MAJOR RANT: These fvckign @sshole system admins!!!!

Page 4 - Seeking answers? Join the AnandTech community: where nearly half-a-million members share solutions and discuss the latest tech.

stevent76

Senior member
May 10, 2001
957
0
0
Originally posted by: n0cmonkey
A thumbdrive would have solved this whole thing... I'll send you a 16MB one, if you're that desperate. :heart:

In our 24x7 department at work we disabled the use of all drive letters except for A C D and H(network drive). They couldnt even use a flash drive if they wanted. And there is no way in the world we would give them access to tools like remote desktop. They cant even change there background.:D

Setting the policies for what your users can use kicks a$$. Keeps you from having to fix a lot of unnecessary crap!
 

spidey07

No Lifer
Aug 4, 2000
65,469
5
76
Originally posted by: Spencer278
How the hell does removing remote access client improve security. That is like cutting off everyone hands at the college so they can't open your unlocked door. Might I suggest fixing the rooted boxes. All someone would have to do to get around your 'security" is bring a laptop.

defense in depth.

Which is why modern networks will require two factor authentication to even communicate. Bring your laptop in and its not authenticated? no talkie-talkie.
 

Spencer278

Diamond Member
Oct 11, 2002
3,637
0
0
Originally posted by: spidey07
Originally posted by: Spencer278
How the hell does removing remote access client improve security. That is like cutting off everyone hands at the college so they can't open your unlocked door. Might I suggest fixing the rooted boxes. All someone would have to do to get around your 'security" is bring a laptop.

defense in depth.

Which is why modern networks will require two factor authentication to even communicate. Bring your laptop in and its not authenticated? no talkie-talkie.

You most go to a different college then anyone else in the world because they everywhere else you can use a laptop at the library.
 

tRaptor

Golden Member
Jul 31, 2002
1,227
1
0
Why dont you just have your own laptop anyway? You sould like you are pretty good at using windows. Natuarally HOW can you stand to use the schools computers.
 

Rogue

Banned
Jan 28, 2000
5,774
0
0
Well, let's dredge up some nefarious actions that someone can do using Remote Desktop.

1) Acquisition of illegal or infected files from a remote, un-managed PC which are subsequently placed on the institutionally owned PC where they wreak havoc they otherwise would not have. Simply put, it's akin to putting a second door on a bank safe made of wood. You do understand that cut and paste functions work remotely that way, right? That in itself is enough justification to stop it. I would have simply blocked the ports outgoing at the firewall to stop morons like you.

2) Remote viewing of explicit images which may offend passers by. I've seen several instances where people would remote to their home computer to mask their activities while they looked at porn or conducted other activities in violation of the standing policies. All it would take is one jackass to be looking at his private stash of porn on his computer at home remotely and someone walking by to be offended. Who do you think is going to take the heat? The school will take some of it.

3) Remember that the connection is a two way connection, so you're tunneling traffic over that connection that the administrators may not want to come into their network. Connecting to any remote PC is a massive unknown factor and only serves to turn a network's security architecture into swiss cheese.

4) Any unnecessary application, and let's be honest here, you're probably the only one bitching about this on the entire campus thus making it unecessary, is a vulnerability. It's the same reason that I always, always, always rip out Outlook Express on a system I build. Don't use it, don't need it and I will only have to patch it later down the line when a vulnerability comes along. You're proving ignorant of the most basic principles of computer and network security.

Need I go on? Oh, by the way, what you've said to this point about network security is some of the most naiive and ignorant bluster I've heard on the topic in some time. You CANNOT, I repeat CANNOT remove viruses or malicious code at layers 2, 3, or 4. You can certainly see them go by in the network stream provided the virus uses a particular protocol or port or originates or travels to a known IP at which point you can mitigate the risk at those levels through access control, but none of the devices that operate at those layers can do what you mistook the Cisco sales rep for telling you. I have a top of the line Cisco network stack at my edge and I can tell you first hand that it takes far more than a switch, router and firewall to secure a network from viruses, etc. Again, your bluster is riddled with ignorance and that's okay, you're learning a lot in this thread if you'd pull your head out and stop walking forward for a second.

