I think it's time for me to join the HDTV era...

[Kryhs]

100k hours? Nice...

You know, how noticable is 1080p from the next step down? Is it really a big deal? What's the best p or i that plasma can do?

 

[Apex]

Originally posted by: Kryhs
100k hours? Nice...

You know, how noticable is 1080p from the next step down? Is it really a big deal? What's the best p or i that plasma can do?

It depends on how good your eyesight is, how close you're sitting to what size screen, and what kind of source material you're feeding. 1080p is a very incremental improvement over 1366 x 768.

 

[NatePo717]

Originally posted by: keeleysam
Samsung DLP

/thread.

I have one from LG. Awesome picture.

 

[Baked]

Whatever's the cheapest and latest at Costco. Make sure you get one that's 1080p.

 

[Project86]

Originally posted by: UNCjigga

The one I know the least about is LCoS. Seriously, who's really marketing LCoS displays these days? Sony? RCA? Can we get some more on the market? I hear its better than LCD projection and shouldn't have the color-wheel effect of DLP, but where can you find them?

Well, for a while JVC was the ONLY company to successfully bring the technology to the market. But then Sony followed with the Qualia high end stuff, and now have their SXRD line for the home user. The JVC units have been very highly regarded in the videophile world, and can be had for about the same price as comparable size DLP or rear projection LCD sets. They "only" do 768p though (which is fine IMO). The new Sony SXRD line can do 1080P but is $4000 for the 50" model, roughly double that of the JVC.

I guess all this is pointless though cuz the OP wants to hang something on the wall. I have yet to see a Plasma screen at any size that does 1080P, and LCD's that can do it are in the $4000+ range. I personally think that 1080P is not worth the price at this point, since it really doesn't look much better than 720P or the rest.... but that's just me.

 

[Apex]

Originally posted by: Project86

Originally posted by: UNCjigga

The one I know the least about is LCoS. Seriously, who's really marketing LCoS displays these days? Sony? RCA? Can we get some more on the market? I hear its better than LCD projection and shouldn't have the color-wheel effect of DLP, but where can you find them?

Well, for a while JVC was the ONLY company to successfully bring the technology to the market. But then Sony followed with the Qualia high end stuff, and now have their SXRD line for the home user. The JVC units have been very highly regarded in the videophile world, and can be had for about the same price as comparable size DLP or rear projection LCD sets. They "only" do 768p though (which is fine IMO). The new Sony SXRD line can do 1080P but is $4000 for the 50" model, roughly double that of the JVC.

Don't forget Philips and their single chip/spinning prism LCOS solution.

 

[NiKeFiDO]

def waffles. the Belgian kind

 

[LikeLinus]

Originally posted by: Apex

Originally posted by: Project86

Originally posted by: UNCjigga

The one I know the least about is LCoS. Seriously, who's really marketing LCoS displays these days? Sony? RCA? Can we get some more on the market? I hear its better than LCD projection and shouldn't have the color-wheel effect of DLP, but where can you find them?

Well, for a while JVC was the ONLY company to successfully bring the technology to the market. But then Sony followed with the Qualia high end stuff, and now have their SXRD line for the home user. The JVC units have been very highly regarded in the videophile world, and can be had for about the same price as comparable size DLP or rear projection LCD sets. They "only" do 768p though (which is fine IMO). The new Sony SXRD line can do 1080P but is $4000 for the 50" model, roughly double that of the JVC.

Don't forget Philips and their single chip/spinning prism LCOS solution.

What would you consider the best screen right now for about $3000.

I was looking at the Panny 50" HDTV Plasma. Any other suggestions?

 

[Apex]

Originally posted by: LikeLinus

Originally posted by: Apex

Originally posted by: Project86

Originally posted by: UNCjigga

The one I know the least about is LCoS. Seriously, who's really marketing LCoS displays these days? Sony? RCA? Can we get some more on the market? I hear its better than LCD projection and shouldn't have the color-wheel effect of DLP, but where can you find them?

Well, for a while JVC was the ONLY company to successfully bring the technology to the market. But then Sony followed with the Qualia high end stuff, and now have their SXRD line for the home user. The JVC units have been very highly regarded in the videophile world, and can be had for about the same price as comparable size DLP or rear projection LCD sets. They "only" do 768p though (which is fine IMO). The new Sony SXRD line can do 1080P but is $4000 for the 50" model, roughly double that of the JVC.

Don't forget Philips and their single chip/spinning prism LCOS solution.

What would you consider the best screen right now for about $3000.

