McDonalds answer to $15/hr min wages

[Jaskalas]

This is not a surprise, this is a Milton Friedman thing. Raising the minimum wage increases low wage unemployment.

Some people just have to learn the hard way cause they can't read history books good. Brawndo, what plants need.

I saw this in school: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ca8Z__o52sk

The internet has flooded the world with so much misinformation people can't tell how the world really works.

I'll tell you how the world really works.
Labor has been devalued below sustainable levels.
Americans need to start living as the third world trash they're being treated as.

Or we need to radically tip the scales as never before.
And we need to do it before this GROWING crisis hits critical mass.

 

[Zorkorist]

It's Government that is stealing money from the middle class.

We need to reduce Government, and give the money they steal back to the people.

-John

 

[Vic]

Automation fails where consumer tastes change. You can fancy up a car frame between model years but you can't reprogram a burger machine to make burrito bowls.

I see this in pharmacy automation. The thing that people forget that came BEFORE automation is interchangeable parts. Manufacturers change the pill size/shape/color arbitrarily between lots and presto the machine malfunctions.

Guess what has large variations? Food. You can spit out Crabby Patties but what about when people lose taste for them? Then you are constantly retooling the manufacturing and the automation - not cheap. Food loses taste, flavor and nutrition when it is processed for consistency. Think, chicken patties. And thus no matter the automation the product is not even equivalent. Preparing a meal from foods that have natural variations you're going to need a 'cook'.

I totally agree. The example I like to cite is from the famous Jeopardy with IBM's Watson. At one point in the game, Jennings buzzed in first but gave the wrong answer. Watson buzzed in right after and gave the same wrong answer. It hadn't been able to adapt to an unexpected change as quickly as a human would. But they're working hard on that, and it's only a matter of time.

 

[Zorkorist]

Maybe we can have the robots fix the debt problem?

-John

 

[Vic]

Maybe we can have the robots fix the debt problem?

-John

"If you owe the bank $100 dollars, that's your problem. If you owe the bank $19 trillion dollars, that's the bank's problem."

 

[Zorkorist]

-John

 

[BoberFett]

Yep.

So EVERYONE successful got there because they were born wealthy, and EVERYONE who is poor is that way because they're being kept down by the man.

You sound as stupid as the right. But you already know that.

 

[BoberFett]

It's not the Government that's paying wages below a livable standard. You're thinking of corporations.

Plenty of government jobs are low paying also, just FYI.

 

[BoberFett]

Shit dude, if he actually has the answer to becoming rich, when starting out with absolutely nothing (no education, no money, no experience, no family members to mooch off of, etc.), tell every god damn morsel of detail. Every damn turn he made, every damn minute of his schedule.

Because it sure as hell ain't obvious to the lads living in poverty and squalor.

Why does the left always focus on "becoming rich"? Isn't it enough to become middle class? Self sufficient? Is the only way you'll accept that the system works is if someone can easily go from living in the gutter to being a billionaire?

Chris al-fucking-mighty, no wonder you think the system doesn't work. You have ridiculous expectations.

 

[BoberFett]

Raising (or not raising) the minimum wage has nothing to do with advancing automation. Seriously, nothing. Robots didn't replace welders on the automotive assembly lines because they work for less, but because they work 24/7/365 and make a perfect weld each and every time. And that's just the beginning. AI is coming and it's going to be a big gamechanger for humanity.

Ummm, you just described why increased wages drives automation. Because it's cheaper to have a machine weld 24/7 than it is to hire people to weld 24/7.

If labor cost $0/hr, those machines would be out the door.

Come on Vic.

 

[MongGrel]

Why does the left always focus on "becoming rich"? Isn't it enough to become middle class? Self sufficient? Is the only way you'll accept that the system works is if someone can easily go from living in the gutter to being a billionaire?

Chris al-fucking-mighty, no wonder you think the system doesn't work. You have ridiculous expectations.

The middle class has been on the decline for 20 years at least.

What rock have you been hiding under, or ignorant of ?

 

[BoberFett]

The middle class has been on the decline for 20 years at least.

What rock have you been hiding under, or ignorant of ?

Goddamit boy, reading comprehension. Get some.

The person I quoted questioned how many people get rich in the US. Well how many people go from abject poverty to being insanely wealthy in Sweden? Germany? France? If "becoming rich" is the measure of an economic system, then all of those countries have shitty systems as well and we definitely shouldn't emulate them.

