Meet my Working Class Roommate

[woolfe9998]

The justification for shortcuts are many. I personally felt his point was not what others thought it was, but, even if I agreed with them I would see no reason to be so angry and lash out. When someone disagrees with me, I want to know why. What I often see are others that see disagreement and then attack.

I didn't really see much point in ivwshane's attack either. But I think I understand his reason even though his style isn't mine. He is probably in no mood right now for anything that even remotely sounds like an excuse for voter apathy.

 

[DrunkenSano]

I didn't say it was pointless, I said in most states its "nearly worthless". I think that's pretty clear, but if you want to make a thread about it I'd be happy to debate it with you, it's not really my point here.

I understand what you mean, I don't vote because in my state of New Jersey, voting is pretty much useless here as well. Democratic candidate pretty much win the presidential election here by a landslide so it's pretty much pointless for me to go out there and cast yet another vote in the same direction. I have more important things to do in my life and cherish my free time after mentally exhausting hours of work. I can see how your roommate has gotten himself into his current situation, I have a feeling that he is an introvert as well so there isn't a high drive in his life to go out and meet people. At least he has you and maybe if you and your family is interested, inviting him on familial gatherings that you have since his own has more or less abandoned him.

I didn't really see much point in ivwshane's attack either. But I think I understand his reason even though his style isn't mine. He is probably in no mood right now for anything that even remotely sounds like an excuse for voter apathy.

A lot of people are very triggered by what happened with the Trump election and will lash out at anyone that doesn't appear to be doing what they can to get out and prevent it from happening. He doesn't understand the reality that the way our government is set up, a lot of people can't do much unless they divert a LOT of their time into politics, which I am not surprised many are against as they hate politics. Hell, politics has caused insane strife between family, loved ones, close friends in this election and that's a shame. Almost like bloodless civil war, very ugly, brother against brother, etc. A good friend of mine, his brother-in-law gets super triggered anytime Trump is mentioned and has broken off friendships with a lot of people who aren't raving anti-Trump people as well. Some people have enough to deal with in their own daily lives to focus a ton of energy on politics.

 

[Blackjack200]

You are catching heat because you are challenging people's morals here. Many see voting as a moral thing to do. When you say that act of morality is pointless, you are saying that this moral thing is pointless. Because people cannot disassociate and objectively assess their moral positions, they instead attack anything that challenges them. If you do anything other than accept the inherent moral nature of something like this, you will catch heat.

I warn you of this because regardless of your intent or motivations, you will be attacked. If you do not mind this, then go ahead. If you do not wish to be attacked, then you should move on.

I don't want to get pulled too far off topic here, because I think this is a real rabbit hole, but I think it would be fun to have a thread about voting and its importance in another thread. I'm quite conflicted myself.

 

[ivwshane]

I understand what you mean, I don't vote because in my state of New Jersey, voting is pretty much useless here as well. Democratic candidate pretty much win the presidential election here by a landslide so it's pretty much pointless for me to go out there and cast yet another vote in the same direction. I have more important things to do in my life and cherish my free time after mentally exhausting hours of work. I can see how your roommate has gotten himself into his current situation, I have a feeling that he is an introvert as well so there isn't a high drive in his life to go out and meet people. At least he has you and maybe if you and your family is interested, inviting him on familial gatherings that you have since his own has more or less abandoned him.



A lot of people are very triggered by what happened with the Trump election and will lash out at anyone that doesn't appear to be doing what they can to get out and prevent it from happening. He doesn't understand the reality that the way our government is set up, a lot of people can't do much unless they divert a LOT of their time into politics, which I am not surprised many are against as they hate politics. Hell, politics has caused insane strife between family, loved ones, close friends in this election and that's a shame. Almost like bloodless civil war, very ugly, brother against brother, etc. A good friend of mine, his brother-in-law gets super triggered anytime Trump is mentioned and has broken off friendships with a lot of people who aren't raving anti-Trump people as well. Some people have enough to deal with in their own daily lives to focus a ton of energy on politics.

Not really. You can skip a lot of the political bs and simply read up on what measures are being proposed locally as well as looking up what your current representatives have voted on. It takes less time than responding or checking your Facebook page daily.