I was looking at the Panny 50" HDTV Plasma. Any other suggestions?

Though the Panny 50" is nice, there are others to consider as well at that price range.

Ultimately, you need to pick what looks best to your eyes, in your viewing environment, with your source material. So, though one TV may irrefutably measure better than others, it may not please you the most.

What's your viewing distance?

How wide is your viewing cone (ie. viewing angles as wide as 40 degrees)?

How deep can the display be (ie. must be 3-4" thick for wall hanging, or can be 12" deep)?

How's your ambient light control (ie. no direct sunlight? some indirect light? total darkness?)?

What kind of material do you view most often (ie. 60% SD digital cable, 20% DVD, 10% HD, 10% PC material)?

What kind of movies/videos do you enjoy most (ie. mostly sports, or mostly dark movies, etc)?

Does needing to change a bulb every 6-8k hours bother you?

Does the need for a TV to be on for at least 15 minutes before you can shut it off bother you (once you turn on the TV, it takes 15 min to completely warm up bulb, which you want it to do before shutting off)?

 

[DragonMasterAlex]

I bought a Samsung 61" DLP earlier this year and I couldn't be happier with it. It's got a gorgeous picture, TONS of inputs and options and the screen *can't* be burned in.

This TV is superior to every Sony TV I looked at, before AND since.

Jason

 

[LikeLinus]

Originally posted by: Apex

Originally posted by: LikeLinus

Originally posted by: Apex

Originally posted by: Project86

Originally posted by: UNCjigga

The one I know the least about is LCoS. Seriously, who's really marketing LCoS displays these days? Sony? RCA? Can we get some more on the market? I hear its better than LCD projection and shouldn't have the color-wheel effect of DLP, but where can you find them?

Well, for a while JVC was the ONLY company to successfully bring the technology to the market. But then Sony followed with the Qualia high end stuff, and now have their SXRD line for the home user. The JVC units have been very highly regarded in the videophile world, and can be had for about the same price as comparable size DLP or rear projection LCD sets. They "only" do 768p though (which is fine IMO). The new Sony SXRD line can do 1080P but is $4000 for the 50" model, roughly double that of the JVC.

Don't forget Philips and their single chip/spinning prism LCOS solution.

What would you consider the best screen right now for about $3000.

I was looking at the Panny 50" HDTV Plasma. Any other suggestions?

Though the Panny 50" is nice, there are others to consider as well at that price range.

Ultimately, you need to pick what looks best to your eyes, in your viewing environment, with your source material. So, though one TV may irrefutably measure better than others, it may not please you the most.

What's your viewing distance?

How wide is your viewing cone (ie. viewing angles as wide as 40 degrees)?

How deep can the display be (ie. must be 3-4" thick for wall hanging, or can be 12" deep)?

How's your ambient light control (ie. no direct sunlight? some indirect light? total darkness?)?

What kind of material do you view most often (ie. 60% SD digital cable, 20% DVD, 10% HD, 10% PC material)?

What kind of movies/videos do you enjoy most (ie. mostly sports, or mostly dark movies, etc)?

Does needing to change a bulb every 6-8k hours bother you?

Does the need for a TV to be on for at least 15 minutes before you can shut it off bother you (once you turn on the TV, it takes 15 min to completely warm up bulb, which you want it to do before shutting off)?

Answers:

Distance - 20 Feet (up to - could be 12/15 if needed)

Depth - Would like to hang on wall - but not a must.

Light - Indirect and darkness. Room has two windows but they can be drawn to almost darkness.

Material - 50% HDTV / 30% DVD or xbox games / 20% SD

Content - Mostly sports and all sorts of movies or games. Kids watch bright things - I watch darker things.

Bulb doesn't bother me so much. My only problem is the sharpness of the image. I've been playing around with a 1024x768 projector at home and it's great...but It doesn't feel as sharp as a plasma/LCD/DLP. It is a concern for my 8 yr old and toddler. I'm not sure they'd like to wait 15mins.

I gave this suggestion to my wife - Get a projector for the entertainment room and buy a plasma to put in the living room. I'd like to keep the total package under $4,000 for both. I have inwall speakers (Klipsch) for the entertainment room with a 3808 Denon head unit. In the living room I have RC5's, same head unit. The entertainment room has nothign but computers right now. I'd like to convert it to a playroom/entertainment room for me and the boys.

 

[DragonMasterAlex]

Originally posted by: Kryhs
Thanks guys, I'll head over to Sears tomorrow and check things out. As of now, I think I'm going for a 42" plasma that supports 1080p. So now I just need to research the best brand and find the best price... Any suggestions? (Assuming I don't change my mind)

Edit: And I have a topic going on AVS. They are helping too, but I'd like as many opinions as possible.

