Well I already built one using this board for my Grandson but I ordered another one and will start building it when I finally get all the parts. I didn't overclock the first one AMD Athlon 64 3700+ San Diego 2.2GHz but will attempt to with this one. Hope I have as much fun as you seemed to have had!!
Well I already built one using this board for my Grandson but I ordered another one and will start building it when I finally get all the parts. I didn't overclock the first one AMD Athlon 64 3700+ San Diego 2.2GHz but will attempt to with this one. Hope I have as much fun as you seemed to have had!!
I should add that I haven't decided on a processor yet. Trying to decide between the 4000 at $96....the FX-55 at $130 or the Opteron 165 at $157. Since I'm doing thios mostly for fun it is hard to decide.
I really suggest the Opteron 165. Main reason is dual core and it's only $50 more than your cheapest choice.
The 4000+ clocks in at 2.6GHz with 1MB of cache right? If so, it's an FX-55 without the unlocked processor. I realize you're taking a "risk" on being able to get a 800-1000MHz overclock out of the Opteron but so many people are doing it. I'd get one while Newegg is shipping the CCBBEs for sure.
The 4000+ clocks in at 2.6GHz with 1MB of cache right? If so, it's an FX-55 without the unlocked processor. I realize you're taking a "risk" on being able to get a 800-1000MHz overclock out of the Opteron but so many people are doing it. I'd get one while Newegg is shipping the CCBBEs for sure.
After doing some pricing it seems to me buying an MSI Neo4-F mobo which is pretty much the same board I believe minus a firewire port for ~$68 or less shipped at several stores online is a better deal. You get all the cables, retail warranty of 3 years etc for ~$25. The warranty and the cost of the cables would easily cover your extra $25. Convince me that I am wrong.
Warranty? Last summer I financed a 2005 $23,500 Acura, six months later I had my own Hondata engine management computer installed. (USB jack in the ECU, plugs into your laptop for realtime adjustments and changes)
Some of us aren't big on warranties, especially when dealing directly with the motherboard manufacturer.
Besides, any ethical person wouldn't send computer parts (or a car) in for warranty service when the part/car has been abused (overclocked) or modified.
Some of us aren't big on warranties, especially when dealing directly with the motherboard manufacturer.
Besides, any ethical person wouldn't send computer parts (or a car) in for warranty service when the part/car has been abused (overclocked) or modified.
The last time I overclocked was like 10 years ago so is there any other reason why I shouldnt just buy retail? Cables are worth at least $15 shipped when you consider SATAx2, EIDEx2, usb port extender and probably some other cables. You aso are getting the installation CD albeit probably useless, and a manual which is nice instead of downloading and printing it. Really I cannot see why I would want to get this white/box refurb 90day warranty version. I was thinking hard on getting it then decided to go check some prices.
Eh, you make a good point, but still cost > *. Most of us have rounded cables we'd prefer to use, admittedly the D-Bracket would've been nice, the pins aren't even on the motherboard, but there's a silkscreen for it. Though, the D-Bracket is useless if you've made it this far and are posting on Anandtech :
:
I bought this board because I had a KN1 Lite die during a tragic Windows flash attempt gone awry and I knew the RMA process from Newegg would be at least 2-3 weeks (I ship UPS Ground for free at work, so no incentive to ship faster)
The KN1 Lite is only $8 more, shipping not included but there is a free PayPal code. It comes with a boatload of stuff, 2 IDE, 4 SATA, USB, USB for floppy port (albeit beige color) and I think the heatsink on the KN1 may be a little better...
:I bought this board because I had a KN1 Lite die during a tragic Windows flash attempt gone awry and I knew the RMA process from Newegg would be at least 2-3 weeks (I ship UPS Ground for free at work, so no incentive to ship faster)
The KN1 Lite is only $8 more, shipping not included but there is a free PayPal code. It comes with a boatload of stuff, 2 IDE, 4 SATA, USB, USB for floppy port (albeit beige color) and I think the heatsink on the KN1 may be a little better...
