Meet my Working Class Roommate

[Blackjack200]

You said he doesn't have a social circle. What about social media? Anyone not engaged in twitter is going to lack the hardwired political polarization and raw seething hatred of others our society has fostered since the '16 election.

That, or maybe he just said !@#$ this noise and just watches cat videos.

I actually don't think he uses Facebook or Twitter at all. I'm sure he doesn't use Instagram. He does watch YouTube videos, but he doesn't watch those insane political channels, he mostly watches tech stuff.

Right, he might not hate them now but he already has racist attitudes. That's one point for the GOP. I believe you when you say you think he was repeating the Kavanaugh talking point. Laborers, even unionized laborers today, love them some Trump and love them some sweet GOP talking points. They appeal to ignorant people and people without the ability to think critically.

I don't think he has any deeply held attitudes about race or women, and I don't really think he fits the type that would become hateful GOP type. He really is mostly worried about videos games, tv shows, movies, and shit.

 

[interchange]

I'm wondering what you think the differences are between you? Do you think there's a difference in your intelligence? Work ethic? Interpersonal ability? Etc.

Reading between the lines it seems as though you have a sense of a common human thread between you but are almost lacking a language to connect to each other on it.

I see that quite commonly, and I don't mean an actual language, dialect, accent, slang, etc. I think the biggest limitation we have as people is our own idea of who we are and can be. On the one hand, expanding the possibilities of how we might see ourselves or who we might become seems like a no-brainer desire. And yet, if we destabilize our sense of who we are and who other people are and who we are in relation to other people, that is a huge source of anxiety and need to regulate. Many people have a hard time with that stability without intentionally trying to expand their identity, and it's common we deal with that by isolation, substance use, denigration of others, etc.

So if it's so hard to do, how do we grow? What makes it easier is having good models of people we can relate to now but also look up to and imagine we can become like. This is where I think America is most failing. We are becoming even more isolated from each other and stereotyped in our identifications. And when others treat us under that stereotype or when we have trouble stepping out of it, it makes us angry. Often we take that out against those who we can't identify with.

As an illustration, I think the best leaders in history are people who seem to be able to be used by others as a model to grow toward. People like MLK who provided a bridge for easing racial tension not by ending racist practice but by connecting to each other. And critically those leaders are vilified by many who fear that bridge because they are too fragile in their identity to grow. And those who vilify can also be overtly hostile. But what particularly marks such a transformative leader is their capacity to accept the hate thrown at them. Not tolerate exactly, but truly accept it because they recognize it as an aspect of normal humanity present in them as well.

 

[realibrad]

I'm wondering what you think the differences are between you? Do you think there's a difference in your intelligence? Work ethic? Interpersonal ability? Etc.

Reading between the lines it seems as though you have a sense of a common human thread between you but are almost lacking a language to connect to each other on it.

I see that quite commonly, and I don't mean an actual language, dialect, accent, slang, etc. I think the biggest limitation we have as people is our own idea of who we are and can be. On the one hand, expanding the possibilities of how we might see ourselves or who we might become seems like a no-brainer desire. And yet, if we destabilize our sense of who we are and who other people are and who we are in relation to other people, that is a huge source of anxiety and need to regulate. Many people have a hard time with that stability without intentionally trying to expand their identity, and it's common we deal with that by isolation, substance use, denigration of others, etc.

So if it's so hard to do, how do we grow? What makes it easier is having good models of people we can relate to now but also look up to and imagine we can become like. This is where I think America is most failing. We are becoming even more isolated from each other and stereotyped in our identifications. And when others treat us under that stereotype or when we have trouble stepping out of it, it makes us angry. Often we take that out against those who we can't identify with.

As an illustration, I think the best leaders in history are people who seem to be able to be used by others as a model to grow toward. People like MLK who provided a bridge for easing racial tension not by ending racist practice but by connecting to each other. And critically those leaders are vilified by many who fear that bridge because they are too fragile in their identity to grow. And those who vilify can also be overtly hostile. But what particularly marks such a transformative leader is their capacity to accept the hate thrown at them. Not tolerate exactly, but truly accept it because they recognize it as an aspect of normal humanity present in them as well.

