It does everything I want, it does it fast, and it does it on a budget. It runs Windows XP and I can tweak and modify it to my heart's content. At this point in time, it's exactly what I need.
The mac mini is a perfect normal user computer. Most normal users use (1) Internet Explorer and (2) Microsoft Word. The mac offers a stable solution at a cheap price. It's aethestically pleasing and, from what I've heard, more stable than Windows. It has a pretty GUI and is easy to navigate for most users. I'd buy a couple for my mom and fiancee if I hadn't just bought or built them new PCs recently.
As for the ram, it's overpriced to us because most users on Anandtech are power users. We know how to properly take apart a computer and where to buy ram to put in the mac. Normal users see it as a bunch of wires and electronics and don't want to touch it. I work at Staples and I was feeling kind of bad that people would come in and buy things like Norton Firewall for $60 and Webroot Spy Sweeper and so on when they could get ZoneAlarm, Adaware, etc. for free, but I then I realized that it all works out. They are not technical people - they want to come down and buy a solution for their problem, and it works for them. I'd try to tell people to use Firefox instead of IE to avoid a lot of their problems, but most people don't even know how to search for, download, and install programs. For the world that they live in, buying software at Staples is a good solution. For our world, using Google and downloading free tools is a good solution. Same with macs...the right solution depends on the end user's needs and what 'world' they live in.
I'm not really for or against any PC or OS. I've used Windows, Linux, Mac, and some other strange stuff. I used to like screwing around with computers a lot more, but now, a computer is either a tool or a toy. The right computer = whatever gets the job done. Right now PCs work best for me because a majority of the software I use is only available for Windows.
Although I'm not emotionally invested in anything in particular, right now I do prefer Windows XP or Windows 2000 running on Athlon processors. The hardware price and flexibility as well as the operating system flexibility are what do it for me. I just upgraded to a laptop that is more powerful than anything I've had in the past. It does everything I want, it does it fast, and it does it on a budget. It runs Windows XP and I can tweak and modify it to my heart's content. At this point in time, it's exactly what I need.
The mac mini is a perfect normal user computer. Most normal users use (1) Internet Explorer and (2) Microsoft Word. The mac offers a stable solution at a cheap price. It's aethestically pleasing and, from what I've heard, more stable than Windows. It has a pretty GUI and is easy to navigate for most users. I'd buy a couple for my mom and fiancee if I hadn't just bought or built them new PCs recently.
As for the ram, it's overpriced to us because most users on Anandtech are power users. We know how to properly take apart a computer and where to buy ram to put in the mac. Normal users see it as a bunch of wires and electronics and don't want to touch it. I work at Staples and I was feeling kind of bad that people would come in and buy things like Norton Firewall for $60 and Webroot Spy Sweeper and so on when they could get ZoneAlarm, Adaware, etc. for free, but I then I realized that it all works out. They are not technical people - they want to come down and buy a solution for their problem, and it works for them. I'd try to tell people to use Firefox instead of IE to avoid a lot of their problems, but most people don't even know how to search for, download, and install programs. For the world that they live in, buying software at Staples is a good solution. For our world, using Google and downloading free tools is a good solution. Same with macs...the right solution depends on the end user's needs and what 'world' they live in.
RealVNC - It works awsome and its free
Here is the Server that runs on the mac:
http://sourceforge.net/projects/osxvnc/
Its great, can install itself as a startup item and you never see it running, I use it all the time.
Here is the client to connect to other VNC computers from the mac:
http://sourceforge.net/projects/cotvnc/
I have also used this one and its one of the better VNC clients I have used.
As far as connecting to the Mac Server from a PC, any VNC Client should work. I use the http://www.realvnc.com/ client.
Everything mentioned above is free.
Ok, just looking at the mac mini FINALLY made me consider buying a mac. Ive always had the price/performance argument against it, so I honestly never gave it a fair chance. So for the hell of it, I went to compusa to play around with the mac there. For the record, I've been a PC user since day one...power user all the way. That being said.
OSX absolutely rules. It honestly is 10 million times better than XP. It was like I was using a computer from the future, only I realized that this is where PCs SHOULD be, but arent, primarily because of the Microsoft monopoly. Windows has barely changed since Win95. This is all based on using one of the emacs there, which is pretty much directly comparable to the mac mini.
Specs were like 1.2ghz G4, 256mb RAM, Radeon 9200. I figured that the 256mb of ram would cripple it more than the processor. I was entirely wrong about that...entirely. It all has to do with the OS. Its built WAY better than XP, or any MS OS released. I always thought it was stupid that apps don't close when you close the window...but its very very smart. It keeps the apps resident in memory, but not entirely resident. I kept the activity monitor open through all this time so I could monitor the mem usage etc. At a base level, the entire OS probably used about 64mb of memory, and managed to look a million times better than XP.
Using itunes as an example: On windows, it sucks 45-50mb. When the program was open and playing on the emac, it used about 25. Closing the window knocked it down to around 10mb...but the song continued to play. Reclicking the itunes button popped the window back in instantaneously...on windows, it would take around 10 seconds to load, every time. On the mac, leaving it open, worst case scenario, it took 10mb...but reopening was instant, and it STILL sucked less memory when fully open.
