Lost $1500 worth of software because I lost a stupid usb key

[xeemzor]

Originally posted by: alkemyst

Originally posted by: fisher
technically the dongle is the value, because it's the heart of the software that keeps you from sending your buddy a copy of your software. that said, there should be a way to get a replacement. a dongle isn't a very big thing, and it is obviously possible for it to get lost. perhaps when you get your new key you phone home online, it gets registered and attaches itself to the software somehow, so that if you had your old key it would no longer work with it. in this day and age there are ways of making it happen without dicking over your customers. these people are your bread and butter, they keep you in business so you don't have to bag groceries for a living, treat them with a little more respect.

edit: the watch analogy is still dumb.

Dude you can't say it's small and therefore easy to lose. In reality that dongle is to stay in the machine it's installed on. They used to be parallel based and screw in.

It's not about dicking over a customer, it's about customers trying to find loophole to get multiple installs running. This is the whole reasoning behind hardware keys.

Why would you need to move that dongle around anyway?

There are tons of items far more expensive than $1500 that are smaller than a dongle and people don't lose them and if they do they have no recourse for their STUPIDITY.

If, as you say, you really did work in a fortune 400 company, then you would know the value of backups. Any system that relies on one component that can easily be stolen/destroyed is an obvious weakness. The company either needs to either allow for easy replacement of the usb sticks, or for the customer to make their own backups. Any other viewpoint is being unreasonable and unrealistic.

The potential of abuse of 1 or 2 computers when sending out replacement keys is far outweighed by the fact that you will retain loyal customers. If the company can't see that, they are being ridiculously short sighted.

 

[alkemyst]

Originally posted by: fisher

so you leave it in and hope the janitor doesn't pull it out? or a coworker? or your kid? you never move your machine? maybe it has to go in a front port and you don't want it getting bumped into and broken?

be serious.

shit happens, things get lost. i understand the reason for hardware keys, but shit happens. this isn't a perfect world.

these are workstations in a work environment. You don't hire janitors that will steal or knock equipment around. If you have a business loss you can file a police report and claim it on your insurance. My money would be if the cleaning staff were going to steal it would be something they knew they could sell not what looks like something you can buy at walmart for $20.

Dongles have been around a LONG time. Parallel port dongles come out probably easier if not screwed down compared to USBs. If your you are worried about theft, hook up the usb key internally with a motherboard cable and lock the case.

That is serious business, not end user nonsense.

 

[alkemyst]

Originally posted by: xeemzor

If, as you say, you really did work in a fortune 400 company, then you would know the value of backups. Any system that relies on one component that can easily be stolen/destroyed is an obvious weakness. The company either needs to either allow for easy replacement of the usb sticks, or for the customer to make their own backups. Any other viewpoint is being unreasonable and unrealistic.

The potential of abuse of 1 or 2 computers when sending out replacement keys is far outweighed by the fact that you will retain loyal customers. If the company can't see that, they are being ridiculously short sighted.

We make a lot of backups...we archive them a LONG ASS TIME offsite at a nice monthly fee...that has nothing to do with hardware, are you like 15 or something you need to think a bit more about this before responding?

We had a mortgage system called Gallagher. It used parallel port dongles, the license was a lot more than $1500. We still need it for old data. If we lose our dongles now there is no getting new ones. So we keep track of them and they don't walk. If they do we have bought multiple ones so they can be replaced. This is just like our harddrives, processors and even full servers. Although we can have a new one by the next day, we have a spare to get up and running immediately.

I don't think most real businesses will fault a company for them losing something...this is something the non-business person does who is not actively making money by using the item.

 

[erikistired]

Originally posted by: alkemyst

Originally posted by: fisher

so you leave it in and hope the janitor doesn't pull it out? or a coworker? or your kid? you never move your machine? maybe it has to go in a front port and you don't want it getting bumped into and broken?

be serious.

shit happens, things get lost. i understand the reason for hardware keys, but shit happens. this isn't a perfect world.

these are workstations in a work environment. You don't hire janitors that will steal or knock equipment around. If you have a business loss you can file a police report and claim it on your insurance. My money would be if the cleaning staff were going to steal it would be something they knew they could sell not what looks like something you can buy at walmart for $20.

