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Kodiak Bear vs African Lion

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I think there are too many confounding factors to properly make the determination, and I think the actual result would be something entirely different.

1- If they encountered each other in the wild, both being healthy, they wouldn't bother each other. Why would they? Part of surviving is avoiding potential dangers, and both would see each other as that.

2- Every instance of them fighting each other has confounding factors affecting it. To get them to fight you have to do a variety of things in conjunction to get them to attack. Starving, torturing and in putting them places not native to either. Being on loose gravel vs grass would affect the fight. There are some videos that I saw a very long time ago between a lion and tiger and a bear vs a tiger and they wanted nothing to do with each other. It was sort of like watching a cat and dog fight. The cat avoided until the dog got too close and then a swipe to the snout, with the dog retreating and the cat going back to avoiding.
 
I think there are too many confounding factors to properly make the determination, and I think the actual result would be something entirely different.

1- If they encountered each other in the wild, both being healthy, they wouldn't bother each other. Why would they? Part of surviving is avoiding potential dangers, and both would see each other as that.

2- Every instance of them fighting each other has confounding factors affecting it. To get them to fight you have to do a variety of things in conjunction to get them to attack. Starving, torturing and in putting them places not native to either. Being on loose gravel vs grass would affect the fight. There are some videos that I saw a very long time ago between a lion and tiger and a bear vs a tiger and they wanted nothing to do with each other. It was sort of like watching a cat and dog fight. The cat avoided until the dog got too close and then a swipe to the snout, with the dog retreating and the cat going back to avoiding.
Flawless post. This should be posted and credited in any of these threads that crop up.
 
heh, funny thread. I love how silver prime just states Lions > * and gives absolutely zero facts/proof. Then when someone else says * < lions, he cries foul and says "where's the proof!?"
 
A kodiak bear will use a lion as a mop, making good use of the nice absorption properties of the male lion's mane.

Even lions are not kings of their own territories. Just youtube lion vs hyena and you will see plenty of cases where hyenas actually dominate them. Lot of times the lion is scared off by hyenas too. Then there are plenty of cases of lions getting an ass whopping from the prey they try to take on... water buffalo, hippos, even giraffe. Just youtube it and watch the videos.

The Kodiak on the other hand is an unstoppable force. just try ot find a case of the kodiak bear trying to kill something but ends up getting killed by the prey.
 
Poor OP would gain much credibility (or is it creditability) if he would just bother to use a browser with a built in spell checker.

For instance, Chrome or Mozilla would work.

Entertaining thread that's for sure.
 
heh, funny thread. I love how silver prime just states Lions > * and gives absolutely zero facts/proof. Then when someone else says * < lions, he cries foul and says "where's the proof!?"

Nah, I just love how you gota twist facts, I dident bring any proof?

-I brought feats of lions (Over 100 sources) of them killing animals bigger than bears.
-An experts opinion who has worked with both on the matter.
-Over 10 Links of occaisons the lion has killed his kin the Polar/Grizzly/Black.
-Brought scientifcal evidence of superior anatomy, bigger; fangs/skulls.
-Explained in detail how both fight
-There sociality
-There heraldry and historical consenes.

What did anyone bring that countered that, in fact what did any one bring other than half ass sources that has been exploited with the credentials to do so.

Nothing.

I'm fine with even if everyone gave there opinion to the bear, but I am more satisfied, since none can match the little data on hand; since that little data has a significant margin, a significant lead, a significant amount of proof that shows atleast...

A 7/10 win for the lion.

Thats being generous, not to mention if no one can match the data...

Then thats how it will stay...a million opinions is still; Opinions, and nothing can change facts, not even a million drops of your tears. So rage on butt hurt fan tard with no evidence, many others have sided with the lion too (with the proper analysis) of seeing through your bias deceptive douche bag-ness. lol
 
The first thing I stated was that the environment would be a major factor.

I also do not know anything about your sloth bear.

I do know that a full size lion is smaller in weight and height than a full size Kodiak and Grizzly.

