Discussion Intel Meteor, Arrow, Lunar & Panther Lakes + WCL Discussion Threads

[Tigerick]

Wildcat Lake (WCL) Preliminary Specs

Intel Wildcat Lake (WCL) is upcoming mobile SoC replacing ADL-N. WCL consists of 2 tiles: compute tile and PCD tile. It is true single die consists of CPU, GPU and NPU that is fabbed by 18-A process. Last time I checked, PCD tile is fabbed by TSMC N6 process. They are connected through UCIe, not D2D; a first from Intel. Expecting launching in Q2/Computex 2026. In case people don't remember AlderLake-N, I have created a table below to compare the detail specs of ADL-N and WCL. Just for fun, I am throwing LNL and upcoming Mediatek D9500 SoC.

		Intel Alder Lake - N	Intel Wildcat Lake	Intel Lunar Lake		Mediatek D9500
Launch Date		Q1-2023	Q2-2026 ?	Q3-2024		Q3-2025
Model		Intel N300	?	Core Ultra 7 268V		Dimensity 9500 5G
Dies		2	2	2		1
Node		Intel 7 + ?	Intel 18-A + TSMC N6	TSMC N3B + N6		TSMC N3P
CPU		8 E-cores	2 P-core + 4 LP E-cores	4 P-core + 4 LP E-cores		C1 1+3+4
Threads		8	6	8		8
Max Clock		3.8 GHz	?	5 GHz
L3 Cache		6 MB	?	12 MB
TDP		7 W	Fanless ?	17 W		Fanless
Memory		64-bit LPDDR5-4800	64-bit LPDDR5-6800 ?	128-bit LPDDR5X-8533		64-bit LPDDR5X-10667
Size		16 GB	?	32 GB		24 GB ?
Bandwidth			~ 55 GB/s	136 GB/s		85.6 GB/s
GPU		UHD Graphics		Arc 140V		G1 Ultra
EU / Xe		32 EU	2 Xe	8 Xe		12
Max Clock		1.25 GHz		2 GHz
NPU		NA	18 TOPS	48 TOPS		100 TOPS ?

As Hot Chips 34 starting this week, Intel will unveil technical information of upcoming Meteor Lake (MTL) and Arrow Lake (ARL), new generation platform after Raptor Lake. Both MTL and ARL represent new direction which Intel will move to multiple chiplets and combine as one SoC platform.

MTL also represents new compute tile that based on Intel 4 process which is based on EUV lithography, a first from Intel. Intel expects to ship MTL mobile SoC in 2023.

ARL will come after MTL so Intel should be shipping it in 2024, that is what Intel roadmap is telling us. ARL compute tile will be manufactured by Intel 20A process, a first from Intel to use GAA transistors called RibbonFET.

 

[511]

NVL uses N2 on premium skus apparently, probably just to end up losing against Zen 6 Vcache... Unless it's that 144mb L3 tile

It will be mix of N2/18A i guess from the leak

 

[msj10]

NVL uses N2 on premium skus apparently, probably just to end up losing against Zen 6 Vcache... Unless it's that 144mb L3 tile

probably not enough 18A volume to support the whole of NVL ,CWF and DMR as well as external customers so they decided to outsource some SKUs
and intel must think 18A-P and N2 are close enough in performance if they are dual sourcing the CPU tile between them

 

[FlameTail]

intel must think 18A-P and N2 are close enough in performance if they are dual sourcing the CPU tile between them

Which is why there is speculation that Qualcomm is avoiding N2 and jumping to Intel Foundry to use 18A-P.

I guess 18A-P should be similar or better than N2 in terms of performance/power, though density may be behind.

 

[511]

The final question remains to be cost structure for 18A considering Intel 4/3 improved it dramatically but fell short vs competition btw get ready to be charged more for US Wafers from TSMC that would be an appropriate comparison

 

[SiliconFly]

.

 

[511]

Actually, Intel has mentioned many times that 18A will cost less than N2.

Yeah but i would not take their word on cost untill we get a leak or a customer confirmation

 

[cannedlake240]

It's so over

 

[511]

It's so over

For Intel yes Pat Gelsinger is getting retired

 

[igor_kavinski]

It's so over

What exactly is being referred to here?

