Justice Down! We have a Justice Down! RBG! Now with cancer

[fskimospy]

IIRC it refers to the place where it started, or what they call the "primary" site. So either she had pancreatic cancer or she had lung cancer which spread to the pancreas, which would just be called "lung cancer."

This is of course anecdotal but when I had cancer it was generally referred to as testicular cancer despite me having no cancer in my testicles. It was a seminoma (testicular cells) but located entirely in my chest. How fun for me!

I guess in some ways that’s the answer as I don’t think ‘pancreatic cancer’ is a medical term, it would be whatever the type of cells are that have become cancerous.

 

[woolfe9998]

This is of course anecdotal but when I had cancer it was generally referred to as testicular cancer despite me having no cancer in my testicles. It was a seminoma (testicular cells) but located entirely in my chest. How fun for me!

I guess in some ways that’s the answer as I don’t think ‘pancreatic cancer’ is a medical term, it would be whatever the type of cells are that have become cancerous.

Wow, that is weird. I assume the means you had the usual cell type of testicular but in a different location. I've heard of cancers identified by cell type, but whenever I've heard it described in relation to a certain body part, it always seems to mean that the specified body part is the primary (first) site. Sometimes you get "pancreatic cancer, adenocarcinoma type" but I've never heard it referred to by location when in fact it is in a different location.

I hope you are well past your last occurrence time wise and have been deemed cured. My dad was cured of esophageal cancer by an utterly horrific surgical procedure but was cured nonetheless.

 

[fskimospy]

Wow, that is weird. I assume the means you had the usual cell type of testicular but in a different location. I've heard of cancers identified by cell type, but whenever I've heard it described in relation to a certain body part, it always seems to mean that the specified body part is the primary (first) site. Sometimes you get "pancreatic cancer, adenocarcinoma type" but I've never heard it referred to by location when in fact it is in a different location.

I hope you are well past your last occurrence time wise and have been deemed cured. My dad was cured of esophageal cancer by an utterly horrific surgical procedure but was cured nonetheless.

Yes, I had some medical students come in and look at me, haha, but nobody called it chest or heart cancer (the tumor was very large and had grown around my heart. That’s how I figured out I had it). Apparently there is a small amount of residual tissue in your chest from where your testicles formed and that’s the part of me that decided it didn’t like the management anymore.

The good news is if you have to pick a cancer to get seminoma is one of the easiest to treat. I’ve been cancer free for a little over 11 years with a low probability of recurrence. Chemotherapy was very unpleasant and I’ve unfortunately suffered moderate hearing loss from it but all things considered I’m doing great. Thanks for asking though, my best wishes to your dad, it sounds like he had a much tougher time than I did.

 

[woolfe9998]

Yes, I had some medical students come in and look at me, haha, but nobody called it chest or heart cancer (the tumor was very large and had grown around my heart. That’s how I figured out I had it). Apparently there is a small amount of residual tissue in your chest from where your testicles formed and that’s the part of me that decided it didn’t like the management anymore.

The good news is if you have to pick a cancer to get seminoma is one of the easiest to treat. I’ve been cancer free for a little over 11 years with a low probability of recurrence. Chemotherapy was very unpleasant and I’ve unfortunately suffered moderate hearing loss from it but all things considered I’m doing great. Thanks for asking though, my best wishes to your dad, it sounds like he had a much tougher time than I did.

11 years, that's great! Being told you had cancer around your heart must have been terrifying.

He passed from other causes 5 years after being cured of the cancer. The thing is, the cure made him miserable. Removal of the esophagus, which is standard for localized esophageal, has a 20%(!) mortality risk. What they do is after removing the esophagus, they stretch your stomach upwards and attach it to your throat, leaving you with effectively no stomach. They then cut the sphincter between what is left of your stomach and your intestines to allow food to flow through and be digested in the intestines. Kind of like a radical form of the gastric bypass that people sometimes get to lose weight.

