Left Wing Groups Call For Limitations On Speech

[Budmantom]

Good that means you don't buy into the Wingnut bullshit. Obviously you aren't one of those Conservatives that listens to Whackjobs on the Rightwing Radio telling you what to think

Don't let the truth get in the way of your liberalism

 

[Red Dawn]

Don't let the truth get in the way of your liberalism

Ah one of the lessor Wingnuts I was talking about who gets his marching orders from the Whackjobs on Rightwing Radio chimes in.:twisted:

 

[woolfe9999]

It's amazing how many threads we've had which progress exactly like this one. One wingnut posts an alarmist "story" about something awful the left is supposed to be doing. 7-8 other of the usual wingnuts, none of who have actually thoroughly read the source, post "me too's." Some non-wingnut mentions that the "left" is not really doing what the OP claimed, often according to the OP's own source. The wingnuts, trying to salvage whatever they can, then chime in with "well this is what the left *intends* to do anyway, even if they aren't exactly doing it now."

P&N really is 99% worthless for any kind of intelligent discussion.

- wolf

 

[umbrella39]

LMFAO... No shit. His mom must have been 80 when she had him.

 

[Budmantom]

LMFAO... No shit. His mom must have been 80 when she had him.

She was 79, how old were your dads when they had you?

 

[Budmantom]

The party that brought us the fairness doctrine is all about free speech.

 

[umbrella39]

The reality here is that left wing radio couldn't compete in the marketplace. Air America was example enough of this. For whatever reason, people wanted to listen to Limbaugh. All the left can do in defense of this is rationalize that they're more level-headed, or can think for themselves. Don't be foolish. You're no different than us, except that you've lost the war in the talk radio arena. Rather than admit defeat in a fair fight, the left opts to silence the opposition.

Yeah because all the left is waiting for is someone with Rush's magnanimous personality to FINALLY make "left wing radio" take off. LMFAO. Honestly... I'm surprised someone who stupid enough to try to keep AA afloat as long as they did. Just not something that will ever work.

Face it, your reality is based on bullshit. Just because your "US" is memorized by hearing the thoughts in your head articulated by others on the radio doesn't mean the left is just waiting for the right pipe player. The rat-catcher hired by the PTB to lure rats away with his magic pipe has no effect on critical thinkers apparently. Keep trying...

 

[Turin39789]

Even taken out of context that's not inflammatory. I think most of us here (with a few exceptions) are bright enough to distinguish the difference between free speech and liable.

Libel.

It's amazing how many threads we've had which progress exactly like this one. One wingnut posts an alarmist "story" about something awful the left is supposed to be doing. 7-8 other of the usual wingnuts, none of who have actually thoroughly read the source, post "me too's." Some non-wingnut mentions that the "left" is not really doing what the OP claimed, often according to the OP's own source. The wingnuts, trying to salvage whatever they can, then chime in with "well this is what the left *intends* to do anyway, even if they aren't exactly doing it now."

P&N really is 99% worthless for any kind of intelligent discussion.

- wolf

This should be the new sticky to read before you post in P&N, so you know how the forum works.

 

[Atreus21]

Yeah because all the left is waiting for is someone with Rush's magnanimous personality to FINALLY make "left wing radio" take off. LMFAO. Honestly... I'm surprised someone who stupid enough to try to keep AA afloat as long as they did. Just not something that will ever work.

From what I can decipher, I agree. The left isn't waiting for someone like Rush because it doesn't matter. The problem with left-wing radio is the message, not the messenger. This point has been hammered home repeatedly, and all you guys do is complain about the messenger.

Face it, your reality is based on bullshit. Just because your "US" is memorized by hearing the thoughts in your head articulated by others on the radio doesn't mean the left is just waiting for the right pipe player. The rat-catcher hired by the PTB to lure rats away with his magic pipe has no effect on critical thinkers apparently. Keep trying...

Again, more rationalization. Your response to defeat is to rationalize that you were above the game to begin with. Time to man up.

 

[DanDaManJC]

Again, more rationalization. Your response to defeat is to rationalize that you were above the game to begin with. Time to man up.

Well, I guess we can give you wing nut radio in trade for higher education and people with real critical reasoning skills...

 

[dank69]

From what I can decipher, I agree. The left isn't waiting for someone like Rush because it doesn't matter. The problem with left-wing radio is the message, not the messenger. This point has been hammered home repeatedly, and all you guys do is complain about the messenger.



Again, more rationalization. Your response to defeat is to rationalize that you were above the game to begin with. Time to man up.

Game?

