If you love Jesus post inside, if you don't, don't post inside.

[Paladin3]

Just a question for the Christians here: Jesus said "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me." Which means (from every interpretation I've ever seen) that without a belief in Jesus, you're going to Hell. I wonder what happens to children who die before they are old enough to think for themselves, or to jungle natives who have never seen a Christian and never heard of Jesus. Are they damned?

Sorry, I haven't finished the entire thread so someone may have answered your question already. Many Christians believe that those who were never given a chance to accept Christ in this world, will be given a chance at the end of times. Everyone will be brought back, shown the truth of God and Christ in their hearts and then allowed to make their own decision. Many Christians don't even believe in concept of Hell as the fiery place of torture. The just believe Hell will be ceasing to exist and losing out on eternity in Heaven.

 

[Perknose]

Youll have to google that one, but innocents go to heaven. An example would be babies who are aborted. They were murdered and given no chance to be baptized.

Well, HEY, they keep changing their mind and fudging that one. Back when I was a Catholic they had this fun eternal wayside fun stop called Limbo for these unborn "innocents." Not heaven, not Hell. A decent, unprepossessing neighborhood with a number of amenities, but probably no swimming pools or piped-in celestial harp music.

Later, they completely tore down Limbo and paved it over and denied that it had ever existed.

WHERE did all those unborn innocents go, Felix, WHERE? I hate to say it, but I think their tiny souls are now imprisoned in asphalt.

WHY can't God make up his own damn mind about these things? And . . . who does God pray to when he tries?

 

[JohnOfSheffield]

Sorry, I haven't finished the entire thread so someone may have answered your question already. Many Christians believe that those who were never given a chance to accept Christ in this world, will be given a chance at the end of times. Everyone will be brought back, shown the truth of God and Christ in their hearts and then allowed to make their own decision. Many Christians don't even believe in concept of Hell as the fiery place of torture. The just believe Hell will be ceasing to exist and losing out on eternity in Heaven.

He wasn't asking you what you believe, he asks about Jesus's words, are you calling Jesus a liar or are you telling me that you interpret Gods word to mean whatever you want it to mean instead of what the literal meaning of the words say?

(note to TheVrolok, THIS is close to a strawman, i misrepresent his position but since it's in the form of a question and i don't provide an answer myself, it's still not a strawman argument)

 

[CraigRT]

If you leave, go play some L4D2 with me

 

[NikolaeVarius]

I just don't get specific religions. If you want to believe in some higher power that created the Universe, fine, I can see where you are coming from. The Universe IS a big and mysterious place and maybe some higher power did it etc etc. And its not like you're subscribing to a ideology or anything. Its a belief in the beginning of the Universe that no one has any evidence for and there is nothing about it that can cause people to act irrationally.

But why do people believe in specific Gods/Religions. Why Yaweh, Allah, Zeus, Horus, or anything. It just seems intellectually completely absurd. There is no evidence of one religion over another. Every single religion had their own holy texts, prophecies that were confirmed, or evidence of existance. I mean, George Carlin had it right, Sun worship probably makes the most sense. It gives light, warmth, and light to the world. And there is evidence for it. In the sky, giving you everything you need to live, No wonder older civilizations had Sun Gods.

The entire faith before evidence seems dumb. Its exactly the argument that makes people see things that isn't there. You Feel the presence of God. Well that Ghosthunter also feels the presence of a ghost RIGHT THERE next to the drafty window, the conspiracy theories sees proof of hidden explosives RIGHT THERE in the smoke of a collapsing building. Why do people convert to specific religions? Is it just because they were exposed to it? People say they turn to Christ after being saved from a accident or something. Wouldn't that person turn to Allah if they were in a muslim area, or Krishna if in an Indian area? I mean, do people really think through their choices in religions? Do people ever sit there and think about their belief systems?

I swear, no one has been able to answer this question to me in any way that made sense.