 

[okoroezenwa]

For Intel ?

Depends on how you view this news

@igor_kavinski

Intel Announces Retirement of CEO Pat Gelsinger

www.intc.com

 

[igor_kavinski]

Thank God!

Intel has a chance now.

I guess the board pinned all responsibility for Arrow Lake on Pat.

 

[511]

It's a bad news they have put finance guys as CEOs it's bad as Swan and Kranzich were not enough

 

[branch_suggestion]

So uhh, is that a plan for the next 5 years is done kinda retirement or an impending doom kinda retirement?

 

[igor_kavinski]

It's a bad news they have put finance guys as CEOs it's bad as Swan and Kranzich were not enough

That's normal for them. Remember, those two aren't gonna be able to mess Intel up for long anyway. And besides, since they couldn't wait to find a better CEO before showing Pat the door, it means they completely lost confidence in Pat's leadership and would rather let his subordinates lead in the interim.

 

[igor_kavinski]

So uhh, is that a plan for the next 5 years is done kinda retirement or an impending doom kinda retirement?

No, it means the best is yet to come. Intel lives once more.

What they should search for now is someone ruthless but only to the ailing elements at Intel (those really responsible for the mess up).

 

[511]

No, it means the best is yet to come. Intel lives once more.

What they should search for now is someone ruthless but only to the ailing elements at Intel (those really responsible for the mess up).

Yes if they can find someone better than him sure but not financial idiots

 

[igor_kavinski]

Yes if they can find someone better than him sure but not financial idiots

Started a thread in the OT section. See you there

 

[511]

Started a thread in the OT section. See you there

You can start i am too lazy 🤣 the hilarious things is if 18A CLW is good than those idiots will get the promotion

 

[Gideon]

Thank God!

Intel has a chance now.

I guess the board pinned all responsibility for Arrow Lake on Pat.

Well yes, hopefully.

Though I'd pay extra attention now, as this event opened up a possibiltiy for a very negative scenario codenamed "Vulture Capitalism". Gutting Intel, selling the assets while doing a massive pump and dump.

Sorta like these:

• Toys "R" Us (2005) - Taken private by KKR, Bain Capital, and Vornado Realty Trust. The firms loaded it with debt, extracted fees, and sold valuable real estate. The company ultimately collapsed in 2018.
• Sears (2005) - Eddie Lampert merged it with Kmart, sold off valuable real estate and brands, while underinvesting in stores. The company declared bankruptcy in 2018 after years of decline.
• Payless ShoeSource (2012) - Acquired by private equity firms Blum Capital and Golden Gate Capital, who loaded it with debt and extracted dividends before its 2017 bankruptcy.
  RadioShack (2000s) - Various hedge funds and investors stripped assets through dividend recapitalizations and real estate sales before its 2015 bankruptcy.

This practice is sometimes called "vulture capitalism" or "asset stripping" - the debt from leveraged buyouts often leads to bankruptcy while investors profit from extracted assets and fees.

So pay attention, who is chosen as a replacement and by whom ...

 

[igor_kavinski]

Though I'd pay extra attention now, as this event opened up a possibiltiy for a very negative scenario codenamed "Vulture Capitalism". Gutting Intel, selling the assets while doing a massive pump and dump.

Yikes!

 

[cannedlake240]

You can start i am too lazy 🤣 the hilarious things is if 18A CLW is good than those idiots will get the promotion

Know what would be even more hilarious

 

[igor_kavinski]

Know what would be even more hilarious

WHAT WHAT WHAT?

 

[maddie]

So uhh, is that a plan for the next 5 years is done kinda retirement or an impending doom kinda retirement?

The latter, it's way too sudden. Intel would be screaming about the good things incoming otherwise + no replacement selected = trouble.

 

[igor_kavinski]

The board probably wanted him to fire some of his buddies at high positions and he must've opposed that. I foresee more departures in quick succession.

 

[Meteor Late]

I heard here that Pat's whole plan and legacy was all about 18A, that this would be his hallmark and main priority and what defines his stance at Intel, betting the whole company on 18A.
Well, this should tell you all you need to know about 18A...