Dongles have been around a LONG time. Parallel port dongles come out probably easier if not screwed down compared to USBs. If your you are worried about theft, hook up the usb key internally with a motherboard cable and lock the case.

That is serious business, not end user nonsense.

hehe. a person might do it because they had a bad day.

there were dongles previous to the parallel ones btw. 🙂

 

[xeemzor]

Do you really plan as if nothing will ever go wrong with the usb dongles and that the whole world is perfect? If so, I feel bad for your company.

 

[erikistired]

Originally posted by: alkemyst

Originally posted by: xeemzor

If, as you say, you really did work in a fortune 400 company, then you would know the value of backups. Any system that relies on one component that can easily be stolen/destroyed is an obvious weakness. The company either needs to either allow for easy replacement of the usb sticks, or for the customer to make their own backups. Any other viewpoint is being unreasonable and unrealistic.

The potential of abuse of 1 or 2 computers when sending out replacement keys is far outweighed by the fact that you will retain loyal customers. If the company can't see that, they are being ridiculously short sighted.

We make a lot of backups...we archive them a LONG ASS TIME offsite at a nice monthly fee...that has nothing to do with hardware, are you like 15 or something you need to think a bit more about this before responding?

We had a mortgage system called Gallagher. It used parallel port dongles, the license was a lot more than $1500. We still need it for old data. If we lose our dongles now there is no getting new ones. So we keep track of them and they don't walk. If they do we have bought multiple ones so they can be replaced. This is just like our harddrives, processors and even full servers. Although we can have a new one by the next day, we have a spare to get up and running immediately.

I don't think most real businesses will fault a company for them losing something...this is something the non-business person does who is not actively making money by using the item.

end users make money with software just as much as "real businesses", especially in this case with music software. i realize you are too arrogant to realize that, but try to keep it in mind so you don't look 15 or something.

 

[Green Man]

Wait, let's go back to the beginning.
You 'bought' music tied to a dongle? who would do that? What did you think would happen?

 

[redly]

I've got ~$300 worth of scratched DVD's in my kids closet...do you suppose disney will just send me new DVDs?

 

[josh0099]

Originally posted by: redly
I've got ~$300 worth of scratched DVD's in my kids closet...do you suppose disney will just send me new DVDs?

actually i am pretty sure there are programs for you to replace them...not sure what the cost is....

 

[erikistired]

Originally posted by: Green Man
Wait, let's go back to the beginning.
You 'bought' music tied to a dongle? who would do that? What did you think would happen?

cubase is music production software.

 

[SampSon]

Why do any of you take a word of what alkemyst says seriously? The guy has been writing mortgages since he was 13, don't step to that!
I'd really love to have a chronological log of all the bullshit our buddy alkemyst has spewed over the years. It would make for great reading.

Never have I seen someone claming to be so versed in everything beat their chest so hard to prove it. Thoes who really have it, don't talk about it. Really, who feels the need to air their entire career history on a forum (you left out some of your unemployed time in that list), bash others and then validate everything they say by stating they "work for a fortune 400 company"? Has your life reached such a desperate low?

If you didn't try to hard to be a big shot badass then some of it might be believeable. Unfortunately that is not the case. Really, any mature person knows that, hell any person with half a chimp brain knows that. I think your alcoholism is starting to really affect your judgement, what little you have. When will you enter a thread and not argue it down to the lowest common denominator of penis wagging? Is there going to be a time when you understand that your fluffed resume doesn't make you right?

There is a person on this forum that you should learn from. His name is descartes. This guy is very successful (in reality). Yet rarely, if ever, feels the need to validate his arguments or himself by going off on a rant about how great he is. He manages to form articulate arguments without having to disclose his career history inorder to validate his arguments. It's very simple, he knows what he's talking about so his posts do all the talking for him. Quaint idea, dontcha think?