Afterwards, if he ate a portion as large as a side of mash potatoes, he felt ill like a normal person would have after eating an entire large pizza in one sitting. He was constantly nauseous and weighed under 100 lbs by the time he passed.

I seem to have inherited the underlying condition which caused his cancer, which is GERD, a condition causing stomach acid to migrate to the esophagus, causing chronic heartburn. I'll be fine so long as I take PPI acid controllers (omeprazole) daily for the rest of my life. My dad didn't start the meds until much later because it wasn't invented until the late 80's after he already had the acid eroding his esophagus for decades.

 

[fskimospy]

11 years, that's great! Being told you had cancer around your heart must have been terrifying.

He passed from other causes 5 years after being cured of the cancer. The thing is, the cure made him miserable. Removal of the esophagus, which is standard for localized esophageal, has a 20%(!) mortality risk. What they do is after removing the esophagus, they stretch your stomach upwards and attach it to your throat, leaving you with effectively no stomach. They then cut the sphincter between what is left of your stomach and your intestines to allow food to flow through and be digested in the intestines. Kind of like a radical form of the gastric bypass that people sometimes get to lose weight.

Afterwards, if he ate a portion as large as a side of mash potatoes, he felt ill like a normal person would have after eating an entire large pizza in one sitting. He was constantly nauseous and weighed under 100 lbs by the time he passed.

I seem to have inherited the underlying condition which caused his cancer, which is GERD, a condition causing stomach acid to migrate to the esophagus, causing chronic heartburn. I'll be fine so long as I take PPI acid controllers (omeprazole) daily for the rest of my life. My dad didn't start the meds until much later because it wasn't invented until the late 80's after he already had the acid eroding his esophagus for decades.

I’m sorry to hear that, one of the things that cancer takes from people is quality of life because to beat it we have to go to such extreme lengths.

 

[zinfamous]

IIRC it refers to the place where it started, or what they call the "primary" site. So either she had pancreatic cancer or she had lung cancer which spread to the pancreas, which would just be called "lung cancer."

right, but even these descriptions are thoroughly limited by available tools: e.g. our actual ability to "see" what is going on, when it is going on.

for example: all cancers metasticize. They all do. It's just what they do. Every tumor is always constantly shedding cells. the difference is whether or not those cells attach somewhere else and establish themselves. Often, that word^ is misunderstood and frequently misused as inferring whether or not a tumor is or isn't doing anything, that cells aren't in the blood, because other tumors can't be found (Again--finding tumors is inherently limited by our current abilities to see them. Going in for surgery for particularly aggressive cancers is usually the "oh shit" moment when the reality of the situation is truly first observed).

So, outside of specific mRNA testing, it does become someone difficult to identify the "true" primary tumor. I mean, the practice is that this protocol is established from years of case studies, so it's reasonable to go with best likelihoods from case to case, but these are all again, especially based on much older cases, sort of limited by testing. Adenocarcenomas, as I understood, can be vaguely indistinguishable in terms of actual tissue of origin, so it is probably becoming less and less accurate to call it "pancreatic" or rectal or colo-rectal. The germline tissue origin--meso/ecto/endo, are probably better ways to understand how cancer cell classes work, instead of focusing on specific tissues, which end up getting their names because it was most often the first tumor that was seen.

 

[sportage]

Imagine a scenario where Donald Trump loses to Joe Biden and Mitch McConnell loses his seat and add to that the Democrats take back the senate and before the Democrats are sworn in RBG passes away and that lame duck president and lame duck senate fast tracking Donald Trump’s nominee onto the Supreme Court. They all lose, Ginsberg dies, and a party rejected by the voters installs a Supreme Court justice. Imagine THAT scenario folks.

 

[pcgeek11]

Imagine a scenario where Donald Trump loses to Joe Biden and Mitch McConnell loses his seat and add to that the Democrats take back the senate and before the Democrats are sworn in RBG passes away and that lame duck president and lame duck senate fast tracking Donald Trump’s nominee onto the Supreme Court. They all lose, Ginsberg dies, and a party rejected by the voters installs a Supreme Court justice. Imagine THAT scenario folks.