Can you expand on what you mean by hate?


Also, MLK today would not fly as he would have his personal life exposed and that would get him dismissed.

 

[interchange]

Can you expand on what you mean by hate?

Hate is a desire to destroy something a person could not tolerate seeing within themselves. It is possible to hate an identity of a person and not the whole person. An action of hate is always destructive. Not necessarily physically so, but for example to exclude the possibility of an identification of possessing value. In order to hate something, you must be able to appreciate the thing within yourself but have it so unacceptable for you to identify with that thing that it must be destroyed altogether. This makes hate extremely powerful because someone who hates understands quite exquisitely the thing they hate. Here is where @Moonbeam would explain that what we actually hate is ourselves and we also create what we hate. To that last part, I might say instead that we never succeed in actually destroying what we hate because what we hate is ourselves, so we are destined to keep finding objects to substitute for that hated self in order to destroy all over again.

Depending on your lexicon, hate might be the converse of empathy or it might be the version of empathy where what is shared is intolerable to experience. Kohut said that the Nazis used perfect empathy to subjugate the Jews.

Also, MLK today would not fly as he would have his personal life exposed and that would get him dismissed.

Not sure I agree, but it would be sad if rigidly true. I'm not sure someone is capable of being a transformative leader without something in their past that could be dismissing.

 

[realibrad]

Hate is a desire to destroy something a person could not tolerate seeing within themselves. It is possible to hate an identity of a person and not the whole person. An action of hate is always destructive. Not necessarily physically so, but for example to exclude the possibility of an identification of possessing value. In order to hate something, you must be able to appreciate the thing within yourself but have it so unacceptable for you to identify with that thing that it must be destroyed altogether. This makes hate extremely powerful because someone who hates understands quite exquisitely the thing they hate. Here is where @Moonbeam would explain that what we actually hate is ourselves and we also create what we hate. To that last part, I might say instead that we never succeed in actually destroying what we hate because what we hate is ourselves, so we are destined to keep finding objects to substitute for that hated self in order to destroy all over again.

Depending on your lexicon, hate might be the converse of empathy or it might be the version of empathy where what is shared is intolerable to experience. Kohut said that the Nazis used perfect empathy to subjugate the Jews.



Not sure I agree, but it would be sad if rigidly true. I'm not sure someone is capable of being a transformative leader without something in their past that could be dismissing.

Would wanting people to not do bad things to others he the equivalent of wanting to destroy?
There are things that I don't like but I don't know if it rises to hate.

I was just taking to my fiancee about something I think it's similar. She asked if I ever got really upset over something on principal. I'm still trying to work through that. I feel l must but I can't recall. I often feel like my reactions are not as deep as others. I have been trying to explore the idea of hate because I'm not so sure now I understand it as well as I thought.

 

[Jaskalas]

She asked if I ever got really upset over something on principal.

People being guilty until proven innocent, where the public can act as a mob and destroy people's lives. For that injustice I can feel pure rage. Perhaps it stems from fear of being a potential victim of it. Perhaps more-so than a random act of violence, because shootings / stabbings are not legally sanctioned, but the "court of public opinion" is. Slander and libel are apparently something people can openly do to others, so long as they are smart in how they approach it.

Housing in this nation. That situation is deeply upsetting. More of a sadness / fear of the risk. Not sure I have a vocal proponent of it to get mad at. Least not yet.

Is that the sort of thing?

 

[interchange]

Would wanting people to not do bad things to others he the equivalent of wanting to destroy?
There are things that I don't like but I don't know if it rises to hate.

I was just taking to my fiancee about something I think it's similar. She asked if I ever got really upset over something on principal. I'm still trying to work through that. I feel l must but I can't recall. I often feel like my reactions are not as deep as others. I have been trying to explore the idea of hate because I'm not so sure now I understand it as well as I thought.

Not so stated, but we all hate. Probably more likely that what you are describing is reflective of a defense against experiencing hate.