 

[Blackjack200]

I understand what you mean, I don't vote because in my state of New Jersey, voting is pretty much useless here as well. Democratic candidate pretty much win the presidential election here by a landslide so it's pretty much pointless for me to go out there and cast yet another vote in the same direction. I have more important things to do in my life and cherish my free time after mentally exhausting hours of work. I can see how your roommate has gotten himself into his current situation, I have a feeling that he is an introvert as well so there isn't a high drive in his life to go out and meet people. At least he has you and maybe if you and your family is interested, inviting him on familial gatherings that you have since his own has more or less abandoned him.

Yes, I'm in New Jersey too. I probably actually will vote, because I share the sense of alarm that people have over the midterms, and I think its important to keep a Democrat in the senate, as repugnant as I find Bob Menendez.

I wouldn't really say that my roommate has "gotten himself into" any situation. I think he's living his life as best as he can, and while his alienation and isolation are certainly not good, he finds a way to cope and do things that he enjoys.

A lot of people are very triggered by what happened with the Trump election and will lash out at anyone that doesn't appear to be doing what they can to get out and prevent it from happening. He doesn't understand the reality that the way our government is set up, a lot of people can't do much unless they divert a LOT of their time into politics, which I am not surprised many are against as they hate politics. Hell, politics has caused insane strife between family, loved ones, close friends in this election and that's a shame. Almost like bloodless civil war, very ugly, brother against brother, etc. A good friend of mine, his brother-in-law gets super triggered anytime Trump is mentioned and has broken off friendships with a lot of people who aren't raving anti-Trump people as well. Some people have enough to deal with in their own daily lives to focus a ton of energy on politics.

I think of that ballot measure in DC to get rid of the tipped minimum wage. People did everything that you're supposed to: they organized, they campaigned they went out and voted, and they passed the measure in the face of a powerful restaurant lobby.

https://www.nbcwashington.com/blogs...inimum-Wage-for-Tipped-Workers-485981061.html

And then the DC Council promply ignored the wishes of the voters and overturned the measure.

https://www.lexology.com/library/detail.aspx?g=b3358278-3d55-4fa1-a48a-79f0289db79d

I don't blame people for getting disillusioned with voting, at the same time none of this reasons really explains why my roommate doesn't vote or why he's politically disengaged.[/QUOTE]

 

[DigDog]

Buy a bong.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

The saying goes that the greatest threat to democracy isn't picking the wrong side, it's apathy.

Yeah, your vote won't matter a huge amount, but the important point is that you care. It might inspire you to participate in votes and other political actions where you'll make more of a difference, and it could encourage your friends and family to do the same.

To me, the "what difference does it make" routine is akin to sitting in a boat and refusing to paddle because the current is going against you. Yeah, you might not get to where you'd like to go in a quick fashion, or even at all, but the point is to try. You can't complain about going over the waterfall if you just sat there assuming your fate was sealed.

I suggest you consider Russel Brand's opinions. Our "democracy" is hardly that. Our candidates we pick are first picked for us. The DNC made sure Hillary would be the candidate and Republicans make sure one school of thought is permitted as well.

We have almost no true alternatives. You get an approved Republican or Democrat who are part of the problem. Do you think either party has the will or intelligence to deal with a climate problem that has an ever decreasing window of opportunity? Not a chance. That is why we're screwed. Taxation isn't going to do it. Regulation? No. No law will fix the problem in time. Something bold and on the order of magnitude equal to Apollo or Manhattan or greater. Who is equipped to do this?

No one.

 

[realibrad]

I didn't really see much point in ivwshane's attack either. But I think I understand his reason even though his style isn't mine. He is probably in no mood right now for anything that even remotely sounds like an excuse for voter apathy.

He probably isn't, but, he can't realize that is his flaw. His overreaction is the equivalent of voting for Trump ironically. Not as damaging though.

 

[realibrad]

I don't want to get pulled too far off topic here, because I think this is a real rabbit hole, but I think it would be fun to have a thread about voting and its importance in another thread. I'm quite conflicted myself.