The lion is not designed to take on an animal the size of a Kodiak/Grizzly.

IF they were to fight; external forces would have to be applied which then negates the natural tendencies.

Because they are not from the same environment; any speculation is clueless.

As others have said; the lion is also a chicken around the hyena which is much smaller but tougher.

So the lion knows about size and opponents.
It is also mainly the female that does the hunt; bringing down the prey and then letting the leader of the pride eat first.

You can believe the stories about the "fights"; but they were staged/manipulated.

The slot bear is not native to the African plains and the lion is unable to survive where there is no thin hide prey.
 
There have been Alaskan Browns that have exceeded 2000 pounds as they gorge on Salmon, but that's not typical nor is 800 pound Lions.

I'd be inclined to favor an Alaskan Brown over most any predatory land animal including Lions and Tigers, but as far as I know the only two species known to kill an Elephant are humans and Lions. Of course, when Lions kill an Elephant they do so with numbers. There is in fact one or more prides in Africa that frequently kill Elephants.

I would love to know if the Romans kept detailed records of the animal death matches in the various coliseums throughout the Roman empire. It would be interesting to see what the outcome of actual matches of this kind would be. Somewhere there must be records...


Brian

(Roman account)

Liokos is not allowed to retire into his cage this time, further infuriating him. The final match is now on between him and the heavily favored bear named Shardik. Diana bets against Shardik hoping that he will be killed. She despises Senator Palladius for making a gift of him to her. The bastard has hated her ever since she ignored his amorous advances during the Saturnalia festivities a couple of months ago. She hopes that the senator loses heavily on this bout. She has learned from her spies that he has bet heavily on Shardik. She has sent her agents around the city to find out what animal the senator is terrified of in order to give him that as gift in return.

Shardik enters the arena and the two animals cautiously eye each other at a distance. Liokos begins his attack by crawling very close to the ground, appearing to be as small as possible to his opponent. Liokos charges him without any further hesitation. Shardik gets a paw up in time to prevent Liokos from getting him by the neck. This has just cost him his paw and part of his foreleg now ripped to shreds. He falls backward with the lion falling on top of him and going to town with his lower claws on the hapless bear's belly. The bear tries desperately to kick him off with his three remaining limbs but by now Liokos has him by the throat and quickly dispatches him with a violent shake of his great maned head. The crowd explodes into applause.

The winner of the Venationes is Liokos the lion, owned by Arminius Reccanellus. The only ones happier than him are the bookies who took in millions of cesterces on the favorite Shardik...and of course Diana who has finally gotten rid of the hated Shardik


Humbly submitted from the stands
http://www.crystalwebvision.com/aedil/april5.htm

Its seems even like now days; people favored the so call bigger, more powerful bear, yet the superior fighting experince of the lion (Sense he kills animals that dwarfs any bear) is almost like a walk in the park for lions.


(Roman account)

Lioness kills atlas bear in the roman arena
http://books.google.com/books?id=nh...a=X&ei=xHkGUMzXDuil2AXP1_DDBQ&ved=0CCoQ6AEwAQ

lion kills polar bear and lion attacks another polar bear 1955 By Alfred Court.[Book]Pages 131-132,

Although it is some, the day of the arisen accident to Artis, the repetition extended itself to noon. For five hours of clock Anton and me had lived in the cage to the big cats. One will believe me maybe if I assert that we in went out exhausted, broken fatigue. The next day this lut the turn of the tigers, then I practiced alternation: a day the lions, a day the tigers. The constant concern of the tamer has 'to be first to assure itself that every beast perfectly possesses l'a.b.c. work that it will have to execute. That obtain, it can risk "the mixture". First the lions and the meet tigers, but that demanded a months and half of repetitions, then the leopards, the Danish dogs, at last the bears of the Himalayas. In the month of August, I began, as early as delivery, the training of the six polar bears. To the first essay of "mixes" the one of them was égorgé by a lion. It immediately was replaced, thus besides that the aggressor that dut to yield his place to another lion less hargneux,,

