If a nuke went off in New York City

[Zebo]

I'd move to swtizerland. The USA would become unlivable.

 

[aswedc]

All the oil in Iran wouldn't pay for a years worth of occupation of Iran in a police state style occupation. How much oil reserves do they have? 90 billion barrels, at $70 a barrell? That's $1.6 trillion worth of oil, barely even enough to dent our GDP, and that's if we could get all that oil in one year (which we obviously can't).

I think you're underestimating the income potential.

For example, the government says all engineers have to work for $3/hr. What, you think you should be paid more? Perhaps you'd rather be in jail...

 

[ntdz]

Originally posted by: aswedc

All the oil in Iran wouldn't pay for a years worth of occupation of Iran in a police state style occupation. How much oil reserves do they have? 90 billion barrels, at $70 a barrell? That's $1.6 trillion worth of oil, barely even enough to dent our GDP, and that's if we could get all that oil in one year (which we obviously can't).

I think you're underestimating the income potential.

For example, the government says all engineers have to work for $3/hr. What, you think you should be paid more? Perhaps you'd rather be in jail...

I don't see how we would make any money from an occupation of Iran, even if we made everyone slaves. It's costs so much money to have troops overseas nowadays...Besides, we would face an insurgency ten times larger than Iraq if we were to do what you're saying in Iran.

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: ajf3

See that's the thing... every time some nutjob dictator does something to us, or we discuss them doing something to us this always comes up.

...but the 'people' are 'good'... he's just an evil dictator.

In my opinon, in these sorts of situations, you are either part of the solution or part of the problem - I don't see many shades of grey.

How long would you describe the Iranian people as being 'opressed' by some nutjob over there? Right - forever. ITS THE WAY THEY CHOOSE TO LIVE. It's their CULTURE. There is ALWAYS some madman or another running things.

If they are willing to let a crazy mullah or whatever do the kinds of things they always end up doing without calling them to task then they're not OPRESSED, they're COMPLICIT - if not in the action, then certainly in the SITUATION.

To me it comes down to this... clean up your own mess or we will. If you're 'opressed' and not on board with the nutjobs actions, then get the hell out of dodge before it gets razed.

Bolded for Truth

In fact Americans because they support the bush regime are looked at by those countries as all Americans support aggression on other Nations.

We let it happen, so we are all guilty just like the people of Germany and Japan were all guilty.

 

[JEDIYoda]

Originally posted by: 2Xtreme21

Originally posted by: ntdz
Personally, I'd make sure every Iranian in Iran was dead.

Mmm, the typical all-American response...

You are who by the way???

 

[JEDIYoda]

Originally posted by: Tab

Originally posted by: ntdz

Originally posted by: Tab

Originally posted by: ntdz

Originally posted by: 2Xtreme21

Originally posted by: ntdz
Personally, I'd make sure every Iranian in Iran was dead.

Mmm, the typical all-American response...

A nuke on NYC would cripple our country, and the worlds economy. Imagine all the banks and stock markets that would be lost, all the information lost. Not to mention the lives of millions. So yeah, if someone were to nuke NYC I'd be for total destruction of the perpetraters. How would you like it if all of Pennslyvania were wiped off the map by Iran?

Of course, every true person would scream that the perpetraters be brought to justice. That doesn't mean I am going let my emotions run wild. You, asking for every Iranian to be killed is just insane and reaks of racism...

It has nothing to do with racism...I know Iranians are very mild people that in general aren't anti-American. But so are Chinese people, and what if China were to nuke us? Would you still not want to nuke Beijing, etc...?

I said it reaks of racism, the actions that you support are borderline genocidal reguardless if those were your intentions.

If China did nuke us, I'd probably ask them what the f*ck they're thinking before I did anything rash, no I wouldn't want to nuke a city full of millions of people.

So you would be in favor of the US passively standing by after New york gets nuked and millions of AMERICANS dying???

 

[Tab]

Originally posted by: JEDIYoda

Originally posted by: Tab

Originally posted by: ntdz

Originally posted by: Tab

Originally posted by: ntdz

Originally posted by: 2Xtreme21

Originally posted by: ntdz
Personally, I'd make sure every Iranian in Iran was dead.

Mmm, the typical all-American response...

A nuke on NYC would cripple our country, and the worlds economy. Imagine all the banks and stock markets that would be lost, all the information lost. Not to mention the lives of millions. So yeah, if someone were to nuke NYC I'd be for total destruction of the perpetraters. How would you like it if all of Pennslyvania were wiped off the map by Iran?

Of course, every true person would scream that the perpetraters be brought to justice. That doesn't mean I am going let my emotions run wild. You, asking for every Iranian to be killed is just insane and reaks of racism...

It has nothing to do with racism...I know Iranians are very mild people that in general aren't anti-American. But so are Chinese people, and what if China were to nuke us? Would you still not want to nuke Beijing, etc...?