We had it. Same guy was just as angry and attacking.

 

[Blackjack200]

We had it. Same guy was just as angry and attacking.

Shocking.

 

[realibrad]

Shocking.

Talking is tacit support of the wrong side.

 

[ivwshane]

He probably isn't, but, he can't realize that is his flaw. His overreaction is the equivalent of voting for Trump ironically. Not as damaging though.

Still not addressing the OP's post.

Quibbles the quibbler strikes again!

 

[Jaskalas]

When I say that living with this guy is illuminating, its because its helped me see a lot of parallels in my own life. At a glance, it seems like I have things much better. I make more money at a less stressful job. I have a large family that I'm very close to, I have a circle of friends (although not a group that I hang out with socially on a regular basis). But I also spend a lot of my money on things to help with my own anxiety. Junk food, sports, technology, etc. I'm living in the same society that he is, and suffering from a lot of the same alienation and isolation that he is. Sure, I have a political philosophy and I vote, but so what?

My brain is just melting trying to find some connection, some narrative reason why all this would eventually end up describing political apathy. I'm sorry, did you think you would find fulfillment somewhere, and it'd involve politics? Certainly not on P&N. So then... Where? What? Who? Why? What are you doing politically to derive an expectation that your "political philosophy" meant something in tangent with a description of your roomie?

Lost, seeking meaning.

I mean, is the point that you were supposed to snub your nose and look down on him, but then saw yourself in his reflection? Is this post a moment into how shocked you are?

 

[realibrad]

Still not addressing the OP's post.

Quibbles the quibbler strikes again!

What do you see as a quibble? Do you understand what that means?

 

[Blackjack200]

My brain is just melting trying to find some connection, some narrative reason why all this would eventually end up describing political apathy. I'm sorry, did you think you would find fulfillment somewhere, and it'd involve politics? Certainly not on P&N. So then... Where? What? Who? Why? What are you doing politically to derive an expectation that your "political philosophy" meant something in tangent with a description of your roomie?

Lost, seeking meaning.

I mean, is the point that you were supposed to snub your nose and look down on him, but then saw yourself in his reflection? Is this post a moment into how shocked you are?

Again, I don't think I'm apathetical. I think I'm just examining my life and pointing out that the political things that I do do, voting and posting on message boards, are not impactful.

 

[ivwshane]

Again, I don't think I'm apathetical. I think I'm just examining my life and pointing out that the political things that I do do, voting and posting on message boards, are not impactful.

Yeah, so what are you going to do about it?

You've got a real live person living right fucking next to you and you don't have the balls to talk politics with him because his views seem contrary to yours. If you can't even make an impact on someone you see daily how do you think you will make an impact voting once a year and posting on a message board with no one you know personally or who you see daily?

Do you know what differentiates a successful person from one who is not? Its how they handle negative stressors.
The successful person will be willing to accept reality and be willing to blame themselves when it was indeed their fault.
The loser (yeah I'm being harsh) will say they suck and that will never change or be better or they will blame others as conspiring against them (the world is against them, the system is rigged, etc).
The winner will look at their situation and figure out how make it better. The loser won't.

If you want to make an impact then go do it. If you just want to complain and pity yourself then shut the fuck up and do it somewhere else. This is a political forum, not a self help forum.

 

[Jaskalas]

Again, I don't think I'm apathetical. I think I'm just examining my life and pointing out that the political things that I do do, voting and posting on message boards, are not impactful.

I think what I read in the OP is that you've empathized with him. Which is good, a perfectly normal, and human thing to do. So you've drawn parallels and even gone so far as to wonder if, ultimately, political difference has no impact. Granted, I suspect you'd only give benefit of the doubt to someone who is as neutral and apathetic as he appears to be. You'd hate his guts if he was already hooked on Hannity and spewing racist shit at Obama years ago, VS signing love songs for Trump today.

If the gist of this was purely politics, your roomie wouldn't be a factor. We'd simply tell you to move to a swing state.

 

[woolfe9998]

Again, I don't think I'm apathetical. I think I'm just examining my life and pointing out that the political things that I do do, voting and posting on message boards, are not impactful.