I'm more than willing to educate you further if you so choose, but between spidey07 and myself, I think you've had your lesson on pwnage tonight. Sleep tight tonight little one and we'll learn more tomorrrow <pats little acemcmac on the head>

Oh, one more thing. It's CORPORATE, CORPORATIONS, and ACCOMODATE.
 

Spencer278

Diamond Member
Oct 11, 2002
3,637
0
0
Originally posted by: tRaptor
Why dont you just have your own laptop anyway? You sould like you are pretty good at using windows. Natuarally HOW can you stand to use the schools computers.

Yeah because everyone has money to buy a laptop and wants to carry around a laptop because some idiot system admin wants more control.
 

spidey07

No Lifer
Aug 4, 2000
65,469
5
76
Originally posted by: Spencer278
Originally posted by: spidey07
Originally posted by: Spencer278
How the hell does removing remote access client improve security. That is like cutting off everyone hands at the college so they can't open your unlocked door. Might I suggest fixing the rooted boxes. All someone would have to do to get around your 'security" is bring a laptop.

defense in depth.

Which is why modern networks will require two factor authentication to even communicate. Bring your laptop in and its not authenticated? no talkie-talkie.

You most go to a different college then anyone else in the world because they everywhere else you can use a laptop at the library.

I've been out of college for over 12 years now focusing on network communications and network security. Heh, when I was in school the network was 2400 baud green screens. There was this cool thing called xwindows, but still at 9600 baud all going to huge banks of terminal servers. ;)

Modern networks "will" require 2 factor authentication. We're getting there but most haven't even attempted a full blown 802.1x implementation. But its where the industry is headed.

You scenario of just plugging in is the way it is today, but it won't be for long. reference my sig.
 

n0cmonkey

Elite Member
Jun 10, 2001
42,936
1
0
Originally posted by: stevent76
Originally posted by: n0cmonkey
A thumbdrive would have solved this whole thing... I'll send you a 16MB one, if you're that desperate. :heart:

In our 24x7 department at work we disabled the use of all drive letters except for A C D and H(network drive). They couldnt even use a flash drive if they wanted. And there is no way in the world we would give them access to tools like remote desktop. They cant even change there background.:D

Setting the policies for what your users can use kicks a$$. Keeps you from having to fix a lot of unnecessary crap!

That makes no sense on a university network. Perfect for corporate networks though. :beer:
 

n0cmonkey

Elite Member
Jun 10, 2001
42,936
1
0
Originally posted by: Spencer278
Originally posted by: tRaptor
Why dont you just have your own laptop anyway? You sould like you are pretty good at using windows. Natuarally HOW can you stand to use the schools computers.

Yeah because everyone has money to buy a laptop and wants to carry around a laptop because some idiot system admin wants more control.

Admins should have all of the control. It's part of the job. :beer:

EDIT: Ok, so the head honchos and the auditors have all of the control, but the admins do what they say. So blame them. The admins did good. :beer:
 

Rogue

Banned
Jan 28, 2000
5,774
0
0
Originally posted by: spidey07
Originally posted by: Spencer278
Originally posted by: spidey07
Originally posted by: Spencer278
How the hell does removing remote access client improve security. That is like cutting off everyone hands at the college so they can't open your unlocked door. Might I suggest fixing the rooted boxes. All someone would have to do to get around your 'security" is bring a laptop.

defense in depth.

Which is why modern networks will require two factor authentication to even communicate. Bring your laptop in and its not authenticated? no talkie-talkie.

You most go to a different college then anyone else in the world because they everywhere else you can use a laptop at the library.