Dude, if your top priority is gaming, you do NOT want Plasma. I had an early Sony plasma and the f*cking thing had burned the screen within 4 MONTHS. I eventually dumped that PoS and got a Samsung DLP. FAR superior in every conceivable way

Jason

 

[Apex]

Originally posted by: LikeLinus

Originally posted by: Apex

Originally posted by: LikeLinus
What would you consider the best screen right now for about $3000.

I was looking at the Panny 50" HDTV Plasma. Any other suggestions?

Though the Panny 50" is nice, there are others to consider as well at that price range.

Ultimately, you need to pick what looks best to your eyes, in your viewing environment, with your source material. So, though one TV may irrefutably measure better than others, it may not please you the most.

What's your viewing distance?

How wide is your viewing cone (ie. viewing angles as wide as 40 degrees)?

How deep can the display be (ie. must be 3-4" thick for wall hanging, or can be 12" deep)?

How's your ambient light control (ie. no direct sunlight? some indirect light? total darkness?)?

What kind of material do you view most often (ie. 60% SD digital cable, 20% DVD, 10% HD, 10% PC material)?

What kind of movies/videos do you enjoy most (ie. mostly sports, or mostly dark movies, etc)?

Does needing to change a bulb every 6-8k hours bother you?

Does the need for a TV to be on for at least 15 minutes before you can shut it off bother you (once you turn on the TV, it takes 15 min to completely warm up bulb, which you want it to do before shutting off)?

Answers:

Distance - 20 Feet (up to - could be 12/15 if needed)

Depth - Would like to hang on wall - but not a must.

Light - Indirect and darkness. Room has two windows but they can be drawn to almost darkness.

Material - 50% HDTV / 30% DVD or xbox games / 20% SD

Content - Mostly sports and all sorts of movies or games. Kids watch bright things - I watch darker things.

Bulb doesn't bother me so much. My only problem is the sharpness of the image. I've been playing around with a 1024x768 projector at home and it's great...but It doesn't feel as sharp as a plasma/LCD/DLP. It is a concern for my 8 yr old and toddler. I'm not sure they'd like to wait 15mins.

I gave this suggestion to my wife - Get a projector for the entertainment room and buy a plasma to put in the living room. I'd like to keep the total package under $4,000 for both. I have inwall speakers (Klipsch) for the entertainment room with a 3808 Denon head unit. In the living room I have RC5's, same head unit. The entertainment room has nothign but computers right now. I'd like to convert it to a playroom/entertainment room for me and the boys.

Hmm. I think the greatest concern there is the 20' viewing distance. That's HUGE, especially with your 50% HD viewing. There's no way to get a screen big enough.

I'd suggest you consider:

Plasma: 50" Panny or 50" Visio from Costco
DLP: Toshiba 62HM195 62" 1080p xHD3 DLP

 

[LikeLinus]

Sorry I should have been more clear.

Distance for the living room is up to 20 feet. This is where I was considering sticking the plasma. I know the distance is huge, but we're actually going to shorten it by moving the seating around.

The entertainment room on the other the other hand is smaller distance wise. I couldn't tell you for sure, but I think its about 10-12 feet.

Suggestions for a projector also?

 

[LordSnailz]

can someone give a quick rundown in layman terms why 1080p is impt. and why most tvs are in the 'rectangular' format? I understand the p, progressive but don't understand the 1080 or why they're rectangular. Sorry not meaning to hijack the thread but I'm starting to look as well, but need some of the basic definitions down first. TIA!

 

[Apex]

Originally posted by: LikeLinus
Sorry I should have been more clear.

Distance for the living room is up to 20 feet. This is where I was considering sticking the plasma. I know the distance is huge, but we're actually going to shorten it by moving the seating around.

The entertainment room on the other the other hand is smaller distance wise. I couldn't tell you for sure, but I think its about 10-12 feet.

Suggestions for a projector also?

That's a much more reasonable distance, though at 10-12', it still may be better to get a 60"+ display with your high quality source material.

I think those suggestions still stand though.

Take a look at those two plasmas. The Panny will have better black levels, better burn in resistance, and better stretch modes. The Visio has higher brightness, and the wonder that is Costco's return policy.

The Toshiba is a great set as well. 62" diagonal size, 1920 x 1080 native resolution, very good contrast, and solid all around color performance at under $3k.

