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"Morally" justified murder?

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techs said:
Yesterday was the 150th anniversary of the execution of John Brown.

"John Brown's raid on Harpers Ferry was an attempt by white abolitionist John Brown to start an armed slave revolt by seizing a United States Arsenal at Harpers Ferry in Virginia in 1859. Brown's raid was defeated by a detachment of U.S. Marines led by Col. Robert E. Lee"


Morality questions:

1) Is a slave morally justified in killing his owner?

2) Is a slave morally justified in killing an employee of the government whose job it is to enforce his slavery, e.g. police, army, etc?

3) Is a slave morally justified in killing someone who actively works to keep him in slavery, e.g. a politician?
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No. i see nothing wrong with slavery, provided it is not based on race or gender discrimination.
only in US history with the mistreatment of black is slavery such an abomination.
 
Schadenfroh said:
John Brown was a terrorist. He is from the same vein as modern day abortion clinic bombers. They both feel that their murders are "morally" justified.
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So you don't approve of the early Colonials who rebelled, eh? Why do you hate America so?
😛

But yes, the early American revolutionary movements were completely terrorism-style activities in the eyes of the British. And if I were a Briton at that time, unless I seriously hated the British government, I'd be calling he who is my own blood-uncle (American ancestry) a terrorist sympathizer, and even a terrorist in some ways (never fought, but he did do a whole lot of peaceful radical activism).

That's the great problem with terrorism. It differs according to who is looking at it and how the people committing it justify it.
There is nothing justifiable in the Middle East terrorism, except in religious justification - which we all know is utter nonsense. But everyone would look a whole lot differently at Christianity if they weren't Christians and witnessed the atrocities that occurred during the Crusades era. Modern Islamic terrorists are simply the new-age equivalent of Crusaders. Doesn't justify it, just like Christianity cannot justify the things they have done.
 
Murder is unjustified killing in the eyes of the law; seeing as how the law can be whatever those in power want, and those in power aren't necessarily moral; yes, murder can be justified.

There is no excuse for slavery as we know it; it's worse to ruin a person's life than to take it; yes it's ok for slaves to kill in order to get their lives back.
 
sao123 said:
No. i see nothing wrong with slavery, provided it is not based on race or gender discrimination.
only in US history with the mistreatment of black is slavery such an abomination.
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Are you kidding me? Do you even understand what slavery is, regardless of the conditions for the enslaved?
 
irishScott said:
Seriously. Screw slavery, if some guy raped my SO and not only got away, but was completely immune to any repercussions, I'd kill him the first chance I got if I could do it without negating repercussions. If he did it repeatably, those repercussions would start to matter less and less...
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SO = slave owner?
 
sao123 said:
No. i see nothing wrong with slavery, provided it is not based on race or gender discrimination.
only in US history with the mistreatment of black is slavery such an abomination.
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So you are in favor of taking ordinary people, who have done nothing wrong, and turning them into slaves, just so long as you are an equal opportunity slave owner?

Wow.
 
I'd say yes. Every living thing is morally justified in doing anything to ensure its own survival and freedom of action, so long as it does not negatively impact the survival of its species. That is the basis for all moral code.
 
IronWing said:
And to him they were justified and in his eyes his was a great crusade to free America of the evil of slavery. To you, apparently not. Again morals are personal so it makes arguing whether an act is moral or not kind of pointless. We can certainly agree that his acts were criminal but arguing morals is like arguing color schemes.
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I wouldn't say that, there are many common points of morality that pretty much everyone in the West can agree on. Shoot, there's even one (if only one) that everyone in the world can agree on, and that's incest.
 
Answer to subject.

I'd say yes.

Would I kill hitler if I saw him and had a gun? yes without a doubt. I am not sure how many people on this forum wouldn't agree with me.


Same could make sense with slaves. Owner kills 20 family members and didnt give a crap. You were a slave and would probably follow their same fate, already lost everything, I would feel that it was morallly justified to murder him.
 
If you want to use the American Revolutionaries as an analogy, you could say that they did what they could to peacefully rebel against the British before resorting to violence to get their way. Similarly, I'd say that a slave should try to escape first and kill only if it is necessary to escape or to save himself. But if a slave did have to kill his owner or anyone else trying to impede his escape, he would be morally justified. Killing his owner even if it wasn't necessary would just be revenge, which often isn't morally justified, unless perhaps it's revenge for another murder that went unpunished.

sao123 said:
No. i see nothing wrong with slavery, provided it is not based on race or gender discrimination.
only in US history with the mistreatment of black is slavery such an abomination.
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Obvious troll is obvious.
 
If I were in the position of a slave and had my freedom taken away, I would find it justifiable to kill to gain my freedom. On a much bigger scale, America had to kill in order to gain it's freedom in the Revolutionary War, it seems logical to me that for your own personal freedom you would kill to achieve it.
 
Hmmm.
According to Wiki:
Historians agree John Brown played a major role in starting the Civil War.

And since the Civil War ended slavery, does that make John Brown the most successful "terrorist" in US history?
 
techs said:
Hmmm.
According to Wiki:
Historians agree John Brown played a major role in starting the Civil War.

And since the Civil War ended slavery, does that make John Brown the most successful "terrorist" in US history?
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They certainly would label his behavior terrorism today. In his day he was a revolutionary though.
 
Chryso said:
No, however, some people were slaves by choice. (Not in the US.)
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OK, i need some facts on this one, because I can't think of a single sane human being would willingly enter slavery.

and fuck you to those people who said slaves aren't justified in killing their captors. Freedom is the basic right of every human being, fuck anyone who tries to change that.
 
sao123 said:
No. i see nothing wrong with slavery, provided it is not based on race or gender discrimination.
only in US history with the mistreatment of black is slavery such an abomination.
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A: Slavery is an abomination no matter what race of the slave or slave master happen to be.
B: Neither the "US" nor English North America existed when blacks began being used as slaves in the Western Hemisphere.
 
canadageek said:
OK, i need some facts on this one, because I can't think of a single sane human being would willingly enter slavery.

and fuck you to those people who said slaves aren't justified in killing their captors. Freedom is the basic right of every human being, fuck anyone who tries to change that.
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He is probably confusing indentured servitude with slavery.
 
weflyhigh said:
1. No.
2. No.
3. No.

It is only morally acceptable to "violate" the 5th commandment under extreme circumstances, and being a slave (as defined by a 1800s U.S. slave) is not one of those.

And legally, the slave owners were within their rights. Them to be murdered under that condition is inexcusable.
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PokerGuy said:
1) No.
2) No.
3) No.

IMO, killing a person can only ever be justified if it is in direct defense of yourself or another person, or if it's been sanctioned by the law as punishment for a specific crime, or if it's sanctioned as part of one's duty to defend the country.
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WOW! You two aren't very bright or moral. Unbelievable.

All people have an unalienable right to be free.
 
Yes to all three, but only if absolutely necessary of course. If the person could escape without killing their owners, that is what they should do.

A slave killing an owner is not murder by the way, it's self defense.
 
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