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J.J. Watt is the 2014 NFL MVP.

angminas

angminas

Diamond Member
Aaron Rodgers has Jordy Nelson (4th in receiving) and Eddie Lacy (7th in rushing). Tom Brady has Rob Gronkowski (T-3rd in receiving TD and one of the most dangerous offensive forces in recent memory) and Bill Belichick (3 rings, 6th most wins in NFL history). DeMarco Murray (1st in rushing) and Tony Romo (1st in passer rating and QBR) have each other, as well as Dez Bryant (9th in receiving). Peyton Manning has...well, everybody.

J.J. Watt has Kendrick Lewis (T-62nd in tackles), Whitney Mercilus (T-84th in sacks), Kareem Jackson (T-21st in INT with 3), and Davon House (T-41st in passes defensed, 10- same # as Watt, though House is a cornerback). His head coach, Bill O'Brien, has a career total of 8 wins in the NFL.

The Texans are so desperate for a quarterback that they called the immortal Case Keenum (at that time 0-8 as an NFL starter with a 34.5 QBR) back from a hunting trip to come play against the Ravens. Yes, a guy who was run out of the NFL got a text from the Texans while in a deer stand.

And yet the Texans are still in the playoff hunt. If you've watched them at all, you know there is NO WAY IN HELL they're anywhere near .500 without Watt. This season is a total dumpster fire without him...and that's being kind. He gives them something to play for. He gives them a chance. He holds them accountable and never allows them to quit. With respect to Arian Foster, Watt singlehandedly transforms the entire organization from garbage to relevant.

MVP does not stand for Most Valuable Position. It stands for Most Valuable Player.

(By the way...that game Keenum started against the Ravens? The recent world champions with a $20 million quarterback? The Texans won.)

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https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2014/12/19/pff-preview-ravens-texans-week-16

http://www.nflshop.com/pages/Top_Selling_Jerseys

http://www.houstontexans.com/media-...s-Titans/5d07c2b4-0313-4903-8b56-dbb11c512210
 
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While, I agree JJ Watt deserves the honor, defensive players simply won't get it unless they break records. If he ends up with more than 20 sacks, I think he will be a serious contender, being the first player to get 2 20+ sack seasons. However, if he doesn't, he will lose it to either Romo or Rodgers.

Look at the game Romo missed. Weeden had all the same weapons Romo had and that offense was awful.
 
yeah jj watt is a beast. he definitely is a contender for it. he's fun to watch and is the most dominant pass rusher by far right now. but ... if his team can't even make it to the playoffs, or they get bounced in the first round, then he won't get it nor should he IMO.

smackababy said:
Look at the game Romo missed. Weeden had all the same weapons Romo had and that offense was awful.
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heh i think if romo didn't come back against the redskins, the cowboys had a good chance of winning that game. he's the reason (or big reason) they lost that game.

EDIT:

and i'm just talking about that one game where romo had a foot in losing it. overall i agree that he is also in the running for MVP.
 
Rodgers is NOT going to get MVP. He just had a fucking terrible game, worst of his career, 2 weeks ago against Buffalo. That blew it for him IMO, he won't even be a consideration for MVP.
 
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mcurphy said:
Rodgers is NOT going to get MVP. He just had a fucking terrible game, worst of his career, 2 weeks ago against Buffalo. That blew it for him IMO, he won't even be a consideration for MVP.
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The metrics that they use for voting, like QBR and QB PAA, aren't going to let the Buffalo game ruin his MVP changes, in my opinion. Check out this article.

http://espn.go.com/blog/statsinfo/post/_/id/100425/metrics-favor-rodgers-over-romo-for-mvp

I totally agree with J.J Watt, that man is a freaking beast.
 
I think the strongest candidate would be Murray. We've seen the results when Romo has to carry that offense. Murray's ability to run so well this year has elevated Romo and the team as a result.

Tom Brady is definitely not a consideration for MVP this year. He hasn't won the Patriots a game for the last month. It's been all defense and special teams keeping them in the game long enough for the offense to come up with a couple of timely plays.