For the entertainment room, you're only going to have about $1000-1200 left for screen & projector. I'm guessing you're going to make your own screen?

 

[UNCjigga]

Originally posted by: Apex

Originally posted by: hans007

Originally posted by: Apex

Originally posted by: UNCjigga
Well from what I can tell, in terms of image quality for flat screens it goes like this:
LCD > LCoS > DLP > Plasma > LCD-projection

Now plasma is a finicky creature...on the one hand its got great contrast, bright colors, good viewing angle. However, I have not yet seen a true 1080p plasma display...and if one exists its probably at least $5k-$7k for a 'small' 42" version. The other problem with plasma is the half-life of certain colors. Generally, I would avoid plasma, as the newest LCD-projection units are true 1080p and MUCH cheaper. If you want plasma, Pioneer or Panasonic FTW. For LCD projection, its hard to beat Sony.

DLP is the best/most affordable option, and the newest panels all support 1080p and have wicked fast colorwheels so you don't see that rainbow effect anymore (unless you have eagle-eye vision.) Samsung FTW!

The one I know the least about is LCoS. Seriously, who's really marketing LCoS displays these days? Sony? RCA? Can we get some more on the market? I hear its better than LCD projection and shouldn't have the color-wheel effect of DLP, but where can you find them?

Now onto the king of kings for image quality. Hands down, a direct-view LCD (as opposed to projection) gives you the best quality and best image, plus the true hang-on-a-wall capability that only comes with LCD or plasma. These used to be limited to 30" but now you can find 45" and even 65" LCD panels. All of these new panels do true 1080p. The only problem is cost--these are less cost effective than plasmas, but they might actually be worth it in terms of longevity. Once you're assured you don't have dead pixels (most of them you can't see anyway) then a good LCD will last a long time. Sharp Aquos FTW.

Actually, most would disagree. LCD's are the worst of those when it comes to color. They can display the least amount of the NTSC color gamut. They have the worst contrast. They have the highest black levels (lowest is best). They experience the fastest brightness dropoff with usage of any flat panel device. They have the worst response time of any digital display, and the ghosting that goes with it.

They do have a few advantages, though image quality isn't one of them.

They are bright in a full window. They have good resolution. They use marginally less electricity. They are very burn in resistant.

i agree with most of what you said, but the brightness half life on lcds is about twice of plasmas.


so they win in that too.

LCDs currently have a brightness halflife of about 50k hours, plasmas are rated at 60k hours. Though plasmas currently have longer lifespans, the difference is minor, since these both equate to 15-20 years of normal use: easily more than enough. The real issue is HOW they dim. Plasmas actually get slightly brighter after the first 100 hours or so, and then have a gradual decrease until close to the 40-60k hour mark, when it's more steep. LCDs on the other hand have a steep initial brightness decline, which levels out close to the 30-50k hour mark. If you go directly to the source (the manufacturers of the high brightness, ultra-long life cold cathode florescent lamps used in top LCDs) you can see this trend.

The next generation is anyones guess. Panasonic has already announced their next gen plasma will have a 100k hour halflife. I have yet to hear anything about the next gen CCFLs. Perhaps LEDs will improve their response time enough to be more widely used for LCD lighting.

Well Sharp's latest panels (2005-2006) look pretty damn good next to a plasma, and after comparing them to nearby plasmas I couldn't see any additional ghosting or slower response time. Granted it was a brightly-lit store so I couldn't compare the black levels, but they say they have panels coming soon with "infinite black" and "million:1" contrast (they've demoed these in a completely dark room, and people say they couldn't tell the panel was on until a picture came up on a black background!)

The successor to LCD panel technology will ultimately be SED, and then some variation of OLED once they can make it feasible.

 

[LikeLinus]

Originally posted by: Apex

Originally posted by: LikeLinus
Sorry I should have been more clear.

Distance for the living room is up to 20 feet. This is where I was considering sticking the plasma. I know the distance is huge, but we're actually going to shorten it by moving the seating around.

The entertainment room on the other the other hand is smaller distance wise. I couldn't tell you for sure, but I think its about 10-12 feet.

Suggestions for a projector also?

That's a much more reasonable distance, though at 10-12', it still may be better to get a 60"+ display with your high quality source material.

I think those suggestions still stand though.

Take a look at those two plasmas. The Panny will have better black levels, better burn in resistance, and better stretch modes. The Visio has higher brightness, and the wonder that is Costco's return policy.

The Toshiba is a great set as well. 62" diagonal size, 1920 x 1080 native resolution, very good contrast, and solid all around color performance at under $3k.