Then either do more, or decide that you have other priorities and do not do more, but then don't worry yourself over it because you've made a choice.

But do vote please, early and often.

 

[dank69]

Honest question... in what way would you try to get him interested in politics?

You've got to be careful here, which is why I suggested not talking politics with him. From the little I have to go on, he seems like a MAGAtard just waiting to happen:

Reason(s) to hate black people.
Identifies with Kavanaugh rather than Ford.

You get him interested and he could easily go down the rabbit hole and the next thing you know we have another Fox News dittohead or worse, a guy buying his monthly supply of fluoride blocker.

 

[Ichinisan]

Read OP to the end. I'll read the thread later to see if we find out more about you, OP

 

[Blackjack200]

I think what I read in the OP is that you've empathized with him. Which is good, a perfectly normal, and human thing to do. So you've drawn parallels and even gone so far as to wonder if, ultimately, political difference has no impact. Granted, I suspect you'd only give benefit of the doubt to someone who is as neutral and apathetic as he appears to be. You'd hate his guts if he was already hooked on Hannity and spewing racist shit at Obama years ago, VS signing love songs for Trump today.

If the gist of this was purely politics, your roomie wouldn't be a factor. We'd simply tell you to move to a swing state.

I have a hard time with the hypothetical because I think Hannity is one of the most hateful people on TV today. His base is resentful reactionaries, and I don't really think that describes my roommate at all. I don't think Hannity would ever appeal to him. I think for someone like my roommate to like Hannity, they'd have to be turned onto it by someone else, and I don't think he really has that kind of influence in his life.

I guess this isn't really so much about his politics as such, more of a profile of what one working class person's life is like, and trying to understand why they may not be politically engaged.

 

[Blackjack200]

Then either do more, or decide that you have other priorities and do not do more, but then don't worry yourself over it because you've made a choice.

But do vote please, early and often.

I guess where I struggle is to figure out what it is I should do. I've tried different things, and some things bring me more satisfaction than others. Honestly though, my own circumstances could be a whole other thread!

 

[Blackjack200]

You've got to be careful here, which is why I suggested not talking politics with him. From the little I have to go on, he seems like a MAGAtard just waiting to happen:

Reason(s) to hate black people.
Identifies with Kavanaugh rather than Ford.

You get him interested and he could easily go down the rabbit hole and the next thing you know we have another Fox News dittohead or worse, a guy buying his monthly supply of fluoride blocker.

Yeah, I don't think he hates black people. At the same time, he has some attitudes that I do think are racist. The Kavanaugh thing was weird, like, I have no idea where that came from, and I almost think he had to be repeating something someone else said to him.

I think the full on MAGA chuds are a different breed entirely. I'm not saying he couldn't turn into that, but it would take some doing.

This is not directed at you, but I think I should emphasize that this guy might not be political, but he definitely has his opinions and he's his own person. He's not really looking for someone to tell him what he should be worrying about.

 

[Jaskalas]

I guess this isn't really so much about his politics as such, more of a profile of what one working class person's life is like, and trying to understand why they may not be politically engaged.

You said he doesn't have a social circle. What about social media? Anyone not engaged in twitter is going to lack the hardwired political polarization and raw seething hatred of others our society has fostered since the '16 election.

That, or maybe he just said !@#$ this noise and just watches cat videos.

 

[dank69]

Yeah, I don't think he hates black people. At the same time, he has some attitudes that I do think are racist. The Kavanaugh thing was weird, like, I have no idea where that came from, and I almost think he had to be repeating something someone else said to him.

I think the full on MAGA chuds are a different breed entirely. I'm not saying he couldn't turn into that, but it would take some doing.

This is not directed at you, but I think I should emphasize that this guy might not be political, but he definitely has his opinions and he's his own person. He's not really looking for someone to tell him what he should be worrying about.

Right, he might not hate them now but he already has racist attitudes. That's one point for the GOP. I believe you when you say you think he was repeating the Kavanaugh talking point. Laborers, even unionized laborers today, love them some Trump and love them some sweet GOP talking points. They appeal to ignorant people and people without the ability to think critically.