JJ Watt is a beast, but it's really hard for defensive players to win MVP these days. The game has shifted so much towards an offense-oriented one and that's usually the focus of the MVP discussion.
 
crownjules said:
I think the strongest candidate would be Murray. We've seen the results when Romo has to carry that offense. Murray's ability to run so well this year has elevated Romo and the team as a result.
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To be honest, even as a Cowboys fan, Murray is the product of one of, if not the, best O Line in the league. When his first contact is mostly LBs and DBs, he is going to look great. I think any good back would have similar success. Someone elite, like say an AP, or someone who could break a ton of tackles, like Lynch, would be so incredibly dominant. Don't get me wrong, Murray is doing fantastic, but it isn't so much of him being just so much better than everyone as it is the primary run stoppers on teams aren't able to get off their blocks against Dallas. Murray's back up, Dunbar, has had similar success, albeit, on lesser amount of runs.

And while Romo is also benefiting from this O Line a great deal, he is still playing above what most view him to be capable of in December. There have been times he has had 7+ seconds IN the pocket, which is just unreal. He is able to consistently make plays and has been great when it comes down to needing him.
 
Houston have only two strong wins, the Ravens and the Bills (and I'm being a little generous with the Bills).
Their other wins are against the Titans(2), Raiders, Redskins, Browns, and Jaguars.

Foster is averaging 4.8 yards per carry. You're underselling his contribution.

Now, beginning of the year, take Watt off the Texans and add Aaron Rogers. How good would the Texans have been with Rogers as QB all year?

Watt is great, Defensive PoY, no doubt. But I'd lean towards Rogers getting the MVP.
 
smackababy said:
To be honest, even as a Cowboys fan, Murray is the product of one of, if not the, best O Line in the league. When his first contact is mostly LBs and DBs, he is going to look great. I think any good back would have similar success. Someone elite, like say an AP, or someone who could break a ton of tackles, like Lynch, would be so incredibly dominant. Don't get me wrong, Murray is doing fantastic, but it isn't so much of him being just so much better than everyone as it is the primary run stoppers on teams aren't able to get off their blocks against Dallas. Murray's back up, Dunbar, has had similar success, albeit, on lesser amount of runs.

And while Romo is also benefiting from this O Line a great deal, he is still playing above what most view him to be capable of in December. There have been times he has had 7+ seconds IN the pocket, which is just unreal. He is able to consistently make plays and has been great when it comes down to needing him.
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IDK, maybe it's Murray that makes the O-line look great too. I'm no cowboy fan, but I def. enjoyed watching him run this year. He has excellent vision, patience, and some of his slight movement to make people miss are just awesome. Not the fastest or flashiest, but fundamentally sound rb. Sorta like Emmitt Smith. I'd like to see him win it. He deserves it for being my fantasy MVP 😀
 
mcurphy said:
Rodgers is NOT going to get MVP. He just had a fucking terrible game, worst of his career, 2 weeks ago against Buffalo. That blew it for him IMO, he won't even be a consideration for MVP.
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Short of A-Rod throwing 3 picks in the season finale, he'll be top-3 in voting. His last 2 games have certainly left the door open for Tony Romo. There's a theory that Watt could win if Rodgers, Romo, Brady & Peyton split a bunch of votes but Watt is hosed if the Texans miss the playoffs (which is highly likely).

If the Packers win and Rodgers has a good game, he'll very much be in for MVP consideration.
 
I would LOVE to see JJ Watt get it. He's a monster, and I have much love for the position as well. Unfortunately, he won't, because the NFL (and football in general now) is all about offense.
 
TheVrolok said:
I would LOVE to see JJ Watt get it. He's a monster, and I have much love for the position as well. Unfortunately, he won't, because the NFL (and football in general now) is all about offense.
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Me too, I would love Watt to get the recognition. He is an awesome person both on and off the field. :thumbsup:

manly said:
Short of A-Rod throwing 3 picks in the season finale, he'll be top-3 in voting. His last 2 games have certainly left the door open for Tony Romo. There's a theory that Watt could win if Rodgers, Romo, Brady & Peyton split a bunch of votes but Watt is hosed if the Texans miss the playoffs (which is highly likely).