 

[realibrad]

People being guilty until proven innocent, where the public can act as a mob and destroy people's lives. For that injustice I can feel pure rage. Perhaps it stems from fear of being a potential victim of it. Perhaps more-so than a random act of violence, because shootings / stabbings are not legally sanctioned, but the "court of public opinion" is. Slander and libel are apparently something people can openly do to others, so long as they are smart in how they approach it.

Housing in this nation. That situation is deeply upsetting. More of a sadness / fear of the risk. Not sure I have a vocal proponent of it to get mad at. Least not yet.

Is that the sort of thing?

I don't like mob actions, but, I would not say my feelings are rage.

I was once in a situation in Miami at a mall where people thought there was a shooting. People were running and screaming and then burst into the restaurant were me and my GF were eating. It was like a scene from a movie where zombies came flooding in. Tables and chairs were flung aside and people were scared out of their minds. This put my GF into a panic. I got an adrenaline equal to playing laser tag. My senses felt heightened but not the point where I got tunnel vision. Everyone including myself thought the situation was real, and after about 3 hours we were escorted out by swat. The next day was when we found out that there was likely never a shooter.

Now, I was able to stay clam and relaxed considering, and, driving on the way home I would say I felt fine. My GF had ptsd and needed to see someone after. She experienced moments of panic thinking about it for weeks after. It took about a month for her to be able to go into a sit-down restaurant and even then you could see she was jumpy. It took her a good 3 months for me to not notice that she was feeling anything. As she was starting to calm down, her fear turned to anger at people. Anger for the person(s) that started the panic. Anger at how others around us were erratic. Anger at the IKEA that messed up our order and was the reason we were down there.

I felt none of that. It was just a story that happened in my life really. Life got busy and we had other things come up. We recently got to talking about things like we do, and were talking about religion and how it can drive people to hate. I'm not religious but she is. That got us onto the topic of hate and anger which lead to that question about me. The shooting came up, and I could not say I hated anyone or anything. I started digging through my mind, and I cannot say I hate anything. I have been angry, but, I would not call it hate ever.

I don't like suffering and would gladly help anyone even if they don't like me. There is not a person on this forum that I would not try to help if I thought I could, and there are some people here that really don't like me.

 

[realibrad]

Not so stated, but we all hate. Probably more likely that what you are describing is reflective of a defense against experiencing hate.

That is quite possible. I think I was very emotionally guarded when I was younger. The last time I cried was around the 6th grade. I feel sadness and I get choked up, but never to the point of crying. I think I may have hardened myself too much and I have actually been trying to soften myself a bit. I feel I have gained a much greater depth in terms of emotions and the ability to empathize. I think I have internalized what I think is a protection from being hateful. I will have to dig deeper.

 

[Moonbeam]

People being guilty until proven innocent, where the public can act as a mob and destroy people's lives. For that injustice I can feel pure rage. Perhaps it stems from fear of being a potential victim of it. Perhaps more-so than a random act of violence, because shootings / stabbings are not legally sanctioned, but the "court of public opinion" is. Slander and libel are apparently something people can openly do to others, so long as they are smart in how they approach it.

Housing in this nation. That situation is deeply upsetting. More of a sadness / fear of the risk. Not sure I have a vocal proponent of it to get mad at. Least not yet.

Is that the sort of thing?

 

[Moonbeam]

[QUOTE="Jaskalas, post: 39608916, member: 137030" Perhaps it stems from fear of being a potential victim of it. Perhaps more-so than a random act of violence, because shootings / stabbings are not legally sanctioned, but the "court of public opinion" is. [/QUOTE]
I believe the answer is fundamentally simpler. I think you have already experienced it in the past and the rage had to be repressed and seeing it fresh awakens those old feelings. You were warned what would happen if you tried to resist and didn't buckle under and you hate yourself because you did. And if you let go you will know you also hate those who did that to you, your loving self sacrificing wonderful dedicated parents.

 

[Josephus312]

I've been thinking about making this thread for some time. I won't get into the details of how this came about, but for the last couple of months I've been roommates with a white 33 year old working class man. I've certainly known plenty of working class people, and had working class friends, but living day to day with this person some of his habits and attitudes are striking, and I think illuminating as well.

