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Israel to colonize new Palestinian territory

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And Israel does not want to be responsible either. And now they have a dilemma. See any progress with Jordan and Egypt go down the tubes or do something to defuse the problems.
And in terms of the chicken and Egg problem---we know who laid the last total egg when Israel starting annexing more land. I am predicting its going to be long term disaster for Israel.

And binding arbitration will work---when the entire world through the UN enforces a decision.---and for awhile afterward I fully expect that both Israel and the Palestinians will chooses to be irresponsible. But in time they will get over it and stop crying about a settlement they can't change. Which is going to be better than letting the problem forever fester.---and if done by the UN its going to be less biased the the nothing settlement Israel wants and never will get. Not even the corrupt Arifat would surrender the right to return.---and now the Palestinians choose new leadership. The new tactics change the chessboard totally.
 
Originally posted by: Jaskalas
Originally posted by: TheSnowman
Originally posted by: Jaskalas
Originally posted by: magomago
And Lemon Head is VERY correct - as he seems to be one of the few willing to actually consider BOTH sides.
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As far as I'm concerned only one side deserves life.
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Your comment reminds me of something Winston Churchill said back in 1937 when Britain was working with the Zionists to partition off part of Palestine for them:
I do not agree that the dog in a manger has the final right to the manger even though he may have lain there for a very long time. I do not admit that right. I do not admit for instance, that a great wrong has been done to the Red Indians of America or the black people of Australia. I do not admit that a wrong has been done to these people by the fact that a stronger race, a higher-grade race, a more worldly wise race to put it that way, has come in and taken their place.
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Such bigotry and outright disregard for human rights fuels much of the conflicts in this world.
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Excuse me? I did not mention any superior race. Not at all.
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I wasn't suggesting your bigorty was racist like Churchil's was, but denying human rights to people on the grounds of them being born into one side of a conflict is bigorty all the same.

Originally posted by: Jaskalas
My harsh and cruel statement stems from a cruel reality in that they have sworn death to infidels and you, me, most the people here regardless of our support in their effort or not. They declare themselves my enemy, and the enemy of my enemy is my friend. So my allegiance in this war is with myself, my country, and then to our allies such as Israel who fights our common enemy.

Unless we intend to watch our children, grandchildren, great grandchildren and untold numbers of future generations die in this bloodbath we must force this war to come to a powerful and decisive end. Against the stratagem of terrorism we must seize absolute control and authority over a population that participates in those acts of war. So long as they are capable of committing acts of war then we have not been brutal, harsh, or cruel enough to force them into a cessation of hostilities.

That, I may remind you is the ultimate goal and they make it abundantly clear that if they were left to their own devises they would kill us all instead of settle for peace. So then it is up to us to return their acts of war upon them and make it cost so grievously that they are incapable of continuing. Until we muster up the will to do these necessary retaliations we shall find ourselves in a constant unending state of warfare in that region and elsewhere where Islamists operate their cells.

If unending warfare and loss of life is your desire, then by all means continue on our present course of action or even submit some bit of will to their desires and show them a continued sign of weakness. I on the other hand would prefer if we ended it.
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That is some hardcore sterotyping you are emplying there to back your calls for genocide.
 
Originally posted by: Lemon law
And Israel does not want to be responsible either. And now they have a dilemma. See any progress with Jordan and Egypt go down the tubes or do something to defuse the problems.
And in terms of the chicken and Egg problem---we know who laid the last total egg when Israel starting annexing more land. I am predicting its going to be long term disaster for Israel.

And binding arbitration will work---when the entire world through the UN enforces a decision.---and for awhile afterward I fully expect that both Israel and the Palestinians will chooses to be irresponsible. But in time they will get over it and stop crying about a settlement they can't change. Which is going to be better than letting the problem forever fester.---and if done by the UN its going to be less biased the the nothing settlement Israel wants and never will get. Not even the corrupt Arifat would surrender the right to return.---and now the Palestinians choose new leadership. The new tactics change the chessboard totally.
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The UN buffer zones did not work in Northern Israel.

Who is going to enforce the PA side of any agreement. They can not even have a government to represent them. Nor to they have or seem to want the ability to control the militants (whether they are offical or supported by external trouble makers).

Is there going to be a buffer zone along the Gaza border.
The wall (right or wrong) is reducing the incidents in the West Bank.

It seems to go back on having the Palestinians decide that enough is enough. They have been misled out of the land of milk & honey. When they stop following leadership that has doe snot have the interests of the Palestinians in mind, then then will have a chance to better their lives.