 

[Vic]

Ummm, you just described why increased wages drives automation. Because it's cheaper to have a machine weld 24/7 than it is to hire people to weld 24/7.

If labor cost $0/hr, those machines would be out the door.

Come on Vic.

Labor can't cost $0/hr, even slaves have to eat.

 

[Victorian Gray]

So EVERYONE successful got there because they were born wealthy, and EVERYONE who is poor is that way because they're being kept down by the man.

Nope and you know damn well that isn't the argument being presented. To interpret it that way when you know better just makes you look small and petty.

You sound as stupid as the right. But you already know that.

There ya go, small and petty.

 

[BoberFett]

Nope and you know damn well that isn't the argument being presented. To interpret it that way when you know better just makes you look small and petty.

Really? So that comic had no intention of generalizing economic success?

There ya go, small and petty.

I heard that's how you like it.

 

[BoberFett]

Labor can't cost $0/hr, even slaves have to eat.

Depends on how long you intend to keep them.

So do you have an actual rebuttal?

 

[Victorian Gray]

Really? So that comic had no intention of generalizing economic success?

I do not for a minute believe that you are that dense so stop pretending that you are.

I heard that's how you like it.

Continue to let that stifled inner jackass out. It's good therapy. Thank Cthulhu for the interwebs, eh.

 

[mysticjbyrd]

slave wages. that term cracks me up.


I will say that when i worked fast food the pay was fine for me and everyone that i knew working in it. During hte day were college kids/retired people. evenings were high school kids.

i rarely recall seeing a 30+ yr old working at mcdonalds.

This isn't 1960 anymore grandpa...

You realize the quality of McDonalds in other countries are much, much hire than the slum-like stores here in the US? Employees there are rated at a much higher standard, ones you would see in a restaurant (Mainly in Japan and Taiwan where I have visited).

The staff in the McDonalds here in the US have the people skills of an angry honey badger but not the intelligence of one. Also, the jobs that aren't manager levels at McDonalds are not meant to be career jobs, they were for high-school kids to gain real life working experience, to try to develop a proper work ethic in preparation for when they step into the real world as adults, and to help them work on people to people interaction.

How you have lazy slobs that work there who do nothing but complain because they feel they are entitled to some sort of career salary wage for a job that requires minimal intelligence and no real education. Get real. You should be paid how much the job is worth, not how much you feel the job is worth.

This is one of the dumbest things I have read today, grats.

Do you not understand, we have transitioned into a service based economy?

Of course not....

 

[Chiropteran]

So EVERYONE successful got there because they were born wealthy, and EVERYONE who is poor is that way because they're being kept down by the man.

You sound as stupid as the right. But you already know that.

Not everyone, there are a few people who essentially win the lottery of being in the right place at the right time with the right idea and who also don't get the idea stolen... sure. But a 1/10000 chance to make it as a success out of poverty levels doesn't mean anyone can do it, it just means statistically a few people will get lucky.

 

[Jaskalas]

Automation fails where consumer tastes change. You can fancy up a car frame between model years but you can't reprogram a burger machine to make burrito bowls.

I see this in pharmacy automation. The thing that people forget that came BEFORE automation is interchangeable parts. Manufacturers change the pill size/shape/color arbitrarily between lots and presto the machine malfunctions.

Guess what has large variations? Food. You can spit out Crabby Patties but what about when people lose taste for them? Then you are constantly retooling the manufacturing and the automation - not cheap. Food loses taste, flavor and nutrition when it is processed for consistency. Think, chicken patties. And thus no matter the automation the product is not even equivalent. Preparing a meal from foods that have natural variations you're going to need a 'cook'.

I missed this little gem.
Your complaint re: automation is entirely accurate... before modern robots.
You really have no idea how they're going to work?

Physical action is being turned into simple script. Walking forward is a wholly complex task... until it is learned. Now IT can tell their robot to walk forward 5 feet or 8 feet. Stupid machines of the past would have to be remade or retooled to achieve a new task. Today you just sort out the script. Changing details is as easy as writing your next line of text.

It's a massive failing to think variety or customization is a meaningful hurdle for the future. Would be like saying we can't write a new line of code.

 

[tracerbullet]

http://fortune.com/2016/03/09/mcdonalds-wages/

Hope that wasn't already posted, hard to read site on my phone.

It didn't apply to all workers and other changes were made as well but CEO attributes some improvements to the wage increase.