I said it reaks of racism, the actions that you support are borderline genocidal reguardless if those were your intentions.

If China did nuke us, I'd probably ask them what the f*ck they're thinking before I did anything rash, no I wouldn't want to nuke a city full of millions of people.

So you would be in favor of the US passively standing by after New york gets nuked and millions of AMERICANS dying???

Please, show me were I even remotely implied that...

 

[43st]

Originally posted by: EatSpam
That scenario would only happen in a Red Stater's wet dream. Iran isn't going to attack anyone.

Fixed that for you...

 

[JacobJ]

"I would give my life in order to save sinners, of whom I am first"

 

[jlbenedict]

If it was truely an Iranian nuke, the world we live in today would be far different than it is at this present day.
An act like this would 99% most likely bring on World War III

 

[piasabird]

Personally if all of New York State was nuked, I would not care less, although it might be a bit better if they were to nuke California or hollywood.

If you dont live in New York of the east coast you dont much care what happens there.

It would cause more harm in some ways to take out Washington DC, or the city in virginia accross the river, where the headquarters of many software companies and I think Wal-Mart is. A lot of corporate offices are in virginia just across the river from DC.

If I were a half-way intelligent terrorists, I would take out a few Conservative or republican strongholds, and leave the liberal states alone. However, for symbolic effect it is better to attack the symbols of America. World Trade center is just a symbol of our free market economy, but it would be more symbolic to bomb the white house or maybe congress or the pentagon. Lets just say I am glad I live in the midwest.

As far as a response, I think we should use a new doctrine of total genocide for any country that attacks us with nuclear weapons. This is because nuclear weapons are designed to wipe out civilian population and only an idiot would use them as a first response. Any country that would use a nuclear weapon desrves to be wiped out as an example to the rest of the world.

I admit that this may sound like the USA is hypocritical in some ways since we bombed the japanese with nuclear weapons. However, they attacked us first and tried to take over hawaii. Hopefully, the world has matured to the point that we all recognize that nuclear wapons can cause more harm than good. When a nuclear blast occurs the cloud of nuclear waste tends to float in whatever direction the prevailing wind blows contaminating everything. I dont really want any state to be bombed with any bombs of any kind, even if they are full of liberal saps.

 

[conjur]

Is this from the Propaganda show on the news channels yesterday showing animation of an Iranian nuke strike on NYC?


(with apologies to Carly Simon)
Prah-op-a-ganda, it's making me sick.

 

[Future Shock]

Originally posted by: ntdz

True, when I think of a city being nuked, I'm thinking total destruction...which may not be the case. You raise good points about consequences, but my first thought when what would you do if New York was nuked by Iran was destroy Iran...However, what are the consequences if we don't retaliate? Would other countries feel empowered by this? Would we be subject to other attacks because we showed weakness?

What if China nuked New York? Would you still not want to nuke them?

Firstly, I'm gald you liked my points, thank you for that. Just some further thoughts..

If we are attacked by China, it would be a political war for control of resources, prestige, or empire building. These types of wars are usually resolved, either by victory, negotiation, or armistice. And let's face it, China is NOT run by madmen or fanatics - their SOLE desire is to maintain a grip on power for themselves, not remake the world (at least at this time).

But a war with Iran is NOT a political war - it is a religious war, and if it escalates it risks drawing in the entire Islamic populations of countries that are nominally our friends, a la Pakistan. That includes Indonesia, that could include parts of several EU countries that have nukes, that includes former Soviet republics that have large amounts of Muslims and parts and technologies left over from the Cold War. Hell, it could EVEN include Muslims within the US military, if it escalates.

BTW, I WAS a huge proponent at first of nuking Afghanistan after 9/11...something so vile that no one would dare harbour terrorists on their soil again. Then the whole issue of Pakistani nukes came clearer, and I have re-thought my position. So I certainly DO see where the "nuke them to the Stone Age" crowd comes from - but I strongly urge you to consider the religious and martyr aspects of such an action. We are dealing with a DIFFERENT FORM of logic here...a key mistake we make is to always assume they will play by our rules to "win"...but I think that experinece should be teaching us that their definition of "win" may be quite different, and have nothing to do with preserving lives, not even their own...

Future Shock

 

[palehorse]

Originally posted by: Future Shock
We are dealing with a DIFFERENT FORM of logic here.

i believe that it's the absence of logic, reason, and rational thought that defines our enemies; not meerly a "different form."

My biggest question is this: What will the EU, Japan, and China do if the USA is attacked with a WMD sometime in the future? Will they support our decision to retaliate in kind? Will they atleast support a definitive response? Or, will they still puss-out again, and promote meer diplomacy in a situation where all logic, reason, and rationality are absent in our enemies, even after a WMD attack occurs?