Oh, by the way guys. 1T is sooo the way to go. I did a Sandra memory benchmark at 2T and I was like "uhh ok. That seems really really weak." I went into the BIOS and changed memory to 1T, then I booted the MemTest86 bootable ISO CD and ran it for about 2 hours with no errors.
Booted back into Windows and ran Sandra again and bandwidth efficiency increased from 68% to 78%, my score went up around 1000MBps, seriously.
Booted back into Windows and ran Sandra again and bandwidth efficiency increased from 68% to 78%, my score went up around 1000MBps, seriously.
$54.11 new shipped
including google checkout bonus at buy.com, in case your search didn't come up with it. As soon as one of these buy.com bargains is posted they seem to go OOS, so don't snooze if you want it.
Sure, if you need the extras, these surplus deals are less than if you do not. Buying the extras separately costs more than the package deal.
Hot-dealers usually have doubles from years of buying the HDs and CDROMs, which commonly have cables included, and mobos, which often have cables too and sometimes multiple cables that aren't going to be used. The custom brackets are hard to come by unless you get them in the package, but for some of these lots of cases have front panel cables which can be plugged into the header too, and IAC many people never use the extra features. A good deal is sometimes not having to pay for something you won't use.
The biggest caution I have is if there may be a minor problem with the Fujitsu board. Two of the big contributors to this thread have had unexplained spontaneous shutdowns. Could be the OCing or the cross-flashed BIOS, but... then they OC massively for 24 hours and no shut down. What's that? Infrequent crashes are tolerable for most people (OCers especially , because computer are crazy anyway, but still...
my board wont start with FSB above 250M, any suggesion?
Cup is AMD Opteron 165 with stepping of CCBBE. My memory is Kingston value 512M DDR 400, I have four of them in my system.
The sysem is stable at FSB=240, HT=5, Memory=200MHZ.
But if I move the FSB to 250, then it wont start even with HT=3 and Memory=133MHZ. Does this mean my cpu is really bad at overclocking?
Thanks.
Cup is AMD Opteron 165 with stepping of CCBBE. My memory is Kingston value 512M DDR 400, I have four of them in my system.
The sysem is stable at FSB=240, HT=5, Memory=200MHZ.
But if I move the FSB to 250, then it wont start even with HT=3 and Memory=133MHZ. Does this mean my cpu is really bad at overclocking?
Thanks.
The spontaneous shutdowns appear to be directly related to heat in the CPU or a memory failure. Memory getting pushed and heating up causes weird funky problems. Those timings are critical to get right, this is not something for the faint of heart. I had a shutdown because the room got warmer during a heat startup, yet played oblivion without a hitch for 2 hours last night. When you push hardware, you can expect the occassional hiccup.
To Touchzen - you need to lower your memory divider. Check up above or page 7 for the settings - 3-3-3-8 @ 166 @ HTT 240 and HT 4X are working for me right now. I'm planning on pushing up to 260 w/ those, if the CPU will handle it when I get a better cooler. I'm running about 50-53C@ full load. I am also planning on pushing the RAM, going to 1T if possible w/ loose timings.
To Touchzen - you need to lower your memory divider. Check up above or page 7 for the settings - 3-3-3-8 @ 166 @ HTT 240 and HT 4X are working for me right now. I'm planning on pushing up to 260 w/ those, if the CPU will handle it when I get a better cooler. I'm running about 50-53C@ full load. I am also planning on pushing the RAM, going to 1T if possible w/ loose timings.
Could you please tell me what is 3-3-3-8? I saw some number like 2.5,3,12T etc .in the memory setting up page but don't know which I should change. And Isn't setting memory speed at 133 low enough?
Thanks.
Well, I've had... two unexplained shutdowns and one unexplained BSOD.
At first, I believed this board had some problems handling dual core processors, but it is true that this version of Windows I have on this machine (while SP2'd) may not be the urm... how do you say, most legitimate OS available. I do have a legitimate copy of XP Pro sitting here, but I did not want to install it until I had my two hard drives I wanted (One 74GB Raptor and a 200GB+ Seagate) and until my girlfriend gives me my X-Mas graphics card.
