I thought that Ike sent aid - it was JFK that put "advisors" on the ground.
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Michael Moore faces US Treasury Probe
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I beleive Ike had a small number of advisors (around 500) on the ground in S Vietnam. Ike supported the French, footing 80% of the cost of their war but they surrendered in 1954 and he/we set-up and recognized the S Vietnam goverment. He didn't want us getting into a big ground war though. JFK ramped it up some, but still only had 16,000 sodiers there when he was assainated.
Johnson was the one who really commited us
Kennedy had less than two years to put troops in place. Most I believe initially were Special Forces. I would suspect that given the ramp up from "none" to 16K, indicates that many more would have been committed by Kennedy - LBJ kept some of the DOD advisors. Kennedy may have had the same fear of Communism that Ike had. The lines had to be drawn quickly and firmly.
Sweet, he replied!
Open Letter from Michael Moore to U.S. Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson
Secretary Henry Paulson
Department of the Treasury
Secretary Paulson,
I am contacting you in light of the document sent to me dated May 2, 2007, which was received May 7, 2007 indicating that an investigation has been opened up with regards to a trip I took to Cuba with a group of Americans that included some 9/11 heroes in March 2007 related to the filming of my next documentary, on the American Healthcare system. SiCKO, which will be seen in theaters this summer, will expose the health care industry's greed and control over America's political processes.
I believe that the decision to conduct this investigation represents the latest example of the Bush Administration abusing the federal government for raw, crass, political purposes. Over the last seven years of the Bush Presidency, we have seen the abuse of government to promote a political agenda designed to benefit the conservative base of the Republican Party, special interests and major financial contributors. From holding secret meetings for the energy industry to re-writing science findings to cooking the books on intelligence to the firing of U.S. Attorneys, this Administration has shown time and time again that it will abuse its power and authority.
There are a number of specific facts that have led me to conclude that politics could very well be driving this Bush Administration investigation of me and my film.
First, the Bush Administration has been aware of this matter for months (since October 2006) and never took any action until less than two weeks before SiCKO is set to premiere at the Cannes Film Festival and a little more than a month before it is scheduled to open in the United States.
Second, the health care and insurance industry, which is exposed in the movie and has expressed concerns about the impact of the movie on their industries, is a major corporate underwriter of President George W. Bush and the Republican Party, having contributed over $13 million to the Bush presidential campaign in 2004 and more than $180 million to Republican candidates over the last two campaign cycles.
It is well documented that the industry is very concerned about the impact of SiCKO. They have threatened their employees if they talk to me. They have set up special internal crises lines should I show up at their headquarters. Employees have been warned about the consequences of participating in SiCKO. Despite this, some employees, at great risk to themselves, have gone on camera to tell the American people the truth about the health care industry. I can understand why that industry's main recipient of its contributions -- President Bush -- would want to harass, intimidate and potentially prevent this film from having its widest possible audience.
And, third, this investigation is being opened in the wake of misleading attacks on the purpose of the Cuba trip from a possible leading Republican candidate for president, Fred Thompson, a major conservative newspaper, The New York Post, and various right wing blogs.
For five and a half years, the Bush administration has ignored and neglected the heroes of the 9/11 community. These heroic first responders have been left to fend for themselves, without coverage and without care. I understand why the Bush administration is coming after me -- I have tried to help the very people they refuse to help, but until George W. Bush outlaws helping your fellow man, I have broken no laws and I have nothing to hide.
I demand that the Bush Administration immediately end this investigation and spend its time and resources trying to support some of the real heroes of 9/11.
Sincerely,
Michael Moore
Open Letter from Michael Moore to U.S. Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson
Secretary Henry Paulson
Department of the Treasury
Secretary Paulson,
I am contacting you in light of the document sent to me dated May 2, 2007, which was received May 7, 2007 indicating that an investigation has been opened up with regards to a trip I took to Cuba with a group of Americans that included some 9/11 heroes in March 2007 related to the filming of my next documentary, on the American Healthcare system. SiCKO, which will be seen in theaters this summer, will expose the health care industry's greed and control over America's political processes.