So I took it upon myself to open every app that I possibly could, just to see how it would handle it. itunes, idvd, imovie, ical, safari, finder, pages, mail, address book, god knows what else, all open. Looking at the activity monitor, it took nearly the entire 256mb...left about 4mb free. Even with the million windows open, it will still rather snappy...on a windows pc with 256mb, this thing would honestly be crawling at this point. So I went ahead and closed every window...not the actual apps. My desktop was clean, afaik or cared, nothing was open...but the point is, clicking on any app at that point, opened it up instantaneously. The OS used all the available memory it could, because it knew it could. I've got 1gb of memory in my PC, and unless I'm playing a game, itll keep 600mb free. If its there, it should be using it.
So the OS is way more efficient...but its also way smarter...its just designed better. It takes a bit getting used to, but when you understand how it works, and why it doesnt work the way windows does, it makes more sense. Theres so many little touches that windows just cant do. Did I mention its beautiful? Why exactly do we have all this crazy hardware in our PCs when its not utilized to the fullest 90% of the time? I mourned the loss of the taskbar, then I realized I didnt need it...the dock was better. Expose rocked. Never seen anything like it before.
As for the apps, I was left equally impressed. The stock apps, along with ilife, are so well designed its not even funny. Its like they took a look at the most bloated POS software (MS Office), and threw away everything that 99% of people wouldnt use. ical, mail, address book, make me never want to use outlook again. They all had everything I needed, including mail filters and rules, colored categories etc...but none of the crap I'd never use. I use itunes for windows, cause honestly, its the best mp3 player there is...Ive tried them all, and itunes rules. iphoto was impressive, but I think I'd still use photoshop elements. Garageband is brilliant...its got the perfect mix of what you need, without confusing you will all you dont need. It sounds limitiing, but in actual use, its more empowering if anything, cause you can actually get stuff done. Same with iDVD and iMovie. Finder blew away explorer. ichat, again, way better than aim, without all the bloat you dont want or need. Safari is rather plain, but I fired up opera and firefox, and they were just as good as they were in windows. Impressive all around. I cant believe I'm actually saying all this.
No antivirus or firewall to be found, but then again, it doesnt really need it.
Now for the bad...bloody expensive. Specs are much lower than what you could get for a PC, but the efficiency of the OS mitigates this somewhat...still overpriced. Games, forget about them. Not even part of the consideration. If youre going to go mac, youre not taking your games with you, and any mac addict that goes on about the mac's gaming prowess is talking out of his ass. Youre also going to be missing a few of the smaller apps youre used to...but anything major, the exact same app, or an alternative can be found. And I'm just not sure about quicktime...I dont know how well the mac is going to handle avi, wmv, wma, divx, xvid files etc...that is crucial.
All in all though, I'm incredibly impressed. I'm ordering a mac mini right now. The stuff coming in tiger is going to make me never want to use a PC again. The fast search, brilliant. Ichat av, rules. The dashboard, another great idea. Automator...itll be a decade before windows has that in any usable form. I've seen whats coming in longhorn, and it isnt even going to meet up to the current OSX. Sad.
I cant believe I just wrote all that! Amazing though...seriously, try one out, I mean really, really try it out, and youll probably come away as impressed as me, and I'm no noob.
OSX absolutely rules. It honestly is 10 million times better than XP. It was like I was using a computer from the future, only I realized that this is where PCs SHOULD be, but arent, primarily because of the Microsoft monopoly. Windows has barely changed since Win95. This is all based on using one of the emacs there, which is pretty much directly comparable to the mac mini.
Specs were like 1.2ghz G4, 256mb RAM, Radeon 9200. I figured that the 256mb of ram would cripple it more than the processor. I was entirely wrong about that...entirely. It all has to do with the OS. Its built WAY better than XP, or any MS OS released. I always thought it was stupid that apps don't close when you close the window...but its very very smart. It keeps the apps resident in memory, but not entirely resident. I kept the activity monitor open through all this time so I could monitor the mem usage etc. At a base level, the entire OS probably used about 64mb of memory, and managed to look a million times better than XP.
Using itunes as an example: On windows, it sucks 45-50mb. When the program was open and playing on the emac, it used about 25. Closing the window knocked it down to around 10mb...but the song continued to play. Reclicking the itunes button popped the window back in instantaneously...on windows, it would take around 10 seconds to load, every time. On the mac, leaving it open, worst case scenario, it took 10mb...but reopening was instant, and it STILL sucked less memory when fully open.
So I took it upon myself to open every app that I possibly could, just to see how it would handle it. itunes, idvd, imovie, ical, safari, finder, pages, mail, address book, god knows what else, all open. Looking at the activity monitor, it took nearly the entire 256mb...left about 4mb free. Even with the million windows open, it will still rather snappy...on a windows pc with 256mb, this thing would honestly be crawling at this point. So I went ahead and closed every window...not the actual apps. My desktop was clean, afaik or cared, nothing was open...but the point is, clicking on any app at that point, opened it up instantaneously. The OS used all the available memory it could, because it knew it could. I've got 1gb of memory in my PC, and unless I'm playing a game, itll keep 600mb free. If its there, it should be using it.