Here's what I remember about the problems I've had with this board:
- It may've killed my X-Finity power supply. I doubt it since I've had the TruePower running almost as long now as the X-Finity, but who knows. Plus, when it comes down to the reliability of MSI and Ultra, who's going to point the finger at MSI.
- I got a BSOD of "bad_pool_header" one day while Prime'n and using Firefox/Winamp. I don't think I've EVER gotten a BSOD on an NT OS, well one time I did install like Nero 3.0 on Windows 2000 and it told me not to and I did anyways and it corrupted the OS.
- I've had two unexplained shutdowns, neither of these have been with my Antec TruePower 650.
- I have great airflow and all of my cables are neat and tidy. In my case there's 3x120mm (one in PSU) and 1x92mm blowhole exhaust. Temps are a chilly low 30s under idle.
- As you guys have seen I've Prime'd the hell out of this board with max HTT testing using my Venice, then max-MHz-within-voltage-reason using my Opteron @ 2.7GHz.
Something I have yet to do is game on this machine, as I've said before I've got a WOEFULLY underpowered X600SE ($20!) so a little after Christmas I can update you guys on how stable it is during a 2-3 hour gaming session.
At first, I believed this board had some problems handling dual core processors, but it is true that this version of Windows I have on this machine (while SP2'd) may not be the urm... how do you say, most legitimate OS available. I do have a legitimate copy of XP Pro sitting here, but I did not want to install it until I had my two hard drives I wanted (One 74GB Raptor and a 200GB+ Seagate) and until my girlfriend gives me my X-Mas graphics card.
Here's what I remember about the problems I've had with this board:
- It may've killed my X-Finity power supply. I doubt it since I've had the TruePower running almost as long now as the X-Finity, but who knows. Plus, when it comes down to the reliability of MSI and Ultra, who's going to point the finger at MSI.
- I got a BSOD of "bad_pool_header" one day while Prime'n and using Firefox/Winamp. I don't think I've EVER gotten a BSOD on an NT OS, well one time I did install like Nero 3.0 on Windows 2000 and it told me not to and I did anyways and it corrupted the OS.
- I've had two unexplained shutdowns, neither of these have been with my Antec TruePower 650.
- I have great airflow and all of my cables are neat and tidy. In my case there's 3x120mm (one in PSU) and 1x92mm blowhole exhaust. Temps are a chilly low 30s under idle.
- As you guys have seen I've Prime'd the hell out of this board with max HTT testing using my Venice, then max-MHz-within-voltage-reason using my Opteron @ 2.7GHz.
Something I have yet to do is game on this machine, as I've said before I've got a WOEFULLY underpowered X600SE ($20!) so a little after Christmas I can update you guys on how stable it is during a 2-3 hour gaming session.
That's a great price from Buy.com. Wish I would have waited a day to order I would have gone with the retail board
PC3200, like the name implies, provides 3200MBps of memory bandwith, this is doubled with dual channel.
Anyways, at 2T I was getting some piss poor memory bandwidth results, so-much-so that I questioned if I really was in dual channel mode, despite the POST process saying I am and CPU-Z reporting I am. Anyhow, I when I changed to 2T the efficiency of my setup from 68% efficient to 78%. If I was at DDR400 it would be closer to 80 methinks.
Higher = bettah!
It doesn't compare to the FX-62, it compares to other memory controllers. As far as this specific computer in Sandra's CPU benchmark, if there were 10 hash marks between the FX-60 and FX-62, I'd be on like the 6th or 7th hash mark. I'm like an FX-61 lol.
Anyways, at 2T I was getting some piss poor memory bandwidth results, so-much-so that I questioned if I really was in dual channel mode, despite the POST process saying I am and CPU-Z reporting I am. Anyhow, I when I changed to 2T the efficiency of my setup from 68% efficient to 78%. If I was at DDR400 it would be closer to 80 methinks.
Higher = bettah!
It doesn't compare to the FX-62, it compares to other memory controllers. As far as this specific computer in Sandra's CPU benchmark, if there were 10 hash marks between the FX-60 and FX-62, I'd be on like the 6th or 7th hash mark. I'm like an FX-61 lol.