First thing I'll say about him is that he's a very nice guy. He clearly wants people to like him when he interacts with them, and he's easy to get along with. He's tidy and cleans up after himself.

The first striking thing about him is his spending habits. I don't know how much money he makes, I would guess $40k or less. He spends his money on electronics (annual smartphone upgrades, smart watch, VR system, gaming computer, consoles, games) vaping supplies, beer, and collectable toys. I've come to see all these things as coping mechanisms for the stress he feels from his job, and his lack of a real social network.

As far as his job goes, he has a physically intense and stressful job. He does not get along with his boss at all, and has told me that his boss frequently calls him "***************" or "cracker" (his boss is black). His theory (and I agree with him) is that his boss doesn't like him because he's a good performer and well liked by regional management. In fact, the regional manager will occasionally visit my roommate's workplace and tell him what a good job he's doing, and he'll get backlash from his boss following those visits. So he works ~ 45-50 hours a week at this place, and is frequently stressed out and upset when he gets home.

Once home, he'll usually have 3-5 beers and a small dinner. He vapes constantly so I wonder if that affects his appetite. I mentioned that he doesn't really have a social network. The only family that he has is his father. That relationship is tenuous, and he doesn't like to visit his father because his father's new wife doesn't want him around. He listens to me when I'm on the phone with my brother and he's said to me a few times that he wishes he had someone that he could talk to like that.

He doesn't really seem to have any kind of political philosophy, and he's only said a few things to me about political news. He said that he couldn't believe that they were trying to blame Kavanaugh for stuff that happened 35 years ago, and he once said something about not being sure if Trump would make it to the end of his term of if 'they would get rid of him'. I just kind of shrugged my shoulders in both cases because I didn't really want to have those conversations. I'm pretty sure he doesn't vote.

When I say that living with this guy is illuminating, its because its helped me see a lot of parallels in my own life. At a glance, it seems like I have things much better. I make more money at a less stressful job. I have a large family that I'm very close to, I have a circle of friends (although not a group that I hang out with socially on a regular basis). But I also spend a lot of my money on things to help with my own anxiety. Junk food, sports, technology, etc. I'm living in the same society that he is, and suffering from a lot of the same alienation and isolation that he is. Sure, I have a political philosophy and I vote, but so what? Voting is nearly worthless in all but a few states, and its certainly worthless in mine. So my political life is basically getting upset at things and posting on message boards. Who cares?

Congrats if you made to the end, you probably have a better attention span than me.

Empathy is one of the worst and the best things we espouse, I think that things will turn out quite different for the two of you and that is because you are inherently an empathic person who cares not only about himself but of others too while he is sort of the opposite.

Only thing I can say is that if you're not working out, start working out and the food choices that go with that will follow. It's really helpful and will boost your confidence and expand your social circle too as well as improve your over all health. You'll sleep better and be in a better mood.

And voting is NEVER worthless, don't you let anyone tell you that it is because things do change and even though the system is rigged beyond all natural democratic prospects it can actually change with enough people voting.

I get the feeling of hopelessness and despair on the system we have but it is the system we have *for now* and it is subject to change as districts turn.

 

[Atreus21]

I've been thinking about making this thread for some time. I won't get into the details of how this came about, but for the last couple of months I've been roommates with a white 33 year old working class man. I've certainly known plenty of working class people, and had working class friends, but living day to day with this person some of his habits and attitudes are striking, and I think illuminating as well.

First thing I'll say about him is that he's a very nice guy. He clearly wants people to like him when he interacts with them, and he's easy to get along with. He's tidy and cleans up after himself.

The first striking thing about him is his spending habits. I don't know how much money he makes, I would guess $40k or less. He spends his money on electronics (annual smartphone upgrades, smart watch, VR system, gaming computer, consoles, games) vaping supplies, beer, and collectable toys. I've come to see all these things as coping mechanisms for the stress he feels from his job, and his lack of a real social network.