That is the real question, because it's not a matter of "if" such an attack will happen, it's simply a matter of WHEN.

 

[Darkhawk28]

Originally posted by: palehorse74

Originally posted by: Future Shock
We are dealing with a DIFFERENT FORM of logic here.

i believe that it's the absence of logic, reason, and rational thought that defines our enemies; not meerly a "different form."

My biggest question is this: What will the EU, Japan, and China do IF the USA is attacked with a WMD sometime? Will all of them support our decision to retaliate in kind? Will they support a definitive response? Or will they still puss-out and promote meer diplomacy in a situation where all logic, reason, and rationality are absent in our enemies, even after a WMD attack occurs?

That is the real question, because it's not a matter of "if" such an attack will happen, it's simply a matter of WHEN.

Hmm.. seems like the world was with us in Afghanistan going after OBL. Seems like the only ones that pussed-out are people like YOU.

 

[Genx87]

Let me guess, most want us to bomb limited targets in Iran and then spend the next 10 years chasing terrorists around in the mountains?

One thing you need to do is hold the entire country responsible. One thing you see with terrorism is plausible deniability. Iran supplies a nuke but we cant pinpoint it on them. The group who drops the bomb on our city is linked with the regime in Iran. Iran gets a free pass because we cant directly link them to the bomb?

If this were to happen I fear what will happen. I honestly believe the first thing that will happen is a civil war in this country between the people who think talking to somebody hell bent on killing you will solve the problem and the people who are sick of being the whipping stick of fundamental Islam.

After that settles out what do you do with the country of origin of the nuke?
I would say give the civilians 30 days to clear out then turn it into a sheet of glass.

 

[Genx87]

Originally posted by: Rainsford
I voted "other", because this topic is a waste of time and energy. Security expert Bruce Schneier calls it movie plot security, and I think it's a good term. We get all worked up over something we have no evidence, strong feeling, call to Miss Cleo, whatever, supporting it, just because it sounds bad. This kind of thinking is exactly where problems come in, because the entire discussion becomes about this hypothetical situation instead of dealing with the real issues or potential issues.

I realize that this probably wasn't the intention of the OP, but we get enough of this noise from people trying to defend the US against imaginary theats, I'm not sure how much more of it we need. You can't talk to a Bush supporter about warrantless wiretapping for 5 minutes because you hear "well what if there was a nuke hidden in New York" or similar nonsense.

This is the same attitude many, including myself felt before 9-11. We felt a large scale operation was not possible and the most we may see in terms of terrorism is an occasional car bombing on a busy street.

I dont underestimate our enemy anymore and honestly beliueve if Iran goes nuclear, it isnt a question of if, but when one of their nukes ends up in NYC or Tel Aviv, both of which will require a massive response.

 

[palehorse]

Originally posted by: Darkhawk28

Originally posted by: palehorse74

Originally posted by: Future Shock
We are dealing with a DIFFERENT FORM of logic here.

i believe that it's the absence of logic, reason, and rational thought that defines our enemies; not meerly a "different form."

My biggest question is this: What will the EU, Japan, and China do IF the USA is attacked with a WMD sometime? Will all of them support our decision to retaliate in kind? Will they support a definitive response? Or will they still puss-out and promote meer diplomacy in a situation where all logic, reason, and rationality are absent in our enemies, even after a WMD attack occurs?

That is the real question, because it's not a matter of "if" such an attack will happen, it's simply a matter of WHEN.

Hmm.. seems like the world was with us in Afghanistan going after OBL. Seems like the only ones that pussed-out are people like YOU.

ummm, what? I just spent a year over there running combat patrols, so who pussed out again? not I...

fool.

and the world's support has changed alot since then anyways, hence my question.

 

[Genx87]

Originally posted by: palehorse74

Originally posted by: Darkhawk28

Originally posted by: palehorse74

Originally posted by: Future Shock
We are dealing with a DIFFERENT FORM of logic here.

i believe that it's the absence of logic, reason, and rational thought that defines our enemies; not meerly a "different form."

My biggest question is this: What will the EU, Japan, and China do IF the USA is attacked with a WMD sometime? Will all of them support our decision to retaliate in kind? Will they support a definitive response? Or will they still puss-out and promote meer diplomacy in a situation where all logic, reason, and rationality are absent in our enemies, even after a WMD attack occurs?

That is the real question, because it's not a matter of "if" such an attack will happen, it's simply a matter of WHEN.

Hmm.. seems like the world was with us in Afghanistan going after OBL. Seems like the only ones that pussed-out are people like YOU.

ummm, what? I just spent a year over there running combat patrols, so who pussed out again? not I...

fool.

and the world's support has changed alot since then anyways, hence my question.

pwned

 

[conjur]

"pwned"? By a Counterstriker? :roll:

 

[Genx87]

Originally posted by: conjur
"pwned"? By a Counterstriker? :roll:

Sounds to me like somebody who has walked the walk.