>Isn't setting memory speed at 133 low enough?
When memory is run at lower speed, it can use tighter timings. So if you set it to 133, the timings are set as if it were run at 133. When you overclock the HTT, the memory speed goes higher than 133; up to 200 with luck. At that speed, the 133 timings may be too tight. Before that occured to me, and I set the timings manually to what they should be for 200, I had a lot of mysterious quirks.
Each memory module has info built into it (the SPD) which the BIOS reads to determine how to set the timings. The one I am looking at now (with CPUZ) has three sets of timings: one set each for 133, 166, 200. So the BIOS uses 133 when you set 133. Auto only means, AFIK, that the BIOS reads the SPD, rather then you having to know the numbers to set them. It would work right (presumably) if you were not OCing.
CAS = 3 ( or 2.5 )
Minimum RAS = 8T
RAS to CAS = 3T
Row Precharge = 3T
Different BIOSes use different descriptions for the same things.
I stumbled into another unforseen hitch when I got a new DDR400 module, which turned out to my shock to OC to over 290MHz using Memtest86+, and I thought I'd OC the memory besides the CPU. I dropped the HTT from 305 to 290 and put the memory divider to 200 (1:1). It ran prime95 for several hours, as expected, but video corruption started to appear gradually and then suddenly went to the point I couldn't make out anything on the screen. Even though it looked like it, it could not be that the AGP was OCed, I thought, because the mobo is supposed to have an AGP lock; they made a big deal out of that at the time it was current. So what the heck...? With the divider at 166 and my HTT back to 305 (which OCs the memory to about 250MHz) all was fine. Some time later I tried out Clockgen, which gives a reading of all the bus speeds, including AGP. So it says the AGP is at 83MHz instead of 66MHz. 83 is what it would be if the AGP were OCed in proportion to the memory, that is 250:200. If that is what happens, then my AGP was overclocked to 290/200 X 66 = 96MHz before. No wonder the video messed up.
When memory is run at lower speed, it can use tighter timings. So if you set it to 133, the timings are set as if it were run at 133. When you overclock the HTT, the memory speed goes higher than 133; up to 200 with luck. At that speed, the 133 timings may be too tight. Before that occured to me, and I set the timings manually to what they should be for 200, I had a lot of mysterious quirks.
Each memory module has info built into it (the SPD) which the BIOS reads to determine how to set the timings. The one I am looking at now (with CPUZ) has three sets of timings: one set each for 133, 166, 200. So the BIOS uses 133 when you set 133. Auto only means, AFIK, that the BIOS reads the SPD, rather then you having to know the numbers to set them. It would work right (presumably) if you were not OCing.
I have an earlier MSI nforce mobo before the chipset for PCIe came out, not his one. (Mine is 7025. This is 7125.) In my BIOS
CAS = 3 ( or 2.5 )
Minimum RAS = 8T
RAS to CAS = 3T
Row Precharge = 3T
Different BIOSes use different descriptions for the same things.
I stumbled into another unforseen hitch when I got a new DDR400 module, which turned out to my shock to OC to over 290MHz using Memtest86+, and I thought I'd OC the memory besides the CPU. I dropped the HTT from 305 to 290 and put the memory divider to 200 (1:1). It ran prime95 for several hours, as expected, but video corruption started to appear gradually and then suddenly went to the point I couldn't make out anything on the screen. Even though it looked like it, it could not be that the AGP was OCed, I thought, because the mobo is supposed to have an AGP lock; they made a big deal out of that at the time it was current. So what the heck...? With the divider at 166 and my HTT back to 305 (which OCs the memory to about 250MHz) all was fine. Some time later I tried out Clockgen, which gives a reading of all the bus speeds, including AGP. So it says the AGP is at 83MHz instead of 66MHz. 83 is what it would be if the AGP were OCed in proportion to the memory, that is 250:200. If that is what happens, then my AGP was overclocked to 290/200 X 66 = 96MHz before. No wonder the video messed up.
