If 9/11 2.0 happens, would you say Torture is ok?

[fallout man]

Originally posted by: Xellos2099

So it is ok for us to just kill them but no some torture for info extraction? I think this school of thinking is created from people watching too much TV and Hollywood movie where there is always some kind of evil general who will torture and some righteous people who can get things done without such method. Unfortunately, this is not how real world work.

So it's ok to throw unwanted human embryos in the trash, but it's not ok to beforehand extract a few pluripotent cells that can be used in stem-cell research which has the potential to save millions of lives? I think this school of thinking is created from people listening to clergy and frothing right-to-lifers who think that every embryonic stem cells scientist laughs maniacally while ripping precious unwanted embryos to shreds for the good of humanity, while every janitor who throws unwanted embryos in the incinerator is doing the right thing. Unfortunately, this is not how the real world works.

Or, perhaps, some folks base their opinions on the moral framework to which they subrscibe.

 

[CitizenKain]

Originally posted by: Mackie2k

Originally posted by: n yusef

Originally posted by: Mackie2k

Originally posted by: dullard
The problem is that you'd just get false information from torture. Heck, under your scenario, we've been torturing for a decade and STILL had 9/11 2.0. What "safety" that brought us. :roll: You are trying to get us to say "Well we tortured and it didn't prevent 9/11 2.0; therefore, we should torture more."

I disagree. We haven't had another 9/11. Does it mean we are safer? Not sure. Guess we'll have to wait 10 years and see.

I for one, have no trouble sleeping at night knowing we've tortured people who will stop at nothing to murder Americans.

We can try to play nice, but it won't work and eventually we'll be hit again.

Germans had no problems sleeping at night during the Holocaust. White Americans had no trouble sleeping at night during the genocide of Native Americans, slavery, segregation, and the internment of the Japanese. Men had no trouble sleeping when married women couldn't get jobs or own anything in their own names.

I'm not making a moral equivalency, just demonstrating that your ability to sleep at night means jack shit.

Who said they all slept well at night? Were you there?

I'm here, and I'm saying I sleep well at night, so that means SOMETHING, not shit. Fuck Terrorists and the pussy liberals who support treating them with anything less than utter brutality.

Aww, look at the little baby rightwinger trying to use grownup words.

 

[Xellos2099]

Ideology men jack shit if you die.

 

[Mackie2k]

Originally posted by: dainthomas

Originally posted by: Mackie2k
Inspired by all the Torture threads....

I'm wondering if all the people saying Torture is wrong, would still think that if say Terroritsts attacked and killed 10,000 Americans?

I'm not saying Torture is right or wrong, just a necessary evil when you are dealing with people who'd rather die than let you live.

So it was OK for Japan to waterboard US POWs to get info about a potential US nuke attack?

Yep.

Just as it was OK for us to NUKE them to stop the war. Don't pick a fight if you don't have the guts to see it through.

 

[fallout man]

Originally posted by: Xellos2099
Ideology men jack shit if you die.

Where are they jacking it from? We should alert the Scotland Yard!

 

[jonks]

Originally posted by: Xellos2099
Ideology men jack shit if you die.

Wow, do you have that backwards. Ideology and values mean nothing if you abandon them when tested.

Values are what you die for, what our soldiers die for.

 

[jonks]

Originally posted by: Mackie2k

Originally posted by: dainthomas

Originally posted by: Mackie2k
Inspired by all the Torture threads....

I'm wondering if all the people saying Torture is wrong, would still think that if say Terroritsts attacked and killed 10,000 Americans?

I'm not saying Torture is right or wrong, just a necessary evil when you are dealing with people who'd rather die than let you live.

So it was OK for Japan to waterboard US POWs to get info about a potential US nuke attack?

Yep.

Just as it was OK for us to NUKE them to stop the war. Don't pick a fight if you don't have the guts to see it through.

So the only mistake the Nazis made was losing the war? Got it. Holy crap thank god you people aren't running things anymore.

 

[Mackie2k]

Originally posted by: CitizenKain

Originally posted by: Mackie2k

Originally posted by: n yusef

Originally posted by: Mackie2k

Originally posted by: dullard
The problem is that you'd just get false information from torture. Heck, under your scenario, we've been torturing for a decade and STILL had 9/11 2.0. What "safety" that brought us. :roll: You are trying to get us to say "Well we tortured and it didn't prevent 9/11 2.0; therefore, we should torture more."

I disagree. We haven't had another 9/11. Does it mean we are safer? Not sure. Guess we'll have to wait 10 years and see.