 

[Moonbeam]

Imagine if you could go back in time and warn the Germans they should do something about the broadcast of fascist hate speech and xenophobic demonetization of the Jews. Goebbels would be working overtime to call you a Communist traitor. The psychopaths in our society are a cluster of primitive minds that huddle together to create the illusion that what they believe is the real good and all others are evil. Thus it is that they are totally immune from any attack by reason, logic, or truth. They need none of those because their delusion is that they already have them and are their protectors. You can tell a bigot, but you can't tell him much. What bigots do is cocoon together and soothe each other with delusions that bigotry is the proper norm of behavior. They are apes throwing sticks from the trees.

But the mentality they posses is exactly the same as what drove the Nazis and they are every bit the same threat to bigoted-free people because they hate anybody who can see them for what they are. I laugh because, if their power grows too great we will have the same psychosis that hit Germany, but if you call them what they really are you'll get banned. Political correctness is all over the place. We must not call worthless scum worthless scum. It violates common courtesy; it might hurt somebody's feelings, the feelings of folk who will send millions to the gas chambers if they get the chance. Evil grows because good people do nothing and the morons march in the millions.

 

[Doc Savage Fan]

Imagine if you could go back in time and warn the Germans they should keep their media open and not allow one ideological perspective to control all their information.

 

[IceBergSLiM]

if you don't think the gubment is in full control of the media to begin with your asleep.

 

[her209]

 

[thraashman]

It's amazing how many threads we've had which progress exactly like this one. One wingnut posts an alarmist "story" about something awful the left is supposed to be doing. 7-8 other of the usual wingnuts, none of who have actually thoroughly read the source, post "me too's." Some non-wingnut mentions that the "left" is not really doing what the OP claimed, often according to the OP's own source. The wingnuts, trying to salvage whatever they can, then chime in with "well this is what the left *intends* to do anyway, even if they aren't exactly doing it now."

P&N really is 99% worthless for any kind of intelligent discussion.

- wolf

Wolf old boy. I must say that I find myself agreeing with you more often than not by a good deal. But I simply don't recommend using logic or truth or good common sense in P&N arguments. Most of P&N are people who find this crazy shit funny. And for every well-spoken and intelligent person like yourself you have the crazies. I've noticed far fewer woolfe9999's then I've seen Danube's, Patranus's, Spidey's, IHateViruses. Hell, even ProfJohn who would previously have been considered the resident right wing voice in P&N seems different than I remember. Which means either what I once saw as the crazy has changed or ProfJohn has changed. I really can't say which. But I'll take 100 ProfJohn's before we get another Danube.

And this is the inherent problem with left vs right talk radio. Wolf is more common amongst the left, Danube amongst the right. Wolf doesn't want some far left nutball screaming hate, rage, and panic. Danube wouldn't be able to live without his righty buddies doing it.

 

[Moonbeam]

Imagine if you could go back in time and warn the Germans they should keep their media open and not allow one ideological perspective to control all their information.

Except that's exactly where they started.

And they don't allow Nazi speach today because 50 million dead made them alot smarter.

There is a real question hiding here, isn't there? Is there such a thing as objective truth and objective evil and if there is why allow objective evil the same place at the table as objective truth. Is everything relative or do unbiased minds exist that differentiate between hate speech and rational speech?

 

[Moonbeam]

Wolf old boy. I must say that I find myself agreeing with you more often than not by a good deal. But I simply don't recommend using logic or truth or good common sense in P&N arguments. Most of P&N are people who find this crazy shit funny. And for every well-spoken and intelligent person like yourself you have the crazies. I've noticed far fewer woolfe9999's then I've seen Danube's, Patranus's, Spidey's, IHateViruses. Hell, even ProfJohn who would previously have been considered the resident right wing voice in P&N seems different than I remember. Which means either what I once saw as the crazy has changed or ProfJohn has changed. I really can't say which. But I'll take 100 ProfJohn's before we get another Danube.

And this is the inherent problem with left vs right talk radio. Wolf is more common amongst the left, Danube amongst the right. Wolf doesn't want some far left nutball screaming hate, rage, and panic. Danube wouldn't be able to live without his righty buddies doing it.

Every sick brainwashed mind has to have data that tells them they are abnormal. Nobody knows who will throw off bigotry and who will not. To give up on others is to give up. We see that many many can identify Danube as a bigot so as I said you can tell a bigot but you can't tell him much. How much is the question. Nobody has made a mental prison who also does not have a key. The question, then, is how do you deal with bigots to give them the best chance of recovery? Every fundamentalist, for example, surely knows you hate the sin but not the sinner, eh?

 

[Perknose]

Two can play this game, OP.

right wing poster calls for limitations on speech

even taken out of context that's not inflammatory. I think most of us here (with a few exceptions) are bright enough to distinguish the difference between free speech and liable.

WHOOSH! Time to changes the batteries in your meter, good sir!

The OP posted a factually incorrect Title (which I intentionally mimicked), as proved in detail by Bowfinger here.

I sardonically commented on his dishonesty with my own faux example.

Need more proof? Please, just re-read the lead sentence of my post:

Two can play this game, OP.