As far as his job goes, he has a physically intense and stressful job. He does not get along with his boss at all, and has told me that his boss frequently calls him "***************" or "cracker" (his boss is black). His theory (and I agree with him) is that his boss doesn't like him because he's a good performer and well liked by regional management. In fact, the regional manager will occasionally visit my roommate's workplace and tell him what a good job he's doing, and he'll get backlash from his boss following those visits. So he works ~ 45-50 hours a week at this place, and is frequently stressed out and upset when he gets home.

Once home, he'll usually have 3-5 beers and a small dinner. He vapes constantly so I wonder if that affects his appetite. I mentioned that he doesn't really have a social network. The only family that he has is his father. That relationship is tenuous, and he doesn't like to visit his father because his father's new wife doesn't want him around. He listens to me when I'm on the phone with my brother and he's said to me a few times that he wishes he had someone that he could talk to like that.

He doesn't really seem to have any kind of political philosophy, and he's only said a few things to me about political news. He said that he couldn't believe that they were trying to blame Kavanaugh for stuff that happened 35 years ago, and he once said something about not being sure if Trump would make it to the end of his term of if 'they would get rid of him'. I just kind of shrugged my shoulders in both cases because I didn't really want to have those conversations. I'm pretty sure he doesn't vote.

When I say that living with this guy is illuminating, its because its helped me see a lot of parallels in my own life. At a glance, it seems like I have things much better. I make more money at a less stressful job. I have a large family that I'm very close to, I have a circle of friends (although not a group that I hang out with socially on a regular basis). But I also spend a lot of my money on things to help with my own anxiety. Junk food, sports, technology, etc. I'm living in the same society that he is, and suffering from a lot of the same alienation and isolation that he is. Sure, I have a political philosophy and I vote, but so what? Voting is nearly worthless in all but a few states, and its certainly worthless in mine. So my political life is basically getting upset at things and posting on message boards. Who cares?

Congrats if you made to the end, you probably have a better attention span than me.

Read the whole thing. Thoughts:

• Anyone with a large family with whom they're generally on good terms should count their blessings. It's a precious redoubt of sanity.

• This guy would profit by more friends and it's good you've provided him that.

• You were also wise to avoid political entanglements unless clearly called for.

 

[Moonbeam]

That is quite possible. I think I was very emotionally guarded when I was younger. The last time I cried was around the 6th grade. I feel sadness and I get choked up, but never to the point of crying. I think I may have hardened myself too much and I have actually been trying to soften myself a bit. I feel I have gained a much greater depth in terms of emotions and the ability to empathize. I think I have internalized what I think is a protection from being hateful. I will have to dig deeper.

If I may offer some unsolicited advice it would be this, that the answer to your confusion is very obvious to me, and it is that you are trying to solve your questions with thought when all the answers are only able to be understood by feeling them. To did deeper, then, if to feel. The feelings are there but we prevent ourselves from feeling them so we are blind to what they are. The answer is to feel what you feel and it is simple as that. Not so simple to do, naturally. Thinking is there to keep us from feeling in my opinion. Give up on thinking you can think your way out. You feel your way out because what you feel you also feel is the truth and what you feel is actually a lie.

 

[realibrad]

If I may offer some unsolicited advice it would be this, that the answer to your confusion is very obvious to me, and it is that you are trying to solve your questions with thought when all the answers are only able to be understood by feeling them. To did deeper, then, if to feel. The feelings are there but we prevent ourselves from feeling them so we are blind to what they are. The answer is to feel what you feel and it is simple as that. Not so simple to do, naturally. Thinking is there to keep us from feeling in my opinion. Give up on thinking you can think your way out. You feel your way out because what you feel you also feel is the truth and what you feel is actually a lie.

It's never unsolicited. If you have an opinion I want to hear it.

I don't think thought and feelings are separate things. I see them as linked and use both.

The other part makes no sense to me.

 

[Moonbeam]

It's never unsolicited. If you have an opinion I want to hear it.

I don't think thought and feelings are separate things. I see them as linked and use both.

The other part makes no sense to me.

Let's do some thinking then. First we can think about whether there are better and worse states of mental health. I do not personally believe that all attitudes and emotional reactions to life situations are created equally. I believe, for example that somebody we might describe as having a Buddha nature has a higher quality of emotional life say than a ghetto gang member who can become violent just because you looked at him. One is mentally serine and the other lives in a hallucinatory hell of his own making, as it were. So what is the difference. Why is one happier, more mentally healthy than the other. Clearly, to me at least, each has a very different self image.