So anyway, what top 10 builder do you work for? Is is Pulte, Centex, KB, Hovnanian, NVR, D.R. Horton, Toll Brothers, Beazer, M. D. C., or mabey Lennar?
Lennar is based in Miami and that's where you live. So that could be probable, it would be the perfect fit for you! I'm fairly certain that all top 10 builders fall into the fortune 400 category. I know that the #1 home builder in 2007 probably has a very large need for a staff of IT monkeys like yourself. Assuming that is the case, were you just trying to be vague by saying "top 10", or was it just convienient that the top builder is HQed in your area? Lennar was only #3 in 2006 going into 2007, mabey you single handedly boosted their total revenues over D R Horton and sabotaged Pulte at the same time. You sneaky bastard! I know you have the skill set to do that, hell I'm surprised you're not chairman of the board yet!

Man you're one sad little man. They make pills for your condition you know. I'm sure your insane benefits package should cover them. If not you could just call up Rush Limbaugh and ask where a good pill mill is, he is sure to help untouchable suit such as yourself. Come to think of it, did you happen to underwrite Rush's first mortgage back in the 80s? That is a huge favor to call in, you might want to use it before Florida is underwater.

Now for the bonus question: Name the company who releases the list your employer is on. Extra points if you can name the parent company.
Hint: It's four letters!

 

[So]

Originally posted by: redly
I've got ~$300 worth of scratched DVD's in my kids closet...do you suppose disney will just send me new DVDs?

It depends, did you buy a disc from them, or a license to play the content on the disc? If the latter, they damn well should.

 

[StinkyPinky]

Sounds like this company needs to think up a new way to track licences of their software. Imagine a large software company getting away with this.

Customer: "Yeah, hi Microsoft. Look our company has a $50,000 site licence to use your product...but I misplaced the volume licence discs. Can I have a new copy please?"
Adobe: "No, you must pay the 50k again"
Customer: "...."

 

[DangerAardvark]

Actually, the more I think about it, the more it IS like losing a piece of jewelry. Gemstones are withheld from the market to keep prices high. So if you lose a piece of jewelry their cost of sending you a replacement might well be about the same in scale as the price of a USB thumb drive to a $1500 piece of software.

 

[StinkyPinky]

Originally posted by: DangerAardvark
Actually, the more I think about it, the more it IS like losing a piece of jewelry. Gemstones are withheld from the market to keep prices high. So if you lose a piece of jewelry their cost of sending you a replacement might well be about the same in scale as the price of a USB thumb drive to a $1500 piece of software.

With most software, you pay for a licence. You never actually own it.

 

[alkemyst]

Originally posted by: xeemzor
Do you really plan as if nothing will ever go wrong with the usb dongles and that the whole world is perfect? If so, I feel bad for your company.

Well as long as you have possession of the dongle, you can get them replaced usually free.

You need to think son, instead of simply believing you are just right because you think so.

I have a Crystal Installation that was about $10k or so for the software license. If I lost my box, manuals and CD's I could call up and provide my license and probably have all of that replaced by 1st am delivery tomorrow.

However; if I called up without any documentation and told them I have the box, manuals, and cd's for their software but lost my license agreement, they'd have another serial to me within an hour for another $10k.

Our plan for lost dongles or any hardware is to pre-purchase spares.

 

[alkemyst]

Originally posted by: fisher
end users make money with software just as much as "real businesses", especially in this case with music software. i realize you are too arrogant to realize that, but try to keep it in mind so you don't look 15 or something.

wrong friend, you are the idiot that doesn't realize if someone is profitable, they are a business and therefore can justify the $1500 business cost to replace it.

I must take up a large part of your day.

 

[erikistired]

Originally posted by: alkemyst

Originally posted by: fisher
end users make money with software just as much as "real businesses", especially in this case with music software. i realize you are too arrogant to realize that, but try to keep it in mind so you don't look 15 or something.

wrong friend, you are the idiot that doesn't realize if someone is profitable, they are a business and therefore can justify the $1500 business cost to replace it.