 

[classy]

Un-American scumbags. "hate speech" is a matter of perception, who decides?

Republicans think you're hateful if you give welfare because it destroys the soul, adversity makes you stronger and all that.
Democrats think you're hateful of you don't give welfare because people will starve.

Which is it and worse who decides?

You know damn well this is not the kind of hate speech they are talking about

 

[Doc Savage Fan]

There is a real question hiding here, isn't there? Is there such a thing as objective truth and objective evil and if there is why allow objective evil the same place at the table as objective truth. Is everything relative or do unbiased minds exist that differentiate between hate speech and rational speech?

Excellent question! I think free speech helps the majority of humanity get enough information to reasonably determine what is 'truth' and what is 'evil'. I think this is a big reason why we're seeing gay bigotry gradually fading in our society. Also, in answer to your question, I believe that unbiased minds do not exist...and no single ideology should ever control what constitutes 'acceptable' speech. Many people who've shaped our history (e.g. Patrick Henry, MLK) said some very unpopular things at the time. Would you want conservatives imposing their standards of 'acceptable speech' on you? It shouldn't be hard to imagine that they may feel the same way if the tables were turned....no?

 

[Moonbeam]

Excellent question! I think free speech helps the majority of humanity get enough information to reasonably determine what is 'truth' and what is 'evil'. I think this is a big reason why we're seeing gay bigotry gradually fading in our society. Also, in answer to your question, I believe that unbiased minds do not exist...and no single ideology should ever control what constitutes 'acceptable' speech. Many people who've shaped our history (e.g. Patrick Henry, MLK) said some very unpopular things at the time. Would you want conservatives imposing their standards of 'acceptable speech' on you? It shouldn't be hard to imagine that they may feel the same way if the tables were turned....no?

There can be no determination of what is truth and what is evil if there are no unbiased minds. If everybody is biased there is no objective reality. I happen to think you are completely wrong, but it is very understandable to have the position you do. The truth is unknown to most people for a reason. It is masked by the ego. To know anything real you have to have died to everything you believe and hold sacred. You have to die to your ego. It's not a road traveled my many.

 

[werepossum]

It's amazing how many threads we've had which progress exactly like this one. One wingnut posts an alarmist "story" about something awful the left is supposed to be doing. 7-8 other of the usual wingnuts, none of who have actually thoroughly read the source, post "me too's." Some non-wingnut mentions that the "left" is not really doing what the OP claimed, often according to the OP's own source. The wingnuts, trying to salvage whatever they can, then chime in with "well this is what the left *intends* to do anyway, even if they aren't exactly doing it now."

P&N really is 99% worthless for any kind of intelligent discussion.

- wolf

You really see no connection between liberals demanding that the FCC monitor "hate speech" and the liberals demanding that the FCC use the Fairness Doctrine and other things like "community content" to eliminate that "hate speech"? Must be lots of totally unforeseeable surprises in your world, Wolf.

 

[woolfe9999]

You really see no connection between liberals demanding that the FCC monitor "hate speech" and the liberals demanding that the FCC use the Fairness Doctrine and other things like "community content" to eliminate that "hate speech"? Must be lots of totally unforeseeable surprises in your world, Wolf.

Back up. This thread started with an assertion, to wit: "Left Wing Groups Call For Limitations On Speech." I open the thread, and see that there is a link in the OP. I click the link, and within 10 seconds I can see that it says the groups are calling for "non-regulatory" measures, and that they are not asking for content restrictions. I am not saying that no liberal anywhere has ever called for censorship. I am also not saying - because I don't know - whether these particular liberals, in their heart of hearts, really want censorship and that its coming down the pike next. I'm still stuck on the bullshit that is the thread title, and the subsequent replies, all of which were based on the original bullshit assertion, with no checking of the source link. That is what I'm saying is par for the course here. Someone makes a bullshit assertion, and anyone who is ideologically inclined toward that person's viewpoint immediately credits the assertion and joins the "me too" brigade without even so much as checking the OP's own source, let alone anything more extensive than that.

- wolf

 

[werepossum]

Just to help out Wolfie, here's a little selection from the NHMC's own web site about "hate speech".
http://www.nhmc.org/node/38

Hate Radio's Bigotry Against Hispanics
Wed, 05/07/2008 - 11:18 — admin
from the May 7, 2008 "Progress Report” section of the Center for American Progress Action Fund website (www.americanprogressaction.org)