I for one, have no trouble sleeping at night knowing we've tortured people who will stop at nothing to murder Americans.

We can try to play nice, but it won't work and eventually we'll be hit again.

Germans had no problems sleeping at night during the Holocaust. White Americans had no trouble sleeping at night during the genocide of Native Americans, slavery, segregation, and the internment of the Japanese. Men had no trouble sleeping when married women couldn't get jobs or own anything in their own names.

I'm not making a moral equivalency, just demonstrating that your ability to sleep at night means jack shit.

Who said they all slept well at night? Were you there?

I'm here, and I'm saying I sleep well at night, so that means SOMETHING, not shit. Fuck Terrorists and the pussy liberals who support treating them with anything less than utter brutality.

Aww, look at the little baby rightwinger trying to use grownup words.

LOL rightwinger...

Right and LEFT have nothing to do wtih Torture. It's right or wrong. I think it's right.

It's easy to be liberal now, spewing love and hold hands across america BS...

Wait until another serious Terrorist attack happens, you'll be wishing someone had been actually watching and responding to these animals.

 

[Phokus]

Editorial: When Israel confronted and rejected torture:

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/01/opinion/01fri4.html

When even a nation like Israel can reject torture, that says a LOT about ATPN republicans (hint: it says you're worse than scum)

 

[dainthomas]

Originally posted by: Mackie2k

Originally posted by: dainthomas

Originally posted by: Mackie2k
Inspired by all the Torture threads....

I'm wondering if all the people saying Torture is wrong, would still think that if say Terroritsts attacked and killed 10,000 Americans?

I'm not saying Torture is right or wrong, just a necessary evil when you are dealing with people who'd rather die than let you live.

So it was OK for Japan to waterboard US POWs to get info about a potential US nuke attack?

Yep.

Just as it was OK for us to NUKE them to stop the war. Don't pick a fight if you don't have the guts to see it through.

Too bad we shot the waterboarders after the war then, if it was OK for them to do it.

 

[Xellos2099]

You can keep your ideology and die but I am going to keep on living, no matter what, One who don't value their own life deserve to die and rot.

 

[Mackie2k]

Originally posted by: jonks

Originally posted by: Mackie2k

Originally posted by: dainthomas

Originally posted by: Mackie2k
Inspired by all the Torture threads....

I'm wondering if all the people saying Torture is wrong, would still think that if say Terroritsts attacked and killed 10,000 Americans?

I'm not saying Torture is right or wrong, just a necessary evil when you are dealing with people who'd rather die than let you live.

So it was OK for Japan to waterboard US POWs to get info about a potential US nuke attack?

Yep.

Just as it was OK for us to NUKE them to stop the war. Don't pick a fight if you don't have the guts to see it through.

So the only mistake the Nazis made was losing the war? Got it. Holy crap thank god you people aren't running things anymore.

LOL......No one will be running much of anything if Obama keeps spending like he is.

 

[jonks]

Originally posted by: Xellos2099
You can keep your ideology and die but I am going to keep on living, no matter what,

A coward dies a thousand deaths. Enjoy your long meaningless life.

 

[fskimospy]

Originally posted by: Mackie2k

Originally posted by: jonks

Originally posted by: Mackie2k

Yep.

Just as it was OK for us to NUKE them to stop the war. Don't pick a fight if you don't have the guts to see it through.

So the only mistake the Nazis made was losing the war? Got it. Holy crap thank god you people aren't running things anymore.

LOL......No one will be running much of anything if Obama keeps spending like he is.

Look, if you're going to concern-troll here you're going to have to hold up the facade of impartiality for more than 2 pages.

 

[jonks]

Originally posted by: Mackie2k

Originally posted by: jonks

Originally posted by: Mackie2k

Originally posted by: dainthomas

Originally posted by: Mackie2k
Inspired by all the Torture threads....

I'm wondering if all the people saying Torture is wrong, would still think that if say Terroritsts attacked and killed 10,000 Americans?

I'm not saying Torture is right or wrong, just a necessary evil when you are dealing with people who'd rather die than let you live.

So it was OK for Japan to waterboard US POWs to get info about a potential US nuke attack?

Yep.

Just as it was OK for us to NUKE them to stop the war. Don't pick a fight if you don't have the guts to see it through.

So the only mistake the Nazis made was losing the war? Got it. Holy crap thank god you people aren't running things anymore.

LOL......No one will be running much of anything if Obama keeps spending like he is.

Good morning! You just wake up after the last 8 years? Want some coffee...or tea?