GeezerMan
Platinum Member
- Jan 28, 2005
- 2,146
- 26
- 91
OK, here's an odd thing. I wanted to try video encoding at stock speeds for the CPU and ram and compare it to 2600MHZ and ram at 472MHZ. I figured the overclocked would be a lot better. Well, it was not, in fact, maybe a tad slower. Now, it passed Prime95 for 24 hours at the 2600MHZ. I have not done a memtest yet, but will this weekend. Any ideas on this? I did try to set the priority to high in task manager, but made no difference.
I'm encoding from the hard drive, and not DVD player. The only thing I can think of is a speed limitation of the software?
Thanks
EDIT: I'm using DVD Shrink, it averages about 21000 KB/s for encoding. Before anyone says anything, I'm encoding non-copyrighted material....
There is some posts saying that DVD Shrink is not optimized for dual core, even if that was true, I still would expect some increase in performance.
I'm encoding from the hard drive, and not DVD player. The only thing I can think of is a speed limitation of the software?
Thanks
EDIT: I'm using DVD Shrink, it averages about 21000 KB/s for encoding. Before anyone says anything, I'm encoding non-copyrighted material....
There is some posts saying that DVD Shrink is not optimized for dual core, even if that was true, I still would expect some increase in performance.
I followed KF and Lurker1's suggestion but still couldn't get HTT pass 250. It seems I got a bad CPU or Motherboard.
Thanks anyway everyone for the kindly help.
Thanks anyway everyone for the kindly help.
Drop your HTT multiplier to 2x, drop your CPU multiplier to like 6x, then set HTT to 250. That's a good test to see if it's really a dud
Geezerman: DVD Shrink streams data when it encodes. It reads, encodes, then writes. Most likely you're experiencing IO bottleneck(s) to your HD. If you have a second drive, read from one, write to the other. (btw, 21,000 KB/s would make me drool. My 3.5 year old 2.4 P4 maxes out around 8KB/s. I'll try the new one as soon as I put the second SATA drive in)
touchzen - 250 isn't bad. It most likely is your memory timings though. The entire process is a lot more involved than the early days, since you're tweaking invidivual items to maximize speeds far beyond what you could years ago. There's one other issue, if you're OC'ing, make darn sure you have a decent quality PSU. As the clocks ramping higher, the CPU and other components draw more power, which can lower the effective voltage on a cheaper PSU, which will cause all number of strange things to happen, like BSODs or spontaneous reboots. (Another cause of those, btw) You should also know that I hit 255 without tweaking memory settings, meaning I was running DDR 510 speeds w/ a single Patriot 1GB stick. Dual channel can also cause issues, so for initial teaking, run a single stick. All in all, it's a nice side hobby, if you don't mind risking frying a system.
touchzen - 250 isn't bad. It most likely is your memory timings though. The entire process is a lot more involved than the early days, since you're tweaking invidivual items to maximize speeds far beyond what you could years ago. There's one other issue, if you're OC'ing, make darn sure you have a decent quality PSU. As the clocks ramping higher, the CPU and other components draw more power, which can lower the effective voltage on a cheaper PSU, which will cause all number of strange things to happen, like BSODs or spontaneous reboots. (Another cause of those, btw) You should also know that I hit 255 without tweaking memory settings, meaning I was running DDR 510 speeds w/ a single Patriot 1GB stick. Dual channel can also cause issues, so for initial teaking, run a single stick. All in all, it's a nice side hobby, if you don't mind risking frying a system.
GeezerMan
Platinum Member
- Jan 28, 2005
- 2,146
- 26
- 91
That makes sense, got to have a bottleneck somewhere and after attaching another SATA drive to dump the output files to, all I can say is Holy Encoding, Batman!
The darn thing is encoding at 54 to 55000 KB/s..that's right, 55000 KB/s
I can start a home movie encoding service right here......
Thanks Lurker.................
P.S. I did let memtest run for 5 passes, it passed. Probably should let it go a bit longer.
So, the Ultra ram turns out to be an incredible performance deal., at least for me.
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