Why? Seems like a really big stretch.

 

[ch33zw1z]

Surely, MoscowMitch wouldn't be salivating over the prospect of another judicial appoint in an election year. The Senate leader, the party of family values, would never lie, right?

 

[ch33zw1z]

Why? Seems like a really big stretch.

Shit man, 'Muricans elected Donald Trump. Anything's possible. If D's took the POTUS and senate majority, and Ginsburg passed away before inauguration, MoscowMitch would most certainly fast track the appoint, like ....that night.

 

[fskimospy]

Shit man, 'Muricans elected Donald Trump. Anything's possible. If D's took the POTUS and senate majority, and Ginsburg passed away before inauguration, MoscowMitch would most certainly fast track the appoint, like ....that night.

Also I fail to see how ‘what if the incumbent wins an election and someone with current, recurring cancer dies’ is such a big stretch.

If a vacancy happens ten minutes before the next inauguration McConnell will try and fill it. It was entirely obvious that he was lying back when he blocked Garland and anyone who isn’t stupid or engaging in motivated reasoning knew it.

This is why it’s so forehead slapping when people say that McConnell wouldn’t be confirming so many judges if Reid just hadn’t eliminated the filibuster. How naive or dishonest does someone need to be to actually claim that?

 

[FaaR]

They all lose, Ginsberg dies, and a party rejected by the voters installs a Supreme Court justice. Imagine THAT scenario folks.

I did, and...nothing. The Repuggers have no honor, no decency, no morals and no conscience. They'd do their darndest to install a new justice the second before Donald goes out of office, if they have the chance.

There's nothing they can do anymore that would be a surprise to me, suspending the U.S. constitution and declaring themselves forever-dictators of a white supremacist nationalist state is what they want to do, they just don't have the guts quite yet. They might though, if Dumpy gets another four.

 

[dank69]

Also I fail to see how ‘what if the incumbent wins an election and someone with current, recurring cancer dies’ is such a big stretch.

If a vacancy happens ten minutes before the next inauguration McConnell will try and fill it. It was entirely obvious that he was lying back when he blocked Garland and anyone who isn’t stupid or engaging in motivated reasoning knew it.

This is why it’s so forehead slapping when people say that McConnell wouldn’t be confirming so many judges if Reid just hadn’t eliminated the filibuster. How naive or dishonest does someone need to be to actually claim that?

To me the stretch is Trump losing and Democrats taking the Senate. I don’t follow the polling but I have to imagine the odds of both of those happening would be astronomical. Much more likely that Trump loses and GOP keeps Senate. I think right now the odds are against Dems taking the Senate regardless of who wins WH. Trump is doing his best to take the Senate down with him though. McConnell as well is really pushing the envelope of what he can get away with.

 

[fskimospy]

To me the stretch is Trump losing and Democrats taking the Senate. I don’t follow the polling but I have to imagine the odds of both of those happening would be astronomical. Much more likely that Trump loses and GOP keeps Senate. I think right now the odds are against Dems taking the Senate regardless of who wins WH. Trump is doing his best to take the Senate down with him though. McConnell as well is really pushing the envelope of what he can get away with.

They aren’t, actually.

As of last time I checked if you assume Democrats win the white house they had better than even odds of winning the senate too.

Edit: the thing to remember is the same thing that happened in 2016 - the presidency and senate elections are not independent events, they are highly correlated.

 

[dank69]

They aren’t, actually.

As of last time I checked if you assume Democrats win the white house they had better than even odds of winning the senate too.

Edit: the thing to remember is the same thing that happened in 2016 - the presidency and senate elections are not independent events, they are highly correlated.

I think I read his initial post as Trump wins and Dems take Senate...and was trying to make the same point you are. Oh well, it's early, haha.

 

[fskimospy]

I think I read his initial post as Trump wins and Dems take Senate...and was trying to make the same point you are. Oh well, it's early, haha.

Hmm, maybe I misread it myself. Regardless I think the likely scenario is whoever wins the white house probably wins the senate.