Why? I would say life experiences related to environment, the kinds of emotional impacts one has to face, positive and building or negative and self demeaning, respectful and nurturing or negative and emotionally damaging.

The implication here then as I see it is that generally speaking we can posit that we have some kind of common human nature that is molded by various shocks and impacts, that we are what we eat spiritually. I use that word because if their is something like a Buddha nature that is possible for some it should be possible for all depending on what that nature has been fed or now chooses to eat. But what will you feed the man with the ghetto mentality who believes that all food is shit because that is all he has ever seen? Any way you try to approach him he will define as disrespect at an unconscious level. So to help anyone eat better there must be some opening, some willingness to taste new things.

Where are we now in our thinking? I would say that we can now point out that some people are more defended against anything that might improve their emotional state than others. And what is the nature of this defense, the preconception based on experience that there is no such thing as a better emotional state, that it just another trap and another threat to one's self respect. I would call this unconscious bias, an attitude inculcated by negative experience. At root it is fear and when provoked or challenged elicits violence. And the person him or herself is unable to see it, does not make the internal emotional connection between current attitude and past experience because we can't live with endless conscious pain and repress it. So we live in a world we invent, our internal picture of reality, our story, the line we feed ourselves.

So yes, thought and feelings are linked. Every time we get near a negative feeling our thought story kicks in, our picture of the world where that feeling isn't real. Thought is fear. Thought is of the past and thus thought is time. End thought and there is only pure feeling and where the connection between feeling and its root are integrated they can also be transcended. Before we were damage and experienced the destruction of self respect, there was only the timeless joy of being.

Thought is the enemy. Thought is ego. It is Loki the trickster. Thought is fear, the fear to love again, to be open and vulnerable, unarmored as the day we were spiritually killed.

So there is an attitude that says I use thought and another that says thought uses me. It is my prison and there is no exit via that means. But thought is not so easy to turn off. That is because all efforts to do so will be the product of thought imagining itself as intention. It is like looking for truth with eagle eyes but with truth taped to the back of your head.

 

[OverVolt]

Its obvious to me that your roommate needs someone to talk to and trust.

I actually found myself with a smaller social network by moving for work and I'm thankful I have people I can still confide in, but the number of potential options/quality is pretty slim.

Recently in a survey on loneliness, apparently 1/3rd of people or more actually have zero people to confide in. So when you need a sounding board for all your negative thoughts from someone who will just hear you out and offer some solace or a new perspective.... yea... those people just have to literally hold it in or write in a journal or something until the feelings just go away.... but they aren't getting life advice or anything.

I would listen more to your roommate instead of studying him like some kind of circus side show to poke at.

When he says "I Wish I had someone to talk to like your brother" you have to realize he has ZERO people to confide in. He recognizes when people have a strong bond and is jealous of that. You should hear out some of his problems. You don't even need to offer solutions. Just hear him out. Because you have a larger social network than his you have more social experience. I'm betting he has practically zero.

 

[realibrad]

Let's do some thinking then. First we can think about whether there are better and worse states of mental health. I do not personally believe that all attitudes and emotional reactions to life situations are created equally. I believe, for example that somebody we might describe as having a Buddha nature has a higher quality of emotional life say than a ghetto gang member who can become violent just because you looked at him. One is mentally serine and the other lives in a hallucinatory hell of his own making, as it were. So what is the difference. Why is one happier, more mentally healthy than the other. Clearly, to me at least, each has a very different self image.

Why? I would say life experiences related to environment, the kinds of emotional impacts one has to face, positive and building or negative and self demeaning, respectful and nurturing or negative and emotionally damaging.

The implication here then as I see it is that generally speaking we can posit that we have some kind of common human nature that is molded by various shocks and impacts, that we are what we eat spiritually. I use that word because if their is something like a Buddha nature that is possible for some it should be possible for all depending on what that nature has been fed or now chooses to eat. But what will you feed the man with the ghetto mentality who believes that all food is shit because that is all he has ever seen? Any way you try to approach him he will define as disrespect at an unconscious level. So to help anyone eat better there must be some opening, some willingness to taste new things.