 

[sandorski]

I just don't get specific religions. If you want to believe in some higher power that created the Universe, fine, I can see where you are coming from. The Universe IS a big and mysterious place and maybe some higher power did it etc etc. And its not like you're subscribing to a ideology or anything. Its a belief in the beginning of the Universe that no one has any evidence for and there is nothing about it that can cause people to act irrationally.

But why do people believe in specific Gods/Religions. Why Yaweh, Allah, Zeus, Horus, or anything. It just seems intellectually completely absurd. There is no evidence of one religion over another. Every single religion had their own holy texts, prophecies that were confirmed, or evidence of existance. I mean, George Carlin had it right, Sun worship probably makes the most sense. It gives light, warmth, and light to the world. And there is evidence for it. In the sky, giving you everything you need to live, No wonder older civilizations had Sun Gods.

The entire faith before evidence seems dumb. Its exactly the argument that makes people see things that isn't there. You Feel the presence of God. Well that Ghosthunter also feels the presence of a ghost RIGHT THERE next to the drafty window, the conspiracy theories sees proof of hidden explosives RIGHT THERE in the smoke of a collapsing building.

I swear, no one has been able to answer this question to me in any way that made sense.

The Holy Simulacrum shall light your way...

 

[Inspector Jihad]

who would win in a fight, krishna or jesus?

 

[sandorski]

who would win in a fight, krishna or jesus?

Neither would show, leading to a Draw and many pissed off Ticket Holders.

 

[tcsenter]

Tweak your nipples if you love Jesus!

 

[dud]

It's a well known fact that the more intelligent a group of people are, the less likely are they to believe in something for which there is no proof.

Indoctrination doesn't work like it used to either, no one is called to the town square for his or her sins and no school will actively indoctrinate children anymore.

In reality, if you are not indoctrinated into it, you're very unlikely to have any beliefs in a higher power and even less likely to follow a religion.

Hah, lol and you have got to be shitting me ...

"... the more intelligent a group of people are ..." I HOPE that you are not referring to the sample group know as the population of AT. Please tell me that you are joking ...!!!!

 

[dud]

As i said, more intelligent people don't believe in what there is no proof of.

More intelligent people also know what a strawman argument is.

Clearly you don't.

Please return to Sheffield ... where men are men and men are glad of it!

 

[shiner]

Religion is regarded by the wise as false, the common as true, and the politicians as useful - Seneca the Younge

 

[NikolaeVarius]

The Holy Simulacrum shall light your way...

Sorry, I'm already a loyal servant of the Chaos Gods, mostly Nurgle, but I'll take Slannesh any day.

 

[Taejin]

loving the lord isnt gonna save if you if he doesnt exist

 

[sandorski]

Sorry, I'm already a loyal servant of the Chaos Gods, mostly Nurgle, but I'll take Slannesh any day.

The Holy Simulacrum is anything and everything. You can not escape The Holy Simulacrum.

 

[Perknose]

the Bible doesn't mention Purgatory. It was created later, by the RCC, as a stop-gap measure for the "unbaptized infant" problem.

Lol, not correct. I can tell YOU were never Catholic.

Purgatory was and is a later RCC parking lot for those who have been baptized (are in a state of God's grace), but have died with unconfessed, and therefore unexpiated, Venial (lesser) sins. That's why the Last Rites are administered by a Priest to the dying, to clean the slate of your heretofore unconfessed sins.

IF you die with unconfessed Mortal (major) sins, you are shit out of luck, you go to Hell.

What you think is Purgatory was what they used to call Limbo. I hear they tore it down and paved it over, though, and have some different policy these days.

Ah, yes:

Apr. 20, 2007 Update: Catholic Church buries limbo after centuries

The Pope will this week overturn a belief held by Roman Catholics since medieval times by abolishing the concept of Limbo.

Limbo is traditionally held to be the place where the souls of children go if they die before they can be baptised and so freed from original sin.