If the Packers win and Rodgers has a good game, he'll very much be in for MVP consideration.
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True, as much as I dislike Rodgers and the Packers, I can admit he still has a chance at it. He does have some talent and the Pack would be shit without him.
 
JJ Watt is a fucking beast...and a great football player. MVP? I dunno about that...but it's too bad he plays for Houston...he'd be a great addition to the Seahawks D line...😀
 
digiram said:
IDK, maybe it's Murray that makes the O-line look great too. I'm no cowboy fan, but I def. enjoyed watching him run this year. He has excellent vision, patience, and some of his slight movement to make people miss are just awesome. Not the fastest or flashiest, but fundamentally sound rb. Sorta like Emmitt Smith. I'd like to see him win it. He deserves it for being my fantasy MVP 😀
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He is similar to Smith in terms of being above average in the athletic department. That line is what is doing it. Look at some of the 4th quarter drives they've had. Giving Romo over 7 seconds to throw the ball is insane in the NFL, even later in the game. Murray is a big product of the line, as far as getting past the front 4. What he does after that is him being an above average RB, but he wouldn't be able to do that without getting those lanes. His only downfall is really his durability. He hasn't gone a full season, though, he might this season because he is playing with an injury. Smith was a machine though. Durable and dependable.
 
Here's something I wrote for another audience. Sorry if it sounds snarky- wasn't originally meant for here.

1. Peyton Manning won the NFL MVP in 2008 when the Colts went 12-4. What if he'd played for the Lions, who were 0-16 that year?

Manning: 27 TD, 12 INT, 4002 YD, 95.0 passer rating. An average year for him.

Lions QBs: 18 TD, 19 INT, 3299 YD, 71.3 passer rating. A notable difference, but nothing gigantic.

The bigger difference was on defense. The Lions defense allowed 1495 more yards than the Colts, or about 1/3 more. They also allowed 517 points versus a Colts total of 298, or about 2/3 more.

The Vikings won the NFC North that year with a 10-6 record, while the Bears (who missed the playoffs) were right behind at 9-7. Let's pretend the Lions beat both the Vikings and the Bears twice each. That would mean they'd have to get to 8-8 to win the division (their easiest path to the playoffs, since a Wild Card berth would have required more wins).

Was Peyton Manning worth AT LEAST 8 more wins than the Lions quarterbacks that year? If not, I guess he wasn't the MVP.

2. In 1973, O.J. Simpson gained 2003 yards on 332 carries for 6.0 YPC and 143.1 YPG. This was 150 yards higher than the previous record set by Jim Brown in 1963, and it stood until 1984, when Eric Dickerson gained 102 more yards with two more games and 47 more carries. The next highest rushing total of 1973 was 1144 yards (from the immortal John Brockington), and over four decades later, Simpson's YPG record for that season still stands.

But the Dolphins won the AFC East with a 12-2 record, and the Steelers grabbed the Wild Card spot at 10-4. The 9-5 Bills missed the playoffs, so there's no way Simpson deserved the MVP. He just didn't do enough to get his team to the playoffs- a real MVP would have done a better job.

3. Using making the playoffs as an MVP requirement is silly because making the playoffs is a team accomplishment. One person can't make that happen alone, no matter how good they are. Even the strongest MVP candidates MUST have a certain amount of team strength or they will not make the playoffs.

What if Houston were in the NFC South? That's a much easier division to win, and to win games in. The Texans would probably have 10ish wins and run away with the division title. Would that make Watt a more deserving MVP candidate? Because it's not supposed to. It's supposed to be about one player, not about the performance of several entire teams.

What if Houston were in the NFC West? There's no way they'd make the playoffs. Would the higher value of other teams make Watt less valuable? No, it doesn't work that way. Those are two separate questions.

Just as one player doesn't win the Lombardi trophy, a team shouldn't win the MVP. I agree that it should not commonly go to a defensive player, since they individually usually have less impact on the game than the best offensive players. But some years are different. Some years the offensive players are not as dizzying and the best defensive player is so ridiculously good that he can take over games and make a huge difference in his team's destiny.

This is one of those years.