I believe that the decision to conduct this investigation represents the latest example of the Bush Administration abusing the federal government for raw, crass, political purposes. Over the last seven years of the Bush Presidency, we have seen the abuse of government to promote a political agenda designed to benefit the conservative base of the Republican Party, special interests and major financial contributors. From holding secret meetings for the energy industry to re-writing science findings to cooking the books on intelligence to the firing of U.S. Attorneys, this Administration has shown time and time again that it will abuse its power and authority.
There are a number of specific facts that have led me to conclude that politics could very well be driving this Bush Administration investigation of me and my film.
First, the Bush Administration has been aware of this matter for months (since October 2006) and never took any action until less than two weeks before SiCKO is set to premiere at the Cannes Film Festival and a little more than a month before it is scheduled to open in the United States.
Second, the health care and insurance industry, which is exposed in the movie and has expressed concerns about the impact of the movie on their industries, is a major corporate underwriter of President George W. Bush and the Republican Party, having contributed over $13 million to the Bush presidential campaign in 2004 and more than $180 million to Republican candidates over the last two campaign cycles.
It is well documented that the industry is very concerned about the impact of SiCKO. They have threatened their employees if they talk to me. They have set up special internal crises lines should I show up at their headquarters. Employees have been warned about the consequences of participating in SiCKO. Despite this, some employees, at great risk to themselves, have gone on camera to tell the American people the truth about the health care industry. I can understand why that industry's main recipient of its contributions -- President Bush -- would want to harass, intimidate and potentially prevent this film from having its widest possible audience.
And, third, this investigation is being opened in the wake of misleading attacks on the purpose of the Cuba trip from a possible leading Republican candidate for president, Fred Thompson, a major conservative newspaper, The New York Post, and various right wing blogs.
For five and a half years, the Bush administration has ignored and neglected the heroes of the 9/11 community. These heroic first responders have been left to fend for themselves, without coverage and without care. I understand why the Bush administration is coming after me -- I have tried to help the very people they refuse to help, but until George W. Bush outlaws helping your fellow man, I have broken no laws and I have nothing to hide.
I demand that the Bush Administration immediately end this investigation and spend its time and resources trying to support some of the real heroes of 9/11.
Sincerely,
Michael Moore
Truman was the one who started funding the French in Vietnam. It might have made sense to do so then as we were in the Korean War. Ike could have gotten us out as Vietnam really didn't have much strategic value to us after Korea, but he choose not to. Instead he rigged elections so we had an excuse to stay. That was our first mistake and why I lay the majority of the responsibility on Ike.
We don't know for sure what Kennedy would have done had he not been assainated, but he had to play the hand that was already dealt. I think Kennedy expanded the training/advisors and let them actually go out with the troops they were training and fight, but it was Johnson who removed all the stops.
About as long as it takes Karl Rove to get convicted
Karl Rove also has stated he has done nothing as wrong, so let's call off that investigation too.
see how that works? 😉
I know this is going to disappoint you, but no one worth mentioning is calling for MM's head. Unlike the democrat response to this sort of thing, we usually don't break out the pitchforks and torches everytime we see the word "investigation" 🙂
Lemon law
Lifer
Regardless what happens to Mr. Moore---the Sicko will be shown---and I certainly hope in will open up a national dialog on health care. And maybe even drive some of the money grubbers from the health care temple that should be regarded as a national birthright.
Maybe this country will eventually awaken---and award a freedom Medal to Moore--who deserves it one hell of a lot more than people like Tenet.
I thank God that Moore had the smarts and integrity to make sure that only the messenger and not the message is all that can be attacked. I doubt a jury will vote to convict
making it but one more embarrassment to the thought police. Sicko is one of the few movies I would pay to see.
Let the sunshine in scares the hell out of GWB&co.