I must take up a large part of your day.

lol. tell that to the independent musician trying to get his music out there who paid 1500 bucks for software he probably couldn't afford in the first place. it must be nice living in your narrow world.

 

[xeemzor]

That was quite a smack down SampSon! Thanks for the read 🙂

 

[alkemyst]

Originally posted by: SampSon
Why do any of you take a word of what alkemyst says seriously? The guy has been writing mortgages since he was 13, don't step to that!

Never said I was writing them...I was never a loan officer. I was aiding in electronic sales to government agencies when I was still in high school though and part of some of the largest pass-through certificate sales in the history of banking in the mid-90's.

Originally posted by: SampSon
I'd really love to have a chronological log of all the bullshit our buddy alkemyst has spewed over the years. It would make for great reading.

Never have I seen someone claming to be so versed in everything beat their chest so hard to prove it. Thoes who really have it, don't talk about it. Really, who feels the need to air their entire career history on a forum (you left out some of your unemployed time in that list), bash others and then validate everything they say by stating they "work for a fortune 400 company"? Has your life reached such a desperate low?

Who is beating their chest, I simply reply to you fools that think because you have such crappy lives that everyone must or just because you made it, no one else can.

I choose to get involved in things instead of trading Pokemon's and being the quickest in my circle jerk.

My unemployed time was only during school when working part time...it was by choice. There has been a couple of 2-3 month periods between changing jobs though so you can note that.

Originally posted by: SampSon
If you didn't try to hard to be a big shot badass then some of it might be believeable. Unfortunately that is not the case. Really, any mature person knows that, hell any person with half a chimp brain knows that. I think your alcoholism is starting to really affect your judgement, what little you have. When will you enter a thread and not argue it down to the lowest common denominator of penis wagging? Is there going to be a time when you understand that your fluffed resume doesn't make you right?

Like I have said in the past, prove me wrong then. Also it's more or less you nitwits calling me out and posting up things in the past I have said. I swear you losers must keep a database on me.

Having 7 years of core college level science just sort of teaches you a little bit about the way things work I guess. Working on many car, boat, home and truck projects likewise. Volunteering my time with some animal groups shows just a little bit about how things go out there too. And of course having over 20 years of experience in mortgage banking taught me a lot about that.

Originally posted by: SampSon
There is a person on this forum that you should learn from. His name is descartes. This guy is very successful (in reality). Yet rarely, if ever, feels the need to validate his arguments or himself by going off on a rant about how great he is. He manages to form articulate arguments without having to disclose his career history inorder to validate his arguments. It's very simple, he knows what he's talking about so his posts do all the talking for him. Quaint idea, dontcha think?

I have yet to see much of decartes posts. I am sure he must be known in RL to not be questioned.

Originally posted by: SampSon
So anyway, what top 10 builder do you work for? Is is Pulte, Centex, KB, Hovnanian, NVR, D.R. Horton, Toll Brothers, Beazer, M. D. C., or mabey Lennar?
Lennar is based in Miami and that's where you live. So that could be probable, it would be the perfect fit for you! I'm fairly certain that all top 10 builders fall into the fortune 400 category. I know that the #1 home builder in 2007 probably has a very large need for a staff of IT monkeys like yourself. Assuming that is the case, were you just trying to be vague by saying "top 10", or was it just convienient that the top builder is HQed in your area? Lennar was only #3 in 2006 going into 2007, mabey you single handedly boosted their total revenues over D R Horton and sabotaged Pulte at the same time. You sneaky bastard! I know you have the skill set to do that, hell I'm surprised you're not chairman of the board yet!

Wow good job, but your spelling and grammar fell off a bit their...breathe a little, maybe loosen your collar. Why don't I just post up my office phone number as well right?

Don't be an idiot.

Originally posted by: SampSon
Man you're one sad little man. They make pills for your condition you know. I'm sure your insane benefits package should cover them. If not you could just call up Rush Limbaugh and ask where a good pill mill is, he is sure to help untouchable suit such as yourself. Come to think of it, did you happen to underwrite Rush's first mortgage back in the 80s? That is a huge favor to call in, you might want to use it before Florida is underwater.