 

[Jhhnn]

Why? Seems like a really big stretch.

I think it's perfectly obvious that Trump & McConnell will replace RBG with a Justice of their choosing should the opportunity arise. What Mitch said about Garland back in 2016 won't matter at all, nor will the results of the election should such a thing occur during the lame duck period. You know it as well as anybody.

 

[pcgeek11]

Shit man, 'Muricans elected Donald Trump. Anything's possible. If D's took the POTUS and senate majority, and Ginsburg passed away before inauguration, MoscowMitch would most certainly fast track the appoint, like ....that night.

Well now that we have the official word on it we can put this question to bed.

Wheeew.

 

[JEDIYoda]

Well now that we have the official word on it we can put this question to bed.

Wheeew.

Moscow Mitch already said he would fast track a SCOTUS appointment even if there was one day left.....there really was never any question!

 

[pcgeek11]

Also I fail to see how ‘what if the incumbent wins an election and someone with current, recurring cancer dies’ is such a big stretch.

Well you did oversimplify what he said a bit.

What he actually said was:

Donald Trump loses to Joe Biden.
Mitch McConnell loses his seat.
The Democrats take back the Senate. ( I assume they retain the House )
Before the Democrats are sworn in RBG passes away.

I'm not saying it isn't possible. Just a stretch.

 

[pcgeek11]

I think it's perfectly obvious that Trump & McConnell will replace RBG with a Justice of their choosing should the opportunity arise. What Mitch said about Garland back in 2016 won't matter at all, nor will the results of the election should such a thing occur during the lame duck period. You know it as well as anybody.

You are arguing against an argument I didn't make.

I wouldn't put it past Mitch to install another SCOTUS Judge if he had an opening. I also believe the same would hold true if the Democrats held the Senate.

 

[pcgeek11]

Moscow Mitch already said he would fast track a SCOTUS appointment even if there was one day left.....there really was never any question!

I never argued that point either.

The only point I was making was the things in the OP all coming true at the same time before the election is a stretch. Entirely possible however, but a long shot.

 

[sportage]

Well, I ask that question (above) and proposed that scenario (above) because I like to play the game of WHAT-IF. And by entertaining those WHAT-IF scenarios, the seemingly impossibles, the utterly unimaginable's, is what keeps us on our toes. For example, who could have ever imagined a world wide pandemic hitting while someone like a Donald Trump were president? A world wide pandemic occurring during the tenure of "THE FUN" president? That "NO-EXPERIENCE-NECESSARY" president? People had actually come to believed that anyone could be president, that anyone could run the country.... A-N-Y O-N-E !!! And it was possible that a country like the United States of America would and could survive such a "FUN" and clueless president. America had actually come to believe THAT. However, the problem with that was.... no one played the WHAT-IF game before casting their vote. That scenario of WHAT-IF America elected a really dumb ignoramus of a president AND THEN something really really awful happened to America? What then? No one ever considered that if THE FUN PRESIDENT were running the country and something really bad happened during that FUN PRESIDENCY.... like oh say an nuclear attack or a deadly pandemic.... that America just might be royally screwed. An America having something really awful taking place, and all that America had to run the country was an idiot. THE FUN PRESIDENT. A simple mind. A total and proven screw-up. So..... what could happen? Well, how about 4,000,000 infected and 140,00 deaths? So I ask and asked (above) if THAT scenario over RBG was worth playing the game of WHAT-IF over ??? Republicans losing in November, then RBG passing away, and a lame duck administration installing their own Supreme Court justice while America looked on in complete disbelief? Is it better to chose a president with the ability to lead during the worse of circumstances, and maybe leave those FUN PRESIDENTS for the TV sitcoms and Hollywood movie makers? Ya think????

 

[pcgeek11]

Oh, If those things do occur I am pretty sure a SCOTUS would be appointed if at all possible before the election.

I don't agree with it, but it would probably happen.

 

[ch33zw1z]

Well now that we have the official word on it we can put this question to bed.

Wheeew.

Glad you agree.