 

[OrByte]

Originally posted by: Mackie2k

Originally posted by: CitizenKain

Originally posted by: Mackie2k

Originally posted by: n yusef

Originally posted by: Mackie2k

Originally posted by: dullard
The problem is that you'd just get false information from torture. Heck, under your scenario, we've been torturing for a decade and STILL had 9/11 2.0. What "safety" that brought us. :roll: You are trying to get us to say "Well we tortured and it didn't prevent 9/11 2.0; therefore, we should torture more."

I disagree. We haven't had another 9/11. Does it mean we are safer? Not sure. Guess we'll have to wait 10 years and see.

I for one, have no trouble sleeping at night knowing we've tortured people who will stop at nothing to murder Americans.

We can try to play nice, but it won't work and eventually we'll be hit again.

Germans had no problems sleeping at night during the Holocaust. White Americans had no trouble sleeping at night during the genocide of Native Americans, slavery, segregation, and the internment of the Japanese. Men had no trouble sleeping when married women couldn't get jobs or own anything in their own names.

I'm not making a moral equivalency, just demonstrating that your ability to sleep at night means jack shit.

Who said they all slept well at night? Were you there?

I'm here, and I'm saying I sleep well at night, so that means SOMETHING, not shit. Fuck Terrorists and the pussy liberals who support treating them with anything less than utter brutality.

Aww, look at the little baby rightwinger trying to use grownup words.

LOL rightwinger...

Right and LEFT have nothing to do wtih Torture. It's right or wrong. I think it's right.

It's easy to be liberal now, spewing love and hold hands across america BS...

Wait until another serious Terrorist attack happens, you'll be wishing someone had been actually watching and responding to these animals.

you contradict yourself.

no surprise.

 

[jonks]

Originally posted by: Mackie2k
I'm wondering if all the people saying Torture is wrong, would still think that if say Terroritsts attacked and killed 10,000 Americans?

Yeah, so we should torture and prevent 9/11 III, but Al Qaeda recuiting goes through the roof and thus causes 9/11 IV-CXXVI. Brilliant man you are.

 

[CitizenKain]

Originally posted by: Mackie2k


LOL rightwinger...

Right and LEFT have nothing to do wtih Torture. It's right or wrong. I think it's right.

It's easy to be liberal now, spewing love and hold hands across america BS...

Wait until another serious Terrorist attack happens, you'll be wishing someone had been actually watching and responding to these animals.

Look, its trying to use logic at a 3 year old's level! At this rate, it could reach grade school within a dozen posts. Then, we could soon be dealing with a creature is forwarding Freep quotes.

Originally posted by: Xellos2099
You can keep your ideology and die but I am going to keep on living, no matter what,

Thats good to put on the tombstone : "Lived like he died, in sheer terror"

 

[n yusef]

Originally posted by: Mackie2k

Originally posted by: n yusef

Originally posted by: Mackie2k

Originally posted by: dullard
The problem is that you'd just get false information from torture. Heck, under your scenario, we've been torturing for a decade and STILL had 9/11 2.0. What "safety" that brought us. :roll: You are trying to get us to say "Well we tortured and it didn't prevent 9/11 2.0; therefore, we should torture more."

I disagree. We haven't had another 9/11. Does it mean we are safer? Not sure. Guess we'll have to wait 10 years and see.

I for one, have no trouble sleeping at night knowing we've tortured people who will stop at nothing to murder Americans.

We can try to play nice, but it won't work and eventually we'll be hit again.

Germans had no problems sleeping at night during the Holocaust. White Americans had no trouble sleeping at night during the genocide of Native Americans, slavery, segregation, and the internment of the Japanese. Men had no trouble sleeping when married women couldn't get jobs or own anything in their own names.

I'm not making a moral equivalency, just demonstrating that your ability to sleep at night means jack shit.

Who said they all slept well at night? Were you there?

I'm here, and I'm saying I sleep well at night, so that means SOMETHING, not shit. Fuck Terrorists and the pussy liberals who support treating them with anything less than utter brutality.

You have the mentality of a teenage gangster. You think that violence solves all problems, and that you have to be tough, not a "pussy liberal." This primitive worldview causes most of the worlds problems. I live for the day when humans abandon it.

 

[Mackie2k]

Originally posted by: n yusef

Originally posted by: Mackie2k

Originally posted by: n yusef

Originally posted by: Mackie2k

Originally posted by: dullard
The problem is that you'd just get false information from torture. Heck, under your scenario, we've been torturing for a decade and STILL had 9/11 2.0. What "safety" that brought us. :roll: You are trying to get us to say "Well we tortured and it didn't prevent 9/11 2.0; therefore, we should torture more."