Sad? It's you that's so angry and upset, not me man. I understand life and comfortable with mine.

Originally posted by: SampSon
Now for the bonus question: Name the company who releases the list your employer is on. Extra points if you can name the parent company.
Hint: It's four letters!

How do you keep an idiot in suspense?

 

[alkemyst]

Originally posted by: fisher

Originally posted by: alkemyst

Originally posted by: fisher
end users make money with software just as much as "real businesses", especially in this case with music software. i realize you are too arrogant to realize that, but try to keep it in mind so you don't look 15 or something.

wrong friend, you are the idiot that doesn't realize if someone is profitable, they are a business and therefore can justify the $1500 business cost to replace it.

I must take up a large part of your day.

lol. tell that to the independent musician trying to get his music out there who paid 1500 bucks for software he probably couldn't afford in the first place. it must be nice living in your narrow world.

Then he should be careful with his property. If the musician lost his guitar will Martin or Gibson, etc just send him a new one?

 

[multiband8303]

So your saying if I lose the key to my car, the manufacturer should pay for it right?

My main point I'm trying to get across is, when does it become your own personal responsibility for your own tangible goods, and not the concern of a business that has already supplied you with the means to perform the function they have promised and have delivered?

 

[multiband8303]

Originally posted by: alkemyst

Originally posted by: fisher

Originally posted by: alkemyst
only with the old serial which is then deactivated. You can get CD's anytime, you aren't even really buying the CD...it's the COA your are buying. In the case of the dongle, that is another part of the purchase. The software is really nothing. Most will not need a new serial...i

A dongle is just like I described. However, you could send in the old one and then you can get a new one...don't have the old one sorry.

Maybe in your little fantasy world you think things work differently, but in a Fortune 400 enterprise with 6000 workstations and tons of specialized software I think I know a little better than you.

it's amazing how many jobs you've held and how many different lives you've lived in the time you've been posting on anandtech.

well dumb ass it's the same line of work that I have been in mostly in throughout my life, a mortgage company.

So your facts are straight for next time I worked mortgage since around 8th grade then chinese delivery part time in high school a bit *edit* I also interned for a large civil/mechanical engineering firm for about 1 year in high school...then interned in both a pharmacy and veternary practice in college while working for a couple mortgage companies. I later decided to no longer go for Pharmacy and found a big opportunity with a mortgage company full time, bought my first house at 23. I got bored after 6 or so years and went back to college for a Comp Sci degree. While in college I used my biological science background to work for a medical coding company part time.

Once I graduated I worked for a web shop, did this for about a year or two and the went into the Information Tech side of the mortgage business for the last 4+ years. We are only one of the top 10 homebuilders in the country.

Take some notes so you know better next time.

I'm sorry but I chuckled.

I work for GMAC (in Minneapolis), I'm just a lowly Network Admin/Engineer, but out of curiousity what mortgage company do you work for? You'd be amazed on what I can find out 🙂

 

[alkemyst]

Originally posted by: multiband8303
I'm sorry but I chuckled.

I work for GMAC (in Minneapolis), I'm just a lowly Network Admin/Engineer, but out of curiousity what mortgage company do you work for? You'd be amazed on what I can find out 🙂

My responsibilities here are mostly bridging the gap between our associates and the technology.

I developed their online application, the main website for our business unit, and a few specialty apps. My secondary functions are operational and in keeping everyone humming.

We are a small IS/IT team here, whereas enterprise wide I think we have about 100 non-technical support reps.

 

[alkemyst]

Originally posted by: multiband8303
So your saying if I lose the key to my car, the manufacturer should pay for it right?

My main point I'm trying to get across is, when does it become your own personal responsibility for your own tangible goods, and not the concern of a business that has already supplied you with the means to perform the function they have promised and have delivered?

Hell no, they should send you a new car with keys.