Another lion attacks a polar bear…

On the big pyramid, a white bear, neighbor of a lion mordit the latter, the lion jumps on the bear, both of them ran down of their perchoir, rolled to the ground and immediately a tiger jumped them over. Instantly Drilled e burst, with his habitual music of blows of mouth, of roarings, of hilarious claws the air. Helped of Schultz that I had taken with me in the cage, I arrived to bring back peace.


http://www.worthpoint.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/02/Life-With-Big-Cats.jpg
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_y2wHaYYEsJw/Saowc4ij0-I/AAAAAAAACzI/uw1xcq-YVxQ/s400/court+act.bmp
http://alfred.court.free.fr/lacageauxfauves.htm

I looked up what egorged means in french, heres what google images shows...
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=égorgé&gbv=1&um=1&ie=UTF-8&tbm=isch&source=og&sa=N&tab=wi

Apearntly the polar bears throat was ripped out by the lion.

A kin to the Kodiak...

jungle-1910-11-21-Ind.jpg

lion-vs-bear.gif


Thats gotta sting, the bear was ready too, hence it states the they both looked at each other, so it wasent a ambush, it shows how more agressive the lion is to the brown bear family not to mention what happen to the all mighty brown bear, it states the lion made short work of him...since all accounts like these; show they are the ones to make the initial attack not the giant fur ball...

scaled.php


Huh! Some unstopable animal, what cant handle a smaller animal as usual?

lol
 
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The first thing I stated was that the environment would be a major factor.

Yes, and you said the polar bear could beat the lion on his own terf, in africa...lol where there has the hottest temperatures on earth? Regular temperatures could kill a polar bear from heat stroke, so it seems you know nothing of what you are talking about.

You dont get to opinionate anything to me after that one, and want me to take you serious?

I also do not know anything about your sloth bear.

You dont know anything of any of these bears, other than fan made sites like wiki.

I do know that a full size lion is smaller in weight and height than a full size Kodiak and Grizzly.

So is almost everything else the lion kills.

The lion is not designed to take on an animal the size of a Kodiak/Grizzly.

Up to 3 1/2 tons (9,000 pounds The third largest land animal)
http://www.outtoafrica.nl/animals/enghippo.html

7,000 pounds heavier than the worlds biggest bear

Single male lion in action:
12.jpg



The giraffe is the tallest animal in the world. Males reach a towering 19 feet tall and weigh between 2400 and 4250 pounds.
http://www.thebigzoo.com/Animals/Reticulated_Giraffe.asp

8 feet taller than the worlds biggest bear

Single lion kills adult male giraffe:
Manengop-at-giraffe2.jpg

http://lionguardians.wildlifedirect.org/2011/03/05/lone-lion-kills-a-giraffe/

Adult weight: 300-900 kg
http://www.ultimateungulate.com/Artiodactyla/Syncerus_caffer.html

4x more powerful then the worlds strongest bear

Single male lion taking down massive buffalo:
http://www.wildwatch.com/sightings/lion-kill-6



IF they were to fight; external forces would have to be applied which then negates the natural tendencies.

Because they are not from the same environment; any speculation is clueless.

You are clueless, this is hypothetical.

As others have said; the lion is also a chicken around the hyena which is much smaller but tougher.

Is that all you can resort to? Talking about low end feats, is non-essential, or other wise, the wolverine has killed polar bears so by that logic Wolverine>Polar bear on average? No. Oh and anyways...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YUCxL3GHTIA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oHDeNjwntKM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FoNmQX09rX0


What was about to happen was unbelievable and a once in a lifetime sighting. The first Lioness dashed in and went for the carcass. With brute force and unbelievable power she swatted one Hyena off the carcass. She grabbed the left over meat and hastily moved into some thicker vegetation. The Hyena saw what was coming and took the opportunity to make himself scarce. His two friends were not that lucky and before they could realise what was happening the remaining three Lionesses attacked them.