On Monday, hate radio king Rush Limbaugh appeared on Fox News for five minutes to discuss the presidential race and managed to make an offensive comment. Limbaugh called Los Angeles Mayor Antonio Villaraigosa (D), who is Hispanic, a "shoe shine guy." Yesterday, Alex Nogales, president of the National Hispanic Media Coalition, blasted Limbaugh for uttering "the same kind of nasty, bigoted, racist type comment that has become so prevalent in today's society, as practiced by Lou Dobbs, as practiced by [Sean] Hannity, [Bill] O'Reilly, [Michael] Savage." Racial slurs, particularly fueled against Hispanics, has found a home on right-wing radio, which claims 91 percent of radio airwaves. The nation's leading Hispanic advocacy group, National Council of La Raza, launched a campaign earlier this year decrying right-wing radio for its "rhetoric that demonizes immigrants and Hispanic Americans." "Talk like Savage's, or Limbaugh's or O'Reilly's, has become routine, even systematic, and certainly a big business. According to the Senate Democratic Policy Committee, the top five radio station owners that control 45 powerful, 50,000-watt or more radio stations broadcast 310 hours of nationally syndicated right-wing talk. But they broadcast only a total of five hours of countervailing talk," Salon reported. Yet these talkers are rarely held to account: For example, neither ABC, Time, nor Politico mentioned the offensive remarks when reporting on Limbaugh's TV commentary this week. Progressive radio host Mario Solis-Marich wrote Tuesday, "As a member of the largest minority ethnic group and a member of the media, I am continually puzzled and outraged by the idea that anyone can say anything about Latinos without fearing any consequence."

DEMAGOGUING IMMIGRATION: A study by the Project for Excellence in Journalism found, "Thanks to energetic opposition from Rush Limbaugh, Sean Hannity, and Michael Savage, immigration was the biggest topic, at 16%, on conservative talk radio in the second quarter" of last year -- when conservative radio led the effort to defeat congressional comprehensive immigration reform, largely by resorting to fear and hatred. Radio host Neal Boortz urged listeners to help defeat "this illegal alien amnesty bill" and "yank out the welcome mat." Speaking of undocumented immigrants he said, "Give 'em all a little nuclear waste and let 'em take it on down there to Mexico. Tell 'em...it'll heat tortillas." Michael Savage repeatedly exhorted listeners to "burn a Mexican flag" and to "tell them to go back to where they came from." CNN's Glenn Beck, who also has a radio show, took particular issue with Sen. John McCain's (R-AZ) support for the immigration bill (though McCain has since changed positions), deriding the senator as "Juan McCain." Beck called McCain's support for the bill and the fact that his national director of Hispanic outreach was of Mexican background "an audacious slap in the face."

A 'RACE WAR': Right-wing radio's discussion of immigration often veers away from policy to focus on race. Savage once warned his listeners, "The European-American, or the white person, is being erased from America's future...There is a racial element to the immigration invasion, at least I see it that way." Discussing a pro-immigrant parade in L.A., O'Reilly said, "So now, it's becoming a race war." O'Reilly also accused supporters of immigration -- "who hate America...because it's run primarily by white, Christian men" -- of seeking "to change the complexion...of America." These hatemongers have made clear their primary concern: maintaining a white majority. Just this year, Fox News's John Gibson gave "a big round of applause" on his radio show to the "non-Hispanic white women" who were having babies, which he said vindicated his call on "the dominant, or largest population sector, which is Caucasians," to "make more babies." "And what happens to white people?" Savage wondered. "That's the real question here. Will our brown brethren, who are so nationalistic and so anti-beloved patriot and anti-Anglo, be as enlightened as the European-American is? I don't think so."

HEALTH SCARE: Right-wing radio hosts have also -- wrongly -- claimed that illegal immigrants should be kept out of the United States because they bring strange diseases in. O'Reilly agreed with a caller into his radio show who said that illegal immigration "surpasses the impact of 9/11" because "each one of these people is a biological weapon." The caller claimed that that "illegals crossing the border" are bringing "tuberculosis, syphilis, leprosy." O'Reilly agreed, and said there was "an absolutely airtight case" that more Americans "have either been killed or injured, based upon the 11 million illegals who are here," than died on 9/11. (O'Reilly later insisted he "never said anything like that.") Last summer, CNN's Lou Dobbs repeatedly claimed that there were "7,000" cases of leprosy in the U.S. in the last three years, and suggested the cases were due to illegal immigrants. When confronted with a CBS analysis that found only 7,000 cases of leprosy in the last 30 years -- and an unknown number involving illegal immigrants -- Dobbs simply replied, "If we reported it, it's a fact."

Please note that "hate radio" is specifically identified as Limbaugh, Hannity, Dobbs, Boortz, Beck and Savage, along with a blatant lie that right wing radio claims 91% of radio airwaves. And you people have the fucking nerve to tell us that "studying" this "hate speech" is no indication of a desire and intention to eliminate it? Nobody should be either that blatantly dishonest or that stupid.

Note also that the National Council of La Raza (The Race) is listed as "the nation's leading Hispanic advocacy group." Evidently advocating "for the race everything, outside the race nothing" is not considered hate speech. Go figure.