4. Watt's statistics are great, but they don't completely show his true value. The touchdown receptions, for instance- they're not valuable because he scored so much as they are because they show that he CAN score. Knowing that your big brother who loves you and who can do anything is backing you up is a tremendous confidence booster...in sports, it can mean the difference between an underpowered team mailing the season in and an underestimated team giving it everything they have so they won't disappoint the greatest player in the history of their team. Even if they don't make the playoffs in that year, the emotional momentum and buy-in can carry over to next year and get a team over the hump. It all adds up, and nobody adds more than Watt.

Anyway, that's enough for now. Thanks for reading.
 
twinrider1 said:
Houston have only two strong wins, the Ravens and the Bills (and I'm being a little generous with the Bills).
Their other wins are against the Titans(2), Raiders, Redskins, Browns, and Jaguars.

Foster is averaging 4.8 yards per carry. You're underselling his contribution.

Now, beginning of the year, take Watt off the Texans and add Aaron Rogers. How good would the Texans have been with Rogers as QB all year?

Watt is great, Defensive PoY, no doubt. But I'd lean towards Rogers getting the MVP.
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If you start looking at it that way, then obviously the mvp would always go to a qb. The position has the most impact on a team (good or bad) no matter what.

Personally I think Watt should be the MVP. The guy is a one man wrecking crew on defense, the way Lawrence Taylor used to be. Then he even scores some TD's on both offense and defense for good measure.
 
Double Trouble said:
If you start looking at it that way, then obviously the mvp would always go to a qb. The position has the most impact on a team (good or bad) no matter what.

Personally I think Watt should be the MVP. The guy is a one man wrecking crew on defense, the way Lawrence Taylor used to be. Then he even scores some TD's on both offense and defense for good measure.
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But, that is the issue. Unless a player has a near record breaking season, another QB will almost certainly have a larger impact on their team as a whole.
 
angminas said:
<snip>

4. Watt's statistics are great, but they don't completely show his true value. The touchdown receptions, for instance- they're not valuable because he scored so much as they are because they show that he CAN score. Knowing that your big brother who loves you and who can do anything is backing you up is a tremendous confidence booster...in sports, it can mean the difference between an underpowered team mailing the season in and an underestimated team giving it everything they have so they won't disappoint the greatest player in the history of their team. Even if they don't make the playoffs in that year, the emotional momentum and buy-in can carry over to next year and get a team over the hump. It all adds up, and nobody adds more than Watt.

Anyway, that's enough for now. Thanks for reading.
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What in the fuck did you type? Nothing quantifiable. If Watt's so great, where are his 20 sacks through double teams? Didn't think so.
 
If you start looking at it that way, then obviously the mvp would always go to a qb. The position has the most impact on a team (good or bad) no matter what.
Personally I think Watt should be the MVP. The guy is a one man wrecking crew on defense, the way Lawrence Taylor used to be. Then he even scores some TD's on both offense and defense for good measure.

It IS the way they look at it. Quarterbacks have won 2/3 of the awards, 1/3 to running backs, and only 3 to all other positions combined (Mark Moseley, Alan Page, and Lawrence Taylor)

And look at the team records in the years those non QB/RBs won the award...

1971 Alan Page Vikings were 11-3 (tied for best record)
1982 Mark Moseley Redskins were 8-1 (tied best record, strike shortened year)
1986 Lawrence Taylor Giants were 14-2 (tied for best record)

None of them were barely over .500, two games out of their division.
 
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SP33Demon said:
What in the fuck did you type? Nothing quantifiable. If Watt's so great, where are his 20 sacks through double teams? Didn't think so.
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Dude. I know that part is not quantifiable. That's why I wrote a paragraph about how it's not quantifiable. If you've read this entire page and still don't know what the fuck is going on, I don't think I can help you.

And, I'm not sure exactly what the second part means, but he has 17.5 already (in addition to a fuckton of other juicy stats) and is getting double teamed and/or held on nearly every play. I've watched about 2/3 of the Texans games this season...you?
 
Watt's going to win his second DPOY in his fourth year in the league. If he never wins another in the rest of his career, that puts him in a club with Taylor, White, Greene, Singletary, Smith, and Lewis.

Don't come at me with that "if Watt's so great" shit. You're smarter than that.
 
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