Where are we now in our thinking? I would say that we can now point out that some people are more defended against anything that might improve their emotional state than others. And what is the nature of this defense, the preconception based on experience that there is no such thing as a better emotional state, that it just another trap and another threat to one's self respect. I would call this unconscious bias, an attitude inculcated by negative experience. At root it is fear and when provoked or challenged elicits violence. And the person him or herself is unable to see it, does not make the internal emotional connection between current attitude and past experience because we can't live with endless conscious pain and repress it. So we live in a world we invent, our internal picture of reality, our story, the line we feed ourselves.

So yes, thought and feelings are linked. Every time we get near a negative feeling our thought story kicks in, our picture of the world where that feeling isn't real. Thought is fear. Thought is of the past and thus thought is time. End thought and there is only pure feeling and where the connection between feeling and its root are integrated they can also be transcended. Before we were damage and experienced the destruction of self respect, there was only the timeless joy of being.

Thought is the enemy. Thought is ego. It is Loki the trickster. Thought is fear, the fear to love again, to be open and vulnerable, unarmored as the day we were spiritually killed.

So there is an attitude that says I use thought and another that says thought uses me. It is my prison and there is no exit via that means. But thought is not so easy to turn off. That is because all efforts to do so will be the product of thought imagining itself as intention. It is like looking for truth with eagle eyes but with truth taped to the back of your head.

I disagree with you on the nature of thought. Thought is not the manifestation from past experiences based on fear. When I think about having kids and feel a sense of joy, that thought does not come from fear. I can use thought to do a great many things.

 

[Moonbeam]

I disagree with you on the nature of thought. Thought is not the manifestation from past experiences based on fear. When I think about having kids and feel a sense of joy, that thought does not come from fear. I can use thought to do a great many things.

Fine. When you find yourself interested in using thought to agree with what I said, let me know. I began by saying that self understanding comes from feeling what you feel, not knowing what you think you feel and that you would not be able to credit this because you don't know what you feel and to know what you feel isn't easy. Well, it's not easy and it won't happen without some sort of motivation or need to allow yourself to feel what you feel. I say we use thought to protect us from what we really feel. That is all I can offer. I can't make you see it and wouldn't if I could. I used thought to paint myself in a corner, to destroy my faith in everything I held sacred. Your attitude to thought was a sacred cow I was forced to reject and that rejection cast me into hell. I discovered that deep within me was a sadness I couldn't believe. But you know it when you feel it, because feeling is truth, truth that can change the deeper you go and the more that you know the unconscious assumptions you hold when you do not know what of what feelings they are derivatives.

I spent just a few moments to see if I could find anything on the net about thinking and ran found the following link as the seconded I visited: It is generally rather interesting:

https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/...201110/the-essential-guide-defense-mechanisms

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

I think one big problem with some people is their dependency on their job. When I really don't like I job - that's when I move jobs. In the 2 times I have moved jobs it has
1) Substantially increased my pay
2) Served as a "reset button" for stress levels - both related to how hard I work and any tensions (crappy boss, etc..). Inevitably my happiness levels always goes up when I switch.
3) It was never that difficult. People like to perceive it as difficult because they are simply too lazy to substantially look. They might spend 1 afternoon

My wife and my mother in law are both horrible at this. Wife has been employed at the same contractor for over 10 years now - still has plenty to complain about... but never spends much time or effort to try and find something new.

Oh and based on his boss - are you saying... that the black person is acting racist against your roommate?

 

[realibrad]

Fine. When you find yourself interested in using thought to agree with what I said, let me know. I began by saying that self understanding comes from feeling what you feel, not knowing what you think you feel and that you would not be able to credit this because you don't know what you feel and to know what you feel isn't easy. Well, it's not easy and it won't happen without some sort of motivation or need to allow yourself to feel what you feel. I say we use thought to protect us from what we really feel. That is all I can offer. I can't make you see it and wouldn't if I could. I used thought to paint myself in a corner, to destroy my faith in everything I held sacred. Your attitude to thought was a sacred cow I was forced to reject and that rejection cast me into hell. I discovered that deep within me was a sadness I couldn't believe. But you know it when you feel it, because feeling is truth, truth that can change the deeper you go and the more that you know the unconscious assumptions you hold when you do not know what of what feelings they are derivatives.