 

[Darkhawk28]

Originally posted by: Genx87

Originally posted by: palehorse74

Originally posted by: Darkhawk28

Originally posted by: palehorse74

Originally posted by: Future Shock
We are dealing with a DIFFERENT FORM of logic here.

i believe that it's the absence of logic, reason, and rational thought that defines our enemies; not meerly a "different form."

My biggest question is this: What will the EU, Japan, and China do IF the USA is attacked with a WMD sometime? Will all of them support our decision to retaliate in kind? Will they support a definitive response? Or will they still puss-out and promote meer diplomacy in a situation where all logic, reason, and rationality are absent in our enemies, even after a WMD attack occurs?

That is the real question, because it's not a matter of "if" such an attack will happen, it's simply a matter of WHEN.

Hmm.. seems like the world was with us in Afghanistan going after OBL. Seems like the only ones that pussed-out are people like YOU.

ummm, what? I just spent a year over there running combat patrols, so who pussed out again? not I...

fool.

and the world's support has changed alot since then anyways, hence my question.

pwned

Says the pissant.

 

[Darkhawk28]

Originally posted by: palehorse74

Originally posted by: Darkhawk28

Originally posted by: palehorse74

Originally posted by: Future Shock
We are dealing with a DIFFERENT FORM of logic here.

i believe that it's the absence of logic, reason, and rational thought that defines our enemies; not meerly a "different form."

My biggest question is this: What will the EU, Japan, and China do IF the USA is attacked with a WMD sometime? Will all of them support our decision to retaliate in kind? Will they support a definitive response? Or will they still puss-out and promote meer diplomacy in a situation where all logic, reason, and rationality are absent in our enemies, even after a WMD attack occurs?

That is the real question, because it's not a matter of "if" such an attack will happen, it's simply a matter of WHEN.

Hmm.. seems like the world was with us in Afghanistan going after OBL. Seems like the only ones that pussed-out are people like YOU.

ummm, what? I just spent a year over there running combat patrols, so who pussed out again? not I...

fool.

and the world's support has changed alot since then anyways, hence my question.

You're a fraud. And a bad one at that.

 

[Genx87]

Originally posted by: Darkhawk28

Originally posted by: Genx87

Originally posted by: palehorse74

Originally posted by: Darkhawk28

Originally posted by: palehorse74

Originally posted by: Future Shock
We are dealing with a DIFFERENT FORM of logic here.

i believe that it's the absence of logic, reason, and rational thought that defines our enemies; not meerly a "different form."

My biggest question is this: What will the EU, Japan, and China do IF the USA is attacked with a WMD sometime? Will all of them support our decision to retaliate in kind? Will they support a definitive response? Or will they still puss-out and promote meer diplomacy in a situation where all logic, reason, and rationality are absent in our enemies, even after a WMD attack occurs?

That is the real question, because it's not a matter of "if" such an attack will happen, it's simply a matter of WHEN.

Hmm.. seems like the world was with us in Afghanistan going after OBL. Seems like the only ones that pussed-out are people like YOU.

ummm, what? I just spent a year over there running combat patrols, so who pussed out again? not I...

fool.

and the world's support has changed alot since then anyways, hence my question.

pwned

Says the pissant.

lmao

You are such a joke it hurts to read your pitiful responses now. At least Conjur still has some life left in him.

 

[Darkhawk28]

Originally posted by: Genx87

Originally posted by: Darkhawk28

Originally posted by: Genx87

Originally posted by: palehorse74

Originally posted by: Darkhawk28

Originally posted by: palehorse74

Originally posted by: Future Shock
We are dealing with a DIFFERENT FORM of logic here.

i believe that it's the absence of logic, reason, and rational thought that defines our enemies; not meerly a "different form."

My biggest question is this: What will the EU, Japan, and China do IF the USA is attacked with a WMD sometime? Will all of them support our decision to retaliate in kind? Will they support a definitive response? Or will they still puss-out and promote meer diplomacy in a situation where all logic, reason, and rationality are absent in our enemies, even after a WMD attack occurs?

That is the real question, because it's not a matter of "if" such an attack will happen, it's simply a matter of WHEN.

Hmm.. seems like the world was with us in Afghanistan going after OBL. Seems like the only ones that pussed-out are people like YOU.

ummm, what? I just spent a year over there running combat patrols, so who pussed out again? not I...

fool.

and the world's support has changed alot since then anyways, hence my question.

pwned

Says the pissant.

lmao

You are such a joke it hurts to read your pitiful responses now. At least Conjur still has some life left in him.

Because I don't treat idiots like you with an ounce of respect. You're too stupid for words.