Definition of venial sins:

Each venial sin that one commits adds to the penance that one must do. Penance left undone during life converts to punishment in purgatory.

 

[TheVrolok]

If that is what you think a strawman argument is, you are mistaken.

I'm sure you have "faith" that you know what it means, but you clearly don't.

Oh, it sounded like you were, in some bizarre way, arguing with what I was saying. Honestly, I didn't see a reason for you to quote my argument either way seeing as what you said really didn't have much to do with it. So now, then I suppose it wasn't a strawman - it was just completely unrelated. I like your insinuation that I must be a man of faith simply because I disagree with you in a particular way; I am not. I'm an agnostic.

 

[OILFIELDTRASH]

I believe in God. Exactly what God is I don't know. There is much wisdom to be had in the Bible whether you agree with it's teachings or not. Sure there is no 100% concrete evidence of a God but there is also not 100% evidence that there isn't.

 

[alevasseur14]

Amen


Most threads aren't religion bashing threads...they're Christianity bashing threads. Most athiests I know aren't anti-religion, they're anti-Christianity

This is why I hesitate to tell people I'm an atheist. Sure, I'm an atheist but I'm not anti-anything. Honestly, I don't care what you believe. I can respect your reasons for feeling as you do, but I don't respect some invisible dude who lives in the clouds and tells us what to do through his 'word'. Replace 'dude who lives in the clouds' with whatever your religious flavor is.

I could go on and on but if there's one thing I've learned, it's that there isn't much point. Don't bother trying to 'save' me, I'm doing just fine. Go ahead and add me to your block list - I don't care.

Hah! Like that's some kind of threat or something...

 

[sandorski]

Lol, not correct. I can tell YOU were never Catholic.

Purgatory was and is a later RCC parking lot for those who have been baptized (are in a state of God's grace), but have died with unconfessed, and therefore unexpiated, Venial (lesser) sins. That's why the Last Rites are administered by a Priest to the dying, to clean the slate of your heretofore unconfessed sins.

IF you die with unconfessed Mortal (major) sins, you are shit out of luck, you go to Hell.

What you think is Purgatory was what they used to call Limbo. I hear they tore it down and paved it over, though, and have some different policy these days.

Ah, yes:

Definition of venial sins:

Shit. What happened to all the Souls in Limbo? Fuck.[/thinks of the movie Dogma]

 

[BoberFett]

Neither would show, leading to a Draw and many pissed off Ticket Holders.

Krishna would win, of course. Jesus would throw the fight, just like he did last time.

 

[sandorski]

Krishna would win, of course. Jesus would throw the fight, just like he did last time.

 

[grrl]

I am serious. I also expected nothing less than the worst of the worst to show up, which gives me a nice list to block. It may even be enough to make me leave this God forsaken place forever.

A while back Quebert threw a hissy fit and threatened to do the same thing. Unfortunately, he was full of shit as well.

 

[JohnOfSheffield]

Oh, it sounded like you were, in some bizarre way, arguing with what I was saying. Honestly, I didn't see a reason for you to quote my argument either way seeing as what you said really didn't have much to do with it. So now, then I suppose it wasn't a strawman - it was just completely unrelated. I like your insinuation that I must be a man of faith simply because I disagree with you in a particular way; I am not. I'm an agnostic.

It was most definently related to what you said, in a way a contradiction of your statement as quoted and replied to. I'm sure if you think about it you'll understand that too. It was definently not a misrepresentation of your general statement though, how it could be seen as such i still don't get.

There was no insinuation either, i never mentioned your take on faith (regarding general faith in a god/s), stop using words like "strawman", "unrelated" and "insinuation" because you clearly don't understand the meaning of them.

 

[smitbret]

I like Jesus. He seems like an alright guy. Got a few zany ideas, but I don't think he's got a mean bone in his body. I could probably hang with J.C.

His posse.....? That's another story.