 

[skull]

What's really funny is that he thinks that a salesman's function cannot be replaced by automation or outsourcing. He is one of the lucky ones who happened to grow up during a time of great economic opportunity where a person with next to no education could get a great job, earn a six figure salary, and live in a 5000 sq foot house. This used to be possible, but is extremely unlikely nowadays. His hubris is such that he thinks all of his success is of his own hands, and doesn't understand that the world has moved on. He didn't need a college education with 35k debt to get a decent job, so no one else needs it. They are just lazy, which is why they are working at McDonalds trying to survive until they can get a start in life (where they will probably earn closer to 45k/year than the six figures he got).
But when someone looks at a salesman's job, what part of it actually requires the human presence? Describing the product? Nowadays people can buy almost anything online, and if there's a question on the product, just email 'John' who works from India and he'll happily assist you while earning $3.50/hr. Is the salesman responsible for haggling for the 'best price'? As Amazon has demonstrated, a product's pricing is a result of supply and demand. It can easily be automated, or set by the original producer. Perhaps marketing is the salesman's special skill? After all, sales involves informing people about opportunities, and convincing them they should do business with you. How else could a potential client know about your excellent customer service? It certainly is too bad that there's no way for people to read reviews about companies to decide whether they should do business with them. In fact, the best reviews might be from previous clients! Customer reviews...what an idea....
The truth is 'sales' is being reduced down to a simple transaction management job nowadays. In fact, the most value that a salesman can bring to a business is by upselling a client. Kind of like "would you like fries with that?". So don't begrudge the salesmen their opinions, their 'path to advancement'. After all, the world isn't quite as fair to the 18 year old with no college nowadays.

What about me? High school educated former heroin addict that worked with all the other losers making $8/hr. Trust me people that make those low wages are making them for a reason. They aren't worth a shit. I finally got my shit together and started a business with nothing working 2 part time jobs one cleaning toilets for $8/hr the other doing maintenance at $10/hr. Six years later its really taking off, I'm not making 6 figures yet but I will be. I consistently make 2k+/week, I just need to get to the point I'm doing it week after week all year. I've learned what you and others can't seem to, scrimping, saving and hard work actually pay off. The American dream is real contrary to what a bunch of lazy entitled pricks on welfare will tell you.

 

[nickqt]

What about me? High school educated former heroin addict that worked with all the other losers making $8/hr. Trust me people that make those low wages are making them for a reason. They aren't worth a shit. I finally got my shit together and started a business with nothing working 2 part time jobs one cleaning toilets for $8/hr the other doing maintenance at $10/hr. Six years later its really taking off, I'm not making 6 figures yet but I will be. I consistently make 2k+/week, I just need to get to the point I'm doing it week after week all year. I've learned what you and others can't seem to, scrimping, saving and hard work actually pay off. The American dream is real contrary to what a bunch of lazy entitled pricks on welfare will tell you.

Ah, yes. The, "I used to be a fucking scumbag loser piece of shit, but since I changed and started my own business, every other fucking scumbag loser can too" argument.

So, your solution is that everyone should clean everyone else's toilets for $8/hr and then start their own business doing whatever it is you do, and everyone will be rich.

Why isn't everyone beating down your door to pick you up as their economic advisor I wonder?

 

[Sonikku]

Plenty of government jobs are low paying also, just FYI.

So? If someone has the choice between $9 a hour working as a government clerk with consistent schedule, healthcare/benefits/pension/sick days/vacation time or a $9 a hour job flipping burgers with none of the above and a frantic constantly changing "flex shift" what are people going to pick given the choice?

 

[skull]

Ah, yes. The, "I used to be a fucking scumbag loser piece of shit, but since I changed and started my own business, every other fucking scumbag loser can too" argument.

So, your solution is that everyone should clean everyone else's toilets for $8/hr and then start their own business doing whatever it is you do, and everyone will be rich.

Why isn't everyone beating down your door to pick you up as their economic advisor I wonder?

No I know they can't all start there own business but they can work harder instead of complaining. My $20/hr guy has skill but has such a bad attitude and work ethic he needs to go. My $10/hr guy has no skill but he shows promise he seems to want to work unlike the $20/hr guy but I just can't seem to get him to do it. I think I'm going to start paying the $20/hr guy piece meal as motivation maybe it'll pick the other guy up.

All I'm asking for is some hard work, I'm willing to pay and keep it steady. Then all they'd have to do is live within there means and show up for work but neither can seem to happen.