Maybe this country will eventually awaken---and award a freedom Medal to Moore--who deserves it one hell of a lot more than people like Tenet.
I thank God that Moore had the smarts and integrity to make sure that only the messenger and not the message is all that can be attacked. I doubt a jury will vote to convict
making it but one more embarrassment to the thought police. Sicko is one of the few movies I would pay to see.
Let the sunshine in scares the hell out of GWB&co.
imported_Lothar
Diamond Member
JFK didn't lead us to Vietnam.
imported_Lothar
Diamond Member
They're both stupid. How about that? 😉
Whatever the case, it's pretty clear that this is nothing but a publicity stunt Moore is pulling to promote his film, and arresting him will only make him earn millions of dollars more from it.
Hell, I haven't heard anything on Michael Moore since the mid-term elections.
This incident will earn him more money than ever required to post bail or reach a settlement.
ProfJohn
Lifer
Healthcare is not a ?right?
A right is something that requires no action from anyone else in support of your ?right.?
Free speech is an example; you can say anything you want and no one else is obligated to take any kind of action or expend money or effort based on what you say.
Healthcare is not a ?right? because it requires you to impose on others.
In order for you to get healthcare someone else must spend time and effort to provide you with that health care. And that time and effort takes money.
I don?t want to go on, but if you really think healthcare is a ?right? then maybe you should look at moving to one of the countries that has free healthcare. (Be sure to write about how great the system is too.)
theeedude
Lifer
There are plenty of countries where healthcare is a right. Also emergency healthcare is already a right since hospitals can't refuse emergency care to anyone regardless of ability to pay, and ER care certainly requires action of others to support, so your definition doesn't work.
Lemon law
Lifer
Once again non Prof John shows he does not understand rights when he says---Free speech is an example; you can say anything you want and no one else is obligated to take any kind of action or expend money or effort based on what you say.
In that is true---why is GWB&co. so damn afraid of Micheal Moore using his free speech rights to make a film----and felt compelled to get back at Joe Wilson when he debunked their claim
of Uranium from Niger. And its also why I feel compelled to act when someone's free speech rights are violated--regardless if I agree with what they say or not.
Many countries regard healthcare as a national birthright---and sorry Johnney--I am staying here to help see that the good ole USA is added to that list. But it must really eat your guts to see that Castro is more humane and compassionate than GWB&co.
In that is true---why is GWB&co. so damn afraid of Micheal Moore using his free speech rights to make a film----and felt compelled to get back at Joe Wilson when he debunked their claim
of Uranium from Niger. And its also why I feel compelled to act when someone's free speech rights are violated--regardless if I agree with what they say or not.
Many countries regard healthcare as a national birthright---and sorry Johnney--I am staying here to help see that the good ole USA is added to that list. But it must really eat your guts to see that Castro is more humane and compassionate than GWB&co.
Are you talking about healt care "system" or the way the country is run? When it comes to healtcare provided / cost the american "system" is by far the worst in the world by spending 40% more pr. capita than any other country in the world (1999). U.S. is also the only country in the world (afaik) without a universal health care system.
imported_Tango
Golden Member
Correct. On a performance/per-capita expenditures the US heathcare is the worst among developed countries.
It shouldn't be a surprise, considering health-care and pharma companies can basically bill your insurance whatever they want. A lot of drugs used here in the US are available overseas as generics for 1/20th of the price.
theeedude
Lifer
I am looking forward to this movie. No one has answered to my satisfaction how Cuba spends 1/10th or less of what we do on healthcare per capita, yet has similar life expectancy.
I am hoping this movie will. Now, it may not be applicable to our situation, but we need to learn lessons from every country out there before we attempt to fix our own system, even if the right in this country wants to remain ignorant and shout slogans about how we are the best healthcare system in the world.
I am hoping this movie will. Now, it may not be applicable to our situation, but we need to learn lessons from every country out there before we attempt to fix our own system, even if the right in this country wants to remain ignorant and shout slogans about how we are the best healthcare system in the world.
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