The second Lioness grabbed one Hyena by the scruff of the neck and started shaking it about as if it was a rag doll. She dropped it to the ground and immediately went for the jugular vein. She kept the Hyena pinned to the ground with one paw while slowly squeezing the life from it. The other Hyena saw what was happening and tried to flee but was not quick enough. The third Lioness got hold of her and latched onto her back driving her canines into the spine of the Hyena. This was accompanied by a blooding-curdling howl and the Hyena, unlike her companion, tried to defend herself by snapping at the Lioness. The Lioness retaliated and had another go at the Hyena – this time with more force and direction. Blood and fur were flying all over the place and once again the powerful cat emerged the victor.
http://www.sabisabi.com/safaris/ranger/2832/eternal-enemies

Even a hyena has a harder bite than any bear...so by your standards, thats again what? Hyena>>>>Bear? lol


So the lion knows about size and opponents.
It is also mainly the female that does the hunt; bringing down the prey and then letting the leader of the pride eat first.

Yet again, you know nothing on subject.

Park, George Schaller (1972) reported that an amazing 62% of all lion prey was made up of Cape buffalo, with 81% of this 62% being adult male buffalo. Buffalo-killing is also important to the lions of Kruger National Park, and studies here have shown, significantly, that male lions are not just frequent and successful hunters: they are also the lions that are best at killing buffalo (Funston et al. 1998)"
http://darrennaish.blogspot.com/2006/11/giant-killers-macropredation-in-lions.html

(Personal observation) Not half ass propaganda storys that merely only tell of part of the story form a stand point of hear say, stop down scaling or I will include and make a list of every animal (100's) that have beatin the shit out of brown bears in pit fights to wild encounters in rare cases, all the animals you've listed along with others are only down scaling and nameing things that are out of the norm, if you think that a hyena is more than a match for a lion, then dont bother posting, because your post are abserd and border line retarded.


You can believe the stories about the "fights"; but they were staged/manipulated.

Proof? Oh yeah you have none, just a butt hurt guy who is twisting facts, using unreliable data, constantly contradicting yourself, consistantly talking of things that arnt facts but seem to regard them as facts; lol.

The slot bear is not native to the African plains and the lion is unable to survive where there is no thin hide prey.

lol lions can kill crocs, who have more reslient and durability factors, Armor plated skin>>>>Bears fat hide...
lion-vs-tiger-lion-wins-most-times-21628745.jpg

africanlionskillcrocodi.jpg

http://books.google.com/books?id=dF...a=X&ei=o21WUM7AHtDsigLuiIHABA&ved=0CCsQ6AEwAQ
 
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Nah, I just love how you gota twist facts, I dident bring any proof?

-I brought feats of lions (Over 100 sources) of them killing animals bigger than bears.
-An experts opinion who has worked with both on the matter.
-Over 10 Links of occaisons the lion has killed his kin the Polar/Grizzly/Black.
-Brought scientifcal evidence of superior anatomy, bigger; fangs/skulls.
-Explained in detail how both fight
-There sociality
-There heraldry and historical consenes.

What did anyone bring that countered that, in fact what did any one bring other than half ass sources that has been exploited with the credentials to do so.

Nothing.

I'm fine with even if everyone gave there opinion to the bear, but I am more satisfied, since none can match the little data on hand; since that little data has a significant margin, a significant lead, a significant amount of proof that shows atleast...

A 7/10 win for the lion.

Thats being generous, not to mention if no one can match the data...

Then thats how it will stay...a million opinions is still; Opinions, and nothing can change facts, not even a million drops of your tears. So rage on butt hurt fan tard with no evidence, many others have sided with the lion too (with the proper analysis) of seeing through your bias deceptive douche bag-ness. lol

That's not proof. You're just typing words and sentences. Again, no real proof. Good job hypocrite!
 
Just wanted to see others opinions on this specific challange of who people think would win, in a (Hypothetical) match up of wild and or arranged event such as amphitheaters an such.

From Silver Prime's OP. He just wanted to see other's opinions. He didn't tell us he'd start berating everyone who actually gave their opinion.

Opinion does not mean you have to bring any proof. It's just an opinion (aka what someone thinks about something).