So the OS is way more efficient...but its also way smarter...its just designed better. It takes a bit getting used to, but when you understand how it works, and why it doesnt work the way windows does, it makes more sense. Theres so many little touches that windows just cant do. Did I mention its beautiful? Why exactly do we have all this crazy hardware in our PCs when its not utilized to the fullest 90% of the time? I mourned the loss of the taskbar, then I realized I didnt need it...the dock was better. Expose rocked. Never seen anything like it before.
As for the apps, I was left equally impressed. The stock apps, along with ilife, are so well designed its not even funny. Its like they took a look at the most bloated POS software (MS Office), and threw away everything that 99% of people wouldnt use. ical, mail, address book, make me never want to use outlook again. They all had everything I needed, including mail filters and rules, colored categories etc...but none of the crap I'd never use. I use itunes for windows, cause honestly, its the best mp3 player there is...Ive tried them all, and itunes rules. iphoto was impressive, but I think I'd still use photoshop elements. Garageband is brilliant...its got the perfect mix of what you need, without confusing you will all you dont need. It sounds limitiing, but in actual use, its more empowering if anything, cause you can actually get stuff done. Same with iDVD and iMovie. Finder blew away explorer. ichat, again, way better than aim, without all the bloat you dont want or need. Safari is rather plain, but I fired up opera and firefox, and they were just as good as they were in windows. Impressive all around. I cant believe I'm actually saying all this.
No antivirus or firewall to be found, but then again, it doesnt really need it.
Now for the bad...bloody expensive. Specs are much lower than what you could get for a PC, but the efficiency of the OS mitigates this somewhat...still overpriced. Games, forget about them. Not even part of the consideration. If youre going to go mac, youre not taking your games with you, and any mac addict that goes on about the mac's gaming prowess is talking out of his ass. Youre also going to be missing a few of the smaller apps youre used to...but anything major, the exact same app, or an alternative can be found. And I'm just not sure about quicktime...I dont know how well the mac is going to handle avi, wmv, wma, divx, xvid files etc...that is crucial.
All in all though, I'm incredibly impressed. I'm ordering a mac mini right now. The stuff coming in tiger is going to make me never want to use a PC again. The fast search, brilliant. Ichat av, rules. The dashboard, another great idea. Automator...itll be a decade before windows has that in any usable form. I've seen whats coming in longhorn, and it isnt even going to meet up to the current OSX. Sad.
I cant believe I just wrote all that! Amazing though...seriously, try one out, I mean really, really try it out, and youll probably come away as impressed as me, and I'm no noob.
:thumbsup: itunes for windows is using 15MB of memory on my windows when its playing, but i just opened it.
Can i plug a Mac mini into my Linksys router?
Will it coexist with the other PC's sharing the cable modem?
the $500 dollar price tag is a tad misleading... Going with the
1.42GHz processor, 512MB of RAM and DVD burner you're at
$774.
Still, i missed out on the CUBE, which i really loved just for
plain looks! This little mini is just a good exscuse to finally
own a Mac.
When will we know how hard a SDRAM upgrade will be?
Would this little machine run Photoshop well?
so many questions!!
Will it coexist with the other PC's sharing the cable modem?
the $500 dollar price tag is a tad misleading... Going with the
1.42GHz processor, 512MB of RAM and DVD burner you're at
$774.
Still, i missed out on the CUBE, which i really loved just for
plain looks! This little mini is just a good exscuse to finally
own a Mac.
When will we know how hard a SDRAM upgrade will be?
Would this little machine run Photoshop well?
so many questions!!
Originally posted by: ZeroEffect
Can i plug a Mac mini into my Linksys router?
Will it coexist with the other PC's sharing the cable modem?
the $500 dollar price tag is a tad misleading... Going with the
1.42GHz processor, 512MB of RAM and DVD burner you're at
$774.
Still, i missed out on the CUBE, which i really loved just for
plain looks! This little mini is just a good exscuse to finally
own a Mac.
When will we know how hard a SDRAM upgrade will be?
Would this little machine run Photoshop well?
so many questions!!
Regarding the router, of course it will work.
I had a linksys router before I bought a Netgear, and my one Mac and 3 PC's shared the connection with no problem. But now, its 2 Macs and 2 PC's sharing the connection on a Netgear router, except the laptop which is running wirelessly off the modem, and works like a charm.The 500 dollar price tag on the mini is for the basic setup with no extra stuff on the. Thats 256mb of RAM and a Combo drive instead of the DVD burner and the 1.42GHz processor.
The mini uses DDR memory. I believe it will be difficult to install because it is recommended an Apple tech installs memory for you. I read in the Apple Discussions that there are many clips that hold the mini's top on.
I bet photoshop will run very well on it. I run photoshop on a 1GHz Mac, and it runs awesome! My 1GHz Mac is slower than the mini by almost everything. My Mac has a 1GHz processor, PC 133 SDRAM, 133MHz FSB. The mini has a 1.25 or 1.42GHz processor, DDR 333 memory, 167MHz FSB.
I am pretty sure Photoshop will fly with the mini.
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