The path that they have followed for the past 50-60 years has only brought them grief.
 
earth to EagleKeeper-----It seems to go back on having the Palestinians decide that enough is enough. They have been misled out of the land of milk & honey. When they stop following leadership that has doe snot have the interests of the Palestinians in mind, then then will have a chance to better their lives.

Hate to tell you Israeli leadership offers the Palestinians nothing as the latest Israeli land grab shows.----Israel has never offered them anything other than being robbed and dehumanized. If you had any empathy you would realize that---but you just choose to be totally biased and overlook the facts---there is not a person on earth who would accept what Israel offers them.
Try looking at it from their viewpoint for a change.
 
Originally posted by: Lemon law
earth to EagleKeeper-----It seems to go back on having the Palestinians decide that enough is enough. They have been misled out of the land of milk & honey. When they stop following leadership that has doe snot have the interests of the Palestinians in mind, then then will have a chance to better their lives.

Hate to tell you Israeli leadership offers the Palestinians nothing as the latest Israeli land grab shows.----Israel has never offered them anything other than being robbed and dehumanized. If you had any empathy you would realize that---but you just choose to be totally biased and overlook the facts---there is not a person on earth who would accept what Israel offers them.
Try looking at it from their viewpoint for a change.
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I can see their viewpoint. They want what they feel is theirs.

However, the consequences of their previous actions are not to be called into play.

Remember, what they initially offered Israel was extermination. Israel is offering them more than that.

Many of their leaders keep demanding an all or nothing.
Israel will not give them all and is not going to wait for them to come up with a acceptable compromise.

 
To EagleKeeper who sez---Israel will not give them all and is not going to wait for them to come up with a acceptable compromise.

Exactly---Israel will offer nothing and try keep all---the politics of a pig---which will not forever endure. The pressure now builds and Israel is totally outnumbered in a region where that kind of apartheid policy is unacceptable to all neighbors.

Your other fallacy is to assume the Palestinian people were unified in 1948---while some opposed the Israeli UN mandate and used violence to oppose it, most did not---yet all the Palestinians were tarred with the same brush without regard to due process or facts. Now this continuing policy is driving all in the region to a very dangerous and extreme positions.
The addition of rockets in the hands of terrorists leaves the Israeli military hegemony powerless to stop these attacks and unless I miss my guess the range, accuracy, and the rocket payloads are all going to escalate the danger for Israel and the surrounding States. The terrorists are likely to gain an upper hand and the conventional wisdoms of prior policy are now totally obsolete.

I see nothing but a total bloodbath coming unless some diplomatic solution are not forthcoming. And any diplomatic Iraqi settlement is also likely to redefine the UN position on Israel.

You can deny my message, you can assume me anti-Israeli when I am not, but what I am saying is likely to come to pass regardless of what you or I say or do. Unless some people of good sense start acting in the mid-east.---right now anyone with common sense is being driven out of any favor.
 
Right now, the extremists are driving the situation.

Unless the extremists on both sides are removed, the situation can not stabilize.
 
To slatr---time to point out that the first intifada involved mostly Palestinians throwing rocks and bottles at Israeli tanks---or using suicide bombers. Now professional terrorists have rockets in large numbers and thats going to be a totally different story---this one is likely going to have higher stakes and different dynamics.---in short, times are changing and not what has changed?

But I agree with EagleKeeper---extremists on all sides are now driving the conflict with a decision by Israel to settle more land being an especially boneheaded provocation!
 
Originally posted by: Lemon law
To slatr---time to point out that the first intifada involved mostly Palestinians throwing rocks and bottles at Israeli tanks---or using suicide bombers. Now professional terrorists have rockets in large numbers and thats going to be a totally different story---this one is likely going to have higher stakes and different dynamics.---in short, times are changing and not what has changed?

But I agree with EagleKeeper---extremists on all sides are now driving the conflict with a decision by Israel to settle more land being an especially boneheaded provocation!
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But we, the United States, are backing them.
 
To slatr,

Who points out---But we, the United States, are backing them.

Then in our own interests we should not if its going to lead to an inevitable bloodbath.

Unlike GWB&co., more responsible people try to look more than a half a move ahead. And are not hopelessly overoptimistic and pigheaded. Nor must we just throw our support to the other side when the sounder course is to seek a more realistic compromise that has a better hope of working.
 
Originally posted by: Lemon law
To slatr,

Who points out---But we, the United States, are backing them.

Then in our own interests we should not if its going to lead to an inevitable bloodbath.

Unlike GWB&co., more responsible people try to look more than a half a move ahead. And are not hopelessly overoptimistic and pigheaded. Nor must we just throw our support to the other side when the sounder course is to seek a more realistic compromise that has a better hope of working.[/q]

Peace Prize to that guy or girl , would be an amazing accomplishment.
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