Of course, someone with as atrocious spelling as his probably wouldn't understand this.
 
I once witnessed a bear bitch slap a tiger, the tiger then proceeded to bitch slap a lion and take its meal and bring it back to the bear, the lion then proceeded to bitch slap a poodle because it felt bad.

So this proves:

bear>tiger>lion>poodle
 
That's not proof. You're just typing words and sentences. Again, no real proof. Good job hypocrite!

lol I've been shelling out proof on each page, I posted the medium on page one; everything is in just a few links, what...do I have to post the same links everysingle time I adress the same things?

All so far have brought the same opinions, and none are even remotely true and or reliable... if the topic was Ali vs foreman, and I showed a article of Ali knocking out george foreman, what else is there more to look at? The statistics like weight and power would then mean little to jack shit. In the same sense, I showed accounts (of majority) of occaisons of lions killing all types of bears, the only way you'd be able to make a more creditable counter-bate is by showing a account where George foreman knocks out ali, in other words a Kodiak/kin killing a male african lion.

Did anyone? No, so shat ap, the only hypocrite here is you cry baby.

Oh an majority of the people have more modern computers that have spell checker, so hardly anyone will be making any mistakes no dought if they dident have it; more mistakes would be made, I make mistakes because this is a 2003 com, and it dosent have spell checker; its also not that I cant spell, I tend to rush and be care free since this is just a free time laugh-a-paluzah its evident because some times I spell correct sometimes I dont, dosent mean I cant spell it moron, you sound like a dumbass with a calculator telling someone who is has only paper and pencil they cant do math, without the calc, you aint shit...I aint writing for the news or a collage paper, so deal with it...if I cared at all about it I would correct it, but I dont; because I'm not a grammar and punctuation nazi. You have all the assests of a newer com, yet you still look more retarded then ever. XD XD
 
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I think there are too many confounding factors to properly make the determination, and I think the actual result would be something entirely different.

1- If they encountered each other in the wild, both being healthy, they wouldn't bother each other. Why would they? Part of surviving is avoiding potential dangers, and both would see each other as that.

2- Every instance of them fighting each other has confounding factors affecting it. To get them to fight you have to do a variety of things in conjunction to get them to attack. Starving, torturing and in putting them places not native to either. Being on loose gravel vs grass would affect the fight. There are some videos that I saw a very long time ago between a lion and tiger and a bear vs a tiger and they wanted nothing to do with each other. It was sort of like watching a cat and dog fight. The cat avoided until the dog got too close and then a swipe to the snout, with the dog retreating and the cat going back to avoiding.

Most of the time the top predators do avoid scruffles, but its not as rare as you think, since all the top predators that co-existed has a big advantage over the the other; that would lead the more larger or more gamed animal as the one that drives off the weaker and inferior one, so the actual fight it self is rare but the confrontations are quite frequent. (At-least where two predators co-exist)

Pit fights are actualy poor sources or via match ups, because we want to see the fight when both are willing; not just a scenario where they are more afraid and confused of the over all motive and verdict, then wanting to aprehend. At-least some of the circus fights are a little more on there own accord, of course not natrual; but they arnt forced directly to fight, so it will be on there own choosing to attack.

On paper this hypothetical fight is too one sided, but alot of things on paper (Statisticaly) can look that way; so far with all the historical records shown it is one sided in favor of the lion. But I do think that it could go either way and I just tend to lean on the records; it is a toss of the coin... because the Kodiak bear is...well...a kodiak bear.
 
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Double ouch for the tiger...
pg4svt7.jpg


Although; any reported storys that came out of california at the late 18th and early 19th century comes into question, I'll try and find more about this specific fight...since there was 3 main storys of the calfornians, 2 with lions and many with bulls...or atleast so call'd many bulls, and yet when you dive into multiple newspaper archives, its hardly the truth, in fact it was just the opposite, the bear was the one that did less than medicore, in fact always lost against the bull.

Shown the fight dident even take place in california, it was moved.
 
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