I spent just a few moments to see if I could find anything on the net about thinking and ran found the following link as the seconded I visited: It is generally rather interesting:

https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/...201110/the-essential-guide-defense-mechanisms

I can think of a few examples of some of those, but, I really mean a few in terms of feelings.

The closest ones are 7,8,9. I think 7 because there are times when in the moment, you cant sit and mull over because action is required. Go back to the shooting situation, and my mind was playing out possible situations and outcomes and what I could do. I tried to think of things that I thought were reasonable possibilities and what I might be able to do. So that might fit.

8 I think is harder. If I make a mistake, I try and understand what went into it. Often its just a failing on my part and that is the end. Other times, I may have been in a situation where someone was or did something to try and provoke me. I then try and weigh how much of that can be a factor for my failing in that situation if at all.

9 I think will be something I have to think over more. I'm not a very productive person, but, I do work and play video games.

 

[Blackjack200]

I'm wondering what you think the differences are between you? Do you think there's a difference in your intelligence? Work ethic? Interpersonal ability? Etc.

That's really hard to say. I think the most important difference between us is our circumstances growing up. I had a supportive family and he did not. We both got picked on and bullied a lot in school, so I think having that support made a really big difference for me.

 

[realibrad]

I think one big problem with some people is their dependency on their job. When I really don't like I job - that's when I move jobs. In the 2 times I have moved jobs it has
1) Substantially increased my pay
2) Served as a "reset button" for stress levels - both related to how hard I work and any tensions (crappy boss, etc..). Inevitably my happiness levels always goes up when I switch.
3) It was never that difficult. People like to perceive it as difficult because they are simply too lazy to substantially look. They might spend 1 afternoon

My wife and my mother in law are both horrible at this. Wife has been employed at the same contractor for over 10 years now - still has plenty to complain about... but never spends much time or effort to try and find something new.

Oh and based on his boss - are you saying... that the black person is acting racist against your roommate?

The US was known for people moving to a better life. Sadly, people do not move as much. I think the cost of moving has gotten much higher.

 

[Blackjack200]

Empathy is one of the worst and the best things we espouse, I think that things will turn out quite different for the two of you and that is because you are inherently an empathic person who cares not only about himself but of others too while he is sort of the opposite.

Only thing I can say is that if you're not working out, start working out and the food choices that go with that will follow. It's really helpful and will boost your confidence and expand your social circle too as well as improve your over all health. You'll sleep better and be in a better mood.

And voting is NEVER worthless, don't you let anyone tell you that it is because things do change and even though the system is rigged beyond all natural democratic prospects it can actually change with enough people voting.

I get the feeling of hopelessness and despair on the system we have but it is the system we have *for now* and it is subject to change as districts turn.

I actually think he is also pretty empathetic. I do think he has some emotional limitations, but I have no idea if they're innate or capable of changing.

I agree on the working out thing. I am going to the gym 3x a week now, and it definitely improves my eating. I was probably in the best shape of my life at the beginning of the year, I'd been going to the gym regularly for about 9 months, but in December I started having horrible pain in my hip. MRI revealed a torn labrum, and a cortisone shot didn't help at all. It's hard for me to explain why, but it threw me into a terrible depression, and it actually took me until about two months ago to emotionally cope with the injury and get back to working out.

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

The US was known for people moving to a better life. Sadly, people do not move as much. I think the cost of moving has gotten much higher.

I'm just saying move jobs - not necessarily move to a different area. Unless you live in a rural town (that isn't close to another town) and the town is dependent upon 1 employer you can probably find something else.

Also if you live in an apartment I give you little excuse. Throw some of your shit that you never use away and pack your bags.

Overall happiness > Shit possessions that you never use.