I disagree. We haven't had another 9/11. Does it mean we are safer? Not sure. Guess we'll have to wait 10 years and see.

I for one, have no trouble sleeping at night knowing we've tortured people who will stop at nothing to murder Americans.

We can try to play nice, but it won't work and eventually we'll be hit again.

Germans had no problems sleeping at night during the Holocaust. White Americans had no trouble sleeping at night during the genocide of Native Americans, slavery, segregation, and the internment of the Japanese. Men had no trouble sleeping when married women couldn't get jobs or own anything in their own names.

I'm not making a moral equivalency, just demonstrating that your ability to sleep at night means jack shit.

Who said they all slept well at night? Were you there?

I'm here, and I'm saying I sleep well at night, so that means SOMETHING, not shit. Fuck Terrorists and the pussy liberals who support treating them with anything less than utter brutality.

You have the mentality of a teenage gangster. You think that violence solves all problems, and that you have to be tough, not a "pussy liberal." This primitive worldview causes most of the worlds problems. I live for the day when humans abandon it.

So we should turn the other cheek when attacked by terrorists? What is your master plan to protect and defeat these evil animals?

 

[Craig234]

Originally posted by: Mackie2k
So we should turn the other cheek when attacked by terrorists? What is your master plan to protect and defeat these evil animals?

There's an old saying, when all a man has is a hammer, everything looks like a nail.

You have one tool in your arsenal - violence, and so you simplify the issue to 'use violence and win' or 'don't use violence and get beheaded along with yout family by Al Queda'.

You ask a good question (badly), but it looks like you are not ready for the answer, IMO.

 

[JohnOfSheffield]

Originally posted by: Mackie2k
Inspired by all the Torture threads....

I'm wondering if all the people saying Torture is wrong, would still think that if say Terroritsts attacked and killed 10,000 Americans?

I'm not saying Torture is right or wrong, just a necessary evil when you are dealing with people who'd rather die than let you live.

If we want to turn into our enemy, to behave like our enemy then i wouldn't fight for either side but combat both.

I'm willing to bet you that if you ask ANYONE here or anywhere else what drives you they will all reply the same.

It's because we are right and the enemy is wrong, now how the FUCK would you distinguish between right and wrong if we behave the same way?

I wouldn't have a problem killing every last one of the torturers on either side just because i would know i was right and they were wrong.

Without that, what the fuck would i be fighting for?

 

[JohnOfSheffield]

Originally posted by: Craig234

Originally posted by: Mackie2k
So we should turn the other cheek when attacked by terrorists? What is your master plan to protect and defeat these evil animals?

There's an old saying, when all a man has is a hammer, everything looks like a nail.

You have one tool in your arsenal - violence, and so you simplify the issue to 'use violence and win' or 'don't use violence and get beheaded along with yout family by Al Queda'.

You ask a good question (badly), but it looks like you are not ready for the answer, IMO.

You're full of shit.

You know absolutely nothing, nothing what so ever of this issue.

Is it wrong to kill people raping and shooting pre pubescent girls in the vagina? Is it wrong to stop them even if that means that you'll have to kill them? These people are not like you who will give up even if you don't have a gun in your hand and i've got my gun pointed at you, they are perfectly willing to die rather than surrender.

So should we let them go on with their raping, murdering and torturing without reacting? Is that your fucking answer?

Diplomacy only works with people who are sane, these are not even people, they are not even animals, they are parasites on every community they infest and the communities need a treatment for these parasites.

 

[Mani]

Nope, but I'm sure a lot of the less-principled, knee-jerk, scared-of-their-own-shadow types will.

 

[Xellos2099]

Originally posted by: JohnOfSheffield

Originally posted by: Mackie2k
Inspired by all the Torture threads....

I'm wondering if all the people saying Torture is wrong, would still think that if say Terroritsts attacked and killed 10,000 Americans?

I'm not saying Torture is right or wrong, just a necessary evil when you are dealing with people who'd rather die than let you live.

If we want to turn into our enemy, to behave like our enemy then i wouldn't fight for either side but combat both.

I'm willing to bet you that if you ask ANYONE here or anywhere else what drives you they will all reply the same.

It's because we are right and the enemy is wrong, now how the FUCK would you distinguish between right and wrong if we behave the same way?

I wouldn't have a problem killing every last one of the torturers on either side just because i would know i was right and they were wrong.

Without that, what the fuck would i be fighting for?

We fought for the right to live peacefully without building blowing up around us, sound simple enough for you?