I've been out of college for over 12 years now focusing on network communications and network security. Heh, when I was in school the network was 2400 baud green screens. There was this cool thing called xwindows, but still at 9600 baud all going to huge banks of terminal servers. ;)

Modern networks "will" require 2 factor authentication. We're getting there but most haven't even attempted a full blown 802.1x implementation. But its where the industry is headed.

You scenario of just plugging in is the way it is today, but it won't be for long. reference my sig.

I'm pushing very hard right now for a full port authenticated 802.1x implementation on the LAN at work right now. If you don't have a computer account in my domain, you don't get network access and the port shuts off. It's coming and it's coming very soon. I'm sick and tired of a$$holes bringing in their personal laptops and surfing the 'net for free off of us.
 

Spencer278

Diamond Member
Oct 11, 2002
3,637
0
0
Originally posted by: Rogue
Well, let's dredge up some nefarious actions that someone can do using Remote Desktop.

1) Acquisition of illegal or infected files from a remote, un-managed PC which are subsequently placed on the institutionally owned PC where they wreak havoc they otherwise would not have. Simply put, it's akin to putting a second door on a bank safe made of wood. You do understand that cut and paste functions work remotely that way, right? That in itself is enough justification to stop it. I would have simply blocked the ports outgoing at the firewall to stop morons like you.

Well I could just use a USB drive, email, a webserver, a FTP server, telnet,. Might as well just make the connection upload only

2) Remote viewing of explicit images which may offend passers by. I've seen several instances where people would remote to their home computer to mask their activities while they looked at porn or conducted other activities in violation of the standing policies. All it would take it one jackass to be looking at his private stash of porn on his computer at home remotely and someone walking by to be offended. Who do you think is going to take the heat? The school will take some of it.

The same person could host an apche server make the connection encrypted and ensure that there are no bad words on the page and be able to offend anyone that passes by.

3) Remember that the connection is a two way connection, so you're tunneling traffic over that connection that the administrators may not want to come into their network. Connecting to any remote PC is a massive unknown factor and only serves to turn a network's security architecture into swiss cheese.

Any connection is a massive unknow.

4) Any unnecessary application, and let's be honest here, you're probably the only one bitching about this on the entire campus thus making it unecessary, is a vulnerability. It's the same reason that I always, always, always rip out Outlook Express on a system I build. Don't use it, don't need it and I will only have to patch it later down the line when a vulnerability comes along. You're proving ignorant of the most basic principles of computer and network security.

Of course the user might use the software, so you not using it isn't a very good excuse to be to damn lazy to update the software when bugs are discovered

Need I go on? Oh, by the way, what you've said to this point about network security is some of the most naiive and ignorant bluster I've heard on the topic in some time. You CANNOT, I repeat CANNOT remove viruses or malicious code at layers 2, 3, or 4. You can certainly see them go by in the network stream provided the virus uses a particular protocol or port or originates or travels to a known IP at which point you can mitigate the risk at those levels through access control, but none of the devices that operate at those layers can do what you mistook the Cisco sales rep for telling you. I have a top of the line Cisco network stack at my edge and I can tell you first hand that it takes far more than a switch, router and firewall to secure a network from viruses, etc. Again, your bluster is riddled with ignorance and that's okay, you're learning a lot in this thread if you'd pull your head out and stop walking forward for a second.

I'm more than willing to educate you further if you so choose, but between spidey07 and myself, I think you've had your lesson on pwnage tonight. Sleep tight tonight little one and we'll learn more tomorrrow <pats little acemcmac on the head>

Oh, one more thing. It's CORPORATE, CORPORATIONS, and ACCOMODATE.

 

spidey07

No Lifer
Aug 4, 2000
65,469
5
76
roguePM me if you need any information or help at all. The best advice I can offer is make sure you plan it out thoroughly and get your 2 factor auth working like butter (especially for the support guys, make sure the practices, procedures, etc are in place) before attemting to role it out.

<---living 802.1x right now.