BlueWeasel
Lifer
- Jun 2, 2000
- 15,944
- 475
- 126
He didn't turn the butterfly into an eagle. The Eagles have always existed, but they didn't have a big part in the trilogy. Go back and read The Hobbit.
He didn't turn the butterfly into an eagle. The Eagles have always existed, but they didn't have a big part in the trilogy. Go back and read The Hobbit.
- Mar 20, 2000
- 102,402
- 8,574
- 126
gandalf's powers are in perception and motivation, not raw power like sauron. sauron is the great warlock of the tales, probably a better witch than melkor himself (especially since melkor sort of burned himself out early, and never came out of his hole in the ground after the noldor king called him out and injured him).
the eagle was called by the butterfly. the eagles are the watchers of manwe, chief of the Lords of the West.
the Western land was where the Valar chose to live in the beginning of time, partly because melkor had taken up abode in middle earth. the Valar wanted to get the elves to come with them to Valinor, but only managed to get part of them (analogous to high elves, standard wood elves never saw the Light.). after a while Melkor poisoned the Trees (the white tree of gondor is the lone descendant, iirc, and originally the Trees were the source of Light in the world) and stolethe Silmarils (the greatest craft of any Elf, and, since they captured the Light, the only way to revive the trees). Feanor, creator of the Silmarils, along with his sons, swore a terrible oath that they would never rest until they had recovered the jewels. so they marched their groups to the sea, and killed the sea elves when the sea elves refused to hand over their ships. for the kin-slaying they were cursed by Manwe, and everything they did would thwart them. they were given the option of returning, but left anyway. when they left the West was hidden from Middle earth. only one person would ever find his way there, Earendil (father of Elrond, btw).
anyway, Earendil's other son choose mortality, and the race of Numenor was started. But Sauron, who had remained in middle earth after the fall of Melkor after Earendil's plea to the Host of the West, poisoned Numenor, so it was destoryed, and the West was removed from the world for mortals, so as not to tempt them.
- Mar 20, 2000
- 102,402
- 8,574
- 126
its where the valar (who pretty much created the world and are the strongest of the gods) live... its called the undying lands, but that isn't because everyone who lives there becomes immortal when they set foot there, it's because everyone that lives there was immortal already. when elves 'die' their souls go to inhabit the halls of mandos in valinor, the west. when men die they pass out of the knowledge of the elves, no one knows what happens to mortal souls. in fact, morality would be accelerated for mortals setting foot in valinor.
yes, it's like Eden or heaven or whatever idyllic peaceful place you would like to imagine. Man was once welcome there, but Isildur and his posse got kicked out for making too much noise, banging all the hot elven chicks, etc. So they sailed to Eriador and founded Gondor. that's why they have a white tree planted outside the king's hall, iirc it is the last remnant from "the west" that they had.
Fingolfin269
Lifer
- Feb 28, 2003
- 17,948
- 34
- 91
Dunno how you guys gleaned so much information out of Tolkien's cryptic verse writing style, which only gets worse in the stuff following the lord of the rings (silmarillion, etc.).
I bet if you spent half as much time on something else, maybe exercising, it would impress a lot more people.
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