For the entertainment room, you're only going to have about $1000-1200 left for screen & projector. I'm guessing you're going to make your own screen?

Well I'm not absolute with the budget. I might wait till I get my bonus in Jan. I want one of the two for XMas. I could invest more then.

I'm open to 61-62" DLP sets also. I would like the Living room to be plasma. I want to put into a frame so it looks like a huge picture on the wall I'll probably move my RC5's into the entertainment room and the in-walls into the living room.

I just want something large for the kids and I to play on!

What are some good suggestions for projectors and screens?

 

[Apex]

Originally posted by: UNCjigga
Well Sharp's latest panels (2005-2006) look pretty damn good next to a plasma, and after comparing them to nearby plasmas I couldn't see any additional ghosting or slower response time. Granted it was a brightly-lit store so I couldn't compare the black levels, but they say they have panels coming soon with "infinite black" and "million:1" contrast (they've demoed these in a completely dark room, and people say they couldn't tell the panel was on until a picture came up on a black background!)

The successor to LCD panel technology will ultimately be SED, and then some variation of OLED once they can make it feasible.

The Sharp panels are very good, easily some of the best available. Color wise, the only LCD that beats the top plasmas is the Qualia one, which has LED based backlighting. Of course, it definitely has its drawbacks.

I'm looking forward to those high contrast models as well. I guess we'll see what the next generations bring.

Originally posted by: LikeLinus
Well I'm not absolute with the budget. I might wait till I get my bonus in Jan. I want one of the two for XMas. I could invest more then.

I'm open to 61-62" DLP sets also. I would like the Living room to be plasma. I want to put into a frame so it looks like a huge picture on the wall I'll probably move my RC5's into the entertainment room and the in-walls into the living room.

I just want something large for the kids and I to play on!

What are some good suggestions for projectors and screens?

Prices will definitely fall by then.

In terms of a huge picture, you'll probably need a business type plasma, or something else with thinner bezel.

What do you think would be an approximate budget for projector and screen?

The reason I ask is if the budget is relatively low, then you can go with DIY screen. You can make a reasonably good one. However, it's generally a good idea to spend more on the screen than projector. Projectors change, the screen not as much.

 

[Mr.IncrediblyBored]

Originally posted by: DragonMasterAlex

Originally posted by: Kryhs
Thanks guys, I'll head over to Sears tomorrow and check things out. As of now, I think I'm going for a 42" plasma that supports 1080p. So now I just need to research the best brand and find the best price... Any suggestions? (Assuming I don't change my mind)

Edit: And I have a topic going on AVS. They are helping too, but I'd like as many opinions as possible.

Dude, if your top priority is gaming, you do NOT want Plasma. I had an early Sony plasma and the f*cking thing had burned the screen within 4 MONTHS. I eventually dumped that PoS and got a Samsung DLP. FAR superior in every conceivable way

Jason

Well good thing the OP won't be buying an early Sony plasma.

The first and second generation plasmas had issues with burn-in. Newer generations have half-brightness ratings in the 60,000+ hour range. By his own admission gaming will take <30% of the viewing time, making burn-in a non-issue.

 

[LikeLinus]

Originally posted by: Apex
Prices will definitely fall by then.

In terms of a huge picture, you'll probably need a business type plasma, or something else with thinner bezel.

What do you think would be an approximate budget for projector and screen?

The reason I ask is if the budget is relatively low, then you can go with DIY screen. You can make a reasonably good one. However, it's generally a good idea to spend more on the screen than projector. Projectors change, the screen not as much.

I honestly have no clues how much screens cost. I was thinking around $1500-2000 for a projector. I had a Dell 3400MP Projectorat home this weekend.

 

[cliftonite]

I would go with one of the new 50 inch plasmas if it is in your budget. Should be in the 3.5k to 4k range.

 

[LikeLinus]

How is the InFocus SP4805? I'm seeing a lot of people on avforums using it.

 

[YOyoYOhowsDAjello]

Originally posted by: LikeLinus
How is the InFocus SP4805? I'm seeing a lot of people on avforums using it.

I like it a lot but if you have a $2000 budget you can do better.

4805 image example from my own

 

[LikeLinus]

Originally posted by: YOyoYOhowsDAjello

Originally posted by: LikeLinus
How is the InFocus SP4805? I'm seeing a lot of people on avforums using it.

I like it a lot but if you have a $2000 budget you can do better.

4805 image example from my own

Yeah I just realized the resolution. It's a bit low. The 5000 looks better.